To stall or not to stall

[BLACK 346]

I am after some opinions on Stall coverters. I never intened on putting a stall in my car, and with the VCM21 cam it is definitely not a necessity. What I want to know though, is will it improve the car? I have never driven a stalled auto, and as a matter of fact this is my first auto car. I watched a couple of vids online of a Camaro with a 3k stall and it seemed like a good addition. What are peoples experiences, good and bad?

[IJ.]

Think of it as a manual where you slip the clutch to take off more into the powerband of the engine, well worth it with a modern lockup converter!

[whitels1ss]

The new style stallies with lock up are absolutely fantastic.

I have had some big old style stallies in a few cars in the past & swore I would never go down that road again, 'till I drove one of the new ones:yup:


Go for it Rod, you will love it!:goodjob:

[white lie]

4500 here and don't regret it one bit.
A lot of people go with little 2000/2200/2500 stalls and regret it because it's too small. 3800 and up is where it's at IMO. Maybe a little smaller on the 6 speeds but the 4 speeds love big stalls.

I have full drive under the stall speed, if I take off and sit on 2000 or 2500rpm, it still sit on that thru the gears without a drama. You might notice it's there as it holds the rpm steady rather than dropping when the gear changes. But mash the pedal and it will flare to 4500 immediately and off you go.

Try and get a drive in a car with a tight converter, I think it will make your mind up pretty quickly.

[BLACK 346]

Thanks for all the replies fella's, looks like they are a good thing :)
Any particular brands that I should look at? Think it was TCI that I saw on the interweb in a Camaro. Or there is circle d like this one
http://www.circledspecialties.com/p-92-gm-278mm-hp-6l80-ls-torque-converter.aspx

[IJ.]

My Circle D is awesome, great guys to deal with as well!

Told them what I wanted and they supplied it .

[whitels1ss]

Thanks for all the replies fella's, looks like they are a good thing :)
Any particular brands that I should look at? Think it was TCI that I saw on the interweb in a Camaro. Or there is circle d like this one
http://www.circledspecialties.com/p-92-gm-278mm-hp-6l80-ls-torque-converter.aspx


"TCI" and "Dominator" are great but I have not personally driven a "Circle D"

[IJ.]

"TCI" and "Dominator" are great but I have not personally driven a "Circle D"


Had a Dominator in my car at first, it felt vary loose at light throttle and only has a single disc lockup so must be unlocked under power...

[white lie]

Haven't personally used a Circle D, was going to get one when I got mine but my Allfast one popped up new but second hand so couldn't refuse. I don't think I've heard many (if any) negative reports about them, seem to make good, strong converters especially for the 6 speeds.
Just may work out a bit more exy with the current dollar.

[IJ.]

Yeah NOT going to be cheap with the Pacific Peso doing it's thing again... :(

[whitels1ss]

IMHO a trans cooler is a must with a stallie.

[Micks]

Some decent atf like Penrite full synth is good insurance too http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/like/271834951961?limghlpsr=true&hlpht=true&ul_noapp=true&hlpv=2&chn=ps&lpid=107&ops=true&viphx=1

[whitels1ss]

IMHO a trans cooler is a must with a stallie.

Actually with all the plastic in radiators these days & the expensive cost of
repairing damage caused by cross contamination between coolant & transmission fluids
I reckon having a totally separate aftermarket transmission cooler, not using the one in the radiator is very cheap insurance on any car.:soap:

[XUV]

Some decent atf like Penrite full synth is good insurance too http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/like/271834951961?limghlpsr=true&hlpht=true&ul_noapp=true&hlpv=2&chn=ps&lpid=107&ops=true&viphx=1
why are they in 4l? When penrite says 5l is needed for a 4l65e

hey, how many litres is needed for a 4l65 flush and change?

[Micks]

why are they in 4l? When penrite says 5l is needed for a 4l65e

hey, how many litres is needed for a 4l65 flush and change?

I generally buy all my Penrite products from Bursons in 20L drums. You certainly buy more but at a much lower/litre rate. It never goes off on my shelf :lol:

[white lie]

why are they in 4l? When penrite says 5l is needed for a 4l65e

hey, how many litres is needed for a 4l65 flush and change?
Just like most Oil drums being 5L when you need 6...

[IJ.]

I generally buy all my Penrite products from Bursons in 20L drums. You certainly buy more but at a much lower/litre rate. It never goes off on my shelf :lol:

Ditto, bought my last 20L of Dex6, $200.

[Micks]

Ditto, bought my last 20L of Dex6, $200.

That's very reasonably priced mate!

[dyno junkie]

Contact Gonzo at AllFast for one of his converters.
Have previously had 3,500, 4,200, 5,000 & 5,000+ converters from Gonzo.
Currently have a small 4,200, but am looking at a triple disc 5,400 or 6,000.

