Any way to reduce piston slap for tradein?

[SSmokin]

After the incompetent fuks at my local holden dealer dropped the oil in my vu,theres been a real bad knock which they have diagnosed as pisotn slap.i want to now trade it for a vz ss but i want the knock to be gone or atleast reduced somewat until its out of my hands.....sounds dodgy but i need to get rid of it and get more finance

[DALER]

Wow and everyone goes around rubbishing dealers. Dealers are dodgy. Dealers ripped me off. Good on ya blame the dealers :flipoff:

[fx160]

Wow and everyone goes around rubbishing dealers. Dealers are dodgy. Dealers ripped me off. Good on ya blame the dealers :flipoff:


get used to it tradies also cop heaps of flack we just put up with it
people winge but if they can't do it themselves they have to pay up wether they like it or not

kev

[Peter B - CV8]

After the incompetent fuks at my local holden dealer dropped the oil in my vu,theres been a real bad knock which they have diagnosed as pisotn slap.i want to now trade it for a vz ss but i want the knock to be gone or atleast reduced somewat until its out of my hands.....sounds dodgy but i need to get rid of it and get more finance

Guess you should have asked them to keep the old oil in it........ oh that's right, it's part of the service schedule isn't it !!!!
Piston slap shouldn't just magically appear following an oil change. It usually builds up over a period of time. Typically noticeable when cold & then going away as the engine warms up. Are you sure that it's not lifter noise that you are hearing - as a different oil viscosity/type can cause this to appear.
If its lifter/valvetrain noise, I would suggest using some Nulon "lifter free" additive. Should start to reduce noise within an hour or so of adding.

[SSmokin]

Guess you should have asked them to keep the old oil in it........ oh that's right, it's part of the service schedule isn't it !!!!
Piston slap shouldn't just magically appear following an oil change. It usually builds up over a period of time. Typically noticeable when cold & then going away as the engine warms up. Are you sure that it's not lifter noise that you are hearing - as a different oil viscosity/type can cause this to appear.
If its lifter/valvetrain noise, I would suggest using some Nulon "lifter free" additive. Should start to reduce noise within an hour or so of adding.

the viscosity is the same as the book has said (10w/60...im using castrol edge) and i thought it would be a lifter problem as well but they reckon that its excessive piston clearence.The noise is there either way wether its cold or hot,more noticeable when the engines up to temp.it goes awa y when u have the gas on but as soon as u back off it comes back.


Wow and everyone goes around rubbishing dealers. Dealers are dodgy. Dealers ripped me off. Good on ya blame the dealers :flipoff:

wat do u mean by good on ya blame the dealers?i will coz there fuked and now its ocsting me money 2 fix (if i end up doing so)

[SS Enforcer]

the viscosity is the same as the book has said (10w/60...im using castrol edge) and i thought it would be a lifter problem as well but they reckon that its excessive piston clearence.The noise is there either way wether its cold or hot,more noticeable when the engines up to temp.it goes awa y when u have the gas on but as soon as u back off it comes back.



wat do u mean by good on ya blame the dealers?i will coz there fuked and now its ocsting me money 2 fix (if i end up doing so)

How is it the dealers fault your car is a slapper ?

Rather than buy a new car if you like the vu why not get a 6.0l crate motor dropped in it instead of shelling out for a new ride .... much cheaper in the long run and you get a brand spankin new motor.

Check out Holmarts website for pricing on a new ls3 or ls2 etc etc.


cheers

[Highway]

How many kms has the engine done ?
Is it a constant slow tapping sound at idle ?

As someone said use the lifter free additive you will soon know if its effective. (Only $15 or so)

If it works trade it in fast as if there is mechanical damage it will be back at some stage.

Mine had a sticking valve so it only worked for a while until it was traded.( 260,000 kms )
Got sick of changing oil and adding the additive all the time.

Mike

[matls1]

i can see why people blame dealers there not all angals out there, i have been in a dealer when the apprentice forgets to add oil after a service then the mechanic goes to take for a test ride oil light doesnt go off after a few minutes then shuts down engine and then relises. i bet the owner hasn't been told.

also another place while draining oil person got told to hurry up by the boss he said the oil hasn't finished draining the boss walked up and put the sump plug back in and said it has now.

