VP 6cyl

[Swordie]

I'm looking around for a reliable car for one of my relatives. They want something below $5,000 with air, power steering and auto. They will be doing less than 120 kms per week so having a 6cyl is not going to blow their fuel budget. I considered a Camry but thought the VP 6cyl should have plenty of life, not struggle as much as the 4cyl and is good value for money.

I was looking at VP 6's and there is the odd one with less than 200,000 Kms and a few between 200 to 250Km.

What do people think of VP 6cyl sedan? What are they like? What should I look for?

[clubbieboy]

You might even consider looking around for a VR Swordie, I picked up a 190K VR exec with roof, IRS and ABS for my better half about six months ago for $3,200 (including roadie but not stamp duty) Does the job a treat only thing that's gone wrong is that I had to replace the shocks at all four corners, which was only like $280 - I fitted them myself so no labour lol. Anyhow worth lookin at, hope they find something :D

[paul05]

i had a vp vacationer v6 for a few years, some things to look out for are ,metalic paint on vp's had problems but would all be cracked or faided by now.series 1 vp's built from august 1992 have series 2 engines(dip stick on the front near the coils not on the side)i only had wear and tear problems at around 220000 km's such as o ring on power steer tank,fuel pump ,radiater re core and some say steering rack but my rack was fine.the series 2 engine were rocker changes and less vibration than the vn and vp 1 series engines.some series 2 had irs and abs but not on all cars.my vp was mint ,i sold it at 280000km to buy my vy.a mate at work took his over the 400000km mark and still went well.if i think of anything alse i'll get back to you. :)
as clubbie said vr's and even vs's for under 6 grand ,i saw a ecotech near work for $5500 but with 215000km good luck

[NinetySix]

pre-ecotech v6's are absolutely rough as guts IMO, but test one out

[Drizt]

pre-ecotech v6's are absolutely rough as guts IMO, but test one out


if driven sedately they are perfectly smooth...

given a bit of a rev over 4,500 rpm... they are rough as guts...

depends on who is driving them....

personally i would never own a pre-ecotec again.....

[Swordie]

The VR sounds like it's worth investigating. This car will be driven by an elderly person so will be driven gently. With 5K to spend the Ecotech is not really an option.

[VXSS346]

My previous car was a VP auto 6. (It cracked a 15.7@87mph with 3.45 gears and full exhaust.) :D
Overall its a good car, its still owned by my mun and with 230,000kms, its still going well.
Original tranny, engine etc.
The engine is are as rough as guts by todays standards, but it'll keep going for a while yet.

Might be hard to find a good one though, a lot of them leak water in the boot, so look out for that too.

Hope this helps

[NinetySix]

my experience comes from my gf's dads early VN S pac, one of the first to roll out of the factory and he has owned it since new. its absolutely immaculate, except for a slightly warped dash just above the middle air vents.. he as absolutely babied the car its whole life, and its got much less than 200,000km on the clock... it certainly hasnt been trouble free tho! but i wont go into that


but even just at idle it reminds me of somebody sharpening an axe on an old fashioned stone wheel that you have to pedal to keep moving :lol: the accellerator is a deadly on/off switch (yes i know that VN s2 and VP dont have that feature) and even under normal accelleration its hardly what i would call smooth... cruising at 60kph its not too bad, but giving it some curry causes the whole car to vibrate, even from lowish rpms... like you can see the dash moving about, you vision is even slightly blurred! just like being in a car with a couple of 15" subwoofers and a few thousand watts in amps :eek: the car has FE2 suspension i beleive, and sits slightly lower than standard (s pac for ya?)

the accelleration is quite good, im sure it could peel off 15 second passes as many others have quoted from stock early v6 commodores... and from a standing start jumping on the gas will engage the smoke screen feature :lol: quite ammusing but actually sort of annoying if your trying to make a quick get away and it just wants to wheel spin! very tractable cars tho so long as you dont just floor it.. you see many P platers driving such cars with no hubcaps, chopped springs and highly polished ducos... and the TLGP warrior driving it usually will have many scalps under his belt from far superior cars :rolleyes:



now call me silly call me crazy call me what ever, but getting out of the gf's dads VN and into the gf's ED wagon to me feels like getting out of.....well, a VN! ( :lol: ) and into a mercedes! 0-100 performance is well down compared to the VN, the handling no where near as precise and a bit boatier, but .... the inline 6 is so so smooth in comparison! its definately nothing like a bmw/mercedes, or even a BA/BF DOHC 4.0 but under normal driving conditions you just dont really get any harshness or vibration compared to the VN... even under full noise its still fairly smooth...

yes call me crazy, but being old enough to not really care about TLGP any more, i find the ED so so so much nicer to drive :confused:

i know VPs are a little smoother than VNs, but not by much!

even my ex-sister in laws VS was noticably harsher than any EB-AU falcon ive driven ... true, faster, but was never a fan of the way the roof and dash kinda shakes under full noise! but uhmmm yeah, id take a VS over a ED truth be told :p


sorry for the rant, but early V6 commodores make me feel ill :box:

[Swordie]

The Ford is probably a smother engine. My concern with the older Ford say EB-EL is issues around head gasgets and transmissions. My impression is the Holden has a more reliable drive train especially with the amount of Kms I'm looking at. I hear there were issues with the VN Series 1 on take off but this was fixed with Series II.

I would consider a Japanese alternative but find the Holden offers good value for money. The Ford Falcon is probably worth investigating too.

[VXSS346]

I wouldn't go japanese, the simplicity of a rear wheel drive sedan, and parts availability make it a better choice for my mind.
They are really easy to service yourself too. Plugs, oil filter/drain plug, leads etc, are all easy to get to.

[vzsv6]

cruising at 60kph its not too bad, but giving it some curry causes the whole car to vibrate, even from lowish rpms... like you can see the dash moving about, you vision is even slightly blurred! just like being in a car with a couple of 15" subwoofers and a few thousand watts in amps :eek: .................................................. .....................


....................................even my ex-sister in laws VS was noticably harsher than any EB-AU falcon ive driven ... true, faster, but was never a fan of the way the roof and dash kinda shakes under full noise!
Roof and dash shaking??
That has got to be, hands down, the biggest crock of shit I have ever read. Does anyone actually believe this garbage?

[Gee]

Another charming post brought to you by vzsv6.

Maybe NinetySix is using a little poetic licence, but V6 VN Commodes (and VP-VS to a lesser extent) are tractors, pure and simple :D

[NinetySix]

hey vzsv6, i thought you said you were leaving this forum? good to see you back :)

any way we've all heard your 2 cents time and time again, well the above is my 2 cents. like it or lump it, its my humble oppinion on buick V6's from what i have experienced. I like to think im quite unbiased (unlike some :lol: ) tho i cant help but go for the underdog :rolleyes:


true the falcons do have trouble with head gaskets, tho at the same time my gf's ED with nearly 370,000km on the clock is still on the factory head gasket... and her dads VN with less than 200,000km has had cracked heads... he has also had gearbox trouble which has been repaired... tho the ED is showing signs of gearbox trouble to come (it shifts with a nasty clunk after about 45 minutes driving)

most of the fords out there have had their head gaskets done, and once they are done they usually dont need to be done again (if the right gaskets and head studs are used) but i wont go too far into that.


still, plenty of nice cars out there for 5k

[oz_utester]

i owned a Vr Series 1 Acclaim for 2 years, from 150,000-175,000.

the engine was raspy and noisy under throttle, but other than that i had no issues, i gave it plenty of stick every now and then. i never encountered this roof and dash flexing. was smooth under accleration, and i was quite happy with it. the biggest let down of these cars was the transmission, the auto is complete junk. i had alot of problems.

calling the VN-VS models a tractor is a joke, from all the vr's and vs's i have been in they havnt been terrible at all. the VR is still in my family, as i went backwards and bought a VH SL/E.

be wary as these cars are reaching the time in their lives were everything needs an overhaul. shocks, etc. if this has all be done, then a VR will suit your needs to a T.

[vzsv6]

hey vzsv6, i thought you said you were leaving this forum? good to see you back :)

any way we've all heard your 2 cents time and time again, well the above is my 2 cents. like it or lump it, its my humble oppinion on buick V6's from what i have experienced. I like to think im quite unbiased (unlike some :lol: ) tho i cant help but go for the underdog :rolleyes:


true the falcons do have trouble with head gaskets, tho at the same time my gf's ED with nearly 370,000km on the clock is still on the factory head gasket... and her dads VN with less than 200,000km has had cracked heads... he has also had gearbox trouble which has been repaired... tho the ED is showing signs of gearbox trouble to come (it shifts with a nasty clunk after about 45 minutes driving)

most of the fords out there have had their head gaskets done, and once they are done they usually dont need to be done again (if the right gaskets and head studs are used) but i wont go too far into that.


still, plenty of nice cars out there for 5k


I have owned VN-VS in the past and would be the first to admit that the engines are not the smoothest going around, but I also know for a fact that what you are saying is total and utter b.s unless there was something wrong with the individual car that you drove. The thread starter asked for realistic and constructive opinions regarding the purchase of a VP V6 and you come out and post these ridiculous and outrageous exaggerations. Now you may accuse me of immature posts and lowering the standards of this forum, but what you have posted in this thread takes the cake for that.

