Is this a SCAM?

[warrick]

Hi
i have a guy interested in buying my car.he is in WA & I am in QLD.he is saying he will have VIP pickup the car & give me a bank chq for it at that time.is that the way it normally works?
cheers
warrick

[vicarious]

wait for the bank cheque to clear into your account before keys are handed over.

[Evman]

Yup I'd be waiting for the cheque to clear too. Besides, he has to go to a bank to get a bank cheque so he might as well just go there and have the money transferred directly into your account.

[boggers007]

Did he actually ring you up? if you recieved a msg from carsales or whatever id take it as fake as i had plenty of this sorta shit when i was selling mine.

[Wonky]

Probably fake. Did he actually offer more money than you're asking? If so, that's a dead giveaway - fkn idiots!! :weirdo:

As others have said, if you do follow through make sure any "bank cheque" clears before parting with the car. There have been cases of forged and stolen bank cheques reported in threads on here before.

[warrick]

thanks for the quick replies.i suggested about putting the money straight in my account but as he said then he has paid the money & doesnt have the car.i cant really do the wait for clearance bit either as the transport people are giving me the chq when they come to pick the car up.yes he did ring me & i have his mobile no.we have been negotiating the price over the last couple of weeks.the transport company is supposed to be VIP.anyone know if this is how they work?
cheers
warrick

[MYVYSS]

thanks for the quick replies.i suggested about putting the money straight in my account but as he said then he has paid the money & doesnt have the car.i cant really do the wait for clearance bit either as the transport people are giving me the chq when they come to pick the car up.yes he did ring me & i have his mobile no.we have been negotiating the price over the last couple of weeks.the transport company is supposed to be VIP.anyone know if this is how they work?
cheers
warrick


Bank Cheques also get stolen and changed, I would be taking photos of said people who pick the car up, the rego of the trucks/trailers that they use. I would possibly also ask the police if they wanted to attend in case the truck or something is stolen as well. Before handing the car over, ring the bank that issued the cheque and quote the number and amounts to see if its a stolen cheque.

[LS1-5.7]

As far as him saying "he's paid the money but does not have the car" is horsepiss. The way this transaction has been arranged does not allow for anything else. What, does he want to have the car B4 he pays you ?
Like that's ever gonna happen !

Do your homework warrick, run his name through google, check his address in white pages, even ring his bank to verify he's actually got money for the cheque etc. It may seem like a pain in the ar*e but it's much easier to do it now rather than chase a phantom who has your car and you've got a worthless cheque to show for it and the guy does not exist.

Try ringing VIP to verify the story as well and check what details he has given them about himself, including the delivery address etc.

Just a thought .....

[Evman]

Before handing the car over, ring the bank that issued the cheque and quote the number and amounts to see if its a stolen cheque.

That probably makes the most sense. I'm sure the banks would have to verify this sort of thing all the time anyway

[ssv402]

If he doesnt want to pay for it first, he can go scam someone else. Simple, dont deal with people like that.

[Tyre biter]

That he called you is not usually a sign of a scam. Regardless, the answer is simple really, and it is not unlike any other transaction these days - it's not the 1970's anymore.

- If the buyer wants to pay by cheque or e-deposit then the goods stay with the seller until the cheque/funfs clear. FFS a bank won't (ordinarily) let you cash a cheque on the spot anymore even!

- But if the buyer wants the car now then he get it now - just that he needs to pay in currency that clears immediately - cash.

You are in the position of strength and have everything to loose and so do it on your terms or not at all. If you tell him it's your way or the highway you will soon find out just how serious he is. Good luck with it.

Cheers, TB

[clubbie]

Stick to your guns.

My options for payment were clearly explained to the prospective customer.

There are the following possibilities.

1.) Cash in person
2.) EFT tranfser. Car released when funds have been cleared.
3.)Bank cheque. Car released when funds have been cleared.

There is a scam atm with fake bank cheques. Pressure is put on the seller to release the car. Pickup on late Friday or weekend. They take your car never to be seen again.

