Commodore name to continue in 2018

[mac06]

Holden have announced the Commodore name will continue after 2018. So now we know for sure after all the debate.

http://media.gm.com/media/au/en/holden/news.detail.html/content/Pages/news/au/en/2015/Jan/0120_Holden.html

Some comments from the article-


“The vehicle will be tuned and honed by Holden engineers and technicians at our world-class Lang Lang Proving Ground in Victoria, ensuring it performs in Australian conditions and to Australian expectations. Right now, our Vehicle Performance team is helping shape the next-generation Commodore for Australian customers.”


Customers cited a number of criteria as critical for the future of Commodore, including: ability to perform in Australian conditions; affordability; external styling; interior space; handling; power, acceleration; towing ability; and offering variants including luxury and sport


“I cannot reveal full details of the next-generation vehicle, but I can say it will either compare very favourably or improve on the current Commodore’s dynamic performance, acceleration, fuel economy, running costs and mass,” Mr Jacoby said.

[Ausmartin1]

Either another media beet up or Holden are seriously deluded slapping a Commodore name on some imported fwd sleigh.
The question should be if this is for real - have Holden marketing totally lost the plot or what !

[mac06]

Well I guess we don't know exactly what the final product will be, but the local input gives me confidence. The Buick Avenir concept car exterior design was from Oz. Depending on how much input Holden is allowed for the next model Commodore could be the difference between ordinary and great. Joe average couldn't care about RWD, performance fans are likely to be more happy with AWD. Holden should be able to satisfy both. Time's are a changing....
The thing that caught my eye was "towing ability". Somehow I can't see that with FWD..... Maybe I'm reading too much into it???

[Smitty]

Either another media beet up or Holden are seriously deluded slapping a Commodore name on some imported fwd sleigh.
The question should be if this is for real - have Holden marketing totally lost the plot or what !


... don't have a problem with an imported replacement from the GM stable being hoisted on us
whether its Korean rubbish, enslave your grannie something from germany (yes I have owned something made there by Opel and it kept me poor)
or something from the Yew Ess of Hay (but its gotta be better than a Malibu.. Camry drivers wear nicer cardigans)


Just don't call it a Commodore!

geezus I worked at GMH when we went thru all the crap about a Torana replacement which also became a Holden killer/replacement
after Design and Engineering screwed up WA and then WB holdens. WB Kingswood anyone? seen one?

GMH went from 2 (Torana and Holden) to 3 to 2 to 1 carline in the space of about 3 years ...the internal turmoil was horrendous there

and for the record (pun intended) .. the GMH 'V' car was to be the 'REKORD' . Thank goodness someone got smart... after they stuck
the Senator nose on and re-engineered most of it... GMH called the car the Commodore. It was introduced to us all as....
the Australian Commodore (and it was)

[VTClubSprtR8]

Yes it is true.

In terms of where it comes from/built, Mexico or China most probably.

[Goggles]

Either another media beet up or Holden are seriously deluded slapping a Commodore name on some imported fwd sleigh.
The question should be if this is for real - have Holden marketing totally lost the plot or what !

I have yet to see any GM and/or Holden exec state that the imported Commodore will be FWD. only journos have said this, which doesn't make it fact.

[Smitty]

I have yet to see any GM and/or Holden exec state that the imported Commodore will be FWD. only journos have said this, which doesn't make it fact.

.. that is correct

what Holden has said is -


In officially announcing that
the Commodore name will live
on beyond 2017 and be sourced
from “GM’s global portfolio”,
Holden executive director of
sales Peter Keley said significant
market research showed that Australians
favoured retaining the nameplate for the
future large car.
“When it arrives in 2018, our new
large car will honour Commodore’s
heritage and support a long and
successful future for Holden in Australia
and New Zealand,” he said.

[mac06]

and also-

“We know the decision to retain or retire the Commodore nameplate will stir passionate responses among Holden fans and customers. That’s why we’ll ensure the next-generation car drives like a Commodore should,” Mr Keley said

[Jag530G]

geezus I worked at GMH when we went thru all the crap about a Torana replacement which also became a Holden killer/replacement
after Design and Engineering screwed up WA and then WB holdens. WB Kingswood anyone? seen one?

Yes, A HJ-HZ Statesman body with a WB nose and different trapazoidial tail lights. Would have looked bloody old fashioned in the 80s. (funnily enough, these days I like the look of the HJ-HZ Statesman, they stand out in a nice way from the crowd of curvier cars on the roads)

Wheels Magazine had an interesting article back in 1986 called "Dead End Kingswoods" which detailed the still-born development of the WA/WB Kingswoods. I remember in the article Holden explored hatchback bodies for the WA which would have been interesting, I suppose it would have been a bit like a Chevy Citation on a bigger scale.

As you say, Holden must have been in an all mighty mess in the mid to late 70s trying to work out what they were going to do to replace the mid and large cars.

Cheers, Matthew

[Hi Octane]

Holden need to stop taking business advice from Kodak & Lehman brothers.

[andrewslr]

Having attended a market research session about this very topic some months ago, the car presented to us was very euro or US styled, not overstyled Korean. The consensus was that the Commodore name should stay so long as the car was RWD or AWD and a natural progression from the VF. If the car was to be FWD and Asian sourced, that is, not in the spirit of the Commodore nameplate, Commodore should be dropped for a new name.

I for one passionately believe this. Though venturing into dangerous territory, I believe the Holden brand is a future endangered species once it becomes an importer. From Toyota and Nissan, and even Ford to some extent, the market expects that. Holden is still "football meatpies........" you know the rest. Don't reckon the market will be that accepting.

[Party Pete]

If they lose the rear wheel drive I frankly can't see why you would by a Commodore over any other boring front wheel drive stuff available. The Toyota's will continue to be more reliable, the Mazdas better built and finished, the Volkswagens more upmarket. It can't be for national pride any more, not that has really counted for much for a while anyway.

[zorro]

Market research or not........

3823

[Woodchukka]

Costed GM a lot of money to tune and hone the VB to suit Australia. Be interesting to see if the lesson learnt has been forgotten.

[Smitty]

Costed GM a lot of money to tune and hone the VB to suit Australia. Be interesting to see if the lesson learnt has been forgotten.


.. actually it wasn't that much. Reputedly a total of $110million and that covered everything from joining the REKORD to the Senator and giving us the Commodore design as we know it
plus BOTH the VA and (eventually released) VB Commodore. Makes the $1billion plus for the VE look very expensive... except of course for the VB we are talking 1977 $ and the VE
gave us a lot more car ... :)

[bozodos]

It's unfortunate that they were never able to shoehorn the VE chassis into the faux SUV type shape that is so popular these days

[redvxr8clubby]

By way of using the name or not I think it's pretty simple really, they (Holden) have an asset, do they choose to use or not. I think it is easy to answer as yes. While the Commodore may not be right at the top of the sales list anymore, it is still one of the top selling cars in Australia. Why would you drop the name? Ford on the other hand are going to drop the Falcon name, basically they don't see the name as an asset, and sales reflect that. If the next Commodore is FWD it is going to have to be a good one if Holden wants to keep previous Commodore buyers loyal. There will be no V8 Commodore which accounts for about a third of Commodore sales, so what is a Commodore V8 person going to get when his current ride starts getting a bit long in the tooth and there is no V8 in the future Commodore. HSV are evidently confident about their future, it reasonable to presume they know what the future product will be so I'm sure there will something good coming. Whether buyers continue to buy Commodores and HSV beyond 2017 will be interesting to see what happens.

[Angeldust]

i was hoping they would have dropped the name. To me it will be an abomination.

[crisis]

and also-

“We know the decision to retain or retire the Commodore nameplate will stir passionate responses among Holden fans and customers. That’s why we’ll ensure the next-generation car drives like a Commodore should,” Mr Keley said
Well it will drive through the front wheels which is not driving “drives like a Commodore should”. They can call it what they want but it makes no difference. If they changed the name and retained RWD and a uniquely Australian car I would care a lot less than I do about retaining a name on a FWD generic “platform”. Five years on no one will care what it is or what it’s called. I have my RWD V8 Holden and I will be buried with it.

[crisis]

Whether buyers continue to buy Commodores and HSV beyond 2017 will be interesting to see what happens.
If I am ever to buy a “new” car in the future it will be a Toyota. If it has to be front drive you may as well get something proven and reliable even if it puts you to sleep.

[mac06]

Below is a video on youtube posted by Holden with Rob Trubiani talking briefly about the future Commodore. At the end of the video there's a red box "have your say". That links to a site where fans can put in their thoughts, suggestions, etc...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hcy8Ic-Tgwo

[Smitty]

Below is a video on youtube posted by Holden with Rob Trubiani talking briefly about the future Commodore. At the end of the video there's a red box "have your say". That links to a site where fans can put in their thoughts, suggestions, etc...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hcy8Ic-Tgwo

already had my say

it is here too...

https://m.secure.holden.com.au/future-commodore

[crisis]

already had my say

it is here too...

https://m.secure.holden.com.au/future-commodore

Ha ha. Rear wheel drive doesn’t get a mention. Well I mentioned it.
“Rear Wheel Drive performance sedans. Holden and Ford Australia are unique in the world at producing these cars at bargain prices. Front drive is a cop out to cheapness and developing hi tech costly differentials to manage increasing power to the front wheels is an absurd paradox.”
Of course it is all a PR exercise as the decision will be made in the US based on $$$.

[Ausmartin1]

If I am ever to buy a “new” car in the future it will be a Toyota. If it has to be front drive you may as well get something proven and reliable even if it puts you to sleep.

Funny you should mention that......
Holden are launching a new campaign the slogan "Lets go there"

is a rip off from the USA Toyotas "Lets go places" 2012 ad campaign.