Now i service all my own cars

cheers matt

[ls1vt209]

Yes nothing like going in for a service, getting the car home to find that the oil is the same colour as when it went in to the dealership. BLACK.

[planetdavo]

the viscosity is the same as the book has said (10w/60...im using castrol edge) and i thought it would be a lifter problem as well but they reckon that its excessive piston clearence.The noise is there either way wether its cold or hot,more noticeable when the engines up to temp.it goes awa y when u have the gas on but as soon as u back off it comes back.

wat do u mean by good on ya blame the dealers?i will coz there fuked and now its ocsting me money 2 fix (if i end up doing so)
I'd LOVE to know where the owners manual "recommends" 10W/60! :rofl:
The book recommends 10W/30 or 10/W40 typically, so likely your motor was already f#cked, but 10W/60 was covering up the issue.
The 10W/30 or 40, as used by the dealers, being a thinner oil than the 60, would have simply exposed the issue you already had!
:goodjob:

[vyc4b]

most of the people I know use Castrol Edge 10/60..........

[planetdavo]

most of the people I know use Castrol Edge 10/60..........
Maybe that's because most people you know have noisy LS1's, and they're going old skool by using thicker oil to try and hide it...:)
Point was simply that that grade is NOT the manufacturers recommended spec, so the dealer would NOT have used oil that thick, hence the slapping now, and hence his misguided spray having no real basis other than looking for someone to blame. :teach:

[Desertws6]

I'd LOVE to know where the owners manual "recommends" 10W/60! :rofl:
The book recommends 10W/30 or 10/W40 typically, so likely your motor was already f#cked, but 10W/60 was covering up the issue.
The 10W/30 or 40, as used by the dealers, being a thinner oil than the 60, would have simply exposed the issue you already had!
:goodjob:


I've always wondered about the oil that I have heard mentioned on this site.
The original GM owners manual for an LS1 recommends 5w-30 for all tempatures and 10w-30 for -18C/+38C it also says "Do not use 20w-50 or any other grade oil not recommended."

I've used 5w-30 for the first 2 years then 10w-30 ever since, with no piston slap or strange noise.

With a thicker oil and tight tolerance I would expect some engine damage to occur over time.





SSmokin,

I do hope that you can get this sorted out!

Cheers,
Steve :cheers:

[German Statesman]

The number of clunking LS1s I've heard/seen that suddenly go really quiet when they're about to be traded in :rofl:

Oh...don't leave the STP can in the boot like one bright spark did, and make sure the used car buyer doesn't run the rego or VIN through the dealership computer system and find the 'suspected piston slap' or 'excessive oil consumption noted' in the advisor comments on its service history...

[Alex81]

I'd LOVE to know where the owners manual "recommends" 10W/60! :rofl:
The book recommends 10W/30 or 10/W40 typically, so likely your motor was already f#cked, but 10W/60 was covering up the issue.
The 10W/30 or 40, as used by the dealers, being a thinner oil than the 60, would have simply exposed the issue you already had!
:goodjob:

Davo,
I was ask by two seperate dealers what oil i wanted used, i ask if they 10w 60 and they stated they did so i put that in, as that what i usually use, so maybe some do there own thing

[vlcalais2005]

I use 10w/60 never had a noisy engine before the change plus i belive mainlube Recomends the oil for the LS1

[planetdavo]

Davo,
I was ask by two seperate dealers what oil i wanted used, i ask if they 10w 60 and they stated they did so i put that in, as that what i usually use, so maybe some do there own thing
Possibly so, but Holden themselves wouldn't want to find out about it, particularly for vehicles under some form of warranty. 10W/60 is enough to void new car warranty for an engine issue.

[VL Executive]

After the incompetent fuks at my local holden dealer dropped the oil in my vu,theres been a real bad knock which they have diagnosed as pisotn slap.i want to now trade it for a vz ss but i want the knock to be gone or atleast reduced somewat until its out of my hands.....sounds dodgy but i need to get rid of it and get more finance


I dont mean to :stick: But arnt you the guy who wanted to put this thing on a burnout pad / skid pan and give it a bit doing burnouts?

Thread here - http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=109314

^ Did you go ahead with those plans? Not having a go at you or getting anyone offside.............but the knock might not be all the Holden dealers fault?