I highly doubt VIP will be doing a run to Perth for one car. They will simply ship the car to a long haul/vehicle freight company if it is really going to Perth.

If the guy is legit he will have no problem in sending you the bank cheque or as others have said put the money in your account.

Walk away if you do not have the money in your account or cash in hand before the car leaves.

[AF20NC]

Had the same situation recently when selling my car, offered to purchase for the exact amount advertised and then send a representative as he called it with a bank cheque to pick it up expressed my concern at the deal and suggested bank deposit or cash but he had every excuse under the sun why it had to be a cheque needless to say I didn't sell it to him be very very careul if you do because if it turns out to be a forged / stolen cheque it could end up in the courts for years thats providing that you can actually find him

[HSVREDSLED]

If you have agreed on a price and he wants the car...he can wait a few days until the funds clear. Either that or find out where he lives, and tell him your tongan brother in law lives around the corner and he will pick up the cheque. Test his reaction to that.

[warrick]

yeah i did google him & found his facebook account ,which looks all legit.checking the transport company site it all sounds legit: http://www.vipinspections.com/secure.html

i will check with the local cops & see what they have to say & go from there.
cheers
warrick

[vxssblown]

Sounds a bit sus, simple dont let the car go untill cheque is clear or he gives you cash first. you cant trust everyone these days.

[Forbz]

I just sold mine, and accepted payment of "bank cheque" its as good as cash, and they can not be cancelled once you have deposited them.
Just make sure they are with you when you deposit the cheque.
or bank it before you hand over any keys !
once the cheque is in your bank, your laughing
still takes 3 days to clear, but its yours.

[MTC]

VIP do provide this service. When I bought My Mustang about three years ago I had VIP inspect it in QLD. & I also used them to transport the car back to Melbourne. I didnt use there payment service or there negotiation service but they do offer it.

[Plenty]

why not make an ebay add, tell him to purchase using PayPal that way you are both covered. If he doesn't pay well no loss cos you still have the car, if he pays but you don't send car well then he gets insurance through PayPal.:teach:

[warrick]

there is actually a scam going at the moment that car sales tells you involves people paying by paypal,so i think i'll stay away from that side.yeah after reading the VIP website i feel a little bit more comfortable.as i said i will check with the cops,check with the buyer on the exact name of the transport company & ring the transport company direct and then see how i feel.thank you for all your advice.
cheers
warrick

[AF20NC]

also heard of people getting caught with another scam which is that they will on purpose spell you name incorrectly therefore making the bank cheque unable to be banked by you

[rgmast]

why not make an ebay add, tell him to purchase using PayPal that way you are both covered. If he doesn't pay well no loss cos you still have the car, if he pays but you don't send car well then he gets insurance through PayPal.:teach:

Cos u will pay a shit load of commission to evilbay

[XLR8 V8]

why not make an ebay add, tell him to purchase using PayPal that way you are both covered. If he doesn't pay well no loss cos you still have the car, if he pays but you don't send car well then he gets insurance through PayPal.:teach:

FYI Paypal protection does not apply to pickups and all sales of vehicles are also excluded.
http://help.ebay.com.au/Help/PayPal/Selling_with_PayPal/PayPal_Seller_Protection
http://help.ebay.com.au/Help/PayPal/Buying_with_PayPal/PayPal_Buyer_Protection
Besides, you're almost more likely to be scammed via a hacked Paypal account than fake bank cheques.

[private9]

Warrick, if it was my car it would be as simple as no cleared funds, no keys.

[LS-SV8]

ive bought interstate cars pretty much every time however ive travelled to inspect the car first and then payed with organised pick up at the time, as for giving your car away without receiving payment i wouldnt do it, Have you thought of fast clearance for the check it is a $15 fee but might speed up the proccess , other than that its hard to say legit or scam as it is interstate and ive bought intersate my self
hope it was some help
also if you do give the car away get a photocopy of his license and details and a stat dec for purchase from the police station sent to you. that should make it 100% legal
good luck

[fx160]

be very careful
your desire to sell the car for a good price is what they pray on

your choice is to get him to direct deposit into your account
you have the money before he has your car
or bank cheque
he has your car before you have any money (and you may not get any)
just need to remember possession is 9 tenths of the law

kev

[Toddler78]

Ill play devils advocate here, what if the OP was to start a thread saying, hey guys just found this car in QLD I want to buy pics look great ive spoken to the guy and weve agreed on a price, I want to send VIP over to pick the car up and get them to give him a bank cheque but the seller wants the money in his account before I can pick up the car does this sound suss? everyone is going to get on here and say 'YEAH its a scam the photos are from google he doesnt own the car blah blah blah.

At the end of the day the sale does sound legit and if it was me Id be going through with the sale, transfer the papers, I dare say you have to give the rego papers to the driver (or even post them), by the the cheque should of cleared if so go into rego place and dispose of vehicle, if not and it is a scam, you shouldhave time to put in a police report for a stolen vehicle and claim on insurance.

you have to accept some risks if you are going to advertise on a forum such as the internet. if you dont want the risk, advertise it in the local trader

[saaz]

I just sold mine, and accepted payment of "bank cheque" its as good as cash, and they can not be cancelled once you have deposited them.
Just make sure they are with you when you deposit the cheque.
or bank it before you hand over any keys !
once the cheque is in your bank, your laughing
still takes 3 days to clear, but its yours.

I am afraid to say that a bank cheque is no better than a personal cheque. Once deposited it still has to be cleared. They can still be stopped or dishonoured. It is nowhere near as certain as cash. Any cheque is only good when it has been cleared.

http://finance.ninemsn.com.au/pfmanagingmoney/banking/8123472/how-long-cheques-take-to-clear

[Daniel996]

You could look into using an escrow service, but make sure it's a reputable one as there are quite a few dodgy ones around. That way you are both protected - money goes into the escrow, when he gets the car you get the money, if the car doesn't turn up he gets the money back.

Cheers
Dan

[gassit320]

Hey Warrick, I live in Hong Kong and used VIP to buy a car for me in Mt.Gambier, they are legit, they did a crap job of the inspection, buts thats a whole other story :soap:

I find it a little strange, and almost disturbing, that people think its ok for the purchaser to transfer 10s of 1000s into the sellers account from another state, without the car or anything at all, but its not OK to accept a bank cheque which has already been paid for by the purchaser ( I am pretty sure they can be express cleared too ) ???
Also the car would not even be close to reaching him in WA before the cheque bounced, so yes it would be a royal P I T A, but I am sure you would'nt lose your car.
You may be able to organise VIP to collect the car after the cheque clears, which would give you piece of mind.

As an aside, someone mentioned Carsales, these :flipoff: don't care what people advertise on their site, we got rorted on Carsales and they would not even reply to my emails, and the Gov dept that looks after internet fraud etc reckons its a private sale, pack of :flipoff:

[VYSHSV8]

Tell him to meet me at a pub and I will see if he is genuine ;)

[seldo]

... "bank cheque" its as good as cash, and they can not be cancelled once you have deposited them.

once the cheque is in your bank, your laughing
still takes 3 days to clear, but its yours. Bullshit.
I had a bloke try to scam me a few years ago. Was a bad payer so I said "cash or bank chq".
Long story short - he actually went to the bank and bought a legit bank chq, paid me with it and then went back to the bank and said he'd lost the chq and to stop it, and he didn't need it anymore, so money back pls.
When I banked the chq it bounced as "payment stopped".
So - bank chq is no guarantee.
Demand cash, direct deposit, or wait until chq clears....unless you can afford to sell your car for $9.00 DR (cost of bounced chq)

I dare say you have to give the rego papers to the driver (or even post them), by the the cheque should of cleared if so go into rego place and dispose of vehicle, if not and it is a scam, you shouldhave time to put in a police report for a stolen vehicle and claim on insurance.Again - not so. If you have given him a receipt for the bank chq, it's his car, and you then have to try to obtain the money. It wasn't stolen - you willingly gave him the car. Insurance will laugh at you.

[steve_t]

Bullshit.
I had a bloke try to scam me a few years ago. Was a bad payer so I said "cash or bank chq".
Long story short - he actually went to the bank and bought a legit bank chq, paid me with it and then went back to the bank and said he'd lost the chq and to stop it, and he didn't need it anymore, so money back pls.
When I banked the chq it bounced as "payment stopped".
So - bank chq is no guarantee.
Demand cash, direct deposit, or wait until chq clears....unless you can afford to sell your car for $9.00 DR (cost of bounced chq)

Forbz did say "once you have deposited..."

[Youngy789]

Hmm this is a tough one as others have said you have to look at both sides. The guy buying the car does not want to give you heaps of cash and then not get the car. You do not want to give the guy the car and then not get the cash. When buying from dealers etc I have used bank cheques plenty of times and they accept these as payment on the spot. I guess their security is they have drivers license etc?? Maybe someone who is/used to be a car salesman can shed light on that side of things? Either way if I was buying a car interstate I would not deposit money into your account without someone being their to take posession straight afterwards. Someone has to give I guess which is why private sales are risky as opposed to just giving it to a car yard for a crappy price.

[seldo]

Forbz did say "once you have deposited..."Huh???
Exactly. And you do not find out it's a dud until you have deposited the chq in your account and get a letter in the mail from your bank 5 days later to say that it has been dis-honoured, the amount reversed, and your account has been debited $9 for the fee.
Unless you can phone the bank and verify the authenticity of the chq you are running a biiig risk.

[steve_t]

Huh???
Exactly. And you do not find out it's a dud until you have deposited the chq in your account and get a letter in the mail from your bank 5 days later to say that it has been dis-honoured, the amount reversed, and your account has been debited $9 for the fee.
Unless you can phone the bank and verify the authenticity of the chq you are running a biiig risk.

Oh yup. It appears that a bank cheque is no different to any other cheque. Sorry, you were right :goodjob:

[seldo]

.... Sorry, you were right :goodjob:You'll generally find this is the case....;)

[gassit320]

Christ !! what has it come to ? was a time when you could buy a car with a personal cheque for gods sake. You used to be able to walk into a bank and cash a bank cheque, since it had already been paid for, now people are scamming bank cheques ? :soap:
In this electronic age why does it take 3 days to clear a bank cheque ? ( rethorical question ) So the banks make 1000s in interest over that 3 days on the squillions worth of cheques they handle :flipoff:
Heres an idea : Lets pick a bank ( I vote ANZ ) and NOBODY in Australia use them, we can all get by without one bank but can they get by without us :rofl: while we are at it, lets choose an oil company too.
Yes, I know, I'm dreaming, no way the whole of the country will ever get together on something :vpo:

Rant over

PS: Warrick, I hope you got it sorted, and that if he paid you cash the bills are not counterfeit ;)

[steve_t]

Christ !! what has it come to ? was a time when you could buy a car with a personal cheque for gods sake. You used to be able to walk into a bank and cash a bank cheque, since it had already been paid for, now people are scamming bank cheques ? :soap:

Yeah, you used to be able to leave your house unlocked while you ducked out and you could do business with people with just a handshake. Times have changed :bawl:

[Forbz]

If you are going to consider taking a bank cheque, ask the buyer what bank the cheque's coming from and call that bank and ask them what there policy is with there bank cheques.

you will find that CBA will tell you that once the cheque is deposited it can not be cancelled
I went through this 2 weeks ago.

Good Luck mate.

[HAVIC]

I know of a few people who have used VIP and have had good experiences. When I sold my WRX to someone in Boonah my $30,000 bank cheque had not yet cleared and he had already taken the car. I took a risk and luckily everything turned out to be legitimate but there are so many horror stories out there.

Good luck for a safe sale!