[A PSYCHO]

I thought Transmax Z was the go-to stuff for the commodore autos? As for the OP, i had a 3500 Dominator stallie in a mild cammed daily, loved it.

[XUV]

Just like most Oil drums being 5L when you need 6...
4l oil would be better as i need 8l ;)

[IJ.]

If you get a couple of 5's you have some in case it needs a top up.. always good to have "spare".

[white lie]

Can't please everyone....

[XUV]

If you get a couple of 5's you have some in case it needs a top up.. always good to have "spare".
My Gator gets the spare from 2 x 5l and I still have 0.7l 'spare' and as if my car uses oil ...... ;)

[Micks]

The other thing Rod needs to think about, there could be an increase in fuel consumption. Might not be an issue to him but something to consider nonetheless!

[BLACK 346]

Well, as I always do, I ran my idea past the bloke who does all the performance mods on my cars (Brad at Enhanced) and his swift reply was " Don't do it Rod, bad idea". This was via emails, so will have a chat with him in person fao and see what his reason/reasons are.

[BLACK 346]

Whilst I am making my mind up on the stall, and as suggested earlier in the thread, I thought I might install a trans cooler. Found this one at a pretty good price. I believe PWR have a pretty good rep, but what are peoples thoughts anyway regarding the size etc? Big enough? Anyone got one of these installed and care to comment good or bad?
Cheers

http://vpw.com.au/Category/Index/512430

PWO7267 Trans Oil Cooler kit - HOLDEN Commodore VE V6 & V8 280 x 255 x 19mm 3/8' barbed $162.

[Micks]

Hey Rod, maybe as Ed mentioned above piss the oem in Rad cooler off altogether bypassing it to a slightly larger cooler like your thinking?

[BLACK 346]

Hey Rod, maybe as Ed mentioned above piss the oem in Rad cooler off altogether bypassing it to a slightly larger cooler like your thinking?

Not really sure Mick. I have been doing a bit of reading, and some say put the extra bigger cooler in line with the existing one, others say piss off the in radiator one altogether and replace as you say.

Edit: Is this PWR one I have linked too small? How big do I need to go to make it worthwhile?

[Micks]

Few things come into it available space, how much free air you can get across it & fin spacing eg fins per inch.

[BLACK 346]

Few things come into it available space, how much free air you can get across it & fin spacing eg fins per inch.

Thanks Mick. I assume this has been done a thousand times on Auto VE's, so hopefully someone will say yay or nay to the kit I have linked. There aren not a lot of ready to go/bolt on kits on the net which is surprising. Maybe not something that is in high demand. Only other one I could find was this, seems to be same PWR cooler just at a premium.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Holden-VE-Commodore-Automatic-Transmission-Oil-Cooler-Kit-TCK-H255VE-/151705067867?hash=item235253a15b:g:igkAAOSwrklVcle M

[whitels1ss]

Not really sure Mick. I have been doing a bit of reading, and some say put the extra bigger cooler in line with the existing one, others say piss off the in radiator one altogether and replace as you say.

Getting rid of the factory one will insure no cross contamination,
yeah I know in an ideal world having 2 coolers could keep the trans even cooler
but these in radiator coolers very often give problems.

[BLACK 346]

As some of you may be aware, I purchased an OEM VE Trans cooler (Police fitment) from Gary (Wonky), thanks mate :)
Before I leap in and get it installed I was wondering if anyone had installed one of these and could tell me exactly where it bolts on? Just want to make sure I have all my shit in a pile before I put it in and trans fluid starts getting dumped. It has 2 bolts each end that appear to be for mounting points, but a quick look at the car does not show any obvious mounting points. Any advice on area I should be looking in would be appreciated :)

[Micks]

Not 100% on your cooler, but going by your pics it appears to have Male/female pipes so just a matter of taking the oem off attaching to the new cooler pipes & forward mounting the cooler. Hopefully the cooler bracket mounts without drilling additional holes. It would be a front bumper off job though.

[BLACK 346]

Not 100% on your cooler, but going by your pics it appears to have Male/female pipes so just a matter of taking the oem off attaching to the new cooler pipes & forward mounting the cooler. Hopefully the cooler bracket mounts without drilling additional holes. It would be a front bumper off job though.

Got a quote today from City Holden (same place we bought our 3 cars). Reason I am considering going with them is that if extra parts are needed like brackets they can obtain them easily. Also, hoping they may have fitted one before. With me supplying cooler and trans fluid (not sure how much will be lost in fitment), they quoted me no more than 2.5 hours labour, so around the $300 mark. Figured it would be a bumper off job Mick.