Probably get myself into trouble saying that. But just food for thought.

[mmciau]

I use 10w/60 never had a noisy engine before the change plus i belive mainlube Recomends the oil for the LS1

Probably be an OK oil range for where you reside!


Mike

[KCB50L]

Obviously the engine didn't like the skid pan day, new engine for you.

[CalaisRider]

A coupla bottles of Lucas Oil Conditioner combined with 20/60 will silence almost anything LOL.

[SSmokin]

I dont mean to :stick: But arnt you the guy who wanted to put this thing on a burnout pad / skid pan and give it a bit doing burnouts?

Thread here - http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=109314

^ Did you go ahead with those plans? Not having a go at you or getting anyone offside.............but the knock might not be all the Holden dealers fault?

Probably get myself into trouble saying that. But just food for thought.
mate,the car hasnt been on the pan....thats not until august and for people that think im just trying to blame holden,there wrong,theres been other little things that have happened while its been at this particular dealership,im not burning every single holden service centre

[matthewfnorbert]

Possibly so, but Holden themselves wouldn't want to find out about it, particularly for vehicles under some form of warranty. 10W/60 is enough to void new car warranty for an engine issue.

how would holden justify no engine warranty on 10w 60?

exactly what mechanically will the 10w 60 do to "cause" a particular failure mode.. what would a typical failure mode be using 10w 60?

[SS Enforcer]

how would holden justify no engine warranty on 10w 60?

exactly what mechanically will the 10w 60 do to "cause" a particular failure mode.. what would a typical failure mode be using 10w 60?

I was thinking the same thing I use 10-60 synth in mine and know lots of people using it. It provides protection in more extreme heat than the std 10-30 oil.
Unless GM are providing the oil free of charge and the oil is recomended by the manufacturer for that type of engine I can't see how warranty could be refused.

cheers


A coupla bottles of Lucas Oil Conditioner combined with 20/60 will silence almost anything LOL.

Hows the 20/60 going in yours Pete does it quieten it down ?

cheers

[planetdavo]

how would holden justify no engine warranty on 10w 60?

exactly what mechanically will the 10w 60 do to "cause" a particular failure mode.. what would a typical failure mode be using 10w 60?
You clearly don't understand the theory of what's thicker must always be better...:teach:
A modern engine can actually wear out QUICKER by using a thicker oil, even if some consider the reduction in certain engine noises to be a "good thing". Oil must be the correct viscosity to do the job it was designed for. Go too far and you reduce the flow of the oil, as most modern engines have very tight tolerances. Tight tolerances need thin oil so it can still flow quickly.
I'm not saying 10W/60 will cause elevated engine wear, but virtually no modern engines recommend oil this thick.

[diabolic]

You clearly don't understand the theory of what's thicker must always be better...:teach:
A modern engine can actually wear out QUICKER by using a thicker oil, even if some consider the reduction in certain engine noises to be a "good thing". Oil must be the correct viscosity to do the job it was designed for. Go too far and you reduce the flow of the oil, as most modern engines have very tight tolerances. Tight tolerances need thin oil so it can still flow quickly.
I'm not saying 10W/60 will cause elevated engine wear, but virtually no modern engines recommend oil this thick.
I'd like to hear Mainlube's response to this comment..

Dan

[ls1 VN]

so would you recommend Mobil 1 then?

[planetdavo]

I'd like to hear Mainlube's response to this comment..

Dan
Fair enough call, but when he does, is anyone on here going to be able to understand it? He really needs to speak in a language people understand, or maybe the real plan is to baffle us all into believing his products are just so much better than anything else. And, since he sells on this forum...:)
All I'm saying is that it's not GM's recommended range, and for a car under warranty, a potential warranty void scenario. Obviously this VU is not under warranty.
This has gone off track anyway. The OP's original rant was about the slapping motor after an oil change, which is almost guaranteed to be caused by using 10W/30 oil, the listed spec for a healthy motor. His is clearly a slapper, and the thick oil was just hiding it.

[SVNLTR]

Not an-other piston slap thread?:confused:

[KCB50L]

I used that mainlube shit once in my engine and never again, yeah good oil pressure after 2 minutes, I'd rather use the 5w30 castrol edge in mine, does the job and has pressure from the word go.

[planetdavo]

how would holden justify no engine warranty on 10w 60?

exactly what mechanically will the 10w 60 do to "cause" a particular failure mode.. what would a typical failure mode be using 10w 60?
Thought I'd paste this post from daskip in another thread matty. He had a noisy top end in a VT LS1...
daskip
Occasional Contributor to the Forums
Last Online: Today 08:35 PM
Member Since: Sep 2008
Location: Brisbane
Current Ride: Cammed VT SS Series II

Re: help! nasty noise :(

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"ended up being the castrol edge 10-60 i put in

i started the car after i got it towed home and the noise was still really bad then all of a sudden dissapeared.

looks like the oil pump couldnt pump the oil and the lifters went dry

im going to keep an eye on the oil pump though as when its cold with the 5-30 in there the oil light takes 10 seconds to turn off now.

drove 1000km from brisbane down to sydney after i changed the oil and the car was fine!!"

[jws]

You clearly don't understand the theory of what's thicker must always be better...:teach:
A modern engine can actually wear out QUICKER by using a thicker oil, even if some consider the reduction in certain engine noises to be a "good thing". Oil must be the correct viscosity to do the job it was designed for. Go too far and you reduce the flow of the oil, as most modern engines have very tight tolerances. Tight tolerances need thin oil so it can still flow quickly.
I'm not saying 10W/60 will cause elevated engine wear, but virtually no modern engines recommend oil this thick.

I agree with what planetdavo is saying here, modern engines have very tight tolerances and you must choose your oil viscosity to suit your application. There is a lot to consider when choosing an oil, age/condition of motor, the way you drive you car ie on full noise all the time or just putt putt around, and probably the most important but overlooked is oil pressure. I use Joe Gibbs XP2 (0W-20), which most people would say is to thin but it suits my application

[matthewfnorbert]

You clearly don't understand the theory of what's thicker must always be better...:teach:
A modern engine can actually wear out QUICKER by using a thicker oil, even if some consider the reduction in certain engine noises to be a "good thing". Oil must be the correct viscosity to do the job it was designed for. Go too far and you reduce the flow of the oil, as most modern engines have very tight tolerances. Tight tolerances need thin oil so it can still flow quickly.
I'm not saying 10W/60 will cause elevated engine wear, but virtually no modern engines recommend oil this thick.

what are your comments on the grades being used by the book are primarily chosen so engines can achieve fuel emission standards and improve fuel economy, both of which are put ahead of engine longevity and wear debris generation.

[Uncle Tone]

You clearly don't understand the theory of what's thicker must always be better...:teach:
A modern engine can actually wear out QUICKER by using a thicker oil, even if some consider the reduction in certain engine noises to be a "good thing". Oil must be the correct viscosity to do the job it was designed for. Go too far and you reduce the flow of the oil, as most modern engines have very tight tolerances. Tight tolerances need thin oil so it can still flow quickly.

I don't know whether I would consider a motor with piston slap to have particularly "tight tolerances" :lol:

[planetdavo]

what are your comments on the grades being used by the book are primarily chosen so engines can achieve fuel emission standards and improve fuel economy, both of which are put ahead of engine longevity and wear debris generation.
Yes, economy and emissions criteria affect it as well, but to suggest the manufacturers WORLD WIDE all are causing premature wear is a pretty wild theory! Should one be p!ssed off that Toyota for example design their motors to "only" last 300,000kms minimum with thin oil??? :rofl:
Some pretty high horsepower factory weapons actually use oil THINNER than 10W/30 you know, down to 0W/## in a number of cases...:teach:


I don't know whether I would consider a motor with piston slap to have particularly "tight tolerances" :lol:
Bit like having a girlfriend that's "been around" in the sack...:rofl:

[matthewfnorbert]

planetdavo you obviously know so much about oil and wear modes and have plenty of analytical experience in this field, so i will bow down to your superior tribology skills. :bow::bow::bow::bow:

[gmh308]

the viscosity is the same as the book has said (10w/60...im using castrol edge) and i thought it would be a lifter problem as well but they reckon that its excessive piston clearence.The noise is there either way wether its cold or hot,more noticeable when the engines up to temp.it goes awa y when u have the gas on but as soon as u back off it comes back.



weird piston slap......piston slap is usually noisier cold and under load. More likely valvetrain.