[steedsy]

Have you thought of asking for a deposit to be transfered to your account then let VIP bring you the balance of the transaction? Put him at ease and tell him if the sale doesn't happen you will refund his deposit and get an account number from him for that purpose. That way you get some sort of commitment to the purchase from him and his bank details .

[ATOMICSS]

I've never had a drama with bank cheques, paid for stuff and let's cars drive away with only bank cheque in hand. That not to say they are 100% safe and secure but I know for a fact new car dealers accept them as payment. Give one a $75000 bank cheque and you can drive away in your new GTS.

[warrick]

thanks everyone for your input,much appreciated.i now have the guy's name,address,email,mobile number,drivers licence & deposit in my account.i am getting these details checked by a member of the p.....,a friend.i have checked scamwatch,been to my local police,rung vip,rung the local branch of his bank.i think i have done as much as i can do.if everything continues to check out i'll give it a go & keep my fingers crossed.thanks again for everyones advice.
:goodjob:
cheers
warrick

ps:i'll let you know how it turns out.

[propane]

Tell him to get a car broker to do the transaction.

I got ripped once, Fake name and bank accounts. I caught the guy on 14 fraud charges. Still waiting to go to court 3 years later, I will win and he will owe the money plus interests for the rest of he's life, but I don't expect to see a cent, I will get my pound of flesh and screwed him for life.....

Always play it safe !!!! Some people are desperate for money.....

[steedsy]

thanks everyone for your input,much appreciated.i now have the guy's name,address,email,mobile number,drivers licence & deposit in my account.i am getting these details checked by a member of the p.....,a friend.i have checked scamwatch,been to my local police,rung vip,rung the local branch of his bank.i think i have done as much as i can do.if everything continues to check out i'll give it a go & keep my fingers crossed.thanks again for everyones advice.
:goodjob:
cheers
warrick

ps:i'll let you know how it turns out.

Good job, hope you got him to sign a privacy concent? :lmao: Sounds like you've done more investigation than your average bank does. I reckon you can sleep easy tonight.

[ls1 VN]

At the end of the day mate you are 57yo, had countless people tell you not to release the car till funds have cleared, don't care how much research you've done, that means squat! Fools and their money are soon parted.

This could be a very legit buyer, but you are selling at your risk. Can't for the life of me understand why you would do this, apart from you being the likely fool.
:deal:

[planetdavo]

It was mentioned, but not by many.
The person buying the car has certain rights and reasonable expectations too. If people make far too many conditions on how the sale is to be done then you might as well just cop the lower price and trade it in at a dealer, because no one will want to deal with you.

[ls1 VN]

It was mentioned, but not by many.
The person buying the car has certain rights and reasonable expectations too. If people make far too many conditions on how the sale is to be done then you might as well just cop the lower price and trade it in at a dealer, because no one will want to deal with you.

Rights and expectations!!!!!!!!

The buyer has the right to pay

The buyer has the right to pick up the car when funds are accounted for in the sellers bank, or hand, and not before.

You sir are another likely victim!

[planetdavo]

Rights and expectations!!!!!!!!

The buyer has the right to pay

The buyer has the right to pick up the car when funds are accounted for in the sellers bank, or hand, and not before.

You sir are another likely victim!

Hardly.
The main difference is that I can see that a sale requires TWO PEOPLE to proceed. Most people posting have only cared about one person.
Too many of you guys have been extremely negative about the sale process, placing unreasonable demands on the buyer. Would you hand over thousands of dollars to a stranger, then happily wait the best part of a week before (hopefully) receiving the car you have paid for??? Doubt it! :confused:
Start playing like that and none of you will EVER find a private buyer for a car you want to sell one day...:teach:

[ls1 VN]

Hardly.
The main difference is that I can see that a sale requires TWO PEOPLE to proceed. Most people posting have only cared about one person.
Too many of you guys have been extremely negative about the sale process, placing unreasonable demands on the buyer. Would you hand over thousands of dollars to a stranger, then happily wait the best part of a week before (hopefully) receiving the car you have paid for??? Doubt it! :confused:
Start playing like that and none of you will EVER find a private buyer for a car you want to sell one day...:teach:

Well fukn pay cash then, if you want to hand you car to someone on the assumption that their cheque is good, then go for it.....I would rather lose the buyer than lose the car through doing what you suggest Gzzzz it will happen to 'YOU' only once for you to realise your stupid suggestion. :rolleyes:

[warrick]

unfortunately no one in their right mind is going to hand over $40000 in cash.there will be 2 members of the police present at the handover so i think my odds are pretty good now of everything being above board.if not well i know i have done all i could do & the police will have a head start with all the info i have already collected.
thanks guy's
cheers
warrick

[warlobo]

If you were worried as the buyer handing over cash you'd fly over for a few hundred extra bucks. Nobody in their right mind should hand over a car without it being cleared funds. Why would you take a 1% risk?

good luck.

[steve_t]

unfortunately no one in their right mind is going to hand over $40000 in cash.there will be 2 members of the police present at the handover so i think my odds are pretty good now of everything being above board.if not well i know i have done all i could do & the police will have a head start with all the info i have already collected.
thanks guy's
cheers
warrick

Hope it all goes well for you. Beers at your place then? :goodjob::jester:

[Wonky]

unfortunately no one in their right mind is going to hand over $40000 in cash.there will be 2 members of the police present at the handover so i think my odds are pretty good now of everything being above board.if not well i know i have done all i could do & the police will have a head start with all the info i have already collected.
thanks guy's
cheers
warrick

:goodjob: The presence of the police should frighten away any potential scammer. :yup:

[warlobo]

Police cannot become involved in civil matters, merely keep the peace, check vehicle is not stolen etc. No protection whatsoever I'm afraid.

[steve_t]

Police cannot become involved in civil matters, merely keep the peace, check vehicle is not stolen etc. No protection whatsoever I'm afraid.

LOL. Swap out "cannot" and insert "are not supposed to" :goodjob:

[Wonky]

Police cannot become involved in civil matters, merely keep the peace, check vehicle is not stolen etc. No protection whatsoever I'm afraid.

Only a scammer with gigantic balls of steel would follow through under those conditions.

[C4B]

Get them to pay with a "bank warrant". Just like a bank cheque, only it's cleared funds. (their main use these days seems to be when large sums need to be transferred after 2.30pm because TT's done after this won't go till the following day)

[gassit320]

Can anyone please explain to me, on which planet, it would be reasonable to expect someone to part with 40K of there hard earned and get nothing for it for a few days ?
Why is the seller so much more at risk than the buyer ? Sure, I suppose nobody has ever handed over a sum of money to never see the goods or seller again, yeh right :soap:

Warrick, VIP are legit, I and others have used them and whilst their inspections are hit and miss because they sub-contract the work out, the rest is above board. Hope it all goes well.

[planetdavo]

Well fukn pay cash then, if you want to hand you car to someone on the assumption that their cheque is good, then go for it.....I would rather lose the buyer than lose the car through doing what you suggest Gzzzz it will happen to 'YOU' only once for you to realise your stupid suggestion. :rolleyes:

You'd walk out of a bank, usually in a shopping centre surrounded by dozens of young d!ckheads these days, with thousands and thousands of dollars of cash bulging from your pockets??? :eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes:
Sh!t dude. Your expectations of a "dodgy" sale are verging on paranoia.

[ls1 VN]

You'd walk out of a bank, usually in a shopping centre surrounded by dozens of young d!ckheads these days, with thousands and thousands of dollars of cash bulging from your pockets??? :eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes:
Sh!t dude. Your expectations of a "dodgy" sale are verging on paranoia.

At no time did i say 'i would' pay in cash!!!!! Just reiterating, if the buyer wants the car there and then 'like you would' then that's an option for him or you. Obviously at your own risk! No way in this world should anyone let the vehicle go without the $$$$$ being secured.

No dude, i've more brains than that, if i was buying a car worth that amount i would make sure 'like a previous poster had said' to go with the seller to both our banks if need be and to a transfer there & then. OK DUDE. :slap: