Can we use foglights in dust storms?

[White Rider]

Is it legal to use foglights in dusts storms?:)


Don't forget to clean your air filters after today!

[GODSMACK]

LOl, this is going to be an awesome thread.... :rofl:

I do believe, that foggy conditions are the only circumstances in which fog lights should be used, going by previous threads. Dust aint fog, so no!!!

I use mine as soon as the sun goes down, much to many members disgust!

P.S. Do we even need air filters, i read on a forum somewhere that i should take my air filter out? It only restrict air flow apparently...

[livewildcard]

NRMA states:

Fog lights

•Designed to improve visibility of the road directly ahead of the vehicle in fog or hazardous weather conditions where visibility has been reduced. The Australian Road Rules state that they are not to be used at any other time.
•In hazardous conditions, the law permits you to turn on your hazard lights to help others see you.

But will the cops allow that? ha. I've been driving with them on.

In regards to the air filter. Oh no. its begun.

[CLUBRED]

Only if they're LED.

[wikky]

P.S. Do we even need air filters, i read on a forum somewhere that i should take my air filter out? It only restrict air flow apparently...

:rofl: I knew it wouldn't take long! :lmao:

[Rub]

Hmmm....

They are called FOG lights...

Maybe switch on your DUST lights....

[chillicatqld]

Hang on... check handbook.... yep fog lights - NOT dust lights.... check

[Jarhead]

Yes you can.

In October (Qld) there will be a $40 fine for having your foggies on if there are no adverse weather conditions.

In common sense terms - if it's a clear night and you have them on = fine.

If there are weather conditions making visibility more difficult (eg dust, fog, rain) then you will be justified for having them on. I will go as far as to say that no one will ever get pinged for having them on in any of the examples above.

Personally I find night time visibility better with them on. I have had them on for the last 7 years. I understand the other side to the arguement. There have been times when an oncoming vehicle has blinded me with badly aligned fog lights. They can be worse than high beam. My opinion is that factory fitted fog lights are ok but a lot of aftermarket ones (particularly if not fitted correctly) can anoy other motorists.

[zorro]

Yes you can.

In October (Qld) there will be a $40 fine for having your foggies on if there are no adverse weather conditions.


they have been fining people for a while now...

[livewildcard]

Hang on... check handbook.... yep fog lights - NOT dust lights.... check

I can imagine the conversation

Police: That could have been avoided if you were using your fog lights as well. Thats what they are for.

Driver: But they are called fog lamps. I couldn't find my dust lamps.

Police: Well no shit

[bladerunner]

i only use mine in bad weather as in "here i am please dont hit me" lights
thats about all they are good for anyway. proper driving lights should be mounted higher to have any effect IMO. down low where 95% are situated only makes the cats eyes immediately in front of your bumper on the road more bright. but if you like having them on all the time and dont mind being booked well thats your choice, just be mindfull when you are coming at us that dont like being dazzled by them at night and kill them temporarily,
yes i kinow they are low watt lights but they are bloody annoying at night
some of the larger lights (wrx's.etc..) are mainly what im refering to

[SHANESVZSS]

i only use mine in bad weather as in "here i am please dont hit me" lights
thats about all they are good for anyway. proper driving lights should be mounted higher to have any effect IMO. down low where 95% are situated only makes the cats eyes immediately in front of your bumper on the road more bright. but if you like having them on all the time and dont mind being booked well thats your choice, just be mindfull when you are coming at us that dont like being dazzled by them at night and kill them temporarily,
yes i kinow they are low watt lights but they are bloody annoying at night
some of the larger lights (wrx's.etc..) are mainly what im refering to

ive never seen or heard of anyone getting booked at night with foggis and driving lights on (not saying it doesnt happen) has any one been pinged for them at night? (genuine question btw)

[macca_779]

ive never seen or heard of anyone getting booked at night with foggis and driving lights on (not saying it doesnt happen) has any one been pinged for them at night? (genuine question btw)

Yes Ive been done for it in my youth. FYI don't confuse driving lights with low beam headlights. Big difference. Driving lights must be operated via a separate switch in conjunction with selecting high beam.

[bladerunner]

ive never seen or heard of anyone getting booked at night with foggis and driving lights on (not saying it doesnt happen) has any one been pinged for them at night? (genuine question btw)

cant say that i have personally, but it is an offence up here if you have them on for no reason, i did a qwik check of the qld trans site a while back for a similar reason. that being said though ive seen cops running around in aurions with them on

[zorro]

In short yes in QLD people have been booked, I was pulled over about 3yrs ago when I 1st got the ute. Was given a warning as the police vehicle which pulled me over also had his on, we both had a bit of a laugh and went our own ways

[TR33VV]

Yep... Sure have...


