Maf/Mafless tune price?

[Beepa]

Hey all,(this is my first post so please wear a raincoat when you do me)but, first up as far as noob goes I'm the flag bearer!! I have just purchased a vx ss 2000..170000k's (yes a time bomb) but all in excellent cond. and I'm more than happy!! After abusing the 'search' button I am more confused than informed about basic add on's ect. I can sift through all the BS in my own spare time!...But there are questions I would like to ask,(bloody noob)...
OK first up...aside frow what combo exh/otr I choose.. Why is a custom tune so expensive? as to my understanding this does not involve constant dyno runs....(for example..I'm an electrician and have several different programmes/operating systems at my disposal(not automotive sozz), apart from major upgrades or physcial wiring/upgrade these software 'upgrades' are pretty straight forth, apart from individual programing for different requirements((which yes we can charge heaps...but its not warranted if you witness the very little work required))...and still this service is not charged at an exorbrant rate..) So with very little information or experience I would like to know if..On a maf or mafless tune do they dyno it multiple times as part of a dynamic tune?....Or do they insert a 'base' or common tune and leave it at that? ( yes I understand the cost involved in the purchase etc of such software) but am puzzled with the price of such a tune when it can be delivered much cheaper(with the corrosponding gains in workshop activity due to poor/failed results)..no offence to any tuner(gonna be dropping in soon) but just trying to understand the price vs benefit ( I completely understand the value of an experienced, professional tuner/tradesman) but with every second shop promising a tune that will deliver 'x'kw...It appears to me there is a 'generic' or two type programme about.... How do I avoid this type of programme (as a noob) whilst still willing to pay for an expert?(and dont say search....u do it and see the diverse results!)...thanks guys!!:goodjob:

[TheRealMadMax]

...I completely understand the value of an experienced, professional tuner/tradesman...

I think that sums it up pretty well. I don't know much in this space, but I would imagine this is a supply versus demand concern. Only a small number of people have the equipement and know how to use it, however there are many who want the service.

You could always go a mail order for half (or less) the price and still experience most of the benefits, if not all. (after re-reading this, the same probably applies to mail order brides also, however that might need a different thread!)

[bush_basha]

dynos and the software is expensive, hence why its expensive. but with the 3 or 4 dyno runs they do, they stick a base tune in, run in up and adjust things to suit your engine and mods, and then run it up again and keep adjusting until they get the maximum out of your car.

[WhiteLion]

Talk to Steve @ Oztrack (Forum sponsor) :goodjob:

Steve

[QldKev]

I recently went through the same search as you are doing.

Info: I live up in Bundy so for me to be in the city (Brisbane, about 4hrs away) at one of the better shops around during a working day gets pretty hard.

A custom tune on the dyno will give the best results. As mentioned above you get the base tune and then it gets perfected to suit your car on the dyno; so you are paying for the tuner with their experience and dyno time.

A mail order tune will get you a decent base tune; from what I read it is 90% as good as a custom one will be; still a huge different from a stock tune.

To me I ended up getting a mailorder mafless tune + DuSpeed OTRCAI from Oztrack that I could fit at home, for about the same price a custom tune alone would cost.

Now if I was chasing every 1/10sec at the drag/track or I need bragging rights with the dyno printout then a custom tune would be a lot more important. In my case I just wanted a bit more from my VX and wasn't as worried about chasing those last couple of rwkw.


QldKev

[SS Enforcer]

Or for the cost of a tune and otr you could buy the software and AFR gauge and start learning to tune yourself. Never have to pay for a tune again once you have learnt to use it, quite a few here tune their own cars.

cheers

[Jonesy40]

Or for the cost of a tune and otr you could buy the software and AFR gauge and start learning to tune yourself. Never have to pay for a tune again once you have learnt to use it, quite a few here tune their own cars.

cheers

i have thought about doing this. can you recommend a good place to start reading about tunning these enigines?

[SS Enforcer]

i have thought about doing this. can you recommend a good place to start reading about tunning these enigines?

http://forum.efilive.com/
http://www.hptuners.com/forum/
http:// www.ls1tech.com

I use Efilive which I bought through Oztrack and really had bugger all issues with it. It's not rocket science really just fuel and spark the VE's are a bit harder to tune though.

cheers

[Jonesy40]

thanks mate ill have a read though thoose links when i get a chance.

i think i would get great pleasure out of tunning my own car a possible a couple of my mates if i do go down that path.

[Oztrack Tuning]

You had a good coach though Paul :). Its not that easy when people have to start from scratch with a stock tune using the stock OS. Gen IV E38s are far harder than LS1s as well.

The factory OS will let AFRs drift alot when faced with variations in ambient temperature when its mafless and it really needs a heap of work to be anywhere near as nice as one our mail order tunes. The best way to start self tuning is to buy EFILive from us and a base tune with orientation. I will show you what to do to get the tune perfected and you will have lots of fun logging and tweaking. You will end up with a tune better than any 1 day custom tune and save money with further mods.

I see many badly formed tunes so it certainly isn't easy. The best 2 have been an overseas tune that cost over 1000 dollars AU and it had just 3 things changed and one of them was the idle speed. Another had a heap of things changed randomly that are best left unchanged, the worst of them had the car varying in spark timing by up to 30 degrees as it was idling from spark correction of idle speed.

[Jonesy40]

oztrack i will send you an email with a few question in regards to this today if i get a chance.

[ratter]

Hey beepa, without sounding disrespectful to you, how hard can it be to join 3 color coded wires together?, that's how some would look at your job. Please do not have a go at me, I understand there is far more to it than that, but some look at others jobs and think it is easy. Plumbers have it easier again, they just join pipes together and make sure they point downwards, see my point.

There are some guys out there that will tune with very little time taken on getting the best out of a customers car and then there are some that will spend all day on the dyno to make sure they are delivering the best result they can. As a customer it is hard to find out who is doing what, but asking questions on forums like this can steer you in the best direction.

Some think a good tune makes good power on the dyno, that's the easy part, almost anyone can do that, the good tunes deliver great throttle response, fuel mixtures etc everywhere, that where the time can come into it.

There can also be a lot of associated costs when using a workshop, they are using a dyno which may owe them $80000-$150000, they have the software which some includes license fees etc, I'm sure you would like an experienced operator tuning and running your car on a dyno rather than just some hack, these guys may be paid more, there is rent, power etc etc

You have done the right thing by asking, you may now have a better idea of why somebody is charging what they do and feel better about your choices :goodjob: