Car Sales People

[GH1967]

While searching for my VZ Monaro I've travelled throughout Sydney to various car yards and made numerous calls related to cars I've seen on sale.

OK, I'm generalising, but what is it about this industry that creates such aggressive bullish people?

I'm in sales myself and if I treated my customers the way some car sales people did, my business would go bust within a year.

One of the worst incidents that comes to mind was at Suttons Motors at Homebush. There I was admiring a Monaro in the yard when this young guy with his Holden shirt comes up to me. This was after about 15 minutes of looking around for someone to serve me...

"Gday mate, after a car are ya?"

"Yep. I'm looking at this stage."

The expression on his face instantly changed to one of disdain. It was like I'd lifted a garlic clove to a vampires face. How dare I, the customer, waste his time by not buying a car here and now.

"So just looking, not interested in buying" he says to me, his tone was one of someone who had been offended or wronged. His body language became almost confrontational.

This is just one example of the sort of person I've come across in this "industry". I always used to think the cliches about car sales people were exactly that; cliches. But after my trek through Sydney car yards and making phone calls, I can assure you it isn't. It seems like every encounter is a confrontation and the sales people are overbearingly aggressive.

Am I Robinson Crusoe on this one?

[HERCULES]

I guess some sales people are good and some are bad, dont let that stop you buying a Monaro. ;)

[GH1967]

It hasn't. I'm collecting mine this week. :D

[HERCULES]

NICE!! Cant wait to see what you think of it, and most of all the PICS :D
What colour did you choose?

[GH1967]

Devil Yellow.

It was a toss up between that and red.

Shame about petrol prices. It would have to happen just as I purchase a Monaro lol :mad:

[HERCULES]

Very nice mate, ive seen yellow vz cv8's on the road and they stickout from miles.
Fuel Prices: They saw you comming lol. :lol:

[JA SV8]

When i was looking for a car i went to Ford, there was a young bloke there and he seemed more keen than me to let me test drive the XR6Turbo, he was not that pushy at all, but his boss was, so i walked away.
The Holden dealer had been around for a while and was even worse, where i could bargin with the young bloke, this old fella didnt want to know what i wanted chucked in on the car..

So i went through a car broker, got all my options added onto the car and paid less for it that a standard one on road :) i was happy, and he didnt charge me a thing :)

Congrates on the new car too :) the Monaro is great

[LSX-438]

you are not Robinson Crusoe, its a pressure job and some of them use pressure tactics. and some are just pricks. It can be hard to find the right person to sell you the car, there is an old saying :

"you are not looking to buy a car, you are looking for someone to sell you one"

how many people have purchased a car off someone they disliked?

(the deal would have to be damn good)

I purchased my monaro from Suttons Homebush a few months back and the salesman was pretty good, it's so variable just depends on who you get.

Why does this industry produce such aggressive people? phone calls are monitored and analysed, conversations with customers are recounted and analysed, nearly everyone who walks through the door has a complex about being ripped off (kind of chicken and egg but the myth is greater than reality i reckon) and i think a large proporation of people put more contemplation, deliberation and worry into buying a car than they do their house.

[Mongy]

The hard sell is very hard to cop sometimes. I do not envy anybody who is at the mercy of the hard sell salesman and the ones who really get up my nose are the one’s who try to hand you over to a closer. No matter what if I am handed over before I am ready to commit I walk away and advise anybody else to do the same because if you are either young or female it is very easy to be talked or badgered into a deal which is not necessarily in your best interest.

[C4B]

I had an annoying experience at a large (multi-dealership) Holden dealer recently.

I was looking at a new VZ..... After scribbling all the details down on a 50c Spirax Notepad (very professional), they were still a couple of grand too dear, so I said to the sales guy that if they could come up with a better offer to ring me.

24hours later I get a phone call from this guy saying that they wanted to help me get into a new car, value my business, bullshit, bullshit. To my amazement, he then went on to offer me the EXACTLY the same price that I had already knocked back the previous day (Groundhog Day). When I told him it was (still) $2000 too dear, he quite abruptly said "I told you yesterday that we couldn't do it for that price".

SO WHY THE F%$# RING ME?????

Car dealers need to realize it's now the year 2005. It's time to stop using 1970's tactics to sell cars.

[Mongy]

I had an annoying experience at a large (multi-dealership) Holden dealer recently.

I was looking at a new VZ..... After scribbling all the details down on a 50c Spirax Notepad (very professional), they were still a couple of grand too dear, so I said to the sales guy that if they could come up with a better offer to ring me.

24hours later I get a phone call from this guy saying that they wanted to help me get into a new car, value my business, bullshit, bullshit. To my amazement, he then went on to offer me the EXACTLY the same price that I had already knocked back the previous day (Groundhog Day). When I told him it was (still) $2000 too dear, he quite abruptly said "I told you yesterday that we couldn't do it for that price".

SO WHY THE F%$# RING ME?????

Car dealers need to realize it's now the year 2005. It's time to stop using 1970's tactics to sell cars.

They did you a favour Geoff, look at what you got instead, you should ring and thank them :lol:

[Marco]

I've had both good and bad with Holden dealers.

At McGrath Liverpool, where my family has bought three cars over the past decade or so from the same salesman, never a problem. Always happy to let you take a look, go for a drive, and sort out a good deal in the end without too much argy bargy.

My personal experience is that the used car guys (and this is dealer used car guys, not just the guys who own used car yards) are probably pushier than new car guys.

[pagey]

If I am buying from a dealer (which I try to avoid) I always

1. buy at the end of the month
2. write down the car & any extras i would like and my best offer.

I just make it VERY clear that if they can do it @ that price they can have the cash in their hand within the hour.

I just leave it with them and wait for the call.

Has worked everytime thus far.

[peber]

I found Sundell at Gordon really good... non-pushy salespeople and no hassles thus far...

[RICHO]

The quickest way to solve the problem is to reduce the pressure on sales people to "make a sale". Now I don't mean they should sell less but changing the way they are rewarded would change their attitudes and approach incredibly.

Many salespeople work based entirely on commission. They are given a sales target of $X and their "salary" is based on them achieving this figure. Don't reach the target and you pay back your unearned salary. Needless to say you're going to be bloody pushy.

Others earn a very low base and get a % commission. The lower the base the more a salespersons income depends on sales volume. You want a decent standard of living you have to see cars and you get pushy.

Both these scenarios result in pushy salesmen (and women) and also result in high turnover among sales people, so low levels of product knowledge and the inevitable crap you get peddled by so many sales people in yards. They just haven't been there long enough to know their product and many of them won't be there long enough to ever learn about their product. It can be a tough way to earn a buck and as a result it doesn't become a career for many people, it's just the job they do between jobs.

Make being a car salesman a rewarding career and bingo you'll get more professional sales people. Higher base salaries combined with lower commissions and a share of dealership profits would mean they can make a living without bringing to bear the traditional array of pushiness, lies and misleading statements we've all experienced. And when a "job" becomes a career people care more, they'll spend time learning about product, they'll seek out training courses etc etc.

We criticise salespeople but like so many of us they are simply trying to make a buck in a damn hard and not always well remunerated way. It's dealers who make the big $$$ and if they shared more of that with their staff we the customer would end up with a much more pleasant sales experience. God forbid we may actually buy our next car from the same dealer!!

Just my 2 cents

[Mongy]

A lot of what you say is quite correct Richo, but I can’t see too many Dealer Principles giving what the rest of us would term a living wage to salesmen that is not based on high sales volume. I think the point being missed here is the fact that some salesmen don’t need to be pushy to make sales, they are not necessarily natural salesmen or women either, some just have a better approach than others. Product knowledge is another area, there is no excuse for not knowing everything about your product and your oppositions. Sales is like any other job, you have to put the effort in to learn to do it properly and do it right to be successful. If you don’t want to put in the effort it would not matter what the head traffic was in the yard you work at you won’t sell cars.

[markone2]

Sales is like any other job, you have to put the effort in to learn to do it properly and do it right to be successful. If you don’t want to put in the effort it would not matter what the head traffic was in the yard you work at you won’t sell cars.


Jump ship...go out on your own..stand behind what you sale with a REAL warranty... prepare the car correctly..price it correctly..and above take pride in what you sell....do it right and no selling is involved as you will have the most powerfull sales aid known to man working behind you..word of mouth advertising :)....but just be prepared for the flack that will head your way from the big boys with the huge overheads to cover....it's not all beer and skittles with pub lunch's.........

[kryten2001]

If I am buying from a dealer (which I try to avoid) I always

1. buy at the end of the month
2. write down the car & any extras i would like and my best offer.

I just make it VERY clear that if they can do it @ that price they can have the cash in their hand within the hour.

I just leave it with them and wait for the call.

Has worked everytime thus far.

yeah I'd second that.

I've not yet met one salesperson who wasn't a prick WHILE they're trying to convince you to buy a car. Once you get to negotiation they're usually pretty OK, it's just getting to that stage that's hard.

I generally like to make my mind up that I'm going to commit before I walk into the dealer, then take charge of the negotiation process. Tell them what YOU want, not the other way around - then walk if you're not happy.

I too recently bought a Monaro - and the process was simple. I walked in, told them what I wanted (of course they always ask if you're ready to purchase today or not), but once you say you are - and you take charge of negotiating, you're off... It's a psychological battle - don't let them get the upper hand and don't ever give into something you're not happy with.

That includes the whole package, not just the cost of the car. If you're getting finance, make sure it's on your terms - not theirs. And don't let them add on their "accessory or warranty" packs, which are just a load of BS.

Good luck - just remember to go in with the right attitude....

[kryten2001]

The quickest way to solve the problem is to reduce the pressure on sales people to "make a sale". Now I don't mean they should sell less but changing the way they are rewarded would change their attitudes and approach incredibly.

Not that I'm disagreeing with you, but don't ya reckon these people KNOW their tactics are s*ithouse, but do them anyway - simply because (although they are heavy handed) they work?

If it were all friendly and no pressure, they'd sell less cars. I reckon more than half the people who buy a car on any given day weren't 100% there before they walked in. The salesdude just has to push them over the edge.

[VLWagonbeast]

Mazda dealers are not much better. I once went in to buy an MX-5, was asking about finance and everything, but at some point I must have accidently muttered a word that triggered some preprogrammed reaction by the salesman to customers not keen to buy. He promptly gave me his card and literally jogged to a couple who were looking at some little hatchback. I was amazed...I was gonna buy!!!

[clubbieboy]

A lot of what you say is quite correct Richo, but I can’t see too many Dealer Principles giving what the rest of us would term a living wage to salesmen that is not based on high sales volume. I think the point being missed here is the fact that some salesmen don’t need to be pushy to make sales, they are not necessarily natural salesmen or women either, some just have a better approach than others. Product knowledge is another area, there is no excuse for not knowing everything about your product and your oppositions. Sales is like any other job, you have to put the effort in to learn to do it properly and do it right to be successful. If you don’t want to put in the effort it would not matter what the head traffic was in the yard you work at you won’t sell cars.

I totally agree with you Mongy, but that's the nature of the beast - the better you perform the more you are rewarded. You're right with product knowledge - I work in a Holden Dealership and last year won the National title of six position sales presentation skills champion, yet I know that I will quite regularly get "beaten" on a deal by the bloke down the road, or up the road by $50 - even thought they haven't provided any level of service, no test drive, no being shown PROPERLY through the car etc, etc!! Imagine a world if shock horror, ALL of the dealers stuck at RRP (and I'm not talking about price fixing)and went back to the lost art of customer service, we'd all be happy with the service, our tradein's would be worth more - yet we'd all bitch about how expensive Holden's are!!!!!!! Us poor blokes are just trying to make a living like everyone else - only we're lucky enough to be around sexy machinery all day every day!!!! :p

[VYBerlinaV8]

The best thing I have found is to be clear with the salesperson what you are there for. When you are just looking, tell them "I'm just looking today, but will buy soon, and I want to check out brands X, Y and Z". The when you're ready to buy you walk into the dealership, and say "I'm going to buy an X today, and I'd like to know what this dealership's best price on that model is". I have also had success by walking in and saying (for example): "tell me what you have in stock in the way of V8 Berlinas, because I want to buy one".

I have always found that when salespeople realise you are serious about handing over your money, they will try very hard to please you, especially if you don't waste their time. Always have an idea of what you want, and how much you want to pay before you get there. Tell them how much you want to pay AFTER they have told you their "best price", and see what they can do. The best deal I ever got on a new car was agreed to 15 minutes after walking in the door, for a car they already had in stock. Over 20% off RRP.

[kryten2001]

Us poor blokes are just trying to make a living like everyone else - only we're lucky enough to be around sexy machinery all day every day!!!! :p

Yeah I dunno mate, I'm really of two minds on this.... I'm happy to pay a small premium for being taken care of, and more importantly - being taken care of AFTER the sale. This is where most car yards fall flat on their ass.

Once sold, you're only an ex-sold pain in the arse that must be taken care of because that's what they must do to get that "satisfactory" tick in the box on the 12 month survey. Most people's loyalty dries up pretty damn quick after they've paid a visit or two to their local service department when they've got a problem.

I'd personally pay a premium if I was taken care of in after-sales service, but in reality it just aint the case. A couple of months go by, and the salesperson you bought your car from has buggered off to another yard (or god forbid, another brand).

So I guess that, plus the normal assumption most people have that they're gonna be screwed (and hey, let's face it, if we don't speak up - we DO get screwed) is why most people have the impression that car salespeople are to be dealt with extreme trepidation.

Still, give me a car salesman over a lawyer any day.

[Mongy]

yet I know that I will quite regularly get "beaten" on a deal by the bloke down the road, or up the road by $50 - even thought they haven't provided any level of service, no test drive, no being shown PROPERLY through the car etc, etc!!
From where I sit that is also wrong. The motoring public expect a certain level of professionalism from the dealer but the public should also play fair with them, it is a two way street. I go back to the same dealer. He looks after me and I don't particularly care about the ads in the paper on a Saturday that advertises deals that are too good to be true. When I buy a new one we negotiate a deal that we are both happy with and that’s that. I bet I wouldn't do much better down the road and I don't particularly care if I could save $50 by going elsewhere. I get looked after, I know them all, they ring me every 2 years to remind me so I stay. I have not seen a deal advertised that I thought would be much better so to change would be pointless and unfair.

[clubbieboy]

From where I sit that is also wrong. The motoring public expect a certain level of professionalism from the dealer but the public should also play fair with them, it is a two way street. I go back to the same dealer. He looks after me and I don't particularly care about the ads in the paper on a Saturday that advertises deals that are too good to be true. When I buy a new one we negotiate a deal that we are both happy with and that’s that. I bet I wouldn't do much better down the road and I don't particularly care if I could save $50 by going elsewhere. I get looked after, I know them all, they ring me every 2 years to remind me so I stay. I have not seen a deal advertised that I thought would be much better so to change would be pointless and unfair.

Couldn't have put it any better myself mate - why oh why don't you and about one hundred of your mates live in the south eastern suburbs of melbourne!!!!!!!!!!!!! True there are fantastic customers out there like you but as a salesperson that has worked in the one dealership for over three years (just down the road before that so same clients pretty much for the last seven years)but they are few and far between - maybe one or two every couple of months which doesn't pay the bills in this day and age :bash:

[clubbieboy]

Yeah I dunno mate, I'm really of two minds on this.... I'm happy to pay a small premium for being taken care of, and more importantly - being taken care of AFTER the sale. This is where most car yards fall flat on their ass.

Once sold, you're only an ex-sold pain in the arse that must be taken care of because that's what they must do to get that "satisfactory" tick in the box on the 12 month survey. Most people's loyalty dries up pretty damn quick after they've paid a visit or two to their local service department when they've got a problem.

I'd personally pay a premium if I was taken care of in after-sales service, but in reality it just aint the case. A couple of months go by, and the salesperson you bought your car from has buggered off to another yard (or god forbid, another brand).

So I guess that, plus the normal assumption most people have that they're gonna be screwed (and hey, let's face it, if we don't speak up - we DO get screwed) is why most people have the impression that car salespeople are to be dealt with extreme trepidation.

Still, give me a car salesman over a lawyer any day.

Not having a go mate but if you have a problem with a yard's service dept how can that be the salesman's fault? Also how is the salesperson supposed to know you have a problem if you don't tell them - i know myself that this happens sometimes, and like I say to all of my customers if you have a problem let ME know about it - just because it's mentioned to the receptionist or a service adviser doesn't mean that the salesperson will find out about it and follow it through to ensure you remain a happy customer. If a salesperson doesn't want to help then your point is fair enough but I can't imagine that person being too successful or working at the same dealreship for too long - I know down here we actaully get paid either a bonus or fined :mad: each month based on the results of our customer satisfaction surveys. Nothin worse than gettin one back to hear such and such a service advisor was rude, or there was a piece of dirt on the floor etc, etc - you then get your arse kicked by the boss and get the hip pocket hurt as well, when you didn't even know there was a problem in the first place - communication (reasonable, polite) communication is the key "demand and you probably won't get", ask and you just might", ask nicely and be reasonable you'll not have a problem in the world that won't be resolved" ;)

[VooDoo]

I agree Clubbieboy. A good relationship with youyr dealer is worth $1000's. I cant fault my dealer at all. All of the the sales process, service, warranty claims have been handled professionally and while the car hasnt been 100% perfect (2 rebuilds) i cannot fault the dealer in any way. My next car will be from the same place without a doubt.

[OzJavelin]

A bit O/T, but being someone who has always been somewhat timid in negotiations I have absolutely no fondness of car sales people. HOWEVER, it seems to me that especially with new car warranties being what they are, people go to some cheap-ass dealer to get the bargain buy, then happily take their car into another, "great" dealer for the servicing/warranty work. The cheap-ass dealer has little overhead 'cos he doesn't do much service/warranty work so he can afford to drop sale prices. Meanwhile the "great" dealer does all the labour-intensive work, requiring staff, equipment, etc. Buyers don't seem to understand the concept of loyalty anymore .. it's just the cheapest price. If you are getting great service from a dealer, make an effort to buy a car from them if you can??

[ I'm sure people will argue that dealers make all their money from servicing - not sales - but I'd find this hard to believe. If all you do is sell cars, surely you have very little overhead compared to "full service" dealers and will have a higher profit margin? ]

[clubbieboy]

I agree Clubbieboy. A good relationship with youyr dealer is worth $1000's. I cant fault my dealer at all. All of the the sales process, service, warranty claims have been handled professionally and while the car hasnt been 100% perfect (2 rebuilds) i cannot fault the dealer in any way. My next car will be from the same place without a doubt.

Thanks VooDoo - let me guess you're salesperson has been aware of all of your issues, or do you have a good working relationship with one of the advisors? Glad to see that you're one of the minority that realise we are driving Holden's not Maybach's or Bentley's, and that the product is sometimes not perfect :bash:

[kryten2001]

Not having a go mate but if you have a problem with a yard's service dept how can that be the salesman's fault?

I never said it was the salespersons fault, I was just highlighting how paying a premium because the salesperson is a nice bloke or the dealership appears "nice" is a waste of money. They all adhere to Holden's "standard" so the "value adds" just aren't there. Finding a good mechanic and service centre, on the other hand, are worth their weights in gold.

If it's only $50, then fair enough - it's stupid shopping around, but in my experience it's rarely $50. It's usually a lot more than that.

Also from my experience, the only way to be sure you're really getting the best price is to test it by shopping around. If you only get your price from one place, and don't push the boundaries, you WILL pay way too much. Hell, we even do it here on the forums by asking who got the best price for an XYZ.

The first "best" price I was given for my Monaro (on road, drive away) was $64,500. The actual sale price ended up at 58,500 (on road) and that's before my Mastercard $3k discount. I only got this price because I did negotiate with two dealers. The final price wasn't negotiated over $50, it was almost $1,000. I didn't bounce between two dealers forever, I simply gave them each a single chance to get my business.

I'm not under any illusion that spending that extra grand up the road would have made a lot of difference how I was treated later.

So yeah I understand what you're saying, from a salespersons point of view it sucks when you have people wasting your time, and then going up the road for a $50 saving - but if you've been in the game a while dude then ya know it's just the nature of the beast... I bet you stole a few deals for $50 less than what others have been quoted too!

[bigdongers]

[ I'm sure people will argue that dealers make all their money from servicing - not sales - but I'd find this hard to believe. If all you do is sell cars, surely you have very little overhead compared to "full service" dealers and will have a higher profit margin? ]

I work with a lot of car dealers and I can tell you that servicing is where the money is. New car sales are obviously important but without the service department, most dealerships will not survive. Thats why dealerships spend so much money on advertising and calling customers to make sure they keep them coming back.

Dont forget people will negotiate to get the car price cheaper but they don't negotiate on servicing costs.

[MRVZSS]

Too right Marco,

I too have purchased 3 cars From Mc Grath liverpool and all three times very happy with their service and approach :) . Can't say the same about their service Department!!!!!!!!!! :mad:.

To strke up a good deal I would List all the Specs of the Car you like in an E-mail and Send it to all the Holden Dealerships in the which are convenient for you and let them bid for the sale. ;)

Another is to try visiting Dealerships which have a low sale turnover, whch means that they will be more desperate for a sale. :eek:

But The best tactic is to spin some bullshit yourself, (but make them belive you). It has worked for me many times. The last purchase I mad I saved $7000 Bucks. :D

Just have some balls to stand up to the Salesman, don't fall for the sales tactics and don't be scared to walk way from the deal, If your not happy just get up and walk out, guaranteed he'll be calling you in the next couple of days. :bash:

[clubbieboy]

I never said it was the salespersons fault, I was just highlighting how paying a premium because the salesperson is a nice bloke or the dealership appears "nice" is a waste of money. They all adhere to Holden's "standard" so the "value adds" just aren't there. Finding a good mechanic and service centre, on the other hand, are worth their weights in gold.

If it's only $50, then fair enough - it's stupid shopping around, but in my experience it's rarely $50. It's usually a lot more than that.

Also from my experience, the only way to be sure you're really getting the best price is to test it by shopping around. If you only get your price from one place, and don't push the boundaries, you WILL pay way too much. Hell, we even do it here on the forums by asking who got the best price for an XYZ.

The first "best" price I was given for my Monaro (on road, drive away) was $64,500. The actual sale price ended up at 58,500 (on road) and that's before my Mastercard $3k discount. I only got this price because I did negotiate with two dealers. The final price wasn't negotiated over $50, it was almost $1,000. I didn't bounce between two dealers forever, I simply gave them each a single chance to get my business.

I'm not under any illusion that spending that extra grand up the road would have made a lot of difference how I was treated later.

So yeah I understand what you're saying, from a salespersons point of view it sucks when you have people wasting your time, and then going up the road for a $50 saving - but if you've been in the game a while dude then ya know it's just the nature of the beast... I bet you stole a few deals for $50 less than what others have been quoted too!

FAir point -we all do have to try and adhere to the "Holden Difference" but what I am getting at is that I know for an absolute fact that the bloke that bought one down the road $50 (that was only a figure of speech by the way)cheaper is NOT going to be given the same level of service as the bloke who spends three hours with me, test drives our car, is given a price which he then shops around (yup you heard me right - I have no problem with that, we've done it to ourselves after all)finds it $50 or $500 or $1,000 cheaper and then gives me the opportunity to sell him car by beating that deal because of the CUSTOMER SERVICE that I provided to him / her - that's the guy that gets my own demo whenever he's in for service, while the other bloke can get on Ventura buslines for all I care :lol:
Oh FYI - It's more than a few that Iv'e stolen, usually because of the great customer service I provide ;)
Cheers,
Clubbieboy

[fekason]

I have now bought four Holdens.

The first two I bought at the local dealer off the same salesman, and was a totally satisfied customer. Sure I checked around, but I always offered my local dealer the last go. I have used that process for all my car purchases over the years, and until recently they always came good. And were good natured about it.

The local dealer changed name before I bought a VS S2, and again before I bought my latest VY S2.

For the VS S2, my usual salesman had moved on to his own yard. They applied what I would call undue pressure to get me to sign, even though they would not come close to the price that I sought. I rang a near local dealer, who agreed to my "deal" over the phone.

For the VY S2, I first went to my "new" dealer, who offered a very attractive price right up front. To check, I went to the local dealer (who had changed name again, and joined a conglomerate). They were thousands out, like about 20% dearer on the final drive away price without a trade in. I told them that their price was not acceptable, and got told in no uncertain manner that it was the best anyone could do. No one would offer better, unless they were crooks and had tricks up their sleeve.

They kept pestering me to buy at their price, and eventually I told them I was buying at the other dealer for the price that I wanted. Their response was to bad mouth the other dealer seriously. No loyalty between Holden dealers? They still claimed that price was a trick, but two days later advertised at $2 less than my price in the Friday Daily Telegraph.

And my preferred dealer again came to the party without heavy negotiation. I know where I will be buying my next Holden - unless things change unduly.

The other trend I have noted in some dealerships is that the trade-in offers are lower if you are trading in the same make. For instance, I was driving a Ford Fairmont Ghia Manual once (I know, don't flame me - that experience is why I drive Holdens now) and the local Ford dealer offered a changeover to another Ford that was about $10K dearer that the move to a Holden. Made it an easy choice.

However, when I moved again, this time with a Holden as trade in, boy wre they competitive. Still bought the Holden though.

My assumption was that they preferred to make big $$$$ from loyal Ford buyers, and thought it better to risk losing the odd swinger rather than lower their profit margins from the regular source.

Good business practice? Or poor loyalty from the dealer to the customer? I guess it depends on which way you look at it.

[Marco]

Too right Marco,

I too have purchased 3 cars From Mc Grath liverpool and all three times very happy with their service and approach :) . Can't say the same about their service Department!!!!!!!!!! :mad:.


Yeah....actually, let's not go there...

[kryten2001]

FAir point -we all do have to try and adhere to the "Holden Difference" but what I am getting at is that I know for an absolute fact that the bloke that bought one down the road $50 (that was only a figure of speech by the way)cheaper is NOT going to be given the same level of service as the bloke who spends three hours with me, test drives our car, is given a price which he then shops around (yup you heard me right - I have no problem with that, we've done it to ourselves after all)finds it $50 or $500 or $1,000 cheaper and then gives me the opportunity to sell him car by beating that deal because of the CUSTOMER SERVICE that I provided to him / her - that's the guy that gets my own demo whenever he's in for service, while the other bloke can get on Ventura buslines for all I care

Mate you wanna try coming working over here in the west. Demo cars as loaners when your car's in for service? You must be joking mate!.... $20 a day for a loaner 1996 barina with a strange odour, and that's only if you book 3 months in advance :lol: ....

That's why I refuse to pay a premium!... I've yet to be bowled over by service, and I've yet to be given service so fantastic that I didn't take my after-sales business elsewhere. You might laugh (and many others may too), but I found the service provided by my local Ultratune (for normal service) and specialised GEN3 Mechanic to be absolutely 100% and far more preferable than taking your luck at your local holden dealer.... Not because of what they did during the actual service, but how they personalised the experience. Let me provide my own oil, let me talk to the mechanics, let me watch it go up and come down off the hoist.

All the dealers I've dealt with (and I'm only talking 4 here, but that's a lot over here in WA!) ALL laugh when you expect your car to be treated any differently from a regular taxi. Man the number of times I've been checking out cars and I see late model SS's/HSVs come screaming out of the service departments, led me VERY quickly to decide I wasn't going to leave my baby there.

That actually reminds me of a true story that happened way back in 1994 when I bought my VR S Ute. I was mulling around the service area waiting for the dudes to bring it out, and I saw a practically brand new Maloo ute which had been absolutely totalled. Looked like it had been opened by the jaws of life. After talking to the service dept manager for a little bit, I managed to wrangle out of him what happened. Apparently it was in for its first service when a young mechanic took it out for it's "test" spin. Spun it in the wet and smashed it into a pole at 80kmh.

I shook my head in disbelief at the VERY moment I heard a loud screech followed by smoke, followed by my V8 ute coming out of the service department.... :mad: :mad: :mad:

So yeah, take charge man - don't become a victim! :box:

But in all seriousness, the service I did get when I bought the Monaro was excellent. I couldn't gauge how good they are in pre-sales (as I just walked in and said "here ya go, take it or leave it") but the time leading up to delivery was absolutely superb. I saw it come off the truck, they locked it in their storage yard, and not a K was put on it after it was pre-delivered. Extremely happy I was.. (Serge from Melville Motors if anybody's interested).

[VX-355]

What you got to do is what ever car you are buying know everything about it. What comes on the car standard, colours, price, etc. Then when you go into the dealer play there game , be an a!@hole, put a front on, and push them as hard as you can. They will back down and play it your way. Works every time for my wife. She plays the hard core bitch. :lol:
We ended up paying for a car that is $70,000 on road, less trade which was arouned the $22,000 plus the upgraded alarm, paint & glaze, leather and fab, the plates she ordered and some HRT shirts all for free and ended up paying change over of $41,000 and noone can match it or go anywhere near that price. I was very happy. :lol:

[clubbieboy]

[QUOTE=kryten2001]Mate you wanna try coming working over here in the west. Demo cars as loaners when your car's in for service? You must be joking mate!.... $20 a day for a loaner 1996 barina with a strange odour, and that's only if you book 3 months in advance :lol: ....

Who would have thought........................... us Mexicans are actually ahead of the times compared to you poor blokes out in the wild wild west :lol: Oh hang on a sec you guys are 2 hours behind the times at least :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: just jokin couldn't resist!!!!!!!!!! From what your'e telling me I couldn't work in the west - 96 Barina as a drive car WHAT THE!!!!!!!!!!!! Perhaps Holden should put in place some sort of exchange program now that would be an eye opener by the sound sof it :eek:

[kryten2001]

From what your'e telling me I couldn't work in the west - 96 Barina as a drive car WHAT THE!!!!!!!!!!!! Perhaps Holden should put in place some sort of exchange program now that would be an eye opener by the sound sof it :eek:

Yeah my missus has a new Golf, and the difference between VW service and Holden's is chalk and cheese.

[kryten2001]

What you got to do is what ever car you are buying know everything about it. What comes on the car standard, colours, price, etc. Then when you go into the dealer play there game , be an a!@hole, put a front on, and push them as hard as you can. They will back down and play it your way. Works every time for my wife. She plays the hard core bitch. :lol:
We ended up paying for a car that is $70,000 on road, less trade which was arouned the $22,000 plus the upgraded alarm, paint & glaze, leather and fab, the plates she ordered and some HRT shirts all for free and ended up paying change over of $41,000 and noone can match it or go anywhere near that price. I was very happy. :lol:

Yeah it's a shame you have to be that way sometimes to get a good price, but I guess the dealers are out there to maximise profits. They're not doing it for our benefit. We have to look after ourselves.

[clubbieboy]

Yeah it's a shame you have to be that way sometimes to get a good price, but I guess the dealers are out there to maximise profits. They're not doing it for our benefit. We have to look after ourselves.

Of course we are mate - if we weren't then you wouldn't have anywhere to go and buy your next one, or anywhere to get service / warranty work done, havin said that I know that my dealership's new car dept (I do work in fleet after all!!)is more interested in selling heaps of cars to make a small profit per unti than only selling a few cars with lots of profit it in :)

[HSVMAN]

Of course we are mate - if we weren't then you wouldn't have anywhere to go and buy your next one, or anywhere to get service / warranty work done, havin said that I know that my dealership's new car dept (I do work in fleet after all!!)is more interested in selling heaps of cars to make a small profit per unti than only selling a few cars with lots of profit it in :)
Like you I work in Fleet Sales. I also have a large number of "retail" or small business clients - and everyone is treated the same.
I will give up my V8 drive car to a good customer before I see them walk, and if they are unable to secure a decent service loan car. I will ruffle feathers in our service department if I think one of my customers is not being treated right but that can only happen like you say, if they let me know, which in most cases they do - and thankfully that doesnt happen often.
Again it comes down to the individual and unfortunately there are still a few cowboys out there (and always will be) that give the rest of us a bad name but having been back in the motor industry now for 2 years I can say I love my job more than I ever thought I would.
We like to think its not always a few bucks that counts but sadly for some people it does. I tend to shrug those ones off and focus on the next.
My advice to buyers - use your instincts and deal with someone you feel you can trust, or take advice from people who have had good experiences and deal with the people they do :)

[Tron2004]

This is what happens when you deal with people on commision. :(

My response when I get pushy salespeople is to tell em, I'm looking and if I need you I'll come get you!

[VZSS250]

If the buying experience is to be made more civil, then Holden should force dealers to treat all customers equally by fixing the on road price of the cars. The fact that two retail customers can pay different sums for the same car makes both the cutomer and salesperson aggressive.

If Holden fixed the on road prices of cars in the same way that the price of a carton of milk is fixed, then customers would not have to negotiate the ridiculous sales tactics before arriving at a perceived fair price and margins could be protected for dealers. Its a win-win.

This way, salespeople can start focussing on selling the car, not the deal for the car, and the whole buying experience can actually be enjoyable.

[VooDoo]

If the buying experience is to be made more civil, then Holden should force dealers to treat all customers equally by fixing the on road price of the cars. The fact that two retail customers can pay different sums for the same car makes both the cutomer and salesperson aggressive.

If Holden fixed the on road prices of cars in the same way that the price of a carton of milk is fixed, then customers would not have to negotiate the ridiculous sales tactics before arriving at a perceived fair price and margins could be protected for dealers. Its a win-win.

This way, salespeople can start focussing on selling the car, not the deal for the car, and the whole buying experience can actually be enjoyable.


If holden did that its called "price fixing" and is illegal. Every company has the right to sell an item for what they want and not what the manufacturer wants. They can put a RRP on it but not fix the price.

[clubbieboy]

If the buying experience is to be made more civil, then Holden should force dealers to treat all customers equally by fixing the on road price of the cars. The fact that two retail customers can pay different sums for the same car makes both the cutomer and salesperson aggressive.

If Holden fixed the on road prices of cars in the same way that the price of a carton of milk is fixed, then customers would not have to negotiate the ridiculous sales tactics before arriving at a perceived fair price and margins could be protected for dealers. Its a win-win.

This way, salespeople can start focussing on selling the car, not the deal for the car, and the whole buying experience can actually be enjoyable.

You won't find a salesperson that would disagree with you but I'm tipping the ACCC might not be too happy about it :rolleyes:

[Swordie]

In general I find if you treat Carsales people with respect there is not really much of a hassle. There is the odd person who you prefer not to deal with like any profession. I prepare by expecting to walk on to their turf and playing their games.

Looking for a new car is a problem I’m happy to have. The last time I looked I made sure I had a test drive of everything I considered. I prefer to do a deal with someone nice and pay a little extra for good service. This way it’s happy experience and if something goes wrong I can go back to issues resolved.

Considering the commission on new Holden’s I wouldn't expect gold service. I find some people like having their asses kissed when they want to purchase something. If I was salesman I someone treated me like crap for little commission I would show much service.

I stepped into a Porsche showroom recently and this was another world away from a Holden dealer. I wanted to have a chat with one of the service people about older Porsches and which one to buy. They sat me down offered me a nice coffee and spent as long as I wanted discussing what sort of older Porsche to buy which they didn't sell. When I left the service person offered his card and said feel free to call him for advice. The Porsche experience was definitely different than the Holden.

[hsvLS1255]

had a lovely experience with a particular dealer at roseberry in sydney. we were looking at getting an astra for my sister. asked how much and they said XXXX dollars, basically was the RRP price. we said fair enough but we were not happy with the price of the trade in. they moved up a bit but we were still not happy. we said we want YYYY dollars for the trade.

in the mean time they moved us from the little rooms they have out the front into the rooms to meet the finance person. they came back with regards to the trade in and said they were still trying to get the price we wanted, they were working on it....

then all of a suddon they salemans asks for my sisters credit card ???..... we ask what for, and could not get a straight answer from them. just said they are working on the trade price but would need our credit card. we asked why but they did not say why exactly they wanted a credit card. as soon as they said that we said dont worry about it and walked out the door. two salesmen still kept hounding us if we wanted the car, and asking if they did something to upset us and not buy the car...

also what really annoying was when we showed we were interested, they would put you in this little room then some other bloke come sin and tried to finish the sale... thenanother different guy etc etc.


still to this day do not know why they would ask for a credit card ??? anyone ever been asked for a credit card when purchasing their card.

[LSX-438]

anyone ever been asked for a credit card when purchasing their card.

usually under the guise as "id" or to get a deposit, but its basically to stop you running away.

[RICHO]

Can also be used to do a quick credit check.

Are you a finance risk?? What's your credit history like?? etc. If you're good to go from a finance perspective they may work a better deal for you.

Many dealers will sharpen their pencils more if you finance the car through them as they earn trail commissions from their financier be it Esanda or whoever else.

[kryten2001]

Can also be used to do a quick credit check.

Are you a finance risk?? What's your credit history like?? etc. If you're good to go from a finance perspective they may work a better deal for you.

Many dealers will sharpen their pencils more if you finance the car through them as they earn trail commissions from their financier be it Esanda or whoever else.

They can't run a credit check without your permission, and credit checks are generally done by financiers - not car yards.

What a sham. Goes back to my original principle. Assume you're gonna get screwed, and start with an offensive position.

Mate the part I hate, is when you put your offer in and they go off and sit in the "new car managers" office for 10 mins pretending to "consider" your offer. They then come back with the old "Oh well we can't do that, but how about this" line. They try and wait you out, so you'll eventually just give in and pay the price they want.

They're not fools mate, they know that must punters are just fish in a barrel and are picked off easily. How many suckers get conned into the "paint protection and rust proofing" scam? Man our local dealer has their own "warranty" that they try and rip you off another $1,300 for. What a crock. $800 tint anybody?..... Con merchants.

I'll take the car at the lowest price thanks, I don't need ya free coffee or tour of the service dept!!!

[RICHO]

They can't run a credit check without your permission, and credit checks are generally done by financiers - not car yards.

Most car yards have a financier on site who can take care of credit checks.

As for paint protection, tint etc......rip off?? Sure is at the prices they charge. But who pays full price for those.

Also worthwhile negotiating a total price (for the car + extras) but arrange for the extras to be invoiced separately after "delivery". Means you avoid a few extra $$ of tax.

[kryten2001]

Most car yards have a financier on site who can take care of credit checks.

As for paint protection, tint etc......rip off?? Sure is at the prices they charge. But who pays full price for those.

Also worthwhile negotiating a total price (for the car + extras) but arrange for the extras to be invoiced separately after "delivery". Means you avoid a few extra $$ of tax.

All the blokes I've dealt with over here in WA work for the car yards, not the finance companies (so we can chose from different finance companies) - so I guess things must be a little different over there.

Also invoicing seperately (to dodge stamp duty), is illegal - at least in WA. Dunno about the other states though.

[ecka]

For my two bobs...

I can't find a Holden used car dealer in the ACT that'll take my money. Three attempts now on V8's. I drive the trade vehicle in, carry a wad of cash in my pocket (combined value of $38,000) and say "I want a 2003 or later, Holden V8 with less than 40,000 km's. I want the deal "drive away". We close the deal today, I'll pick the car up within a week."

If they actually show me a 2003 model, it'll have more than 40,000 km's. If I point at a 2003 model with less than 40,000 km's they want "an extra $4000 changeover and I pay stamp and rego myself". Then they start offering me 2002 Stato's, 2001 Calais' etc etc

One phone call to a Sydney dealership today, a mate who went over the car for me, sight unseen agreement to my trade (with lots of details naturally), and suddenly I'm on the precipice of getting a 2003 Holden V8 with 20,000 km's drive away and keeping $5000 in my pocket!?

Maybe the salesman down here don't have to sell cars? Maybe they collect them? One I offered on had been advertised in the paper for 13 weeks straight "priced to sell this weekend" (a WK Stato). I went in 4 weeks after the advertising ceased and found it reduced by $1000. Best price I got was ticket minus trade, trade was shite, I was still $4000 short, and rego and stamp were still being negotiated as I was driving away trying to decide wether to laugh or hurt something.

[exwrx]

LOL @ ecka - I know exactly how you feel.

I have so many funny stories about car salespeople I could write a book. End result is that I dont buy a car from someone who treats me like shIt, no matter how cheap or good the car is.

One small example - after taking a car for a test drive a few years ago the salesman took me into his office and started filling out the contract, asking me for my address etc. I went along with the ruse until he asked me to sign. When I crossed out the list price he had thoughtfully put in and gave it back to him, he pretended to be all hurt and offended. I offered what I thought was a reasonable price and gave him my phone no to contact me if he changed his mind. He openly laughed at me and assured me he would not be contacting me again. I could set my watch by the regular weekly phone call I received from him for the next two months until I broke the news to him that I had bought a car elsewhere. :booty:

The scars from buying my VT are just starting to heal. I will start looking for a car for the cook soon so fun times ahead... :lol:

[clubbieboy]

LOL @ ecka - I know exactly how you feel.

I have so many funny stories about car salespeople I could write a book. End result is that I dont buy a car from someone who treats me like shIt, no matter how cheap or good the car is.

One small example - after taking a car for a test drive a few years ago the salesman took me into his office and started filling out the contract, asking me for my address etc. I went along with the ruse until he asked me to sign. When I crossed out the list price he had thoughtfully put in and gave it back to him, he pretended to be all hurt and offended. I offered what I thought was a reasonable price and gave him my phone no to contact me if he changed his mind. He openly laughed at me and assured me he would not be contacting me again. I could set my watch by the regular weekly phone call I received from him for the next two months until I broke the news to him that I had bought a car elsewhere. :booty:

The scars from buying my VT are just starting to heal. I will start looking for a car for the cook soon so fun times ahead... :lol:

Gday exwrx,
If you want to why not P.M me with the details of what you're after (presuming it's a Holden you're looking at, and new of course) I'll do the best that I can - you can go and shop it all over town no questions asked, get WRITTEN quotes from as many dealers as you like and if the genuine WRITTEN quote you get from somewhere else is cheaper than my first price (unlikely) I'll make sure we put a cheque in the glovebox for $250 and sell you the car at the cheaper price - now we can't be fairer than that can we??????

[exwrx]

Gday exwrx,
If you want to why not P.M me with the details of what you're after (presuming it's a Holden you're looking at, and new of course) I'll do the best that I can - you can go and shop it all over town no questions asked, get WRITTEN quotes from as many dealers as you like and if the genuine WRITTEN quote you get from somewhere else is cheaper than my first price (unlikely) I'll make sure we put a cheque in the glovebox for $250 and sell you the car at the cheaper price - now we can't be fairer than that can we??????

Thanks for the generous offer but unfortunately the mrs wants a VW Golf ! :eek:

Hopefully our little anecdotes are both amusing and sobering though, and no doubt you have just as many stories about unreasonable buyers. However if you treat customers with respect, then they should reciprocate. ;)

[clubbieboy]

Thanks for the generous offer but unfortunately the mrs wants a VW Golf ! :eek:

Hopefully our little anecdotes are both amusing and sobering though, and no doubt you have just as many stories about unreasonable buyers. However if you treat customers with respect, then they should reciprocate. ;)

I'm sure everyone who views the post will get a good laugh :lol: Oh with the GOlf - never fear the dealership I work for also owns two Volkswagon dealerships so still may be able to help out if you want :cool:
Either that or bite the bullet give her a good slappin, live on pizza and baked beans for a week and buy her a Holden :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[peber]

However if you treat customers with respect, then they should reciprocate. ;)

A classic example was when i was shopping for my current ride... was looking briefly through a nameless fleet sales yard to see if they had anything good (and not surprisingly everything was crap)...

The sales person was badgering the whole time, even after i made it clear he was not getting a sale.... finally as we're walking down the driveway and out i told him
"i don't see anything that interests me at all"
he keeps following us and says: "so what are you looking for then"
my mate replies with "a non pushy salesman"
salesperson: silence.
me and mate: *walk...*

[clubbieboy]

A classic example was when i was shopping for my current ride... was looking briefly through a nameless fleet sales yard to see if they had anything good (and not surprisingly everything was crap)...

The sales person was badgering the whole time, even after i made it clear he was not getting a sale.... finally as we're walking down the driveway and out i told him
"i don't see anything that interests me at all"
he keeps following us and says: "so what are you looking for then"
my mate replies with "a non pushy salesman"
salesperson: silence.
me and mate: *walk...*

Absolute gold mate i bet the salesman was :confused: Although if he was like that I'm surprised he didn't offer to get one of those in for you and ask what colour and how many years (k's :lol: )you would be happy with on your "non-pushy salesman :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[VooDoo]

I looked for a car for 3mths before buying the caprice. I wanted a Grange but they were either WAY overpriced or in poor condition. One of the dealers on the gold coast was VERY good at helping me but just couldnt get the right car.

In the end (after i blew the aircondup in the old VQ TWICE grr) i walked into Zupps, asked the sales guy if he wanted to sell me a car or not (didnt bother even looking in the lot). He asked what i wanted, what he needed to do to get me a car and what was my budget (i was fully pre-approved for the $$ for the last 3 mths)

He showed me a 2002 Caprice which was ex-Air Services Aust. Car was imaculate, low k's and full history from Zupps (they sold it, serviced it and traded it back on a new one) I got 3k more for the VQ than anyone else offered, full tank of fuel, free mats and a HSV jacket thrown in. At no point did i get pressured although they tried to sell me tint and PP which the car already had on it. Deal was done on the spot, they delivered the car to me @ work (over 40ks from the dealer) took my trade away. Overall i was happy with the price, the sales cycle, the after sales service has been excellent and my next car will come from them as well.

You can get good dealers, good sales people and a good experiance.

[ecka]

Bloody amazing! :eek:

There I was, tapping away my earlier post to this thread whilst making a few enquiries via Carsales. Phone rings (yesterday arvo) from a dealer in Sydney with one of the V8's I'd picked out. We get to chatting, my trade, his car, tyranny of distance, good deals yadda yadda yadda - then I drop how much of a nightmare it's been trying to get one in my neck of the woods...

This morning he rings me and asks for directions!!! :) He's driving the car (3 hours) down to my farm so I can check it out and he can get a better look at my trade. We've done the changeover negotiations already over the phone subject to us both being happy. He's thrown in a few bits and pieces, the price is "drive away", he's coming to me while I sit with my feet up in front of the fire, and the price difference between WHAT I OFFERED down here (and wasn't accepted) leaves more than enough for Sureflow (stainless full system plus coated pacemakers), Laptop surgery, and about 18 months fuel!!!! :deal: :deal: :deal:

Me thinks I'll be driving it around the Holden dealers in Canberra and very innocently approaching the various sales people that wouldn't take my money and asking "mate, directions to the service and parts section please." :yup:

MUHUhahahahahaha

[VZSS250]

My first car buying experience was in 2001 when I went in to buy a VX II SS at Ralph D'Silva in Preston, Vic.. The young bloke who served me was great, offering me a test drive in an M6 even though I made it clear I had never driven manual. He was also happy to talk cars in general and I really appreciated that.

But the price he offered was $52k when RRP back then was $46k. He also offered $16k on my VS II SS (40,000km, sunroof, stereo, botanica mica) when market value for that was $22k-$24k.

Anyway, I walked away and went to Mantello Holden (where eventually i purchased my VZ SS) in Fawkner and the guy there was in the middle of reading Motor Mag when I approached him so straight off I knew this guy would be good to talk to. He was great and cut the price I was offered at Ralph D'Silva. But that night Ralph D'Silva had me on the phone and offered a good deal, and in return for offering me a nice long test drive, I sealed the deal with them.

As for the VS II SS, I sold that to a friend for $20k the same day. We both came out of that deal $4k ahead. TRADING IN IS A BIG MISTAKE.

The price was the most important issue, but it was the test drive that swayed me. Young blokes in the forum will understand how hard it is to pursuade a dealer to give you a test drive.

3 years later I rejected Ralph D'Silva for that reason - I was not offered a test drive.

[ecka]

Just to let the forum know, I'm soon (Tuesday) to be a member of the LS1 club!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D

The fella arrived at my farm. We went for a drive. I backed it into my shed and went through it with a fine tooth comb. He had a look at my trade. I put the kettle on, we negotiated around my kitchen table, and the deal was done.

It gets better.

He's delivering the car to my door next Tuesday and driving the trade away. Now that's service.

If only I could get Greg to come down from Sureflow and do the exhaust and header work in the shed..... :lol: :lol:

[fekason]

In my earlier days, test drives were an important issue for me too.

I remember the days when the Holden dealer at Waverley in Melbourne, Brady Holden from memory, was willing to lend a car for a 24 hour test drive. Took a VC SL for a good run, but unfortunately had to not buy it. My wife couldn't physically get the gearbox into 2nd.

I can only recollect one test drive that sold me a car. I was walking past the local Holden dealer, and stopped by to window shop. A salesman engaged me in talk, and I made the comment that it was sad that they never had a manual Commodore demonstrator, especially with the Nissan engine in the VL. Shock, horror! They actually had one at that moment.

He said, "Let's go for a spin".

Off we went, and I asked could I drive the initial climb up to Glenbrook (from Penrith) to see our the engine worked. I nearly fell over when he suggested Old Bathurst Rd. It was a blast and a half. :D

Anyway, I was tempted but thought I should check the opposition. When I suggested the same road to the Mitsubishi dealer, he refused a test drive point blank. :mad: The Ford dealer only offered a test drive in a used vehicle rather than a demonstrator. :rolleyes:

I lasted about two days, and then bought the VL.

My last two cars, a VS S2 manual and a VY S2 manual, I bought without a test drive. I guess I have reached the point when I am content with my research and a short drive in a vehicle seems less critical now.

Now maybe if a dealer would give me a 24 hour test drive of a HSV or such, I might be tempted?

[Marco]

That's bloody brilliant service. If it all goes well on the day, I reckon the bloke and his employer deserve a plug here :)

[rodp]

"you are not looking to buy a car, you are looking for someone to sell you one"

how many people have purchased a car off someone they disliked?

Indeed. Last car I bought, I was still in looking mode (as all red blooded Aussie males like to do from time to time) and at that stage hadn't even decided I was going to buy a new car. Had been there before and spotted a car that really caught my eye. The salesman that dealt with me was a young bloke and was happy just to talk cars, no pressure at all.

Same guy recognised me and as more of a curiosity thing, decided to let them eval my car as a trade. They're willing to give me 20k on a VT2SS with 110k on the clock 5 months ago (that was starting to rack up some repair bills) so it was a case of show me where to sign. The guy was great, car had Vic plates and knowing he already had the sale, busted his arse to get me in the car on the Fri afternoon instead of taking the easy way and delivering it Monday morning.

[rodp]

TRADING IN IS A BIG MISTAKE.

It's not that black and white. Being in Sydney, living in a dodgy area and absolutely relying on a car to do my job with a 1 car garage is a huge risk. Trade for me in a convenience particularly since it's a buyers market.

Besides, the loss I incur against the depreciation of my car is a tax deduction. :p

[Y2kGoofball]

its an interesting read (and sorry to drag up an older topic)

Going back to the first post, I think we may have dealt with the same guy recently but it didnt quite go down like that, possibly though because they were the only dealership that acctually had the exact model we wanted on their floor and we didnt say "we're just looking", we said " we want to buy ..."

But I know what your talking about. I work in a service department for a certain manufacturer, but I dont mention this to dealerships when we're looking at buying the car, and some of the cr@p they spin is rediculous :rolleyes:. Not only that, to the common man you notice how different the car can be to different salesman even within the same dealership. Power ratings, fuel tank sizes and consumption rates, accessories and even tyre and rim sizes change for the same model car! I didnt realise the same model, say an SS or a CV8, can have so many variations!

But we have been the same. 1 dealer was more then happy to talk until he found out we would be buying via a company lease plan, which meant we would be buying from their fleet salesman and not him therefore he makes no commission ... his tune certainly changed and we stood out in the rain for 10 mins while he found a brouchure, then another 15 mins while he dug up the fleet guys card, then he dissapeared into the office to grab his coffee "he made as we walked in" and never come back.

1 dealership didnt come near us at all. We sat in the car, turned the stereo up to full ball even blasted the horn at the 30 minute mark and still no one even looked at us (except other customers)

1 told us the model we wanted was total BS and he heard nothing but bad reports, thats why he has the VY V8 version avail. When we said we want a 6 for a reason he still tried to push us to the 8

1 took my number to call me when their brouchures come in, "to have a look and if we still want that particular model he'll try to organise one". I've since called 4 times and went in in my work clothes twice and I'm still waiting just for brouchure ...

Suttons had a 45 minute wait for a salesman/woman, but they appeared busy so we waited patiently. As I said, they were the only dealership we'd been too that had our particular model! It was pelting down with rain but the car we were after was in the showroom (with the monaro) so it gave us a good chance to test out the comfort factor of the seats and look over the car

1 dealership told me one price for the VZ on Wednesday, one price slightly higher on Thursday when I went back in, and one price some $15 000 higher again for a VY on Saturday when we went back. FYI they cant get a VZ V6, only a VY V8 which defeats the purpose especially when I told them we're after a VZ and a 6 cylinder!

Why do we bother half the time?

[Vx_Adonis]

Had an interesting experience afew years ago!
Was looking at buying a secondhand VT SS 2 - went to afew dealers, didnt like the price they were offering me, so i thought id try Ferntree Gully Holden.
Salesman came up to me, asked me what i wanted, and tells me that he can get the one i want from their holding yard, located somewhere else. I thought ,great, asked him what day they would have it here so i could check it out.
What he told me next i couldnt beleive - they would only bring it down if i put a deposit on it!! I asked if i did that, could i get my money back? He said only if it didnt pass their 'stringent' inspection :mad: :mad:
I told him thats its crazy putting down a deposit on a car without having seen it - his reply was if they put the car i wanted on display , someone else might buy it before i had a chance to look at it. That way, by putting down a deposit, it would be yours. (By the way, this same salesman was adament that all the cop interceptors were being modified at HSV in Clayton, and came with there own build number :lol: )
To cut a long story short, the following week i got a new VX SS 2 on a cheap runout price.
:mad: FARK YOU FTG HOLDEN :mad:

[ecka]

What he told me next i couldnt beleive - they would only bring it down if i put a deposit on it!! I told him thats its crazy putting down a deposit on a car without having seen it

Before mine was driven 3 hours to my place, by the salesman, for me to check out, I was asked for a $500 deposit over the phone (via a CC). Being seriously interested in the car (sight unseen) and having already nutted out a ballpark changeover price subject to both parties liking each others cars, I reached immediately for the card and put down the deposit.

When the fella was filling out the paperwork on my kitchen table I asked him about the deposit. His words "Just a mechanism to see if you're serious. If you're still deciding between models etc and are yet to commit, not much point driving three hours for you to have a look and kick the tyres."

I thought that was perfectly fair enough.

Maybe your joker was trying the same tactic? Feel out how serious you were? Seeing you bought a different car (VX as opposed to VT, possibly new as opposed to second hand) maybe he was right? ;)

[Vx_Adonis]

it was just his attitude - the holding yard was close by, but it was closed on the weekend. One of the biggest smart-ass salesman i have ever seen.

[COSMOS]

Just had an interesting experience at Suttons Chullora. But lets start at the beginning. Compared to most people we buy more new cars than average. Since March 2004 I have bought a VY SS, an Astra, a Vectra and another Astra. Our family only seems to drive Holdens and in the past few years I reckon we have bought about 10 all up.

My wife is a hard bargain hunter – never rude, just professional and honest with the dealer along the lines of “heres our best price, if you want our business you need to better it, match it and have some added incentive or admit you cant help us and we can be out of here.”

Back in 2003 I got this new job and decided to lease a car – at the time I thought a Vectra CDXi in manual would be nice. I went down to Suttons Chullora and had a look (didn’t drive it) at a demo. The salesman at the time, lets call him “Fred” pulled it out of the service garage but it was raining so hard I decided not to take it out. I came back the next Saturday and took it for a drive and decided it wasn’t for me. I also took an Sv8 and SS series 1 out.

Thanked “Fred” and let him know I would prefer a series II SS and would wait for them to come out in October 2003 before making a decision. This was June.

Fast forward to October 2003 and work was so busy I never got around to actually driving a series II SS until almost the beginning of December. I thought it was silly to pay full price for a 2003 plated car that would devalue so much in a matter of a month or so. Come January and my mums next door neighbour is the salesman at another dealership in the area. Of course I bought my SS and the other three holdens since from him.

Well one of the cars I bought was a 2004 Vectra for my wife and our new baby – this was in December 2004. Come to now and my wife has decided she no longer wants the Vectra. I paid 30k for it with my GM discount as a demo with 1333 klms in auto. It’s a great car which I actually like to drive but she reckons it’s a little too wide and it wallows on the road. So we have decided to off load it and buy an Astra CDX wagon. She was undecided about auto or manual, as our old 2001 Astra was manual but now with a kid manual isn’t so much fun.

Problem is they are so new that its hard to find one to drive, let alone an auto and manual at the one dealership. So this morning she rang around a few places trying to locate both at the one dealership.

She spoke to a salesman at Suttons Homebush who told her the manual drives just the same as the auto so come and take their auto for a drive. She laughed and thanked him before hanging up the phone. I told her to ring him back and ask to buy the auto at the manual price if they drive the same.

Next call was to Suttons Chullora. They had both in a CD, not CDX but it was the diff between auto and manual we wanted to see, not the trim levels. So we went down and introduced ourselves to the salesman. He showed us the car and then the sales manager comes out and its “Fred” from 2003.

“Fred” tells me I look familiar so I say yeah I was looking at a Vectra in 2003. He asks if I bought one and I told him yeah I ended up buying my wife one in December but I bought myself an SS in early 2004.

Like a smart arse he asks me if its going to take me a year to decide on the Astra wagon. I laughed in a kind of “pull your head in dopey” way and said yeah maybe even two years mate. Then I got all serious and said we were looking to buy as soon as possible.

The salesman takes us for a drive in both and we prefer the auto. I ask him the price during the test and he tells me he doesn’t know the price. WHAT THE F**K you don’t know how much the cars are you are selling. He tells me only “Fred” the sales manager knows how much the cars cost and we have to talk to him about the price.

Now whilst all this is happening I am considering what I should sell the Vectra for. We got a trade in valuation last week of 20k where we bought it which is not really a great price so I have decided to sell it privately for 24-26k. For comparison I asked the salesman to organise a valuation on it whilst we were out driving the Astra’s.

I may already have a buyer but I don’t know what to ask for it and really the price of the new Astra will determine what I ask my mate to pay for the car (if he wants it). As I have the GM card I am trying to do a $nil or <$1000 changeover. If the new car is more than say $29k or $30k then I wont sell the Vectra, and we wont buy the Astra. It’s a bit chicken/egg like but that’s business isn’t it?

We get back and go into the sales area. Still our salesman cant tell us the price – we have to wait for “Fred” to finish with the other two customers before us and then tell us the price. UMMMM HELLO??????????????

Finally “Fred” comes over with his piece of paper and asks us what we thought etc. I told him we would likely buy the auto. He tells us, after friggin around for a while and me telling him to spit out the valuation, that he will give us $18k for the Vectra. I said okay – how much is the Astra in auto CDX please mate.

He wont tell us – he wants us to accept the offer for the Vectra there and then or he says we are wasting his time. I thought I misheard him so I said – “are you saying that unless I agree to buy this car right now with a trading you wont tell me the price?” He says yes – I didn’t buy the Vectra off him last time so he wont tell me the price.

What a dope – my missus just stood up and said we’re outta here mate. Give me my car keys. I stood up and told him as loud as I could that I wouldn’t ever be buying a car from a Suttons dealership and that I will be putting my complaint in writing to the Suttons leadership team for feedback.

I went to another dealer and got an on the road best price in about 10mins. So now I have a firm price I know what I can afford as a changeover between what the Vectra is worth in the private market - $24800 – and what the new Astra will cost me driveaway after GM rebates ($23,000 for an auto CD with plenty of extras to $25,600 for an auto CDX with not as many extras).

Now that I know this I know what I am prepared to take as a sale price for the Vectra and pricewise what price I wont take that will necessitate keeping the car. I have a mate who is thinking of buying it for use as a company car for one of his employees – if we come to terms then he will have it next week and some dealer will have my deposit and order for a new Astra mid this week.

One thing I know – Suttons Chullora wont be that dealer. Why do these idiots make it so hard?

[Bully]

One of the worst incidents that comes to mind was at Suttons Motors at Homebush. There I was admiring a Monaro in the yard when this young guy with his Holden shirt comes up to me. This was after about 15 minutes of looking around for someone to serve me...

"Gday mate, after a car are ya?"

"Yep. I'm looking at this stage."

The expression on his face instantly changed to one of disdain. It was like I'd lifted a garlic clove to a vampires face. How dare I, the customer, waste his time by not buying a car here and now.

"So just looking, not interested in buying" he says to me, his tone was one of someone who had been offended or wronged. His body language became almost confrontational.
Am I Robinson Crusoe on this one?
I had a very similar experience with suttons at Waitara when looking at buying our clubby a little over 12 months ago. I had seen their salesman a few weeks earlier & told him we were in the market, what could they do as we had bought other cars through them in the past. Response was I was given the list price, see what we can do when you are ready. The day we bought our clubby (which I had already seen & been quoted an extremely good quote on) I thought we would give them a chance at repeat business. I was approached by a young salesman who said he would get the sdalesman I had spoken to, he couldnt be bothered to come outside & see me, Barry Smith Holden got a sale. A few weeks later, a girl from suttons rings & asks if we were still looking at buying, when I told her what happened, she couldnt give a stuff!!!!!! Go figure!!!!!

[Falchoon]

I have only bought one new car and found it is essential to do all your research on price, options etc before you go anywhere near a dealer. With the internet it is just too easy to this, using the website of the manufacturer of your preferred vehicle, and also forums like these.

In late 2002 I bought a XR6T and I went to the dealer fully armed with the retail price, what options were available and how much they cost. You can even research the approximte worth of your trade-in through such places like redbook.com.au. This cuts down on so much of the BS.

The salesman I dealt with wasn't that pushy but had poor product knowlegde of what he was trying to sell (he was an ex-Holden salesman). He actually talked me out of a couple of options (MOMO steering wheel was one) that I was thinking of getting!

I actually didn't have a serious intention to buy at the time, I was more curious to view the then new Falcon in the flesh. Without me even asking the dealer offered me a test drive! After that I was hooked!

The salesman wrote down his you-beaut-special-discount price for me and I had to stop myself from laughing in his face as the price was full retail. In the end I only managed to negotiate about $800 off the retail price but at least it was better than paying $800 more.

[Vulture]

... He actually talked me out of a couple of options (MOMO steering wheel was one) that I was thinking of getting!

What is it with that? Exactly the same thing happened to me only 2 weeks ago while looking at the XR6T. Maybe it's so they can source the car faster and not have to wait for it to be custom built by the factory. My guy was talking me out of performance brakes! WTF would a salesman discourage upselling?

[COSMOS]

What is it with that? Exactly the same thing happened to me only 2 weeks ago while looking at the XR6T. Maybe it's so they can source the car faster and not have to wait for it to be custom built by the factory. My guy was talking me out of performance brakes! WTF would a salesman discourage upselling?

so he can sell you stock either in their yard or already on its way to their yard or another yard they are trying to do a stock swap with.

When i was at the other holden dealer yesterday i saw a VY SS in phantom mica which has been in the showroom for 398 days - costing the dealer $40 per week on their floor plan, unsold !

[MRGPACK]

Not all car sales are like that im in the trade myself and i treat my customers well if they dont buy on the spot thats bad luck but if u are nice they come back.