Try 3am on the highway between Santuary Point and Nowra. Travelling into Nowra with cruise control set to 105, slowly came up behind a bum wagon and overtook him. It probably took around 2kms to overtake him and then after leaving about a 5 car length gap I pulled back into the left lane. Throttle wasn't touched, still doing 100-105. As soon as I pulled back into the left lane I saw him accelerate quickly and hit his lights. I pulled over and was rudely asked why I was doing 120 in a 100 zone to which I replied "Well Sir I think my cruise control or your radar may be wrong as the speedo said 105 maximum". His reply was "Just give me your farking license". From there I knew it wasn't going to get any better so just played the Yes Sir, No Sir game. Copped a $80 odd fine as was told not to move until they were turned off.

Sorry for the long rant but the bottom line is he was going to book me for ANYTHING he could and it just so happened to be the foggies.

[moconn20]

As far as NSW is concerned fog lights are only to be used in "adverse weather conditions". I think its safe to say dust storms count.

and please please PLEASE dont turn this into another bloody fog light arguement thread.

[zorro]

and please please PLEASE dont turn this into another bloody fog light arguement thread.

cmon they are good fun, watching people justify a lost cause is hilarious :lmao:

[VX2VESS]

air filters/otr's etc, i was thinking after today you could tell what one are good and what ones let shit in..

take you filter out and check down the intake for red dust...........

[SHANESVZSS]

i suppose it depends on the mood of the copper , BUT having said that with modified cars like ours its probably best NOT to draw attention in anyway shape or form....

[TR33VV]

What ?!? So we aren't even allowed to use em to look fully sick when out cruisin ?? :banghead:

[taner]

yea not too impressed with the weather washed the car and cleaned the air filter on monday then rained in the arvo... and now the dust..! have to CLEAN everything again:vpo:

i was told once by a fireman to turn my fog lights off when it was belting down rain... so i guess he must of thought to only use them in fog..:)

[vz300]

I have my fog lights/driving lights on through the day and also at night....... During the day people can see you coming a little easier and at night they tend to light up more each side of the car so its great for any animals running across the road and so on...... Dont forget HSV just put them in e series 2 and called them day lights so ?????

They are a safety thing pure and simple and being fined for having them on is just another rort by the government and traffic authority.

[Djbarnstar]

ive never seen or heard of anyone getting booked at night with foggis and driving lights on (not saying it doesnt happen) has any one been pinged for them at night? (genuine question btw)

Here you go. Not much fun.

http://i376.photobucket.com/albums/oo201/djbarnstar/20090923161844_00001.jpg

My Argument was that it was just on dusk. As you can see it didn't work.

[boompy]

I was pulled over in Adelaide and it was pissing down.
Told I was being pulled over because i had my fog lights on.
Subsequently breath tested and returned a positive test (4 beers in just over an hour).
6 months loss of licence which I beleive is fair as I was over the limit (not intentionally).
What i thought was unfair was that it was pouring and the cop said he had issued upwards of 6 fines that night for fog lamps as they caused glare on the wet roads and were therefore dangerous.
I had mine on for the 3 years previous and was unaware that it was illegal....wish I had known before.

[MJR-57T]

:rofl: I knew it wouldn't take long! :lmao:

not long at all :goodjob: :goodjob:


I was pulled over in Adelaide and it was pissing down.
Told I was being pulled over because i had my fog lights on.
Subsequently breath tested and returned a positive test (4 beers in just over an hour).
6 months loss of licence which I beleive is fair as I was over the limit (not intentionally).
What i thought was unfair was that it was pouring and the cop said he had issued upwards of 6 fines that night for fog lamps as they caused glare on the wet roads and were therefore dangerous.
I had mine on for the 3 years previous and was unaware that it was illegal....wish I had known before.

Ive been pulled over in NSW a few times and been told only in fog and rain
Nothing about glare on wet roads

[NewV8]

breath tested and returned a positive test (4 beers in just over an hour). I was over the limit (not intentionally).


hehe. Would 5 beers in the hour have been an intentional PCA offence?

[wikky]

I have my fog lights/driving lights on through the day and also at night....... During the day people can see you coming a little easier and at night they tend to light up more each side of the car so its great for any animals running across the road and so on...... Dont forget HSV just put them in e series 2 and called them day lights so ?????

They are a safety thing pure and simple and being fined for having them on is just another rort by the government and traffic authority.

Having your low beams on during the day is ample enough for other road users to see your car. There is no need for fog light use during the day. If you say more is better, why don't you just drive around with your hi-beams on? Also, in regards to your comment about animals running across the road, unless you drive around at 10km/h you have no chance of stopping from hitting something you pick up in your fog lights.

