Suburban

[Swordie]

I'm helping someone out at the moment research 4WDs. They have a large family, need the 3rd row of seats and will be towing a caravan.

Out of interest does anyone know what Holden Suburban's are like for reliability, economy, servicing costs, towing and 4WD capabilities? Is it a practical car to drive around Australia? There are two types petrol 5.7 and diesel 6.5. I would be interested to hear information on both.

The Toyota Landcruiser Turbo Diesel seems hard to go past but is pricy. The Turbo Diesel Prado has potential but seems to shadow under the Landcruiser for towing capability and grunt.

[Glenn@Autowerks]

Mate of mine has a Suburban and he has no complaints. Its actually his misses car. He imported it before they became available here and changed it over. Its like driving a tank though, not a city car.

[MICK_EZEKIEL]

I would be a bit hesitant to go a Suburban... They stopped selling them and the resale value wouldnt be all that good and im guessing parts would be a little harder to find or have to be imported from the US.. wouldnt be too many around as I havent seen one in ages.. I would be sceptical as im guessing they stopped selling it for a reason...

IMO I would go the Landcruiser... parts would be easy to find and they are more "commercial" as there are heaps of them around....

I'll prob get shot for saying this... but have you looked at even a Ford Explorer...??? they are big american 4X4 that are pretty cheap... if thats what your looking for...

[exploder]

I'll prob get shot for saying this... but have you looked at even a Ford Explorer...??? they are big american 4X4 that are pretty cheap... if thats what your looking for...


If you go down this path only get the newer body shape. Plus keep in mind with the explorer the 7 seat and 5 seat versions are different chassis, so you can't just buy a 5 seat one and option the 3rd row seats.

[Dover]

Yea i would go the td landcruiser, my old man has a td shara and gets a av fuel of 9-11 per 100 k. There toyota which gm cant compare with, i reckon it almost handles better than my ss ute.. Well its a lot lighter in the steering dept. Th td goes real well. A td hilux will be my next ute as i want something reliable which is something gm can not offer in my experiance.
Ben

[Stevotski]

Do you need 7 seats or 8 seats?

If it's only 7 then have a look at a Patrol - they havent got the best build quality but then they are a lot cheaper than a Cruiser wagon and come with a factory 3500kg towbar...

The 4.2TD would be better than the 3.0TD for towing - plus they have some amount of tuning potential as they run a low boost turbo setup. The 3.0 is already boosted to the shithouse by the factory

Had a friend with a suburban V8 TD - huge tank to park and definetly not an urban vehicle - patrol is bad enough in this respect

[Dover]

the hilux is a 3lt the landcruiser is a 4.5lt

Edit: Both TD

[Swordie]

The Landcruiser is a 4.2 Diesel on NA and Turbo. I’ll have a look into the Patrol. From my research it seems the same old story with Toyota they don't have as many problems.

I'm wondering if the extra $10,000 (brand new) is worth it for the Turbo Diesel over the Petrol V8 Cruiser? On tow the V8 uses nearly 10 litres per 100kms more, that’s allot of Kms to make up the price difference.

The new Pathfinder is an interesting car, it can seat 7 and tow 3000 kg. It seems to have some off road abilities as well. There's as not much infomation on it as the Landcruiser and Patrol.

[Dover]

yea sorry the cruiser is a 4.2 td. could a sworn the sahara had 4.5 on the side but it just says turbo..

[vxcalais]

if you have your hart set on a suburban buy a 5.7 petrol they are a better truck the only problem they have is the diff's are weak

[Stevotski]

The new Pathfinder is an interesting car, it can seat 7 and tow 3000 kg. It seems to have some off road abilities as well. There's as not much infomation on it as the Landcruiser and Patrol.

I just don't know about the longevity of the 2.5TD in the Pathy - it makes more power and torque than the 3.0TD in Patrol, an engine itself with a bad reputation for self-imploding at 80-100Km, so a smaller engine, boosted to make even more power from the same manufacturer raises some reliability questions... although the YD is a different engine series so it may well have been properly designed to handle the boost... as you would hope so

also Pathy uses AWD rather than a full 4WD system if that matters

[chevypower]

I am going to dispell all these myths about Suburbans
ok true, the interior quality and styling were a let down on the ones they brought to Australia - if you can look past these things, here is some reality

Hard to drive? They are very easy to drive, if you have driven old Landcruisers and found them truck-like to drive, that is fairly true, you have to work them to get them going. Suburbans actually have a good sized V8 engine, with gear ratios similar to a Commodore, and they get going with minimal fuss - very easy to see all around you too, and where the edges of the vehicle is - they also launch hard when pushed, and you feel plenty of torque when half-throttling Personally, i think they are enjoyable to drive, but I guess it depends what you like driving.

Resale? THey were released in 1998 for a similar price to a Caprice. Suburbans still sell for around $40k-45k, a VS Caprice is worth about $15,000

fuel consumption? between 13-18L per 100km for the Vortec 5.7 (about the same economy or better than a Discovery3 V8) The diesel is better again.

Towing? For some reason the 1500 petrol is only rated at 2.7 tonnes in Australia and the 2500 diesel at 3.5 tonnes - but you know they will pull at those limits with no fuss, just stick it on cruise control, and you wont even feel it.

Hopefully one day Holden will replace it with the 2007 Tahoe, which i think would sell better here, and would still be good enough to replace that gap in it's product lineup.

Having said all that, as good as the Burb is, for $45000 you could get in to a brand new Pathfinder, with 3000kg towing capacity as suggested. But get the 4L V6 if you like driving.

[VL Executive]

Silly question, But are the 5.7 ltr V8's in the suburban, the same as the LS1's in VT Commodores?

Sorry if I sound like a Dill. :o

[chevypower]

nah the 98 Suburban had a gen 2 (true 350ci) iron block V8, the 2000 Suburban 5.3 and 6.0 were generation 3 Vortec V8s, but different displacements, and also had iron blocks
the 2007 Escalade has an all alloy 6.2 Gen 4 - not sure what the Tahoe and Suburban will have

[Swordie]

I remember when the Suburban was first released, one of major criticisms is they were hard to park when going shopping around the suburbs. From what I have read about the them from U.S owners they seemed to be quite reliable and most people are quite happy. As someone mentioned in a previous post depreciation hasn't been too bad compared to other cars originally in its price range. They seem like a good if you need something for towing and carrying lots of people around with a bit of space.

It’s a shame all countries can’t drive on the same side of the road, we miss out on allot of product due to the expense of engineering LHD to RHD.

It’s looking like a Toyota or Discovery Diesel is the options at this stage. The new Pathfinder doesn’t seem like an option at this stage as not enough is known and their potential 4WD capabilities are not in the same league.

[ADSXR8]

If your prepared to shop around with an open mind, have a look at a F250. They come in a variety of motors and seating arrangements. It too has a petrol or turbo diesel V8 with a towing capacity of 3.5tonnes plus.

But I am sure it will have the parking issues similar to a Suburban.

Good luck

[Stevotski]

It’s looking like a Toyota or Discovery Diesel is the options at this stage. The new Pathfinder doesn’t seem like an option at this stage as not enough is known and their potential 4WD capabilities are not in the same league.

If they can wait, our fleet dealer has told us that there is a new Prado coming out this year with the DOHC version of the TD engine (ie: same as current Hilux). The Japanese domestic spec Prado has had this engine for some time. This engine has 125kw@3400rpm and 352Nm@1400~3400rpm rather then the 96kw@3600rpm and 343Nm@2000rpm of the current australian model. So while not the 150kw / 430Nm of the Landcruiser, it is getting there.

Another good thing with Prado is 180L fuel capacity, especially when towing a van. My Patrol is only 135L and I am lucky to get 900km out of a tank (not towing anything).

[Swordie]

It's looking like 2000kg max to tow, maybe around 1600Kg. Something really big is probably not necessary at this stage.

The new Prado sounds interesting. Is there an ETA when it will be released? I would assume mid year. Looking to purchase in the next few weeks.

[Stevotski]

It's looking like 2000kg max to tow, maybe around 1600Kg. Something really big is probably not necessary at this stage.

The new Prado sounds interesting. Is there an ETA when it will be released? I would assume mid year. Looking to purchase in the next few weeks.

Sorry i dont have anything more specific but i got the impression it was a mid-year thing.