We get to throw kids in - because kids are cute right!

If it's so good yes you might as well buy the real product, Toyota boring to drive - but hey put together using the worlds best production control system TPS.

I'll be visiting Toyota HQ in Japan in April and will do the tour of final assembly at one of their plants.

Now Toyota if we can get the same "drivers" passion from the 86 into the rest of the fleet, then we would be onto something.
Toyoda family and current CEO has that passion, but I wonder if he can pass it on beyond the 86 and through the Toyota culture to the other models?

Numbers look great from scientists - but take a product and refine it with exceptional drivers that's what makes great driving cars.

[crisis]

Now Toyota if we can get the same "drivers" passion from the 86 into the rest of the fleet, then we would be onto something.
Toyoda family and current CEO has that passion, but I wonder if he can pass it on beyond the 86 and through the Toyota culture to the other models?

Numbers look great from scientists - but take a product and refine it with exceptional drivers that's what makes great driving cars. To be honest I would not be buying it for “drivers passion”. Pretty much if I have to have a bland commuter I will just go for the quality. I have my CV8 to give me my thrills and a 100 Series Landcruiser for off road exploits.

[powerd]

Tradition, enthusiast and biases don't make profits for car companies. That's why the unique cars for Australia are finishing. RWD platforms are dearer and less space efficient, these cars are cheap and built in pitiful numbers so can't possibly repay the investment required to build a modern mass market car. Industry players have said you need a minimum of 300,000 units built on a platform to make a mass market vehicle profitable in the competitive automotive world, and that's in competitive cost factories. What has Holden produced in the last year? About 30,000. VW will soon be making something like a couple of million units pa off its MQB platform, and more in future years.

If Holden does sell a RWD Commodore from one of the new platforms you can probably expect it to be somewhat dearer than the current one. My tip is on FWD with an AWD higher spec model, probably based on new Insignia platform, but could be a RWD platform from the US.

And will Cadillac ever come here?

[Ausmartin1]

Do we know if it's going to be a:
Chinadoore
or
a
ChiMexidoore

Be interesting to see where they source it and with what parts its built from & yes it will make a difference long term locally.
This will determine how well it sells long term.

[Aus8]

My Holden days are over after my brilliant VF. I am not a Holden enthusiast most of the range is crap Daewoo imports. VF is a exceptional vehicle and Aussie made RWD V8. That's all I care about. It's a disgrace to call this new front drive a Commodore I will not be buying one.

[Smitty]

.. interesting cover on the latest Wheels I saw in the newsagents this morning.

They reckon the plebs will get their 4cyl FWD Commodore .. but the rest of us will
get a 477kw supercharged Cadillac (CTS-V) as the performance machine

https://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/t31.0-8/s960x960/10860866_1065731796785811_2905598099005004267_o.jp g

If it comes.. personally I think it will be HSVs solution to losing the Commodore as a base for their performance models

And if it does come, who will be the first to put a Chev badge on it? :woot:

[CLUBRED]

I picked that magazine up when I saw it and went wow, until I saw the side on and rear images and put it back down :doh:

[BLACK 346]

.. interesting cover on the latest Wheels I saw in the newsagents this morning.

They reckon the plebs will get their 4cyl FWD Commodore .. but the rest of us will
get a 477kw supercharged Cadillac (CTS-V) as the performance machine

https://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/t31.0-8/s960x960/10860866_1065731796785811_2905598099005004267_o.jp g

If it comes.. personally I think it will be HSVs solution to losing the Commodore as a base for their performance models

And if it does come, who will be the first to put a Chev badge on it? :woot:

Estimated cost of the Caddy once landed in Oz is $150k, that is what the mag says anyway. Says Corvette will be $150k+ and Camaro $60k.

[amckiwi]

Would be nice but wheels should appologise to their punters the number of times they get this sort of thing wrong.
I wonder how that price will compare to the US market price?
Stu

[Ausmartin1]

I picked that magazine up when I saw it and went wow, until I saw the side on and rear images and put it back down :doh:

Not a fan lately of GM USA design? Personally I think they have some issues like:
Lack of Aussie car guys who can bring some taste to the recent North A only styling disasters.

[HSV,_I_GOT_ONE]

For that price I don't think we'll get the CTS-V as that is a large price disparity compared to other comparable brands. If it was priced closer to GTS then it could be likely. Its not far fetched that Cadillac is coming to Australia as before the GFC there were plans to bring the brand here.

[crisis]

Estimated cost of the Caddy once landed in Oz is $150k, that is what the mag says anyway. Says Corvette will be $150k+ and Camaro $60k.Bring it by all means but the cost is the clincher. The HSV GTS barely kept the “bargain “ price feature as part of the package but at $150,000 you are starting to get into BMW and Merc territory and the whole package will have to compete with no caveat. The reality is a SSV Commodore is more than a match for a Cadillac XTS so the premium we would have to pay for the Caddy can’t be justified. That’s even before you get to such issues as styling.