[moconn20]

Having your low beams on during the day is ample enough for other road users to see your car. There is no need for fog light use during the day. If you say more is better, why don't you just drive around with your hi-beams on? Also, in regards to your comment about animals running across the road, unless you drive around at 10km/h you have no chance of stopping from hitting something you pick up in your fog lights.

Dont laugh, the odd person every now and then can be seen driving around intentionally with highbeams on during the day.


I have my fog lights/driving lights on through the day and also at night....... During the day people can see you coming a little easier

This is a ridiculous call, if people need you to have foglights on for them to see you in clear weather in the middle of the day you're either on the wrong side of the road or they are blindfolded.

[keepleft]

What i thought was unfair was that it was pouring and the cop said he had issued upwards of 6 fines that night for fog lamps as they caused glare on the wet roads and were therefore dangerous.
I had mine on for the 3 years previous and was unaware that it was illegal....wish I had known before.

The answer to OP's question is "yes"; "Under hazardous weather conditions causing reduced visibility".
The same regulation covers REAR fog lights, and when visibility is reduced, particularly say in heavy dust on a length of road (say 100m< visibility), the law permits, and expects you to do so.

Also during:-
a) bushfire smoke, or
b) Heavy rain, or
d) On a gravel road where dust restricts vision of your taillights
e) In blizzard conditions, or
f) Yes, even in heavy fog.

I used parkers and front fogs for a short period this morning during the heavy dust conditions, I'd be off to court if fined for doing so. A primary advantage of this method over mere low-beam headlight use, is that the vehicles front indicators then stand-out to other traffic more clearly, as they are not then 'masked' as is otherwise the case with the headlamps.


See this Broken Hill video linked at another site, note how 'dark' it got - f.a.s.t, and imagine the on-road visibility.
YouTube - Broken Hill comes over pitch black during a dust storm (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrlD22HwPvI)

NOW, If readers think Aussies are badly done by in regards penalties when using front or rear fog lamps in clear weather conditions, see page 5 of this Singapore government FAQ on the matter:-
http://ask.lta.gov.sg/home/lta/listings.asp?projectid=9274006&category=45052#2289838

Our penalties, by comparison, are very, very weak.




Purchase a hazard-warning triangle for your car to improve the ‘warning-time’ given to approaching traffic, at both crash scenes and vehicle breakdowns. Store it in the boot. I suggest Hella Part No. 2901 - $70, or from Auto Parts Shops, - supplier "Prokit" - Item No. RG9212 - $20. A World/Euro standard triangle device exceeding AS3790 triangle performance requirements. http://www.dpi.wa.gov.au/mediaFiles/lic_drivesafe4.pdf

[moconn20]

My Argument was that it was just on dusk. As you can see it didn't work.

Yeah cops wont buy that, as i said earlier the law in NSW states it must be adverse weather conditions.


Dont forget HSV just put them in e series 2 and called them day lights so ?????



Wrong, HSV put daytime running lamps on, aswell as fog lamps... they are completely different, project a different amount of light in a different direction and serve a completely different purpose. If they were the same then HSV wouldnt have bothered with foglamps ASWELL as daytime running lamps.

[Ausmartin1]

P.S. Do we even need air filters, i read on a forum somewhere that i should take my air filter out? It only restrict air flow apparently... [/B][/QUOTE]

Must of been a racers forum with pleanty of $$$

Yes do remove your air filter for immediate SHORT term performance gains if you can afford regular rebuild - just like race cars.
For some reason finely honed cylinder walls and sliding piston rings don't work too well with SAND & GRIT. I wonder why ...:1peek:

Me - LONG TERM filtering perfomance is more important - hence stock air filter they are good quality and filter well. With longer real performance.
The days of the undersized factory air filter are well over, these days most manufactures fit a very decent setup with panel filters. They even outperform K&N ones - WHY ?
In the Longer term scored cylinder bores means less compression therfore less PEFORMANCE.
Eg. K&N may flow better initially and if KEPT CLEAN, but they block earlier than factory ones. The factory ones may have a little less flow initially - but do FILTER much better and their filtering and clogability performance over the longer term is better.

It'a a balance of Performance / Money (for rebuilds) and Longetivity.

Cheers.

[alexcs]

most fog lights on our commodores are useless in any whether be it clear or foggy. they illuminate the first two feet in front of your car, which is really only useful if youve lost a contact or want some illuminating action on your bonnet with a nice young lass.

seriously, theyre for looks dudes, just admit it. :)

[keepleft]

most fog lights on our commodores are useless in any whether be it clear or foggy. they illuminate the first two feet in front of your car.

