VE SSV LOst 5th & 6th Gear

[Finney]

Hi List,

Need some help....My VS SSV manual with 168K on the speedo lost 5th and 6th gear. Holden are telling me they won't help me financially.

What are peoples experiences with something like this?

With Holden Customer Service Telling me this, they are saying that the gear boxes are only good for about 160-170k....Bit of a worry really!

Thanks in advance

Finney

[peter b]

They will say they won't help because the car is out of warranty by 68000 kms if it happened closer to the 100000 mark you would find that they would have come to the party. Holden warranty is actually quite good in comparison to some other car companies but it isnt just out of warranty and the way they see it if they helped you with this being this far out of warranty then they would have to do the same for everyone else.

[Finney]

Thanks for the response, so it still stands....The VE SS 6 Speed Manual Gearbox is only good for about 160-170K....sounds like a pretty expensive issue and something that needs to be taken into account when negotiating for when ppl choose to buy Holden or perhaps not buy with such knowledge?

[swingtan]

A little more infor would be good...

What year is the car?
Where has it been serviced?
What sort of life has the car had? Does it tow a lot etc?
What other issues has the car had, if any?
What other components have been changed? Clutch, brakes etc and how often?
Has the car been modified?


all this needs to be taken into account.

Simon

[VX2VESS]

A little more infor would be good...

What year is the car?
Where has it been serviced?
What sort of life has the car had? Does it tow a lot etc?
What other issues has the car had, if any?
What other components have been changed? Clutch, brakes etc and how often?
Has the car been modified?


all this needs to be taken into account.

Simon

yes but its an auto i think..

Some may last longer depending on how used, but generally most autos have issues by 200,000.

Change the fluid every 20,000 helps

Not sure on the A6 but the A4's died early from manual shifting them, some well under 100,000

[swingtan]

See post #3.....

[steve_t]

Thanks for the response, so it still stands....The VE SS 6 Speed Manual Gearbox is only good for about 160-170K....sounds like a pretty expensive issue and something that needs to be taken into account when negotiating for when ppl choose to buy Holden or perhaps not buy with such knowledge?

I'm sure there are plenty of M6 'boxes that have done over 160 and plenty that haven't even come close to reaching 160. As Swingtan said, there are a LOT of factors that influence the lifespan of drivetrain components.
At 160k on the clock, it's not surprising that Holden aren't going to help.
Get it checked out and see what the damage will be. If you've bent the shift fork, a new 5-6 shift fork may only be $50 for the part plus labour. It may not be as expensive as you think... hopefully :goodjob:

[Finney]

Thanks for the responses. To answer some questions:

Year 2007 (Oct)
Regularily serviced by Holden
Does lot's of highway work - cruising along - Very little towing and only a small aluminium boat about 6 times and and another trailer but that is not much and light.
Few other issues....Not major.
Due to a lot of hghway work, brake shoes last a long time
Stock Standard

[peter b]

The comment saying they only last 160,000 kms doesnt have much weight behind it I am afraid too many factors and you could be the unlucky 1 out of 100. These boxes are mass produced but to buy a car and expect to never have a failure of any kind is a bit high and then to turn around and say this part will only last X amount of kms because you had a failure is a bit rich. If ALL of the A6 boxes died under same circumstances and same kms then ok your comments would be justified but how do you justify saying a part will only last this amount of kms because you have had a failure.

[swingtan]

OK then, 3 months out of the 3 year limit and 68,000 km over the 100,000 km limit.

The fact that it's been regularly serviced at Holden and had few issues should be a good thing and if it was only just over the 100,000 km mark, Holden would possibly help out. When was the last time the oil was changed in the box and who did that? It might be worth checking the levels.

Simon.

[peter b]

68,000 km over the 100,000 km limit.

That is the only part Holden will look at I'm afraid to say.
Do know the warranty procedure fairly well if it was only 10,000 km over you would find their response would be different

[steve_t]

68,000 km over the 100,000 km limit.

That is the only part Holden will look at I'm afraid to say.
Do know the warranty procedure fairly well if it was only 10,000 km over you would find their response would be different

That's really good to hear :goodjob: I was under the impression that, these days, you'd be lucky to get warranty coverage if you'd done 100,100km (unless you have an amazing relationship with the dealer). This, of course, is only the impression I get from stories here :rofl: If someone has covered someone's car that had done 110,000km I would hold them in very high regard :goodjob:

[peter b]

Holden are very reasonable when it comes to warranty but there is an extent to where they would say yes and when you will get a flat out no. Unfortunately it comes down to Kms and that is more than 1.5 times the warranty period
3yrs or 100,000 kms whichever comes first

[VX2VESS]

See post #3.....

ok missed that

they are a shit clunky tractor type box. an Excel box is even smoother than these.

if you leave auto fluid in them for that long probably will fail.

[Finney]

Hey there,

A few comments to the thread:

I get the car regularily serviced as per the manufacturers specifications at the dealer I bought it from. If that means change the oil in the box, then they do it. I do know the oil was change about 40K ago as it was difficult to get into 1st but I have no idea if it is part of regular servicing. That determination should be part of what testing is about!

In regards to ppls comments that too bad too sad you could be the unlucky one, then there is just as much reason to help if there were 50/100. The fact is this car has been well maintained, done highway work and the box couldn't cope. Just maybe (I don't know for sure) I am one of the unlucky ones but that isn't acceptable. This is a huge company and for the sake of customer sat it would be in their interests to look after their customers. With the internet, social media and the many choiuces of vehicles these days, there is much influence and the ability to communicate with many thousands of people. Certainly this gives the ability to influence on sheer fact of what has happened.

Scenario: Last Vehicle Toyota Lancruiser 267K on the clock and still going strong. New vehicle Holden SSV - Dead gearbox at 168K....Mmmmm

Interesting also that googling has found similar problems...Not many but some...So one does wonder how deep the problem really is. I will also say that the mechanic that I spoke to at the dealer told me he has changed quite a lot of these boxes....Mmmmmmmm

Cheers

Finney

[BLACK 346]

My first T56 lasted just over 8k, would not go into any gear. Was replaced under warranty at the time though. I still have the Holden Invoice somewhere that listed the cost of the replacement box at $8,000 :eek: This was back in 2001.

[Knawful]

My 'box (07 VE) lasted all of 38k km's.
Holden replaced the box, they never got back to me as to what the drama was.
First they tried to blame the (aftermarket) clutch.

Symptoms were: hard to get into 2nd, sometimes kicking out of gear, then 4th went, then 6th.

Doesnt help you much, but it seem's there were gearbox dramas in some of the earlier VE's...

Bad batch of recyled coke can's hit mexico is my guess.

[steve_t]

Where do you draw the line? 168k is a fair few k's. Do you think the warranty should expire at 200k? Do you think they should warranty the vehicle forever so long as you stick to their prescribed service schedule? Did your Landcruiser gearbox have to withstand 260kw and 517nm of torque?
Have you looked at the thread about replacing the brakes on HSVs after 35,000km?


Again, I'm not sure if this is the right solution for you but

http://www.thegearbox.org/catalog/item/3838217/3508335.htm

US$23.95 for the selector fork

[DioXidE]

Have you looked into the laws of statutary warranty???

If a product has a perceived life of x amount of ks then it should last that long... Talk to the ACCC and you might get it sorted :)

[moconn20]

Scenario: Last Vehicle Toyota Lancruiser 267K on the clock and still going strong. New vehicle Holden SSV - Dead gearbox at 168K....Mmmmm


The day a landcruiser is outlasted by a commodore is the day I'll eat my hat.




Interesting also that googling has found similar problems...Not many but some...So one does wonder how deep the problem really is. I will also say that the mechanic that I spoke to at the dealer told me he has changed quite a lot of these boxes....Mmmmmmmm



Have you seen this thread?
another c4b bites the dust (http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=144714)
It wouldnt be the first time an issue has popped up down the track with a mechanical component in their vehicles.

[ryno]

Like with any vehicle problems will crop up if enough of them are on the road, its just unfortunate when your the one with the problem.

My 07 gearbox didn't make 40K let alone 167K.. Twice out then finally a replacement box and my problems are sorted.

Im involved in large fleets and can say that all manufacturers have their bad moments.

[BLACK 346]

The day a landcruiser is outlasted by a commodore is the day I'll eat my hat.

Plenty of late 70's and early 80's Commodores getting around Adelaide. What sauce you want with the hat? :)

[Toddler78]

:doh: seriously what do you expect, the car is 68000 out of warrenty , as fabreaus said, it is not just out of warrenty, a lot of companies big and small will come to the party if a product is just out of warrenty (depending on your demeaner to them), but what you are asking is pretty over the top. for the shear number of these boxes out there I don think it is a eperdemic of broken boxes out there, they are a mechanical part and as such are subject to failure, thats why you have a 100,000km, 3year warrenty. did you get the dealer extended warrenty? if yes why cant you use that if no then maybe a lesson to be learnt for next time you buy a new car that is going to be driven over the average number of kays. But I dont think you should bad mouth or feel shafted by holden for not coming to the party

[duke5700]

I don't think you can expect too much of Holden...

The reason could be anything and nothing to do with manufacturing fault.

[peter b]

Hey there,

A few comments to the thread:

I get the car regularily serviced as per the manufacturers specifications at the dealer I bought it from. If that means change the oil in the box, then they do it. I do know the oil was change about 40K ago as it was difficult to get into 1st but I have no idea if it is part of regular servicing. That determination should be part of what testing is about!

In regards to ppls comments that too bad too sad you could be the unlucky one, then there is just as much reason to help if there were 50/100. The fact is this car has been well maintained, done highway work and the box couldn't cope. Just maybe (I don't know for sure) I am one of the unlucky ones but that isn't acceptable. This is a huge company and for the sake of customer sat it would be in their interests to look after their customers. With the internet, social media and the many choiuces of vehicles these days, there is much influence and the ability to communicate with many thousands of people. Certainly this gives the ability to influence on sheer fact of what has happened.

Scenario: Last Vehicle Toyota Lancruiser 267K on the clock and still going strong. New vehicle Holden SSV - Dead gearbox at 168K....Mmmmm

Interesting also that googling has found similar problems...Not many but some...So one does wonder how deep the problem really is. I will also say that the mechanic that I spoke to at the dealer told me he has changed quite a lot of these boxes....Mmmmmmmm

Cheers

Finney

So basically you are asking Holden to warrant the vehicle for life.
Driving conditions won't matter as said it not like your only 10,000kms over.
If Holden had to cover every single part failure OUTSIDE the warranty terms then they would go broke as with every other vehicle manufacturer. The warranty terms are there and are solid. It doesn't sound like a maintenance issue and is just a failure.
Comparing it to a landcruiser gearbox means nothing.
Your car may not be the only one that has failed but it certainly not a special case that requires Holden to cover it under warranty which has expired 68,000 kms ago.
Sorry if I sound harsh but believe in telling it how it is not giving lies or false hope.
You can try writing in to head office they might help financially a bit but that is best case scenario and at most would only be the first $1000 of the repair.
Good luck

[Steve-LS2]

Not sure if Holden do it or not, but the warranty is essential an insurance policy against the manufacturer.

Part of the purchase price is for this 'policy' and is paid directly to the underwriters.

This maybe be why it is so hard to get things fixed under warranty but when it is during the period of the warranty then the underwriters pay for it.

If it happens afterwards or is a recall or something then the manufacturer pays.

Like I said, not sure if Holden do this, but a friend of mines old man does this sort of stuff.

[Wonky]

I agree it's a concern if someone at Holden has said that's about all you can expect out of these boxes but as others have said, you're pushing $hit uphill with a very small stick if you expect Holden to come to the party when the car is getting on towards double the warranty kms! At least they have decent warranty now - my first new car (a Holden) had 12 months, 12,000 miles (20,000km) warranty. :(

[Irish]

I agree it's a concern if someone at Holden has said that's about all you can expect out of these boxes but as others have said, you're pushing $hit uphill with a very small stick if you expect Holden to come to the party when the car is getting on towards double the warranty kms! At least they have decent warranty now - my first new car (a Holden) had 12 months, 12,000 miles (20,000km) warranty. :(

In this day and age manufacturers like mitsubishi are offering 10 year 160 000km powertrain warranty

[BLACK 346]

In this day and age manufacturers like mitsubishi are offering 10 year 160 000km powertrain warranty

Good point, that shows a fair bit of confidence the product they are selling doesn't it.

[steve_t]

In this day and age manufacturers like mitsubishi are offering 10 year 160 000km powertrain warranty

If Finney's SSV had that warranty, it still have run out 8000km ago

[Irish]

If Finney's SSV had that warranty, it still have run out 8000km ago

They may have fixed it because of how close it is to the limit. All manufacturers will sometimes fix issues just outside of the warranty period. It is just another example of why holden and ford are losing sales when people can have piece of mind for much longer.

[moconn20]

In this day and age manufacturers like mitsubishi are offering 10 year 160 000km powertrain warranty

For vehicles whose production numbers are far higher than any Commodore and are sold world wide.

[Wonky]

In this day and age manufacturers like mitsubishi are offering 10 year 160 000km powertrain warranty

May be a cynical point of view but I see that as just a risk calculated to try to increase their relatively small market share.

[Jac001]

Don't Chevy in the USA offer 5yr or 100,000 mile powertrain warranty?

Wouldn't the same v8 drivetrain in a commodore appear somewhere in the chevy line up? (corvette maybe??)

[BLACK 346]

Don't Chevy in the USA offer 5yr or 100,000 mile powertrain warranty?

Wouldn't the same v8 drivetrain in a commodore appear somewhere in the chevy line up? (corvette maybe??)

I will assume you already know this, but yes, the LS Series of engines and the T56 Gearbox pop up in the Corvette and Camaro and probably a lot more Chev models that I am not aware of :)

[redvxr8clubby]

May be a cynical point of view but I see that as just a risk calculated to try to increase their relatively small market share.

Also consider how many would have documented dealer service done over 10 years, I think not too many cars will actually be covered more than 3 or 4 years down the track. I think you would have to have dealer servicing for 9 or 10 years. To their credit though I think Mitsubishi is one year or 20,000 Km servicing, so getting a dealer service done once a year isn't unreasonable, also they have capped price servicing for I think 3 years also. Pretty good value really. Getting back to Holdens, as has already been pointed out, this is a 260/ 270 kw performance car with over 500Nm of torque, I wonder if even Mitsubishi would do a ten year warranty on any similar type of car, I doubt it. Hopefully the gearbox can be repaired for a reasonable sum.

[BLACK 346]

Also consider how many would have documented dealer service done over 10 years, I think not too many cars will actually be covered more than 3 or 4 years down the track. I think you would have to have dealer servicing for 9 or 10 years. To their credit though I think Mitsubishi is one year or 20,000 Km servicing, so getting a dealer service done once a year isn't unreasonable, also they have capped price servicing for I think 3 years also. Pretty good value really. Getting back to Holdens, as has already been pointed out, this is a 260/ 270 kw performance car with over 500Nm of torque, I wonder if even Mitsubishi would do a ten year warranty on any similar type of car, I doubt it. Hopefully the gearbox can be repaired for a reasonable sum.

I also doubt many Mitsuibishi have a massive T56 truck gearbox behind their motors either? You warrant what you sell, yes?

PS...Don't get me wrong, I love my Holden to bits and will never sell it, but I doubt I would buy another. My wifes Rex at nearly the same age leaves it for dead quality wise. Most of the reliable parts on my SS are very expensive aftermarket items.

[steve_t]

Also consider how many would have documented dealer service done over 10 years, I think not too many cars will actually be covered more than 3 or 4 years down the track. I think you would have to have dealer servicing for 9 or 10 years. To their credit though I think Mitsubishi is one year or 20,000 Km servicing, so getting a dealer service done once a year isn't unreasonable, also they have capped price servicing for I think 3 years also. Pretty good value really. Getting back to Holdens, as has already been pointed out, this is a 260/ 270 kw performance car with over 500Nm of torque, I wonder if even Mitsubishi would do a ten year warranty on any similar type of car, I doubt it. Hopefully the gearbox can be repaired for a reasonable sum.

I also like that the warranty isn't transferrable. I'd love to see the stats on how many new car buyers keep their cars for 10 years