[NinetySix]

well i cant admit to owning these cars, but have had plenty of driving time in several of them, which gives me a fairly unbiased view of their traits as im not "used to them" and can compare them quite reasonably to the I4's, I6's and V8's that im more familiar with.

maybe there were serious problems with all the V6 commodores ive been in, maybe they ALL had buggered drive shafts causing the symptoms i have observed. but maybe not.

im just stating the facts from what i have observed, he asked for oppinions and he got them, dont shoot the messenger :box:


i think for smoothness the pick of the buick's that i have driven was probably a VT s-pack (atmo not SC) tho i couldnt help but notice that in its 'midrange' it seemed about the same as an EF 4.0 did at the redline (which aint pretty!)


but hey you cant take oppinions from people on forums as godsent, they might be biased and they dont even know it :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

i cant help but prefer I6's (regardless of manufacturer) to V6's due to my experiences with them...


tho i gotta say i was impressed with a VZ v6 ute i was in (175kw version) it was dead smooth, tho i could tell from the sound it was a V6, but i couldnt feel that it was a v6. power was a little toooo linear for my liking tho, tiny bit too rev happy as well. nice tho.

[NinetySix]

The thread starter asked for realistic and constructive opinions regarding the purchase of a VP V6 and you come out and post these ridiculous and outrageous exaggerations.

what he said was.....


What do people think of VP 6cyl sedan? What are they like?

so i gave him my take... it sounds like hes never been in one if he asks "what are they like" .... i think the best thing he could do is take one for a test drive, and if he agrees with me, so be it, if he thinks im full of it, fair game.

[holdennutta]

Just weighing in on this OT VN V6 debate...I drive a series one VN V6 with 205k km on the clock. Done a bit of towing in it's day and a few long distance trips. I wouldn't call it babied, but it's not thrashed either.

I wouldn't reccomend one for an elderly couple because from my experience with mine at this end of it's life it's just not reliable enough. Plenty of performance but at the compromise of smoothness and reliability (heck, if you want smoothness/reliability you don't look anywhere near a 14yr old Commodore!).

I gotta say though, I don't know where NinetySix got his info from but I know for a fact that the dash in these cars doesn't like to be removed and put back together as the plastic has gone all hard and won't fit perfectly again, but my VN has had the dash out numerous times and there is no sign of it moving about at all. Does tend to break traction alot if prevoked and the throttle is touchy. And now the idle is starting to get a little rough but I think "blurred vision" is hyperbole!

(Although, as a result of some recent trouble mine sounds remeniscent of a diesel..)

[NinetySix]

well i didnt say anything about taking the dash out... tho perhaps where it has warped around the vents in the middle doesnt help?


by 'moving about' i mean vibrating and rattling.. the dash wont move or wobble if you push it with your hand with the engine off



oh, i got my info from my eyes, ears, hands and bum :lol:

[VXSS346]

Well, I think 'Swordie' has got enough useful info now, as well as some useless info as well :D

Best advice I can give is to look around, drive various examples and judge for yourself.
Most are bad, some are good, you only have to look at condition of them on the road to know that.
Theres too much woffling on here for him to make a constructive choice.

[V8R]

a tidy VL povo pack (~2k) and spend a few k on it, maybe?
I rather the "last" of a line then the first. I'm having this exact debate with myself.. spend ~5k on a newer (relativly unknown) car, or drop 3.5 or so into the VL and really give it a full-house tidy up?

[vzsv6]

oh, i got my info from my eyes, ears, hands and bum :lol:

I think your bum is where it's coming out of :lol:

[The Griff]

Back on topic, I don't think you could go wrong with a well maintained VR, which would be in your price range. I have had my Acclaim since new (1994) and have had no mechanical problems except for a replacement water pump in the last few months. Mine has only 130,000 k on it, but there are plenty of low k examples around so you will have no problem picking one up. Servicing and part are also cheap.

Despite the negative comments by others on the pre ECOTEC V6, it is tolerable below 4000 rpm and is smooth enough when cruising. I agree that it is rough at idle though. My other car is an Accord Euro with an engine so smooth and refined you barely know its running, so I do have a good comparison.

I would recomend an Acclaim over an Executive or a Berlina as it came standard with ABS, Airbag and IRS. Live axle VRs are not as nice in my opinion.

[Swordie]

Thanks all for your help.

For my elderly relatives I picked up a 1993 ED Falcon GLI with 133,000Km for $3,200 with RWC, service history and 7 months registration. The car's interior is quite good, the body is straight with the odd scratch. Not bad car to drive, the old 4.0 has a bit of grunt.