In my experience, oil viscosity doesnt affect piston slap much, but it does affect valvetrain noise: and M1 10W30 much quieter than 20W50. some other postas on this forum experienced similar, quieter with thinner oil. :)

[VX2VESS]

Thought I'd paste this post from daskip in another thread matty. He had a noisy top end in a VT LS1...
daskip
Occasional Contributor to the Forums
Last Online: Today 08:35 PM
Member Since: Sep 2008
Location: Brisbane
Current Ride: Cammed VT SS Series II

Re: help! nasty noise :(

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"ended up being the castrol edge 10-60 i put in

i started the car after i got it towed home and the noise was still really bad then all of a sudden dissapeared.

looks like the oil pump couldnt pump the oil and the lifters went dry

im going to keep an eye on the oil pump though as when its cold with the 5-30 in there the oil light takes 10 seconds to turn off now.

drove 1000km from brisbane down to sydney after i changed the oil and the car was fine!!"

i mentioned that in that other oil thread. thicker oil will make the lifters noisier at start as the oil doesn't flow as fast to the top as thinner oil will. thicker oil doesn't hide lasy lifters, it hides slap a bit. but most ls1's with over 90,000 K will be lifter noise. thinner oil can shut them up at start sometimes depends how bad they are, for a while anyway. you need to replace them eventually.

[German Statesman]

N14 Nissan SSS 2.0L engines required a 0-30W oil, and all the mechanics in the Nissan dealer over the road from us revolted because it poured in like water.

Then they went to Nissan tech school and saw the accurate and tight tolerances that Nissan were achieving in production, and to say they were amazed was an understatement.

This was 1992, by the way.

[mechatron]

I'd like to hear Mainlube's response to this comment..

Dan

Below was Mainlubes response on 23/11/08 to a thread regarding 10w60
------------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not logical for a 10w60 to be nosier than something like a 5w30 as a 10w60 has double the film strength and hence double the protection, double thickness of oil holding load bearing surfaces apart.

Noise can only come from metal to metal contact.

vt2vx made an interesting comment a few months ago in a post that made allot sense, he said he'd noticed that when the oil in a, "not so clean" engine was changed to a thicker 10w60 oil the valve train sometimes got nosier. He thought that some of the small oil feed holes to the lifters could be partially blocked with sludge thus slightly starving the lifters of oil as the 10w60 being slightly thicker at 100C. A great observation, well done vt2vx!!

This would be the only explanation I would except when being told that a 10w60 made an engine nosier. It is mechanically impossible for a 10w60 to make an engine nosier than something like a 5w30.

All this being said and I hope understood it puts a huge emphorces on flushing your engine in between oil changes.

You should be using a Synthetic (full synthetic not a groupIII) in your LS series engine and go for an SM spec, I would use a 10w60 only in my LS series engines and have proven many times that it reduces wear significantly.

If the Mainlube makes it hard for you to get up after seeing the price, the next in line I'd run would be the Edge 10w60, if if make you motor noisy, give your motor a farkin good flushing because it should make it quieter.

I have not had anyone come up with a logical reason not to run a 10w60 in our engines, it has double the film of oil and double the protection.

[VX2VESS]

I posted in here to that on worn lifters older motors yes cold thicker oil is slower to get to the top and into the lifters, start up clatter. and yes when changing to a high detergent oil the crap removed can make the problem worse by further clogging entry to the lifter to slow filling it, also allowing more leak down with crap caught in the ball. therefore older motors with worn lifters that leak all the oil out when the motors off will be noisier on thicker oil, more so with high detergent oils in a dirty motor.

New or newish motors hold oil in the lifters longer so they are not empty at startup. So they don't need to wait until they are filled with oil to quieten down.

But older motors with worn other clearances and slap thicker oil will help. you have to decide what the noise is. if it gets worse on thick oil its probably lifters or crap caught in them. noise isn't always slap, in fact thats pretty rare these days most have been fixed if they had it to start with.

[planetdavo]

I have not had anyone come up with a logical reason not to run a 10w60 in our engines, it has double the film of oil and double the protection.
You do of course realise that your quote ASSUMES the thinner oil is actually NOT doing it's job. :teach:
In the meantime, that thicker oil getting forced around the tight tolerances increases drag, costing you horsepower, fuel economy, as well as the risk of a rattly top end (as quoted by more than one member!).
One needs to be aware of "old school" thinking. Metals quality and production tooling have dramatically improved from our grandfathers generation, where much of this thinking comes from...:)

[mac06]

I have not had anyone come up with a logical reason not to run a 10w60 in our engines, it has double the film of oil and double the protection.

To add to planetdavo's comments, if 10w60 has double the film of oil and double the protection then why do many manufacturers not recommend it as standard? I know Mazda had lots of problems with their hydraulic lifters until they went for a thinner detergent oil. Then the problems went away.

[BLACK 346]

To add to planetdavo's comments, if 10w60 has double the film of oil and double the protection then why do many manufacturers not recommend it as standard? I know Mazda had lots of problems with their hydraulic lifters until they went for a thinner detergent oil. Then the problems went away.

Poor fuel consumption figures maybe, who knows?
Steve from Mainlube, or PD from GMH spare parts, you choose :)

[mmciau]

To add to planetdavo's comments, if 10w60 has double the film of oil and double the protection then why do many manufacturers not recommend it as standard? I know Mazda had lots of problems with their hydraulic lifters until they went for a thinner detergent oil. Then the problems went away.

Detergent oil is the key to cleaner oil passageways.

The ideal oil would be a diesel designated detergent oil

Mike

[planetdavo]

Poor fuel consumption figures maybe, who knows?
Steve from Mainlube, or PD from GMH spare parts, you choose :)
Now, which one of us tries to sell one of their products every time they post on this forum, and which one doesn't?
:goodjob: :rofl::rofl::rofl:

[mac06]

Detergent oil is the key to cleaner oil passageways.

The ideal oil would be a diesel designated detergent oil

Mike

From memory Mike that's exactly what they used. They realized the oil passageways were smaller than before and clogging up, hence the problems getting oil to the lifters. I guess the alternative is as Mechatron quoted from Mainlube as below-


All this being said and I hope understood it puts a huge emphorces on flushing your engine in between oil changes.

[BLACK 346]

Now, which one of us tries to sell one of their products every time they post on this forum, and which one doesn't?
:goodjob: :rofl::rofl::rofl:

Have you been burnt by a sponsor? I knew you had an agenda
here, I reckon I have finally figured it out :)

[Auto Ls1]

I used that mainlube shit once in my engine and never again, yeah good oil pressure after 2 minutes, I'd rather use the 5w30 castrol edge in mine, does the job and has pressure from the word go.

Mate I have been reading this forum for many years and a lot of the forum members recommended using mineral oils for the first 10,000 kms to bed the piston bores in ect, then switch to a synthetic oil so I have been using Castrol Edge Sport 5w 30 since like you with no problems , I change my oil & filter every 5000 klms because I do a lot of stop start city driving but next oil change I will be switching to Castrol Edge 0w40 because of our hot summers & use 5w30 in winter. From wot Ive heard It may not be wise to use a synthetic oil in a new engine so what does that say about synthetic oils they must give good protection.

[matthewfnorbert]

use the net and investigate such topics as
"reliability based engineering"
"condition monitoring"
"predictive maintenance"
"precision maintenance"
"tribology"

you will find much interesting reading, including learning that there is an entire industry out there dedicated to testing oils (as well as other component condition indicators..) with the sole purpose of increasing machine reliability, life extension, and achieving the lowest asset life cycle cost, all this regardless and independent of manufactures specs..

this (high standards including ISO or to halt wear debris generation modes) generally cannot be achieved by following manufacturers recommendations, particularly as manufactures are not for example tribologists and are not the asset owners.

for example in the case of engines, often many different types of oil and air filter systems (and location!) are trialled to yield the least amount of wear debris (and type of wear debris modes) being generated or to halt incipient failure modes as by the book recommendations are not good enough for required reliability..

guys like mainlube labs etc deal with this stuff every day, particularly in industry's where far higher standards (than for say car engines) for oil cleanliness and performance are expected to achieve life extension and reliability.. you should listen to these guys as they are offering advice based on real world data in an area (tribology) of engineering so far above your local holden dealer or even manufacturer.

manufactures turn to these guys (noria for example, or other condition monitoring companies) to solve problems etc, even the auto makers (and oil manufacturers!) in australia use specialist tribologist companies etc to gain the best from their machinery (gearboxes, blowers, compressors, hydraulic systems etc), they do not always follow manufactures spec, ironic eh!

most switched on engineers and asset owners will test all new oil, even in new sealed containers for cleanliness before it is deemed fit for purpose, believe me, often these oils fail the ISO cleanliness tests and are rejected or cleaned before being used.

its very interesting stuff, but not a topic that can be simplified or explained away on a forum from your armchair unless you are a tribologist, experienced reliability engineer or CM practitioner.


just my 2 cents

[planetdavo]

Have you been burnt by a sponsor? I knew you had an agenda
here, I reckon I have finally figured it out :)
A "sponsor" is simply any business that's prepared to pay money to advertise. If they don't think it will pay off, they won't "sponsor" the forum.
Hardly rocket science at work here. :teach:

[BLACK 346]

A "sponsor" is simply any business that's prepared to pay money to advertise. If they don't think it will pay off, they won't "sponsor" the forum.
Hardly rocket science at work here. :teach:

Thanks for stating the bleeding obvious.

[planetdavo]

Matthewfnorbert, you do realise that scientists often spend years proving something that any "real world" person with half a brain solved in under a week...:teach:

[BLACK 346]

Matthewfnorbert, you do realise that scientists often spend years proving something that any "real world" person with half a brain solved in under a week...:teach:

Would probably take someone with half a brain to know that I would
think :goodjob:

[matthewfnorbert]

Matthewfnorbert, you do realise that scientists often spend years proving something that any "real world" person with half a brain solved in under a week...:teach:

if you took the time to research the topic you are making statements about you would know that the condition monitoring industry (including oil analysis guys) is made up of very down to earth, practical, trades and engineering folk (no scientists or oxygen thieves). often the best CM analysts are trades based with many years of experience in this field.

[planetdavo]

if you took the time to research the topic you are making statements about you would know that the condition monitoring industry (including oil analysis guys) is made up of very down to earth, practical, trades and engineering folk (no scientists or oxygen thieves). often the best CM analysts are trades based with many years of experience in this field.
I reckon I could almost buy a brand new crate motor for the Monaro with the money spend on all this oil analysis!
One with the lot please! :rofl:
My statements still stand. I actually spent 15 years working a LOT closer to many oil companies before my current employment, if you had bothered to ask...:bow:

[Micks]

I still can't believe the crap that goes on around the net re early LS1 piston slap if anyone's to blame it's the manufacturer. Get over it well known by now.

Also @ Davo sorry to say but you take the bait every time...more to life than a post count mate.:fishing:

Merry Christmas

Cheers
VYT:xmas:

[planetdavo]

Yeah I know, but if it means I get the opportunity to publicly spray a few idiots, it's worth it everytime!
Some people punch punching bags, I spray forum d!ckheads.

[BLACK 346]

Yeah I know, but if it means I get the opportunity to publicly spray a few idiots, it's worth it everytime!
Some people punch punching bags, I spray forum d!ckheads.

Maybe you should get away from the keyboard and go try and
punch some real people, they punch back a lot harder though.

[r8ls1]

Re: Any way to reduce piston slap for tradein?

this might not work on all of them, but back some yrs i had an ls1 that had piston slap at idle, it had 30k kms on it. i put a 160 deg stat and set the fans to come in earlier and the piston slap went away and never returned, even after head/cam bolt ons etc and 90k extra kms. when the car went back to stock the std thermostat went back in and instantly it was slapping again at idle. i couldnt beleive it could be so simple so out of curiosity i swapped out the stat again and the piston slap dissapeared yet again, at 120,000 kms old. the holden factory wont run a 160 stat because they think it will increase engine wear, but interesting that the ls1's that were sold in the USA had a colder stat fitted from the factory, allthough not as cold as the 160, they are around the 170 from memory, maybe 180. why holden chose to run them hotter (in Australia of all places) is beyond me, but my ls1 had a direct effect of piston slap vs the running temp at idle.

[Luke_]

There are some pretty heavy hitters in this thread.