[BLACK 346]

Was doing some more research on location of Police spec cooler and came across this:


"Genuine secondary trans cooler (police spec?) sits in front of the top of the radiator and has hard pipes that come down in front of the engine and connect in line with the factory cooler in the radiator. Not good spot if you want to add an over the radiator cold air intake"

If this is true then I am unable to use this cooler, as I have VCM OTR :(

[Wonky]

Hmmm. Bugger! If that's the case I would have also had problems with the Dus OTR on the ute. I'm sure there will be a workaround but it just works against having OEM spec for ease of fitting.

When I've been at Chev's sometimes there's been a guy there making up hoses like those. Sorry. :(

[BLACK 346]

Hmmm. Bugger! If that's the case I would have also had problems with the Dus OTR on the ute. I'm sure there will be a workaround but it just works against having OEM spec for ease of fitting.

When I've been at Chev's sometimes there's been a guy there making up hoses like those. Sorry. :(

All good mate, It will work out in the end :)

[BLACK 346]

Another bit of info that points to the factory cooler not being able to coexist with OTRCAI. Still not sure if the cooler physically will not fit with OTR in place or whether it is a heat issue for the intake.
I am going take the car and cooler down to Holden next week and show Josh the service manager, see what he thinks.

http://forums.justcommodores.com.au/ve-holden-commodore-2006-2013/245171-ve-transmission-cooler-otr-cai.html

[Micks]

Seeing though you have purchased this unit Rod, maybe consider ditching the hard pipes in preference to suitable flex hose with machined crimped fittings to suit.
Then install to a suitable spot in front of the rad?

[BLACK 346]

Seeing though you have purchased this unit Rod, maybe consider ditching the hard pipes in preference to suitable flex hose with machined crimped fittings to suit.
Then install to a suitable spot in front of the rad?

Thanks Mick. I am definitely going to investigate what options are available to me, just a matter of choosing the right workshop that is happy to rig it up without asking for my first born in payment. Even looking at dedicated trans shops in my area, as I assume they will at least have the facilities, tools and know how to make it fit when everything aint perfect.

[IJ.]

Where are you located Rod?

[BLACK 346]

Where are you located Rod?

Adelaide inner Northern suburbs IJ.

[IJ.]

Adelaide inner Northern suburbs IJ.

Might help someone to suggest a shop nearby ;)

[Micks]

Might help someone to suggest a shop nearby ;)

Yes maybe Ed could chime in perhaps? Reckon a good hose doctor could whip up the pipes without too much trouble then probably just a few hours to fit it all up.

[whitels1ss]

Yes maybe Ed could chime in perhaps? Reckon a good hose doctor could whip up the pipes without too much trouble then probably just a few hours to fit it all up.

Sorry but I am way over the other side of the city Mick
& the guy I would use is booked out for a couple of months at the moment.

[lmoengnr]

Was doing some more research on location of Police spec cooler and came across this:


"Genuine secondary trans cooler (police spec?) sits in front of the top of the radiator and has hard pipes that come down in front of the engine and connect in line with the factory cooler in the radiator. Not good spot if you want to add an over the radiator cold air intake"

If this is true then I am unable to use this cooler, as I have VCM OTR :(

The factory cooler on my Maloo interfered with my Ramjet intake, so I ditched the mounting bracket for the cooler for clearance.
The hard lines give it plenty of support, with a couple of nylon ty wraps to stop it moving around.

[BLACK 346]

The factory cooler on my Maloo interfered with my Ramjet intake, so I ditched the mounting bracket for the cooler for clearance.
The hard lines give it plenty of support, with a couple of nylon ty wraps to stop it moving around.

That sounds promising. Mine didn't come with any brackets, but if it can be mounted without them, then that could be my only hope. Thanks mate.

[BLACK 346]

As some of you may be aware, I purchased an OEM VE Trans cooler (Police fitment) from Gary (Wonky), thanks mate :)
Before I leap in and get it installed I was wondering if anyone had installed one of these and could tell me exactly where it bolts on? Just want to make sure I have all my shit in a pile before I put it in and trans fluid starts getting dumped. It has 2 bolts each end that appear to be for mounting points, but a quick look at the car does not show any obvious mounting points. Any advice on area I should be looking in would be appreciated :)

Got this fitted by City Holden at Hillcrest a few days ago, they were able to source the correct brackets and it fitted up nicely. Cost me $300 (I supplied Penrite trans fluid) and that included fitting my GTS Steering wheel as well. Been extremely happy with the work done at that dealer since Josh Halls took over as service manager. I was originally concerned that it would not fit with my VCM OTR, but no issues with that either, so very happy. Thanks again to Gary (Wonky) :)

[Micks]

How is the new wheel compared to the Calais oem one mate?

[BLACK 346]

How is the new wheel compared to the Calais oem one mate?

Night and day Mick, love it :)