Sure, because UNDER seriously reduced visibility, your SPEED *should* be reduced; the lamps work by reducing 'reflected glare' caused by low-beam headlight operation, and because under such low visibility it is not feasible to send a beam-of-light a great distance down the road, so instead; - front fogs will show the close-in edges of the roadway better - than those low-beam headlights, and will work well on that basis - IF the driver is doing the right thing and has slowed down for the prevailing conditions.


Your right though, for some here its the 'look', its quite sad:-) Per my previous post, see Q5 of this Singapore government FAQ, AUS penalties for using front and rear fogs in clear weather, are weak by comparison:-
http://ask.lta.gov.sg/home/lta/listings.asp?projectid=9274006&category=45052#2289838


Purchase a hazard-warning triangle for your car to improve the ‘warning-time’ given to approaching traffic, at both crash scenes and vehicle breakdowns. Store it in the boot. I suggest Hella Part No. 2901 - $70, or from Auto Parts Shops, - supplier "Prokit" - Item No. RG9212 - $20. A World/Euro standard triangle device exceeding AS3790 triangle performance requirements. http://www.dpi.wa.gov.au/mediaFiles/lic_drivesafe4.pdf

[WLDLS1]

what you guys are forgetting is that the lights in the bar on your SS/HSV ETC are not FOG lights. they are DRIVING LIGHTS. you can use driving lights on dusk or dawn. you are not meant to have them on all day. dont know about dust. FOG lights are yellow.

[keepleft]

what you guys are forgetting is that the lights in the bar on your SS/HSV ETC are not FOG lights. they are DRIVING LIGHTS. you can use driving lights on dusk or dawn. you are not meant to have them on all day. don't know about dust. FOG lights are yellow.

Driving lights reference = Wrong. Point blank sir. The subject lamps bear the FRONT FOG Compliance Code; "B", AND the SWITCH uses the FRONT FOG LIGHT "ISO symbol". Complianced front fog lights are "white-optic" or "selective yellow", the *majority* on road are white-optic nowadays.

Every year seasonally, in and out without fail, this topic raises its head and the same things are stated, discussed, refuted. Australia's law on the matter (use of and standards) is now harmonised with "the rest of the world team".


NB - The VX-VY Series SS 'fogs' were NOT compliant with world standards, and are discontinued. They were noted "glaries". HSV units of the same model range WERE compliant.


TAKE A LOOK AT THE SINGAPORE GOVERNMENT FAQ ON THE MATTER, IT SHOULD HELP READERS. Weblink above in earlier post.


Purchase a hazard-warning triangle for your car to improve the ‘warning-time’ given to approaching traffic, at both crash scenes and vehicle breakdowns. Store it in the boot. I suggest Hella Part No. 2901 - $70, or from Auto Parts Shops, - supplier "Prokit" - Item No. RG9212 - $20. A World/Euro standard triangle device exceeding AS3790 triangle performance requirements. http://www.dpi.wa.gov.au/mediaFiles/lic_drivesafe4.pdf

[moconn20]

what you guys are forgetting is that the lights in the bar on your SS/HSV ETC are not FOG lights. they are DRIVING LIGHTS. you can use driving lights on dusk or dawn. you are not meant to have them on all day. dont know about dust. FOG lights are yellow.

Any highway patrol copper will disagree with you and give you a ticket for having them on at dusk or dawn.
However if your argument holds up in court and you get off your fine let me know, ill use it as a precident case if i ever get a ticket.

[WLDLS1]

Driving lights reference = Wrong. Point blank sir. The subject lamps bear the Compliance Code; "B".



Purchase a hazard-warning triangle for your car to improve the ‘warning-time’ given to approaching traffic, at both crash scenes and vehicle breakdowns. Store it in the boot. I suggest Hella Part No. 2901 - $70, or from Auto Parts Shops, - supplier "Prokit" - Item No. RG9212 - $20. A World/Euro standard triangle device exceeding AS3790 triangle performance requirements. http://www.dpi.wa.gov.au/mediaFiles/lic_drivesafe4.pdf

are no i am not. ring your dealer and ask him if your car comes with fog lights. NO it comes with driving lights. read your owners manual. DRIVING LIGHTS. fog lights are yellow. that works best in fog. a white beam will not. you have driving lights in your car for a reason. to use on dusk or dawn without using headlights. they are not illeagal. they are installed by your manafacture for a reason and are still installed in cars. they are not fog lights.

[macca_779]

are no i am not. ring your dealer and ask him if your car comes with fog lights. NO it comes with driving lights. read your owners manual. DRIVING LIGHTS. fog lights are yellow. that works best in fog. a white beam will not. you have driving lights in your car for a reason. to use on dusk or dawn without using headlights. they are not illeagal. they are installed by your manifacture for a reason and are still installed in cars. they are not fog lights.

Your actually questioning Keepleft on this? Your kidding right. Perhaps you should do some research on what actually determines a driving light. You honestly think a Dealerships word or an incorrectly printed owners manual determines legal policy.. That would be the day.

[WLDLS1]

why would i not question him. they are driving lights. check and legal doc and you will see. australian legal doc. not singapore.

Print Fog & driving lights
Using fog or driving lights at the wrong time can make it difficult for other drivers to see. Incorrect use of fog or driving lights can result in a fine and loss of points from your licence.


Using fog lights
Front fog lights are designed to better illuminate the road in fog, snowfall, rainstorms or dust clouds. They can be recognised by the narrow pattern of light emitted.

Road Rule 217 states that drivers must not use front or rear fog lights unless driving in fog or other hazardous weather conditions that cause reduced visibility.

Fog lights cannot be accidentally switched on. They must be switched on separate from the main and dipped beam head lights.


Using driving lights
Driving lights are designed to illuminate the road over a long distance. They are the same as the high beam (main beam) head light and emit the same lighting pattern.

Road Rule 218 states that drivers must not use the high-beam headlights when driving:


less than 200 metres behind a vehicle travelling in the same direction
less than 200 metres from an oncoming vehicle.

Driving lights cannot be accidentally switched on. They can only be switched on and off with the high beam head lights.


More information
For more information on lighting standards and the installation of lights on vehicles please see: Vehicle Standards Information Sheet No.10: Installation of lights on road vehicles [PDF, 4.32MB, 83PP]

this is the law in victoria. you can use driving lights when less than 200 metres behind a vehicle travelling in the same direction
less than 200 metres from an oncoming vehicle.

NOTICE two types off lights. FOG AND DRIVING. WE HAVE DRIVING LIGHTS. NOT FOG LIGHTS.

And there is a flaw in the law because all new cars can turn on driving lights without having high beam lights on. They can only be switched on and off with the high beam head lights..

[keepleft]

why would i not question him. they are driving lights. check and legal doc and you will see. Australian legal doc. Not singapore.

Standards: - Australia, on the matter of front fog lights in regards DESIGN, MOUNTING and WIRING are the same as Singapore, Germany, England, China, New Zealand, Suid Afrika, basically well over 92 countries that are the UNECE contracting parties.


DRIVING LIGHTS, are a lamp wired to ONLY operate in conjunction with the cars regular high-beam. Aftermarket installs MUST have a switch, so the driver can alternate between the cars regular high-beam headlamps AND the added driving lamps.

Do you follow??


NOTICE two types off lights. FOG AND DRIVING. WE HAVE DRIVING LIGHTS. NOT FOG LIGHTS.
Which model and build date - car, *exactly* do you have?



Purchase a hazard-warning triangle for your car to improve the ‘warning-time’ given to approaching traffic, at both crash scenes and vehicle breakdowns. Store it in the boot. I suggest Hella Part No. 2901 - $70, or from Auto Parts Shops, - supplier "Prokit" - Item No. RG9212 - $20. A World/Euro standard triangle device exceeding AS3790 triangle performance requirements. http://www.dpi.wa.gov.au/mediaFiles/lic_drivesafe4.pdf

[boompy]

hehe. Would 5 beers in the hour have been an intentional PCA offence?
Possibly, my point was that I would not have driven if I thought I was over the limit or was feeling drunk.
Many people I know do not care about drinking and driving regardless of how intoxicated they may be.
I would call them intentional drink drivers.

[moconn20]

Using fog lights
Front fog lights are designed to better illuminate the road in fog, snowfall, rainstorms or dust clouds. They can be recognised by the narrow pattern of light emitted.

Fog lights cannot be accidentally switched on. They must be switched on separate from the main and dipped beam head lights.


Using driving lights
Driving lights are designed to illuminate the road over a long distance. They are the same as the high beam (main beam) head light and emit the same lighting pattern.



Youve just shot your own argument down... if you think your factory fitted fog "driving" lights are "the same as the high beam (main beam) head light and emit the same lighting pattern" then your on crack.

Personally the fog "driving" lights that came on my 2009 SSV wagon emit a narrow pattern of light and have a sperate switch... therefore according to your "evidence" my car came with FOG lights not DRIVING lights.

Thanks for your help on clearing this up.

[aedeau]

Section 1A-31 of my owners manual refers to my lower lights as "Fog lamps". these look basically the same as the headlights to me (not yellow in colour).

[macca33]

You can lead a horse to water.....:doh:

[WLDLS1]

best you take the time to have a read.
For more information on lighting standards and the installation of lights on vehicles please see: Vehicle Standards Information Sheet No.10: Installation of lights on road vehicles [PDF, 4.32MB, 83PP]

[White Rider]

why would i not question him. they are driving lights. check and legal doc and you will see. australian legal doc. not singapore.

Print Fog & driving lights
Using fog or driving lights at the wrong time can make it difficult for other drivers to see. Incorrect use of fog or driving lights can result in a fine and loss of points from your licence.


Using fog lights
Front fog lights are designed to better illuminate the road in fog, snowfall, rainstorms or dust clouds. They can be recognised by the narrow pattern of light emitted.

Road Rule 217 states that drivers must not use front or rear fog lights unless driving in fog or other hazardous weather conditions that cause reduced visibility.

Fog lights cannot be accidentally switched on. They must be switched on separate from the main and dipped beam head lights.


Using driving lights
Driving lights are designed to illuminate the road over a long distance. They are the same as the high beam (main beam) head light and emit the same lighting pattern.

Road Rule 218 states that drivers must not use the high-beam headlights when driving:


less than 200 metres behind a vehicle travelling in the same direction
less than 200 metres from an oncoming vehicle.

Driving lights cannot be accidentally switched on. They can only be switched on and off with the high beam head lights.


More information
For more information on lighting standards and the installation of lights on vehicles please see: Vehicle Standards Information Sheet No.10: Installation of lights on road vehicles [PDF, 4.32MB, 83PP]

this is the law in victoria. you can use driving lights when less than 200 metres behind a vehicle travelling in the same direction
less than 200 metres from an oncoming vehicle.

NOTICE two types off lights. FOG AND DRIVING. WE HAVE DRIVING LIGHTS. NOT FOG LIGHTS.

And there is a flaw in the law because all new cars can turn on driving lights without having high beam lights on. They can only be switched on and off with the high beam head lights..


What? If we have driving lights they dont meet the criteria you listed:

-they dont act like high beams (on the car they r narrow and short)
-they turn on even when high beam is not selected

Fog lights can be yellow or white: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fog_lights

[WLDLS1]

and in answer to the question that started this thread. YES YOU CAN. BY LAW AS IT IS CLASSED AS A HAZZARD.

[moconn20]

best you take the time to have a read.


i think someone needs a re-read

[keepleft]

Youve just shot your own argument down... if you think your factory fitted fog "driving" lights are "the same as the high beam (main beam) head light and emit the same lighting pattern" then your on crack.

Personally the fog "driving" lights that came on my 2009 SSV wagon emit a narrow pattern of light and have a sperate switch... therefore according to your "evidence" my car came with FOG lights not DRIVING lights.

Thanks for your help on clearing this up.

Fella is confusing l.a.w that regulates USE of "headlights (low/high), front fog and driving lights" and mistakes that for Australian Design Rule parameter (& NVS) that DEFINES what each lamp is.

Each automotive lamp has specific compliance markings, and the ISO switch symbols can further help identify complianced function, most people here understand all that.

Fella could be confused with "auto lamps on" feature. Here, low-beam is activated.

We'll not discuss "cornering lamps" or DRL's:-)))




best you take the time to have a read.
For more information on lighting standards and the installation of lights on vehicles please see: Vehicle Standards Information Sheet No.10: Installation of lights on road vehicles [PDF, 4.32MB, 83PP]
Thank you for quoting some of my old work:-)




Purchase a hazard-warning triangle for your car to improve the ‘warning-time’ given to approaching traffic, at both crash scenes and vehicle breakdowns. Store it in the boot. I suggest Hella Part No. 2901 - $70, or from Auto Parts Shops, - supplier "Prokit" - Item No. RG9212 - $20. A World/Euro standard triangle device exceeding AS3790 triangle performance requirements. http://www.dpi.wa.gov.au/mediaFiles/lic_drivesafe4.pdf

[moconn20]

We'll not discuss "cornering lamps" or DRL's:-)))



jesus dont open that can of worms haha



Thank you for quoting some of my work:-)



Oh SNAP :rofl:

[vz300]

This is a ridiculous call, if people need you to have foglights on for them to see you in clear weather in the middle of the day you're either on the wrong side of the road or they are blindfolded.

Ridiculous call is it....... So why then must road bikes or any bike for that matter that use our roads have a light on at all times day or not....... Its proven fact that You pick up a light weather it be day or night before you pick up anything else.......... Its hard to believe that someone can make such a stupid comment as you have but on ls1 I suppose nothing suprises me.......:rofl:

[moconn20]

Ridiculous call is it....... So why then must road bikes or any bike for that matter that use our roads have a light on at all times day or not....... Its proven fact that You pick up a light weather it be day or night before you pick up anything else.......... Its hard to believe that someone can make such a stupid comment as you have but on ls1 I suppose nothing suprises me.......:rofl:

You backup your theory with an argument based on a roadbike, not a car.
If your car is the size of a roadbike ill eat my own head.

[WLDLS1]

Is it legal to use foglights in dusts storms?:)


Don't forget to clean your air filters after today!

yes it is.


You backup your theory with an argument based on a roadbike, not a car.
If your car is the size of a roadbike ill eat my own head.

its about being visable. big or small.

[vz300]

Is your user name moccon is it or morron..... I back up my argument with common sense........ If a light was not easily seen before a car the why would police ambulance and fire engines use lights that flash in an emergency.........

[Jarhead]

Guys,

Keepleft is 100% correct in regards to the use of, and definition of, fog lights.

Remember ignorance is no excuse in the eyes of the law. My mother-in-law was pulled over for speeding for the first time in her life at age 54 on her way from Toowoomba for Christmas lunch. The officer ended up giving her a warning - probably couldn't stop laughing. When asked if she had any reason for speeding she replied (straight faced), "what do you mean, 'speeding'?" The officer expalined that it was a 80km/h posted speed limit. She replied (again, straight faced) " My husband - rest his soul - told me those signs were only a 'suggested' speed for the road conditions". :confused:

When she told us the story over Xmas lunch I couldn't believe anyone could be so stupid.

[BigAl83]

Is your user name moccon is it or morron..... I back up my argument with common sense........ If a light was not easily seen before a car the why would police ambulance and fire engines use lights that flash in an emergency.........

If you drive down the road flicking your lights on and off people might see you better. :idea:

Driving lights come on with the high beams, Foggies don't. As has been stated the fog lights shine under the front of the car to prevent the blinding reflection you get with normal headlights in heavy fog. Driving with them on to be more visible is just :jerk: factor, parkers do this perfectly adequately.

[wikky]

Is your user name moccon is it or morron..... I back up my argument with common sense........ If a light was not easily seen before a car the why would police ambulance and fire engines use lights that flash in an emergency.........

Common sense? Fark me. You can't compare a motorcycle with a car. It's 1/4 the width. That's why they require a light on at all times. But earlier you were saying that having your fog lights on AS WELL as your headlights is better to be seen by an oncoming car. A motorcycle runs a headlight too, not fog lights. Your arguement is flawed.
Also you can't compare flashing lights (coloured in fact) to a set of headlights or fog lights: apples and oranges mate.

[moconn20]

Is your user name moccon is it or morron..... I back up my argument with common sense........ If a light was not easily seen before a car the why would police ambulance and fire engines use lights that flash in an emergency.........

Resorting to personal insults is childish. Grow up.
I never said a light wasnt easily seen before a car, simply implied its not necessary on a clear day... which its not.
If you drive down the road with red and blue lights flashing and a siren blaring then i guess you have a valid point.

Lets keep in mind that emergency vehicles have a heightened requirement of visability because they run red lights, speed, and drive on the wrong side of the road.

Once again, the example you've chosen to support your argument is not relevent to the everyday driving situation.

[MJR-57T]

Guys,

Keepleft is 100% correct in regards to the use of, and definition of, fog lights.


Correct
You may as well bash your head on the keyboard coz you'll get further.
One thing ive learnt is that keep left actually knows what he's talking about and a few times have felt like bashing my head on the keyboard too.

Just give up, admit defeat and get on with your life with your fog lights off

I do have to mention though, is there a model of VE (Holden or HSV) that have the bottom lights come on with (and only with) high beam.
I remember reading about it in the same style of fog light argument thread a few weeks ago.
Maybe WLDLS1 is mistaking fogs for these highbeam activated lamps (if they exist)


Is your user name moccon is it or morron..... I back up my argument with common sense........ If a light was not easily seen before a car the why would police ambulance and fire engines use lights that flash in an emergency.........

Dont forget that we use both sirens and lights for all response driving.

The lights are basically useless during a clear sunny day so we rely on the sirens.

The lights come into effect at night where the siren is only used around traffic and then turned off to let the sleeping get a good night sleep

If you cant see a car approaching you with no lights on during a clear day then you might need to consider glasses

[alexcs]

Ridiculous call is it....... So why then must road bikes or any bike for that matter that use our roads have a light on at all times day or not....... Its proven fact that You pick up a light weather it be day or night before you pick up anything else.......... Its hard to believe that someone can make such a stupid comment as you have but on ls1 I suppose nothing suprises me.......:rofl:

but why use the foglights that often dazzle oncoming road users? use your ****ing headlights on lowbeam like every other sane person.

i understand having your parkers on and foglights looks quite good, but theres no genuine reason for doing so when your low beams are more effective and less annoying.

[taztassio]

Yes you can.

In October (Qld) there will be a $40 fine for having your foggies on if there are no adverse weather conditions.

In common sense terms - if it's a clear night and you have them on = fine.

If there are weather conditions making visibility more difficult (eg dust, fog, rain) then you will be justified for having them on. I will go as far as to say that no one will ever get pinged for having them on in any of the examples above.

Personally I find night time visibility better with them on. I have had them on for the last 7 years. I understand the other side to the arguement. There have been times when an oncoming vehicle has blinded me with badly aligned fog lights. They can be worse than high beam. My opinion is that factory fitted fog lights are ok but a lot of aftermarket ones (particularly if not fitted correctly) can anoy other motorists.

I only have 'driving lights' ;)

[moconn20]

Dont forget that we use both sirens and lights for all response driving.


have i finally found a fellow NSW ambo on here?

[MJR-57T]

have i finally found a fellow NSW ambo on here?

Close
NSWFB

[Sime]

Anyone who gets dazzled by driving lights on a holden/hsv on a clear day should go get their eyes checked. How the f*@k do you people cope at night with normal headlights?? If they're a real problem then don't bloody look straight at them! Based on my own vision, a car is more visible in the day with it's fog lights on, particularly on a highway where cars coming towards you are crossing on to the wrong side of the road to overtake. The fact you can get fined for this is outrageous! I have my fog lights on during the day no matter what the conditions. Perhaps it makes a-holes think twice before pulling out of side streets and forcing me to slam on the brakes. The foggies go off at night because, yes, they are irritating at night. But they're no more irritating than these blue/white xenon lights going around!

[vz300]

Anyone who gets dazzled by driving lights on a holden/hsv on a clear day should go get their eyes checked. How the f*@k do you people cope at night with normal headlights?? If they're a real problem then don't bloody look straight at them! Based on my own vision, a car is more visible in the day with it's fog lights on, particularly on a highway where cars coming towards you are crossing on to the wrong side of the road to overtake. The fact you can get fined for this is outrageous! I have my fog lights on during the day no matter what the conditions. Perhaps it makes a-holes think twice before pulling out of side streets and forcing me to slam on the brakes. The foggies go off at night because, yes, they are irritating at night. But they're no more irritating than these blue/white xenon lights going around!


At last someone else that can see some sense as to wear im coming from..........

[SHANESVZSS]

to be honest even the day time driving lights on audi's ect.. can be annoying when you look directly into them , so i agree when you say dont look into them , for the recored i only drive with my foggies on during the day IF/AFTER someone cuts me off or nearly hits my car...(either way its illegal)

[yiddo]

LOL @ this thread.

Fog Lights.
Driving Lights.

Who cares.

If you feel you are doing the right thing with them off, then thumbs up, keep them off, you won't get a fine..

If you want to have them on, leave them on, but expect to possibly cop a fine. If you have an issue with it, take it up with the cop and / or take it to court. If not, pay the fine.

[vessloveit]

Forget about the fog/driving light issue, what about the use of your normal low beam when visibilty is poor eg rain etc people who put their parkers on in this situation or no lights at all a down right danger to themselves and other road users.

Even saw a police car in light rain without any lights on at all WTF.

[WOMBIE]

Another farking fog light debate :lol:

[MJR-57T]

LOL @ this thread.

Fog Lights.
Driving Lights.

Who cares.

If you feel you are doing the right thing with them off, then thumbs up, keep them off, you won't get a fine..

If you want to have them on, leave them on, but expect to possibly cop a fine. If you have an issue with it, take it up with the cop and / or take it to court. If not, pay the fine.

Couldn't word it better




Another farking fog light debate :lol:


Ill put $10 on another 3 by the end of the year

[alexcs]

and they still dont get it. certain models have ****ing bright foglights that are actually brighter than their highbeams. it is ****ING ANNOYING to cop every second knob who thinks driving with foglights on, day or night helps him see any better. They are useless and there is no valid reason for using them. If part of the joy you get in life is to annoy other road users then jump in, but otherwise try and realise they piss people off. I do 200k in a truck every year and apart from most of the VE foglights, the rest are directionless and genuinely look like youve got high beams on at night. in the day its easy to ignore, but at night it ****s with your eyes.

but hey, at least you look like a star when youve got them on right? **** everyone else.