But 10w60 in my LS1 has never had me any troubles :)

[KCB50L]

I run a 160 degree thermostat, bloody beautiful of a summer time as the engine temp never goes above 1/4, bit iffy on it in the colder months though, as it barely raises above cold. But I only use the HSV recommended grade of oil in the engine (even though it's only an SS), bit thinner but the ute runs smoother on it, Ran like a busted arse with the 10W60 in it, but mine isn't a slapper, it just needs new valve train and lifters.

[VX2VESS]

But I only use the HSV recommended grade of oil in the engine (even though it's only an SS), bit thinner but the ute runs smoother on it, Ran like a busted arse with the 10W60 in it, but mine isn't a slapper, it just needs new valve train and lifters.

that's my point that's the fix, but until then mess around with some thinner oils for the quietest one. the thicker oil will be ok when the top end is reco'd

lifters can sound like slap in these motors

[SSmokin]

ok ive seen a mechanic that i know well and he knows his shit,he says its in the topend so most prob lifter issue as it only happens on decompression,were going to drop the oil out and run an engine flush through it to see how that goes.if this solves the problem then i wont be trading it in.

[Micks]

The engine flush may do the trick.
What Ive done previously with very dirty engines is to totally dump the oil.
Refill the sump with straight Diesel Fuel & run the engine only till warm & not on the road.
The amount of shit that comes out when you drain it...is amazing.
I then remove & drain the oil filter & put back on refill the engine with a cheap clean oil & run for a few hours on the road then drain again, new filter & fill with correct oil.
Bit of mucking around but has proven fruitful for me anyhow.

Cheers
VYT

[diabolic]

ok ive seen a mechanic that i know well and he knows his shit,he says its in the topend so most prob lifter issue as it only happens on decompression,were going to drop the oil out and run an engine flush through it to see how that goes.if this solves the problem then i wont be trading it in.
So if the car is fukced, then you want to trade it in, otherwise you'll keep it?

You sound like a stand-up guy mate.

Dan

[heavyduty1340]

So if the car is fukced, then you want to trade it in, otherwise you'll keep it?

You sound like a stand-up guy mate.

Dan

:rofl::rofl:

+1 agreeing with Diabolic

[planetdavo]

ok ive seen a mechanic that i know well and he knows his shit,he says its in the topend so most prob lifter issue as it only happens on decompression,were going to drop the oil out and run an engine flush through it to see how that goes.if this solves the problem then i wont be trading it in.
Might have been best to see your "trusted" mechanic BEFORE starting this thread perhaps?

[warlobo]

just put the thickest oil around in, should cover the noise temp... morreys truck oil does the job nicely...

[seedyrom]

Just make sure you leave the air con on, then when they pop the bonnet whilst the engine is running, atleast the low speed fan will be buzzing away, and distract from some of the noise.

[Tecca]

The engine flush may do the trick.
What Ive done previously with very dirty engines is to totally dump the oil.
Refill the sump with straight Diesel Fuel & run the engine only till warm & not on the road.
The amount of shit that comes out when you drain it...is amazing.
I then remove & drain the oil filter & put back on refill the engine with a cheap clean oil & run for a few hours on the road then drain again, new filter & fill with correct oil.
Bit of mucking around but has proven fruitful for me anyhow.

Cheers
VYT



Hmmm i would not really recommend running an engine without oil even for a second.

[seedyrom]

True, but VYTonne has more years of experience than you have pubes :yup:

[SSmokin]

So if the car is fukced, then you want to trade it in, otherwise you'll keep it?

You sound like a stand-up guy mate.

Dan

well i dont have the funds like some people have on this and other forums just to throw at the car without going and seeing the bank for a loan,and besides,im sure im not the 1st and wont be the last person to do this as well.as for the standup guy remark,mate u dont know me so :flipoff:

[KCB50L]

I agree with VYTone on this, diesel has enough lubrication factor for an engine that is just idling, and it also has enough solvents in it to desolve most if not all the buildup in an engine after all you are only running the engine for max 5 minutes at idle, just don't sit there with it out of gear and hold it on the rev limiter, you will fornicate the engine.

[Tecca]

True, but VYTonne has more years of experience than you have pubes :yup:

LOL!:rofl: