Xr6 Turbos Everywhere

[vysandman]

Don't know about people in other states but has anyone noticed how many XR6 Turbos/Typhoons are getting around Sydney at the moment. Everywhere I go lately there's a Turbo Falcon lurking and now quite a few "sleepers" which seem to be modified.It seems to have a wide appeal to both older and younger demographics. I travel between 90-150km a day on Sydneys roads and I see a few VY/VZ Clubbies a few (more) GT/GT-P's and several XR6 Turbo/Typhoons. I know you're going to say, yeah well what about the SS Commies to make a fair comparison, well if you added all VY/VZ SV8's,SS,Clubbies etc and all GT/GT-P's,XR6 Turbos and Typhoons BA/BF, then I'd think that I see more Fords. The Turbo Falcon really seems to be the Weapon of choice at the moment. Does anyone have any figures comparing HSV Sales 2005 to FPV Sales 2005 or GT/GT-P sales compared to Typhoon sales ? I'm aHolden man through and through and I love V8's (very old school) but that Typhoon/Tornado really looks like a muscle car and for very little money can go like one.

[Aus8]

I hate to say it but to be totally 100% honest I see more XR6T's than SS's now and more FPV's than VY/VZ HSV's. Just my "personal observations" before someone flames me quoting sales figures. No doubt the BA brang out some of the closet Ford Supporters aswell as quite a few Holden converts. (Just like Ford fans that bought VT'SS instead of AU's). I would like a Yellow BF Typhoon 6 Speed Auto please with a edit and instant 12 second quarters please.

Take a 6 Speed Auto typhoon for a drive......... Yes they are that good even a diehard General man like me can admit it! This car really is a new driving experience! Just take one for a drive the Auto and motor, suspension are absolute pearlers!!

Cheers

Aus8

[OLS108]

Just more Fodder on the roads really:cool:

[macca33]

Yep, XR6s, XR6Ts and to a lesser extent, XR8s are like the proverbial now....everyone's got one.

Still, they're no LS1/2!!!!! :cool:

Regards,

Macca

[XLR8 V8]

Yes, I see quite a lot of XR6's, but many of them aren't the turbo model - just some reps new company car he squeezed into the leasing guidelines

[seedyrom]

the buyback is better on an xr6 than xt for company cars.
My wife's company has started moving to xr6's (non turbo), though im not sure if her level will get them at next changeover. gotta love accountants, just do whatever is good financially :)

[STATIE]

I would like a Yellow BF Typhoon 6 Speed Auto please with a edit and instant 12 second quarters please.


Saw exactly that happen at Calder last friday.
Apparently dead stock but with a tune and running high 12's.

[SteveK]

I have to agree and I think it is a great thing for the local market. The cult car from years gone by has been the VL Turbo and now Ford has taken the same formula and given it to the crowd that grew up with those cars. They are really onto something here and the Typhoon is just an awesome car to comprehend and can be very intimidating too.

Does anyone else agree that Ford and FPV have been able to do with a turbo what Holden and HSV failed to do with the supercharged V6 and the XU6? I think a turbo has more appeal because of the use of them in imported cars than what a supercharger does. Slap a turbo on a V6 and watch the sales pick up for Holden, but then we'll be accused of copying.

Well done Ford, they've got someone in marketing with some nouse. We 'had' Mike Simcoe.

Steve

[vysandman]

[QUOTE=Aus8]. No doubt the BA brang out some of the closet Ford Supporters aswell as quite a few Holden converts. (Just like Ford fans that bought VT'SS instead of AU's). I would like

Spot on Aus8, I remember when Ford had the AU and quite a few Ford lovers I talked to bought SS Commodores because they didn't like the look of the AU. How the tide has changed. This time it's not because of looks alone (in the case of th FPV/HSV) but performance.

[Gabe]

yeah i have seen alot of XR6T's lately. its a brilliant engine. pity the car weighs so much. it would be a awesome engine to stick into a old school car. and amazing torque! heaps more than the current crop of v8's at that low an rpm, and a very thick torque wave.

[Fabio's CV8]

Once the resale drops and younger people will get there hands onto them they will be the next VL turbo to hit the streets.

fooly sic mate!

[vxleather]

When thay can get the exhust note on an xr6t to thump like my vx ss I would definitly look at one.

[IIV8II]

where else on the planet can you get cars like this. So much for so little...

[vysandman]

When thay can get the exhust note on an xr6t to thump like my vx ss I would definitly look at one.

Me too! I hope they release the V8 Symphony on i-tunes and then I can get a Tornado sooner.:nyuk:

[MR R33]

Don't know about people in other states but has anyone noticed how many XR6 Turbos/Typhoons are getting around Sydney at the moment. Everywhere I go lately there's a Turbo Falcon lurking and now quite a few "sleepers" which seem to be modified.It seems to have a wide appeal to both older and younger demographics. I travel between 90-150km a day on Sydneys roads and I see a few VY/VZ Clubbies a few (more) GT/GT-P's and several XR6 Turbo/Typhoons. I know you're going to say, yeah well what about the SS Commies to make a fair comparison, well if you added all VY/VZ SV8's,SS,Clubbies etc and all GT/GT-P's,XR6 Turbos and Typhoons BA/BF, then I'd think that I see more Fords. The Turbo Falcon really seems to be the Weapon of choice at the moment. Does anyone have any figures comparing HSV Sales 2005 to FPV Sales 2005 or GT/GT-P sales compared to Typhoon sales ? I'm aHolden man through and through and I love V8's (very old school) but that Typhoon/Tornado really looks like a muscle car and for very little money can go like one.

why bother gettin a xr8 wen you can get the turbo and its alot faster, and alot more potential, not to mention you can save alot of fuel when you are off boost.

[buickman]

I have to agree and I think it is a great thing for the local market. The cult car from years gone by has been the VL Turbo and now Ford has taken the same formula and given it to the crowd that grew up with those cars. They are really onto something here and the Typhoon is just an awesome car to comprehend and can be very intimidating too.

Does anyone else agree that Ford and FPV have been able to do with a turbo what Holden and HSV failed to do with the supercharged V6 and the XU6? I think a turbo has more appeal because of the use of them in imported cars than what a supercharger does. Slap a turbo on a V6 and watch the sales pick up for Holden, but then we'll be accused of copying.

Well done Ford, they've got someone in marketing with some nouse. We 'had' Mike Simcoe.

Steve

So would have been the VN's a cult if they had of fitted the V6 turbos from the 87 Buick GNX's. With Car & driver tests of 0-60mph at 4.7 sec & 1/4 times of 13.26 at 104.11mph
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~puhukwut/mypic12.jpg

[VT LS1]

[QUOTE=vysandman]Don't know about people in other states but has anyone noticed how many XR6 Turbos/Typhoons are getting around Sydney......




Must be time to move

[vyssls1]

you cant even compair a xr6 turbo, to a forced induction v8, want power go cubes, and what if ford didnt bring out the turbo 6, they would only sell cars on the looks (thats a first).

[Aus8]

you cant even compair a xr6 turbo, to a forced induction v8, want power go cubes,

Hrmmm after seeing the HPF 1000HP XR6T in action I call :limpy: to that.

[vyssls1]

Hrmmm after seeing the HPF 1000HP XR6T in action I call :limpy: to that.


well i guess it wont be long before ben bray decides to run a turbo 6 in his new drag car:p

[vyssls1]

and how much boost was neede to create that power

[SV8VY]

Yes, I see quite a lot of XR6's, but many of them aren't the turbo model - just some reps new company car he squeezed into the leasing guidelinesYeah I do 250-300km a day and I also see this.Not too many turbos.
Still it is fun to give even the xrt around some twisty stuff in the Ford transit van a hard time .....the cars may have the goods but driver skill is lacking.....oh and the transit is a turbo too :clown:

[tuff304]

have to agree I don't do that much driving but when i do drive its in peak hour and i've seen alot of NA XR6's. There are quite a few xr6t's / typhoons out there now making big numbers and running times to back them up. I think it will take a long time before they earn VL T status though. Still nothing beats the sound of a horn V8 :headbang:

[Danv8]

Yes, I see quite a lot of XR6's, but many of them aren't the turbo model - just some reps new company car he squeezed into the leasing guidelines


Some sneaky buggers remove the turbo badges.

[Danv8]

So would have been the VN's a cult if they had of fitted the V6 turbos from the 87 Buick GNX's. With Car & driver tests of 0-60mph at 4.7 sec & 1/4 times of 13.26 at 104.11mph
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~puhukwut/mypic12.jpg


Mate had a buick turbo V6 in a LJ Torana that thing flew!
Shame he stacked it and its a complete write off.

[Merlin]

Some sneaky buggers remove the turbo badges.

The XR6T has made the list of cars I will one day own. First thing I would do (after edit) would be to remove the turbo badge.

1) Reduce police attention
2) Reduce boy racer wannabe attention
3) Surprise people who think its only an NA.

Could have a lot of fun I think.

[2 cylinders shy]

The XR6T has made the list of cars I will one day own. First thing I would do (after edit) would be to remove the turbo badge.

1) Reduce police attention
2) Reduce boy racer wannabe attention
3) Surprise people who think its only an NA.

Could have a lot of fun I think.

Ive been caught out by #3 myself

[VTSSDUDE]

Yeah I have seen a few XR6Ts around town. Been told a fair few have only just stuck the turbo sticker on. That's a wannabe racer.
Anyway, turbos are fun. But I bet you if you stuck a V8 and the Turbo six on a benchtest with the same load. I know which engine would last longer.
I mean hard loading so the six has to rely on the turbo to keep up with the V8. Turbo setups are fun when they are all working well.

Cheers,
Jim :cool:

[XLR8 V8]

Yeah I do 250-300km a day and I also see this.Not too many turbos.
Still it is fun to give even the xrt around some twisty stuff in the Ford transit van a hard time .....the cars may have the goods but driver skill is lacking.....oh and the transit is a turbo too :clown:

But you wouldn't wanna take on this thing I spotted the other month on my way to work ...... It appears to be a Turbo Iveco SS XL Executive fitted with a Jack Beedhams exhaust .... would be some serious grunt right there! :lmao:

http://haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/XLR8V8/P1020612.jpg

[Danv8]

But you wouldn't wanna take on this thing I spotted the other month on my way to work ...... It appears to be a Turbo Iveco SS XL Executive fitted with a Jack Beedhams exhaust .... would be some serious grunt right there! :lmao:

http://haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/XLR8V8/P1020612.jpg


Its an Iveco Daily with some fully siiick features.
:)

[Angeldust]

The XR6T has made the list of cars I will one day own. First thing I would do (after edit) would be to remove the turbo badge.

1) Reduce police attention
2) Reduce boy racer wannabe attention
3) Surprise people who think its only an NA.

Could have a lot of fun I think.


i had a torana with 308 and 4 speed. and 202 badges :banana:

[Abdula Butcher]

why bother gettin a xr8 wen you can get the turbo and its alot faster, and alot more potential, not to mention you can save alot of fuel when you are off boost.
Your spot-on I have a BF F6, 6 speed auto, used 77 litres of fuel from Melbourne to Parramatta....98 octane..
Can still run a 12.9 @ 109mph with a crap 60 foot 2.145, there a nice car to drive too... better than my BA XR8...The power delivery is very much different...

[Drewie]

Not all that familiar with Turbos but with the Ford's setup do they need timers or an idle down period or can you just shut them down and not worry,
my son has a few friends with turbo Skylines which have timers and I often hear them come in side and their cars are ticking away for quite a while before shutting themselves down. Do the Fords have a different lubrication set-up for the turbo or is it to do with the design of the turbo, think I read some where they are a Ball Bearing set up.

[MagicRat]

Good to see the competition has finally caught up in the performance stakes after years of standing in the shade of LS1. The new turbo falcons are a great drive and as mentioned have superb performace potential.

But their time in the sun is short, VE is coming TWIN TURBO HFV6, HIGH FEATURE 6.0L V8, HSV UPING THE ANTE 320KW+ LAUNCH CONTROL ECT.

Hahahahahahahahahahaha (evil laugh)

[BA$TAD]

Good to see the competition has finally caught up in the performance stakes after years of standing in the shade of LS1. The new turbo falcons are a great drive and as mentioned have superb performace potential.

But their time in the sun is short, VE is coming TWIN TURBO HFV6, HIGH FEATURE 6.0L V8, HSV UPING THE ANTE 320KW+ LAUNCH CONTROL ECT.

Hahahahahahahahahahaha (evil laugh)

only if it happens. although the falc 6's have always had the upper hand in the 6 field but in the 8 stakes the LS1/2 trumps it. as much as i would love to see a TTV6, i'll just say now, i'll believe it when i see it.

[fathershags]

I can't see the attraction to the XR6T's, I looked at one and saw how expensive they were, i'd prefer a holden any day, much more value for your money, when they hit 20-25k i'll be interested!

What sort of holden could you get for 35k? Perhaps a VX R8 Clubby?

Edit - just had a browse on carsales, wow they're alot cheaper than i thought, I guess they're not too bad!, i'd still prefer an LS1 though :)

[SSASSC1]

Had a chance to drive a new XR6T with the 6 speed man. It had about 10,000 kms on the clock. I took it for a good drive in the country and wound it out.

To tell you the truth I don't really know what all the fuss is about with the xr6 Turbo's. It handled pretty good but I was really expecting more power from it. There was not much of a turbo rush and I recon my Ls1 would eat it in a straight line. Maybe if the turbo was modified ( my ls1 is basically stock ) things would be different. In stock form I rate the xr6T as ordinary

Cheers

[lowhsv]

its like that old game "spot the aussie" in chinatown, "spot the holden in the city"

im a holden v8 man, ive had a wrx (worse car ive ever owned) ive seen heaps of these xr6t on dynos etc and they have been going alright but not my cup of tea rather see the turbos hanging off v8's at least you get the v8 roar as well as the turbo scream.....:cool:

[flappist]

Had a chance to drive a new XR6T with the 6 speed man. It had about 10,000 kms on the clock. I took it for a good drive in the country and wound it out.

To tell you the truth I don't really know what all the fuss is about with the xr6 Turbo's. It handled pretty good but I was really expecting more power from it. There was not much of a turbo rush and I recon my Ls1 would eat it in a straight line. Maybe if the turbo was modified ( my ls1 is basically stock ) things would be different. In stock form I rate the xr6T as ordinary

Cheers

If you are used to driving a V8 then the turbos feel strange and do not have that "instant grunt" that is typical of any high compression engine. The basis of performance for the 6T is the large and constant torque demonstration between about 2000 and 5000 rpm.

It is important to not that power equals torque * RPM so demonstrating a lot of torque at low revs is not perceived as power only force.

In a manual equipped vehicle (e.g. my F6) the torque demonstrated by the postive pressure created by the turbocharger is lost between gear changes as the disengaging if the driveline as subsequent relaxation of the throttle control cause the blow off valve to vent the manifold.

In the new 6 speed automatic equipped vehicles the system is designed to keep the vehicle within the quite wide and linear maximum torque area and therefore the vehicle accellerates very cleanly.

This is why they are so quick and also why it is difficult to replicate such performance with a naturally aspirated engine.

[Redline]

I drove an modified XR6T Auto ute a couple of weeks back, the thing was pretty quick considering what it is however the auto left me fairly bored....like flappist says power delivery is very linear with the auto.

I think manual turbos are much more fun to drive. I have not driven a manual XR6T lately but saw one make 300rwkw with just a tune and some injectors a few weeks back.....pretty awesome stuff from a six banger.....make a LS1 with bolt-ons seem as weak as piss......hang on they are :rolleyes:

And before anybody shoots me down, i drive a VYSS with a cam making about 250rwkw and its the weakest thing to drive compared to what i had (GenT Kit).

[DK-3800]

havent driven any xr6's, was disappointed in the xr8, (drove a few) my ecotech v6, manual, extractors and fit rockers walks away from the n/a ba xr6 at speeds over 80-100k, havent had the chance to give one a run from standstill, but i think it would be even quicker than 1 down low. 180+kW barra engine, meh.

id still love to try the typhoon, as i thought the super pursuit ute was rather soft (after getting out of an ls2)

:moon:

[Aus8]

You aint driven nothing until you test the 6 speed Auto IMO!

[SSASSC1]

If you are used to driving a V8 then the turbos feel strange and do not have that "instant grunt" that is typical of any high compression engine. The basis of performance for the 6T is the large and constant torque demonstration between about 2000 and 5000 rpm.

It is important to not that power equals torque * RPM so demonstrating a lot of torque at low revs is not perceived as power only force.

In a manual equipped vehicle (e.g. my F6) the torque demonstrated by the postive pressure created by the turbocharger is lost between gear changes as the disengaging if the driveline as subsequent relaxation of the throttle control cause the blow off valve to vent the manifold.

In the new 6 speed automatic equipped vehicles the system is designed to keep the vehicle within the quite wide and linear maximum torque area and therefore the vehicle accellerates very cleanly.

This is why they are so quick and also why it is difficult to replicate such performance with a naturally aspirated engine.

I understand the auto would be a better option for the turbo. As I briefly said, I had a chance to wind the turbo out and experience it at the full rpm range. It just went ok, not as I thought it would.

I have owned and driven a huge variety of cars: 4s, 6s, and 8s and turbo's. Probably the quickest car I owned ( in unmodified form ) was a 03 STI. On boost it would of absolutely flogged the xr6T. No doubt. Would of also beaten my Ls1 as well...

After owning and driven quite a large range of cars, in my opinion the new 6 man XR6T is "average"

[buickman]

only if it happens. although the falc 6's have always had the upper hand in the 6 field but in the 8 stakes the LS1/2 trumps it. as much as i would love to see a TTV6, i'll just say now, i'll believe it when i see it.

The Ford 6's have had most of the upper hand but the hot 6's in the Toranas were more into the V8 league in performance inthose years.

The LS1 mtrs were designed for the C5 Corvettes & the 5.4 Fords are really a truck mtr fitted with performance heads.
I personally think they are still behind the LS1/2 Chev mtrs.

Though I did drive a Chev trail Blazer in the states fitted with the chev vortex mtr and found.
1/ Gutless of the mark
2 /Sucked heaps of fuel
Plus I've heard rumours of them being fitted the aussie holdens

[Super Snake]

One of the guys at work has got a BA XR8. He has had numerous problems with his brakes, the disks seem to warp on numerous times. They have been changed, but the problem is still there.

Another mate at work bought one of the first 80 BA Typoons. He had that gear box problem which Ford said did not exsist. They ended up sucking up his but at the end, and fixed it. He is still happy with the car and tells me how fast it is. Beats all FPV GT's and HSV. He travels from Geelong to Clayton every day to work, and can't help himself sometimes.

Eventhough I own a few clasic Fords, my every day cars have been Holdens.

[vyssls1]

One of the guys at work has got a BA XR8. He has had numerous problems with his brakes, the disks seem to warp on numerous times. They have been changed, but the problem is still there.

Another mate at work bought one of the first 80 BA Typoons. He had that gear box problem which Ford said did not exsist. They ended up sucking up his but at the end, and fixed it. He is still happy with the car and tells me how fast it is. Beats all FPV GT's and HSV. He travels from Geelong to Clayton every day to work, and can't help himself sometimes.

Eventhough I own a few clasic Fords, my every day cars have been Holdens.


id back the 290 gt over the typhoon, anyway go talk ford crap on thee forum.

[Aus8]

id back the 290 gt over the typhoon, anyway go talk ford crap on thee forum.
You are aware the F6 Typhoon 6 speed Auto does the 1/4 mile in 13.3 seconds stock? Cant see a Gt doing that even with a Edit it would be lucky.

Dont like our Ford Crap? Then stay out of the Ford thread, quite a simple concept really. Most of us on this forum are performance car enthusiasts and appreciate all fast cars as our interest.

Cheers

Aus8

[VRIIClubby]

Two of my good mates did within three weeks of each bought MKII XR6 Turbo utes, one a M6 other Auto (old box) One true blue ford fan the other a holden boy,
The Auto seems to have shit loads more torque from 80-150kmh, both very nice cars though and something I would consider if i was never to buy a v8 again..would love a drive of the new Auto,

[vyssls1]

i like all cars doesnt matter if its a volkswagon as long as its looked after.

its just like when you go to a v8 supercar event, alot of people go there to see the race, and some go there to arguee, some go there for the chicks, some go there just to get pissed and wouldnt even have a clue who drives what car, but its amazing how many ford fans comeout when a blue oval starts to win.

i pay respect to all cars out there, but you cant beat a v8.

its good that ford finally brought out a decent product, now theres competition.

ive driven a hell of a lot of cars ranging from holden, ford, gmc pickup's (the new avalance GMC is awesome if you have a spare 160k) vettes, porsche, evo's, 3000gt's, wrx's, some older ferrari's etc. but the xr6t doesnt really do it for me, without a turbo its hasnt got much going for it, no power or torque.

and whats the oval around the ford badge mean, THEY CAUGHT THE PROBLEM :stick:

[Aus8]

. but the xr6t doesnt really do it for me, without a turbo its hasnt got much going for it, no power or torque.



Thats more like although still a little confusing. We are talking about The XR6"T" so it does have a Turbo and it has plenty of power and more Torque than a FPV or any HSV.

The WRX without a Turbo also hasnt got much going for it, no power or torque to use the logic you applied to the XR6T.


Cheers

Aus8

[vyssls1]

exactly right they unless forced induction, thats why v8 win

[McobraR]

But you've got to remember that the I6 stock has 190kw and 383nm.....if im right, the 5.0L V8's had that much power about 10 years ago? so in 10 years time when the 6 cylinder engines have got close to 300kws stock, are you going to say that it doesnt have much power?
All i can say is that even if theres lag, theres still 190kw/383nm to do the work for you, better than a 2.0L I4 with only about 100kw/200nm.
Persoanlly i wouldnt kno what to get, the sound and look of a GT or acceleration and potential of the F6... shouldnt be thinkin about this anyway since i cant afford any of them.... i'll just go back to my V6 commie :o

[laughing@u]

id back the 290 gt over the typhoon, anyway go talk ford crap on thee forum.
you lose all your mulla...:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Aus8]

exactly right they unless forced induction, thats why v8 win

Ok then :hmmm:

[F6Mauz]

If anyone doubts how good the 6 speed auto is with the turbo come to the dinner next week:evil:

/me runs and gets edit with 20psi boost upgrade :booty:

[vyssls1]

all ready been for a spin in a six speed auto, only stock though, 20psi would be different.

[SV8VY]

But you wouldn't wanna take on this thing I spotted the other month on my way to work ...... It appears to be a Turbo Iveco SS XL Executive fitted with a Jack Beedhams exhaust .... would be some serious grunt right there! :lmao:

http://haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/XLR8V8/P1020612.jpg
thats fooly sic maat!
Yeah but I have all the racing and oil stickers inside the van.....mines a sleeper (In between work I sleep inside it ) :nyuk:

[tuff304]

i hate to say it but the in-gear acceleration on the xr6t and typhoon compared to the SS (5.7) and Clubsport (ls2) is miles ahead. it seems the NA can't compete with the torque the fords produce.

[Danv8]

i hate to say it but the in-gear acceleration on the xr6t and typhoon compared to the SS (5.7) and Clubsport (ls2) is miles ahead. it seems the NA can't compete with the torque the fords produce.


Thats just a typical large capacity engine with a blower on it.
Ford would be nothing without the turbocharged engine I'd rather have a low stressed V8 anyday.

[BA$TAD]

I gotta say the old heavy bastard XR6 still holds up very good against the lighter SV6, so I guess the I6 ain't nothing after all :D

[IIV8II]

It's gunna be Turbo Territories soon...!

[Danv8]

It's gunna be Turbo Territories soon...!

It would be a turbodiesel I would be intrerested.
I've already seen the Nirzpo (sp?) Terry turbo and it looked great.

[hsvLS1255]

CSV LS1

have you taken the F6 and trown it on the dyno....reading on other forums and guys are getting aroung above 220 rwkw on the autos...one guys got 228rwkw.

my Z got 232 rwkw so , is there any possibility ford has advertised a low power rating on these F6 things... to save face and not piss of GT owners possibly ?

[PepeLePew]

It's gunna be Turbo Territories soon...!
Yep!
https://www.ford.com.au/motorshow/melbourne2006/territoryturbo/index.asp

[Evil LS1]

I gotta say the old heavy bastard XR6 still holds up very good against the lighter SV6, so I guess the I6 ain't nothing after all :D

There's only 100kg in it at most. The falcon's engine got more torque and infinitely more refinement.

[willimtell123]

I have always been a ford man. Way back i had a new xw gt and yes i test drove the typhoon. People ask what was it like? The thing that stands out is the 6 speed box its just the best, but i just bought the ssz more features and fast enough for me .Besides the wife fell in love with the ssz on the showroom floor

[Brendan24688]

willimtell123 wy didn't you buy a phoon. Did you already ave the SSZ?

[willimtell123]

i had a choice the r8 , gt , xr8 , typhoon, i wanted the r8 we nearly bought it, then she saw this car on the showroom floor ooooh she said i like this, leather ,bluetooth,and we put a sunroof in it (she choose ssz ) but very happy with ssz

[Aus8]

SSZ is a nice car! Pity its now obsolete so soon after its release with the 6L out now though :-(

[willimtell123]

any car after a year is obsolete but this is a limited ed of 930 ????? i hope lol this is my first holden in 37 years of motoring i love driving it (so far so good)

[Aus8]

any car after a year is obsolete but this is a limited ed of 930 ????? i hope lol this is my first holden in 37 years of motoring i love driving it (so far so good)
True, Well you got the last of the 5.7's so you know/hope they are well sorted now and a bit of collectability with it!

[Squid Lips]

The XR6T is a wonderful car to own and drive both stock or modified, and it does not suprise me that some Holden people have thought about buying one. Just by reading the previous posts I can see there are some serious misconceptions about the XR6T, one being how it delivers its power.

It is so deceptively smooth that you wouldn't pick it has 240kw. When I took mine to the drags a few times I was shocked to run consistant 13.8's and 13.9's stock as a rock. It did not feel like it would do it, but it did it again and again. Even friends used to comment 'it doesn't feel THAT fast.."

A friend has a edited VY SS and you can really feel the top end rush of the LS1, which makes it 'feel' faster than it really is (don't get me wrong, it feels bloody strong). It's just a lot less smoother power delivery and adds a lot of drama during hard acceleration.

But anyway you look at it, there are some really good cars out there right now that are cheap. The VX SS is a bloody good buy at the moment and in a few years the XR6T will be exactly the same - excellent bang for buck, which equals good for us, the enthusiasts.

[plonkerchops]

The XR6T is a wonderful car to own and drive both stock or modified, and it does not suprise me that some Holden people have thought about buying one. Just by reading the previous posts I can see there are some serious misconceptions about the XR6T, one being how it delivers its power.

It is so deceptively smooth that you wouldn't pick it has 240kw. When I took mine to the drags a few times I was shocked to run consistant 13.8's and 13.9's stock as a rock. It did not feel like it would do it, but it did it again and again. Even friends used to comment 'it doesn't feel THAT fast.."

A friend has a edited VY SS and you can really feel the top end rush of the LS1, which makes it 'feel' faster than it really is (don't get me wrong, it feels bloody strong). It's just a lot less smoother power delivery and adds a lot of drama during hard acceleration.

But anyway you look at it, there are some really good cars out there right now that are cheap. The VX SS is a bloody good buy at the moment and in a few years the XR6T will be exactly the same - excellent bang for buck, which equals good for us, the enthusiasts.
bung something like a stage 2 APS kit ( or something equivilent ) on it and you can certainly feel the acceleration :)

[347stroker]

Being a Ford person, there was a link here from the other forums, and I have to say alot of you have very misguided opinions on what the XR6T or Typhoon is.
I do believe even Motor mag handed the clubbie is ass in the Phoon....
Alot of the guys here are right, they are a bloody good car, and finally ford have made something that everyone wants to own.
They are such a smooth, torquey quiet car that you really dont know what you are doing untill you look down at the guages.....

Heres a challenge for you......

Find me another FACTORY BUILT AUSTRALIAN CAR, that with a $950 upgrade, you can run 12's all day......

Come on......balls in your court guys....

[347stroker]

And just one thing, I have not come here to bag, pay out or be a troll, I just felt I had to say my bit, as alot of your guys do here on my side....

[vyssls1]

Heres a challenge for you......

Find me another FACTORY BUILT AUSTRALIAN CAR, that with a $950 upgrade, you can run 12's all day......

Come on......balls in your court guys....[/QUOTE]

take the hairdryer of and youve got yourself a 15 second car, you cant compair n/a and forced induction.

i mean i totally back the xr6t up against the supercharged 6 from holden/hsv they were a belly flop, hands down ford wins on that vote.

just imagine if holdens brought out the ve v8 turbocharged, then for a extra $1000 youd crack the 10's, and it would start all over again.

[F6Mauz]

I got my car dyno'd on wednsday at Beninca Motors, an alfa romeo workshop that have a well setup dyno facility. My car ran when it was over 30 degrees in the afternoon and made 214rwkw. It hit 9.5psi in the midrange and settled to a touch over 8psi the rest of the way. The car has 3500km's on it.


http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/CSVLS1/Typhoon%20Dyno%20Sheet.jpg



CSV LS1

have you taken the F6 and trown it on the dyno....reading on other forums and guys are getting aroung above 220 rwkw on the autos...one guys got 228rwkw.

my Z got 232 rwkw so , is there any possibility ford has advertised a low power rating on these F6 things... to save face and not piss of GT owners possibly ?

[347stroker]

Heres a challenge for you......

Find me another FACTORY BUILT AUSTRALIAN CAR, that with a $950 upgrade, you can run 12's all day......

Come on......balls in your court guys....

take the hairdryer of and youve got yourself a 15 second car, you cant compair n/a and forced induction.

i mean i totally back the xr6t up against the supercharged 6 from holden/hsv they were a belly flop, hands down ford wins on that vote.

just imagine if holdens brought out the ve v8 turbocharged, then for a extra $1000 youd crack the 10's, and it would start all over again.[/QUOTE]


Its not about "what if Holden did this" is about what you can buy, and have bucket loads of fun in now, for reasonably little $$$.
Give credit where credits due, Ford have created a fantastic package, that has the goods to hose most competitors.....lets think about the last time Ford had that.....1973-4.....is there anything more recent?
I think not.
Then in sept 1982, they canned the v8 for 9 long years, giving its customers asthmatic uninspiring cars to drive, then in 1991, with the reintroduction of the v8, it was still that bad for Ford drivers...
Holden have created so many rockets in the years past, that it truly has been hard to keep your eye on the prize and keep your horsepower Ford, because ther just was nothing on offer....hell even 10 years ago when the ELGT was released, it only had 200kw...didnt the GenIII GTS come out not long after, with 50% more power than Fords big hitter.......
So at the end of the day, if Ford dont create cars like this, Holden have no need to try and make cars faster for us to buy....because there is no real competition.
Let the modern day suer car wars run I say........

Now if only those mongrels down at Broadmeadows would answer my emails about the GT500 Mustang motor in a Falcon...then we would have a title holder....bwahahahahaaaaaaa

[SSZO6]

its a tough business - the bloody things look and sound so stock - dont get me wrong, im a ford man and i tune a few turbo's, but id rather the heart and soul of the V8.

THEN add boost!!!! hahahahaha

[flappist]

take the hairdryer of and youve got yourself a 15 second car, you cant compair n/a and forced induction.

i mean i totally back the xr6t up against the supercharged 6 from holden/hsv they were a belly flop, hands down ford wins on that vote.

just imagine if holdens brought out the ve v8 turbocharged, then for a extra $1000 youd crack the 10's, and it would start all over again.

You really do have a complex about this don't you.

Take off the hair dryer.... Maybe add 100kg to the SS, or maybe pull 2 spark plug leads so they both have the same number of operating cylinders, or make sure that they are both the same colour and have the same level of tint in the windows.

Why don't Holden and Ford make almost identical vehicles and just change the body shape so the whole of Australia is one big V8 supercar race?

Holden & HSV make the SS & Clubby the way they want to.
Ford & FPV make the XR6T & F6 the way they want to.
The driving public can chose one of these vehicles, both or neither, it is called FREEDOM OF CHOICE.

If you personally don't like forced induction then that is your choice but constant whinging about it does not support your position. I know this is the LS1 forum but the majority here have two eyes and discuss all sorts of non Holden topics regularly. The same happens on AFF. If you are really that anti anything without a lion on the bonnet then I am sure you will be welcomed by streetcommodores.com.

Build a bridge, please.........

[NODDY347]

its a tough business - the bloody things look and sound so stock - dont get me wrong, im a ford man and i tune a few turbo's, but id rather the heart and soul of the V8.

THEN add boost!!!! hahahahaha

arrrh...i hear your a closet hairdryer fan! say around 4-5psi:stick: next it will be :nos: :hide:

[Danv8]

arrrh...i hear your a closet hairdryer fan! say around 4-5psi:stick: next it will be :nos: :hide:


Not denying the fact that I am a closet hairdryer fan as well. I like the point of a large capacity V8 with a low boost turbo not just to give it the edge on the kw but more on the torque.

Best of both worlds really.

[forcedindction]

It's great to see Ford eat into Holdens territory. It can only mean better cars for all.

The great thing about forced induction from the factory, is that it is quite easy and cheap to get more power (up to a point). Ford have to be congratulated for going down this road and it looks like it is paying off big time.

So where does Holden go from here? I'd say a turbo 6 has to be in the offering somwhere down the line. Churning out bigger and bigger V8s is getting a little old hat.

[stew7700]

Even then though they are going to have to feed some boost into the 3.6 to compete with the falcon torque, Its a pretty big 6 cylinder so it was always going to do well with boost IMO. The 3.6 is down on torque already, but its got potential. Its goin to be interesting to see what Holden/HSV comes up with!! Cant wait! :thumbsup: :driving:

[tuff304]

It's great to see Ford eat into Holdens territory. It can only mean better cars for all.

The great thing about forced induction from the factory, is that it is quite easy and cheap to get more power (up to a point). Ford have to be congratulated for going down this road and it looks like it is paying off big time.

So where does Holden go from here? I'd say a turbo 6 has to be in the offering somwhere down the line. Churning out bigger and bigger V8s is getting a little old hat.

Have to agree, all this means is better products for the consumer at a more competitive price.

[hunted]

I still see more SS Commodores on the roads than XR6T's.

I like the new 6lt, and seems it will even up the score a little, and maybe take some sales back to Holden.

It's all good and keeps the manufacturers giving us what we want..

[double k]

the t is a great little car and i do see some on the road but the majority are the xr6 n/a's.

the holden gang also seems to have an interest in the t as do the ford gang in the holdens (especially the new 6ltr ls2).

the fact that everytime there is a thread abouth the xr6 t it goes for 7-8 pages shows that a great car, no matter what manufacturer, always gets a response. and this is exactly what this car has done. heck it even has its own website which is very popular among ford owners.

anyway, ford have stepped it up with the xr6t and the f6 so holden need to step it up next.

the ball is in your court holden.

[clixanup]

I still see more SS Commodores on the roads than XR6T's.

I like the new 6lt, and seems it will even up the score a little, and maybe take some sales back to Holden.

In the latest Motor magazine, a completely STOCK 6 litre SS ran a 13.8. :eyes:

[Squid Lips]

the fact that everytime there is a thread abouth the xr6 t it goes for 7-8 pages shows that a great car, no matter what manufacturer, always gets a response.

Excellent point.

Personally I can't wait to see if the Alloytech V6 cops a turbo (or two?) and what lb of boost it will run standard, seeing as it is not really a torque monster or anything special in terms of pace in naturally aspirated form.

From what I have read in magazines and newspapers the Alloytech is still rattly and a bit harsh in high revs like the old Buick V6 was, so it will be interesting how it copes with the added stress of boost, particularly if it has to run more lb's than the Ford engine.

It will also be interesting to see how the Ford engine will stand the test of time and km's. But at least we are doing better than 10 years ago where a 'perfomance' car was a VS or EL V8 with less than 220kw.. We live in good times.

[PepeLePew]

We live in good times.

And you have to wonder how long it'll all last with the declining market in large cars and fuel prices going to hell.....

Hopefully after the initial gut reaction to these silly prices things will stabilize on the large car front and the manufacturers still have $$$ to spend on the interesting models.......

[falcon coupe]

Being a Ford person, there was a link here from the other forums, and I have to say alot of you have very misguided opinions on what the XR6T or Typhoon is.
I do believe even Motor mag handed the clubbie is ass in the Phoon....
Alot of the guys here are right, they are a bloody good car, and finally ford have made something that everyone wants to own.
They are such a smooth, torquey quiet car that you really dont know what you are doing untill you look down at the guages.....

Heres a challenge for you......

Find me another FACTORY BUILT AUSTRALIAN CAR, that with a $950 upgrade, you can run 12's all day......

Come on......balls in your court guys....

Hmm no takers on this question ?
I have seen a Typhoon dyno graph after edit, over 250rwkw with stock exhaust makes for cheap bang per buck.

[347stroker]

Hmm no takers on this question ?
I have seen a Typhoon dyno graph after edit, over 250rwkw with stock exhaust makes for cheap bang per buck.

Yes mate, have been watching this thread closely, and have had a good ol' chuckle about every one side stepping that post......

Any takers?

[SS_Fury]

an edit to an xr6t will get you roughly how much rwkw and nm of torque?

[plonkerchops]

wouldnt a GTS 300 be close after edit???

[rednut99]

an edit to an xr6t will get you roughly how much rwkw and nm of torque?

Mine made 256rwkw on stock everything with an edit, but it ran out of fuel at 5000rpm and the power was still climbing, I settled for 242rwkw on 8psi that reved out to 6200rpm,stock as a rock. My tune in over 12 months old and I believe there are better methods out there to extract more power and higher up in the rev range on stock components. Torque increased 30% which is roughly 580nm at peak. Enough to make the T5 shudder in fear!

I never got a chance to test the difference on the track, and it wouldn't have been that great considering the 5sp manual and 1900kg of ute. Too bad I have sold it now because I am saving for a house (and a wedding!) :banana:

This graph compares the old power curve (straight linear line = boring) with the edited power curve, notice the massive increase in area under the curve? THat is where the awesome 1/4 mile times come from, more work happening more of the time. Notice thought how it dies in the arse well before peak power, if it had fuel it would have gone as high as 270.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/yoot/XR6%20Turbo/IMG_0298.jpg

[myles]

Regarding the original post, I see a lot of XR6s in Brisbane, but don't see too many XR6Ts.

Probably be about a ratio of say 20 to 1. Could be less than that as it didn't occur to me many might be removing the turbo badge.

A bit of a generalisation but a good one to point out, every XR6T I've seen, the driver has been 'sensible'. Nothing foolish....

[FatBoy]

Hmm no takers on this question ?
I have seen a Typhoon dyno graph after edit, over 250rwkw with stock exhaust makes for cheap bang per buck.

I've seen a bog stock Holden (not HSV) make 212rwkw without an edit, and definetly no turbo, what's your point ?? What did you want mate - everyone to get down on their knees and bow ??

There's no denying 250rwkw with an edit is great, but it's like us all crowing about what a GTS makes when in reality very few of us own one - you'd agree a Typhoon would be similar to a GTS right ??

The Typhoon is a FPV product, and DOHC 4 litre turbocharged engine. If i didn't make impressive numbers you would think Ford would have a major problems on their hands !! :)

I personally like the look of the BA / BF series, but have been put off by the problems when they were new. I need a ute that can tow a decent load (circuit car) and i will be looking at an XR6 ute in the very near future, even though i have always been a Holden man... (The missus will remain an LS1 pilot)

Most of appreciate cars for what they are, but shit, this is an LS1 forum, we have a healthy respect for the late model Fords but don't expect us to love them...

[falcon coupe]

I've seen a bog stock Holden (not HSV) make 212rwkw without an edit, and definetly no turbo, what's your point ?? What did you want mate - everyone to get down on their knees and bow ??

I simply pointed out there are good gains from edit only, what you do on your knees is your buisness.




Most of appreciate cars for what they are, but shit, this is an LS1 forum, we have a healthy respect for the late model Fords but don't expect us to love them...

I also appreciate both Marks and enjoy taking my mother in laws CV8 for a spin, who asked you to love Fords, i'm replying to the topic in hand.

[VY2 LS1]

OK Fordmen, try this for size:

Match up the diff ratios to be equivalent to your Typhoon by putting on a 3.73 diff on an 2006 VZ SV8 A4, then with an edit, bye bye Typhoon. Then when your 4L Turbo shits itself after 120,000Kms, my 6L 2006 SV8 will be just warming up for the next 120,000Kms.
Which ever way you look at it. 4L Try-hard vs 6L. Go figure.

[falcon coupe]

OK Fordmen, try this for size:

Match up the diff ratios to be equivalent to your Typhoon by putting on a 3.73 diff on an 2006 VZ SV8 A4, then with an edit, bye bye Typhoon. Then when your 4L Turbo shits itself after 120,000Kms, my 6L 2006 SV8 will be just warming up for the next 120,000Kms.
Which ever way you look at it. 4L Try-hard vs 6L. Go figure.

And if my auntie had balls she would be my uncle :dance:
That has no relevance to the topic, there is nothing to be gained by starting a Holden vs Ford flame.

[VY2 LS1]

Hmm no takers on this question ?


A response was asked for and one was provided. No flame intended. Just that when someone throws down the gauntlet, it will be answered. The point about the SV8 diff and edit remain valid. It will be a great cheap car. BTW, the typhoon is a great car also.

[BA$TAD]

OK Fordmen, try this for size:

Match up the diff ratios to be equivalent to your Typhoon by putting on a 3.73 diff on an 2006 VZ SV8 A4, then with an edit, bye bye Typhoon. Then when your 4L Turbo shits itself after 120,000Kms, my 6L 2006 SV8 will be just warming up for the next 120,000Kms.
Which ever way you look at it. 4L Try-hard vs 6L. Go figure.
and if we take out the interior and body panels of the typhoon we will have the same power to weight ratio...:teach: :slap:

[VY2 LS1]

and if we take out the interior and body panels of the typhoon we will have the same power to weight ratio...:teach: :slap:


Good point. I suggest you do so!!!

[SS_Fury]

im a big fan of the xr6t - i would go to the dark side and trade in the vx ss - but the xr6t's are holding their value very well and i cant afford one heehee...who could say no to a car that gets 250+rwkw with just an edit?

and VY2_LS1 i think you would need more than diff gears and edit to beat an edited xr6t - just my opinion but i rekon a full zorst change and a little cold air would prob change the outcome.....on second thought, i dunno it would be close.

[Steffo]

OK Fordmen, try this for size:

Match up the diff ratios to be equivalent to your Typhoon by putting on a 3.73 diff on an 2006 VZ SV8 A4, then with an edit, bye bye Typhoon. Then when your 4L Turbo shits itself after 120,000Kms, my 6L 2006 SV8 will be just warming up for the next 120,000Kms.
Which ever way you look at it. 4L Try-hard vs 6L. Go figure.

Shits itself after 120,000km?

Think again... :rolleyes:

And what's the obsession with comparing modified to stock? SV8 stock will get violated by a Typhoon. If you're allowed to edit the SV8 and change its gearing... lets see what the same mods will do to the F6.

[vyssls1]

You really do have a complex about this don't you.

Take off the hair dryer.... Maybe add 100kg to the SS, or maybe pull 2 spark plug leads so they both have the same number of operating cylinders, or make sure that they are both the same colour and have the same level of tint in the windows.

Why don't Holden and Ford make almost identical vehicles and just change the body shape so the whole of Australia is one big V8 supercar race?

Holden & HSV make the SS & Clubby the way they want to.
Ford & FPV make the XR6T & F6 the way they want to.
The driving public can chose one of these vehicles, both or neither, it is called FREEDOM OF CHOICE.

If you personally don't like forced induction then that is your choice but constant whinging about it does not support your position. I know this is the LS1 forum but the majority here have two eyes and discuss all sorts of non Holden topics regularly. The same happens on AFF. If you are really that anti anything without a lion on the bonnet then I am sure you will be welcomed by streetcommodores.com.

Build a bridge, please.........

im only stating my point, maybe some of you guys dont see that as well, as others.

some people decide to do big camshafts, headwork, etc and just stay n/a, some like the torque increase from forced induction.

hey i think its great that ford have finally brought out a decent product, this then means that holden will respond to this and then hopefully increase power, etc. and this will continue for years.

The holden and ford debate has been going for years, and will continue for years to come. v8 supercars have made this even worse than ever, and specially that ford have released a good product.

i do also have forced induction, but i prefer bigger cubes to start of with, if holden had brought out crap cars for the last 10 years, i would also buy a ford, but they havnt.

The competition is just getting better between car manufactors, and us as the buyers reak this benefit.

but in adelaide i tend to see a fair few turbo's, but i see a hell of a lot more non turbo models, i think the reason for this people are a bit sceptical, on fords mechanical record for the past so many years.

[BLK6T]

As a XR6T driver I love the thing...everytime I drive it it puts a smile on my face especially when on full boost :nyuk: and thats the reason I drive it. My GF's oldies are SS lovers and drive a VX & VZ SS and they are both great vehicles also. I just think its great that two very close aussie car manufacturers can produce so much variety in the performance car market. I hope one day Holden releases a v6 Turbo (SV6T) because it will be great for the aussie turbo market and it will be healty for ford to have a little competition.

[RobboXR6T]

A quick note to people test driving or doing a comparo. Not sure about the current BFs but if there is a traction control button, turn the bastard off. Driving with it on makes the car suitable for your grandmother. Turn it off and the horns come out. The acceleration behaviour is chalk and cheese.

I have one of the first BA XR6Ts and having owned V8 Commodores as well as normally aspirated XR6s before, the XR6T is the ducks guts.

My routine is :

Ignition on.
Seatbelt on.
Traction Control OFF !!

[VooDoo]

Hmm no takers on this question ?
I have seen a Typhoon dyno graph after edit, over 250rwkw with stock exhaust makes for cheap bang per buck.

I went from 180rwkw to 241rwkw with just an edit. Ive seen some with more, some less. Not to mention the LS1 edit was cheaper then the Ford Edit (currently)

Both camps have some awesome cars and at times the lines blur between whats "the best"as people have differant requirements and like differant things. I like some of the Ford features but dont like others. There isnt anything in the current ford lineup that would make me change sides just yet but thats saying they are bad cars. Just not enough to make me move yet. 5 yrs ago i wouldnt even have looked at anything, now i'd at least concider them. Thats a pretty good effort for ford and im sure there are others that have changed to the blue oval due to the current lineup that were diehard Holden fans.

[347stroker]

So have we come to the conclusion that between both of our camps that the turbo 6 is the bang for your bucks king at the moment?
I know Holden/HSV will bring out something in the near future to reverse the scales, its the way people are, and it makes for better cars for all of us.
And just for the record, I could not own a 6, be it turbo/blown, nothing. I am V8 all the way through, but credit is given where credits due, and by christ, the $$$ I have spent on my XR8 ute to get it to be tail happy in 3rd has been fun, and I dont get many cars meet me at the lights that get the better of me, even with the 1.2T work trailer on....220kw VT Clubbie even.....lol.
But I have been hosed by some stock sounding, idling old guys in these rotten 6T's.

Me hopes both manufacturers give us some boosted 8's in the future....I have a strong suspicion, and some good insight that one is......Sombody say GT500? It will fit in a Falc bay too......

[SCOTTR8]

iam not surprised to see so many of them had a run with one this morning from the legal speed on the highway up to ?00 (testing one ?) and they do haul balls. if i had togo and buy a new car shock, gasp i'd goto the dark side and buy one.

[vysandman]

So have we come to the conclusion that between both of our camps that the turbo 6 is the bang for your bucks king at the moment?
I know Holden/HSV will bring out something in the near future to reverse the scales, its the way people are, and it makes for better cars for all of us.
And just for the record, I could not own a 6, be it turbo/blown, nothing. I am V8 all the way through, but credit is given where credits due, and by christ, the $$$ I have spent on my XR8 ute to get it to be tail happy in 3rd has been fun, and I dont get many cars meet me at the lights that get the better of me, even with the 1.2T work trailer on....220kw VT Clubbie even.....lol.
But I have been hosed by some stock sounding, idling old guys in these rotten 6T's.

Me hopes both manufacturers give us some boosted 8's in the future....I have a strong suspicion, and some good insight that one is......Sombody say GT500? It will fit in a Falc bay too......

In some circumstances the XR6T is the best bang for your buck at the moment (in gear acceleration) and in others the V8 is better. The latest wheels mag (March issue) has the new 6L SS doing 0-100 in 5.5 and 400m in 13.8.....pretty impressive. With minimal mods both cars could see vast improvements but for less money the XR6T would have the wood on the V8 and so it should because it has F.I. I'm old school so I'll stick with the V8, and hope to in my next car have a Turbocharged one, then you've got the best of both worlds. One thing is for sure the BA/BF Falcons look very good now (No better than a Commodore though) but the Typhoon/GT's are the best looking Australian made performance cars at the moment. HSV's look too sedate and I'm sick of the limited colour range Red, Black, Blue, White and one Hero colour. Competition is great, lets hope HSV realise it !

[Danv8]

Looks like this topic slid over to AFF

http://fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=36680

[Shockwave XR8]

The XR6T and Typhoon/Tornado have certainly gained a cult status, become the flavour of the month and stirred quite a debate. The comparisons between them and the XR8 and GT/GTP are well documented and make an interesting read because performance wise they are neck and neck. Sure, there have been some V8 converts to the 6T, but deep down I rekon they miss the sound and low down grunt of the V8. Me... I've driven one and yes, great cars, exhilarating performance! However you will never get me out of the seat of a V8... never.

There has been a lot of talk about Ford and Holden lifting their standards in the peformance war and the benefits to us the purchasers, but the next V8 offerings for GT/XR8/Clubbie/SS to combat the turbo trend will be very interesting... and a bonus for the V8 purists.

[DK-3800]

Looks like this topic slid over to AFF

http://fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=36680

ROFL had a quick look, they thought i was dreaming regarding my comment on n/a xr6 against my car, well i must have been dreaming on 3 separate occasions, as it happened with 3 separate n/a xr6's, Anyway, just checked the specs for n/a xr6, 0-100 just over 8 seconds and quarter mile time of 16 seconds? of course an ecotech with those mods is gonna do a faster quarter than 16 seconds. :confused:

[XA coupe]

ROFL had a quick look, they thought i was dreaming regarding my comment on n/a xr6 against my car, well i must have been dreaming on 3 separate occasions, as it happened with 3 separate n/a xr6's, Anyway, just checked the specs for n/a xr6, 0-100 just over 8 seconds and quarter mile time of 16 seconds? of course an ecotech with those mods is gonna do a faster quarter than 16 seconds. :confused:

dunno where you get the 16 second 1/4 mile from

[XA coupe]

, but the next V8 offerings for GT/XR8/Clubbie/SS to combat the turbo trend will be very interesting... and a bonus for the V8 purists.

that's what I am hoping for !!

[DK-3800]

dunno where you get the 16 second 1/4 mile from

got it from here

http://autospeed.drive.com.au/cms/A_1729/article.html

[Merlin]

ROFL had a quick look, they thought i was dreaming regarding my comment on n/a xr6 against my car, well i must have been dreaming on 3 separate occasions, as it happened with 3 separate n/a xr6's, Anyway, just checked the specs for n/a xr6, 0-100 just over 8 seconds and quarter mile time of 16 seconds? of course an ecotech with those mods is gonna do a faster quarter than 16 seconds. :confused:

16 second quarter? Without getting involved in this whole thread they run low 15's and low 7's to 100 (as do XT's). Ecotoecs run low 9s to 100. But honestly who really cares?

[XA coupe]

16 second quarter? Without getting involved in this whole thread they run low 15's and low 7's to 100 (as do XT's). Ecotoecs run low 9s to 100. But honestly who really cares?

thank you.
I would never believe anything autorice has to say these days anyway

[sKeptiK]

thank you.
I would never believe anything autorice has to say these days anyway

Too right. The sentence before they reckon the XR6 felt quicker than a VX SS. That's a reliable source....NOT:lol:

[Ghia351]

Too right. The sentence before they reckon the XR6 felt quicker than a VX SS. That's a reliable source....NOT:lol:

Actually they were referring to a VX clubby:eek:
"it never remotely feels like you're at the helm of a lifeless lump. In fact, during our week with the test car we also had a HSV VX Clubsport auto and, amazingly, the big 5.7-litre monster felt less alive than the atmo XR6! "

and I love my Fords but the Clubby must have been suffering from food poisoning....

[McobraR]

Well looks like the coppers are also getting into the xr6T craze. Was heading to liverpool today, and spotted an unmarked white BF xr6t cop car, with blue racing stripes (MKII GT type) and tinted windows, just stopped at the left most lane of the hume highway. Knew it was a copper cus it had red and blue lights flashing through its rear windscreen.

[hsv1413]

In VIC, the only Fords left are the unmarked.
The highway patrol cars were a waste.
Kept on dying.

Useful!!!

[ratter]

In VIC, the only Fords left are the unmarked.
The highway patrol cars were a waste.
Kept on dying.

Useful!!!

Thats wrong, ask the P plater who lives accross the road from me, he had a marked ford follow him home the other night, it made a pretty sight, the red and blue flashing lights lighting up the neighbout hood, I guess the neighbour had it coming to him, Clubby with steel rims on the back for some reason ;)

[BIG T]

Do you guys think that when Holden sorts out the L76 with the new 6 speed auto, that when these L76's are modified that they will also see easy 12s like the Typhoon?

It seems that its only since Ford has realsed the 6 speed auto, that in car camparos for the first time in a while that the Ford 6/8s are just as quick or quicker than the Holdens.

Just an observation.

[Ghia351]

In VIC, the only Fords left are the unmarked.
The highway patrol cars were a waste.
Kept on dying.

Useful!!!
A little off topic but maybe some facts would be useful.
If you fit out the cars with all their equipment including in-car PC, mobile radar, new high intensity roof bar, spot lights and then have then idling for long periods or not have the engine running at all while not specifying a higher rated alternator then stock or a second battery as recommended by your supplier (which is both Holden & Ford atm) then what would you expect...

taken from the Australian Police vehicles website:
http://members4.boardhost.com/auspolvehicles/msg/1138786970.html

Quote: "Strobes are only part of the problem. Sure, electrical problems increased overnight with the introduction of the high-drain MX7000 bar, but ICV and MDTs and radar all competing for power havnt helped either.
I am not knocking the MX7000, it is a highly visible excellent roof bar, and fitted to a police vehicle with NO MDT, ICV or radar, im sure there would be considerably less problems. Why, during the 'exhaustive' trial process didnt someone with decision making capability consider speccing a LED bar instead of strobe/rotator assembly? We have had radars and MDTs for some time now, and ICVs have been in the pipeline for quite a while. Given that, CDF would dictate that electrical problems were just around the corner...

No more band aid solutions, its about time we got a purpose built police car. The standard Ford and Holden vehicles are excellent world-class family performance cars but they are not receiving the mods needed for police work. I am still waiting for someone to explain why it is that SS commodores are not optioned up with the performance HBD brake package to equal the Ford product. Wasnt the association trialling this over 12 months ago?? Oh, maybe that was the gel belt and the polartech jacket, i may be confused..

Ive had my rant, i feel better now"

[XA coupe]

A little off topic but maybe some facts would be useful.
If you fit out the cars with all their equipment including in-car PC, mobile radar, new high intensity roof bar, spot lights and then have then idling for long periods or not have the engine running at all while not specifying a higher rated alternator then stock or a second battery as recommended by your supplier (which is both Holden & Ford atm) then what would you expect...

taken from the Australian Police vehicles website:
http://members4.boardhost.com/auspolvehicles/msg/1138786970.html

Quote: "Strobes are only part of the problem. Sure, electrical problems increased overnight with the introduction of the high-drain MX7000 bar, but ICV and MDTs and radar all competing for power havnt helped either.
I am not knocking the MX7000, it is a highly visible excellent roof bar, and fitted to a police vehicle with NO MDT, ICV or radar, im sure there would be considerably less problems. Why, during the 'exhaustive' trial process didnt someone with decision making capability consider speccing a LED bar instead of strobe/rotator assembly? We have had radars and MDTs for some time now, and ICVs have been in the pipeline for quite a while. Given that, CDF would dictate that electrical problems were just around the corner...

No more band aid solutions, its about time we got a purpose built police car. The standard Ford and Holden vehicles are excellent world-class family performance cars but they are not receiving the mods needed for police work. I am still waiting for someone to explain why it is that SS commodores are not optioned up with the performance HBD brake package to equal the Ford product. Wasnt the association trialling this over 12 months ago?? Oh, maybe that was the gel belt and the polartech jacket, i may be confused..

Ive had my rant, i feel better now"


It's quite true. I recall when the VT1 5 litres were used for TOG duties and the alternators kept failing due to the load on them. Considering it wasn't me, watching two coppers pushing a cop car across an intersection is quite funny!
I know we don't have the market that ford in the US have.. but one of them really needs to build a proper police car. Giving the police taxi packs and standard SS's and XRs just doesn't cut it. The cars need the extra brakes, they need the better electricals, they need seats suited to someone who is wearing a gun ... but I'll bet it doesn't happen.

[flukeyluke]

have to agree I don't do that much driving but when i do drive its in peak hour and i've seen alot of NA XR6's. There are quite a few xr6t's / typhoons out there now making big numbers and running times to back them up. I think it will take a long time before they earn VL T status though. Still nothing beats the sound of a horn V8 :headbang:

Apparently about 30% of all BA's / BF's sold are now XR's, but the bulk are N/A's.

[alexcs]

Saw exactly that happen at Calder last friday.
Apparently dead stock but with a tune and running high 12's.


not exactly hard to do, its called upping the boost and guessing how much lifespan you take from the engine and driveline. boost is an interesting variable, and does different things to differently put together engines.

[alexcs]

It's quite true. I recall when the VT1 5 litres were used for TOG duties and the alternators kept failing due to the load on them. Considering it wasn't me, watching two coppers pushing a cop car across an intersection is quite funny!
I know we don't have the market that ford in the US have.. but one of them really needs to build a proper police car. Giving the police taxi packs and standard SS's and XRs just doesn't cut it. The cars need the extra brakes, they need the better electricals, they need seats suited to someone who is wearing a gun ... but I'll bet it doesn't happen.

what exactly do you envisage these cars doing? these days, HWP get called off chases when speeds hit 160, which is around 15 seconds in most cars these days. (unless theres is a very rare occasion when i a gold HWP officer is in the vehicle)

these cars are perfectly fine for modern HWP duties, if they can cop me hitting redline and max brakes at wakefield for hours at a time, they can cope with a max 1hr chase.

several friends currently in nsw hwp have happily explained this all to me.

the weak point in these hwp vehicles isnt the car, its the driver. inexperience abounds in the modern nsw police theerrvvvrithe

[sle383]

Being a Ford person, there was a link here from the other forums, and I have to say alot of you have very misguided opinions on what the XR6T or Typhoon is.
I do believe even Motor mag handed the clubbie is ass in the Phoon....
Alot of the guys here are right, they are a bloody good car, and finally ford have made something that everyone wants to own.
They are such a smooth, torquey quiet car that you really dont know what you are doing untill you look down at the guages.....

Heres a challenge for you......

Find me another FACTORY BUILT AUSTRALIAN CAR, that with a $950 upgrade, you can run 12's all day......

Come on......balls in your court guys....
I did see a SS one tonner stock, except it had a tune ran a high 12. Pretty sure it was in a street machine commodores mag!!!

[sle383]

The XR6T and Typhoon/Tornado have certainly gained a cult status, become the flavour of the month and stirred quite a debate. The comparisons between them and the XR8 and GT/GTP are well documented and make an interesting read because performance wise they are neck and neck. Sure, there have been some V8 converts to the 6T, but deep down I rekon they miss the sound and low down grunt of the V8. Me... I've driven one and yes, great cars, exhilarating performance! However you will never get me out of the seat of a V8... never.

There has been a lot of talk about Ford and Holden lifting their standards in the peformance war and the benefits to us the purchasers, but the next V8 offerings for GT/XR8/Clubbie/SS to combat the turbo trend will be very interesting... and a bonus for the V8 purists.
The V8 ford owner wont be missing the low down grunt as it doesnt have any.The XR6T on the other hand has good low down torque.

[McobraR]

The V8 ford owner wont be missing the low down grunt as it doesnt have any.The XR6T on the other hand has good low down torque.

True, but you gotta remember before holden/hsv got the LS2, the Boss/Triton engine was the best V8 in terms of low down torque. Find a stock LS1 that has more bottom end than a comparable Boss/Triton V8. As said before, LS1 for top end, Boss/Triton for bottom end.
So if what you're saying is true then what does that make the LS1? considering that you said the Ford V8 has no 'low down' grunt... thought so, fact is the LS1/Boss/triton/LS2 engine has enough bottom end grunt for a street car.

[ratter]

. As said before, LS1 for top end, Boss/Triton for bottom end.
.

You may have that backwards, the Boss motors are getting approx 270 rwkw unopened on the same dyno that see's LS1's get lower than that with cams etc.

[McobraR]

You may have that backwards, the Boss motors are getting approx 270 rwkw unopened on the same dyno that see's LS1's get lower than that with cams etc.

I was talking about stock, as in straight from holden/ford without ANY mods watsoever. And what i meant by top end also includes its rev range...revving higher than the BOSS, again, also in stock form. :)

[markone2]

I did see a SS one tonner stock, except it had a tune ran a high 12. Pretty sure it was in a street machine commodores mag!!!


Rest assured the term *Stock* when used in conjunction with time slips is wide open to interpretation…..that includes cars from both camps..imho

[ratter]

I was talking about stock, as in straight from holden/ford without ANY mods watsoever. And what i meant by top end also includes its rev range...revving higher than the BOSS, again, also in stock form. :)


Boss 260 makes 260 FWKW and revs to approx 5900 without changing valve springs .....stock :stick:



P.s what is the rev limiter set to on an unedited LS1? (serious question)

:p

[oz_utester]

i see 3 new hero car fords, from XR6T to GT-P to every SS to HSV item.

they are everywhere

[clixanup]

i see 3 new hero car fords, from XR6T to GT-P to every SS to HSV item.

they are everywhere
Other way around where I live. Half the cars in my suburb seem to be Holden V8s. Very few Fords at all, even though Broadmeadows is just up the road.... :confused:

[MFX_R33]

The BA has shown that Ford have finally lifted thier game, and the styling of the VY and VZ in my opinion has not been up to thier usual standard. GMH have some work to do to get back on top.

Jeff.

[Danv8]

The BA has shown that Ford have finally lifted thier game, and the styling of the VY and VZ in my opinion has not been up to thier usual standard. GMH have some work to do to get back on top.

Jeff.


Not for long VE is only a months away now.

[XA coupe]

what exactly do you envisage these cars doing? these days, HWP get called off chases when speeds hit 160, which is around 15 seconds in most cars these days. (unless theres is a very rare occasion when i a gold HWP officer is in the vehicle)

these cars are perfectly fine for modern HWP duties, if they can cop me hitting redline and max brakes at wakefield for hours at a time, they can cope with a max 1hr chase.

several friends currently in nsw hwp have happily explained this all to me.

the weak point in these hwp vehicles isnt the car, its the driver. inexperience abounds in the modern nsw police theerrvvvrithe

I take it you have been in a general duties car on the way to an urgent job?? I'd guess not or you wouldn't make a statement like that.

[McobraR]

Boss 260 makes 260 FWKW and revs to approx 5900 without changing valve springs .....stock :stick:



P.s what is the rev limiter set to on an unedited LS1? (serious question)

:p

Yep Boss cuts out at about 5900rpm, but the LS1 cuts out at about 6500rpm, stock. So thats why the LS1 is better up top, cus it revs higher.

[vecommo]

finally ford have made something that everyone wants to own.

Everyone?? That's a pretty broad statement to make. You can count me out of that.

[sle383]

True, but you gotta remember before holden/hsv got the LS2, the Boss/Triton engine was the best V8 in terms of low down torque. Find a stock LS1 that has more bottom end than a comparable Boss/Triton V8. As said before, LS1 for top end, Boss/Triton for bottom end.
So if what you're saying is true then what does that make the LS1? considering that you said the Ford V8 has no 'low down' grunt... thought so, fact is the LS1/Boss/triton/LS2 engine has enough bottom end grunt for a street car.
Sorry mate driven both cars on a number of occasions, i still think the LS1 has the wood on the BOSS 260 for low down torque but there isnt much in it.

[ratter]

Yep Boss cuts out at about 5900rpm, but the LS1 cuts out at about 6500rpm, stock. So thats why the LS1 is better up top, cus it revs higher.

:doh:
But the boss is making more power and using lower revs to do it.

[ratter]

So is the LS1 rev limited to 6500 rpm from the factory?

[XA coupe]

ugh, this is just turning in to another Us Vs Them thead

[BA$TAD]

ugh, this is just turning in to another Us Vs Them thead
just like what would happen at fordforums. both have immature one eyed zealots

[Ghosn]

ugh, this is just turning in to another Us Vs Them thead

Don't u hate that. It never ends, just be happy with what u own, be it ford or holden. If it does the job u require, that's all that matters. Not my car penis does this better than ur car penis. So long as both camps are building decent performance cars, we all win.

[McobraR]

:doh:
But the boss is making more power and using lower revs to do it.

Look, the fact that the power band of the LS1 is between 4500 and 6500rpm, means that its got 2000rpm to play with, when changing gears the LS1 will still be revving high. where as the boss, when changing gears it will drop lower. like what most journalists say, the boss engine just runs out too quickly, (i think in the original 5 speed manual) the GT drops like 1000rpm from 2nd to 3rd. when running quarter miles, its best to keep the engine in the powerband and revving high, the boss 'needs' to rev higher to compete.
Yes i said before that when they tested the LS2 and BOSS in motor, the BOSS pushed more power, but like i stated above, the boss drops too much rpms, and also weight comes to play.

[McobraR]

Sorry mate driven both cars on a number of occasions, i still think the LS1 has the wood on the BOSS 260 for low down torque but there isnt much in it.

Personally i havent driven both, but majority of the reviews stated the boss had the upper hand due to bottom end and torque, but i guess theres different opinions so i can't say that what ur saying is wrong :hide:

[McobraR]

So is the LS1 rev limited to 6500 rpm from the factory?
i believe so buddy, thats the cutout it says in the wheels mag. i think the LS2 cuts out even higher.

[ratter]

Look, the fact that the power band of the LS1 is between 4500 and 6500rpm, means that its got 2000rpm to play with, when changing gears the LS1 will still be revving high. where as the boss, when changing gears it will drop lower. like what most journalists say, the boss engine just runs out too quickly, (i think in the original 5 speed manual) the GT drops like 1000rpm from 2nd to 3rd. when running quarter miles, its best to keep the engine in the powerband and revving high, the boss 'needs' to rev higher to compete.
Yes i said before that when they tested the LS2 and BOSS in motor, the BOSS pushed more power, but like i stated above, the boss drops too much rpms, and also weight comes to play.


When racing you want to keep the engine at it's highest torque curve when changing gears not necessarily at it's highest revs, the two are at different rpms.

RPM drop on gear changes are determined by the ratios more so than the power of the motor, Ideally if you ran either motor to the redline and changed into the next gear you would want it to be near the torque peak to keep it pulling hard.

[ratter]

I just checked the holden and HSV web sites and both say max power is acheived before 5800 rpm (Holden 5600 and HSV 5800) for the LS1 so I can't see that that rev limiter would be set much higher than that.

If some one could actually tell me what their stock rev limiter is/was set at

I don't consider myself as being 1 eyed at all, I just don't like it when people are quoting things that I don't feel is correct, but I have been proven wrong before :doh:


This has gone way off topic, but I want to know the facts :headbang:

[McobraR]

When racing you want to keep the engine at it's highest torque curve when changing gears not necessarily at it's highest revs, the two are at different rpms.

RPM drop on gear changes are determined by the ratios more so than the power of the motor, Ideally if you ran either motor to the redline and changed into the next gear you would want it to be near the torque peak to keep it pulling hard.

interesting, ok, the LS1 reaches max power at 5600rpm. yet it has a cutout at 6500rpm (as shown in wheels mag). the advantage of this is that when a driver revs past its max power, when changing gears, it'l drop back down closer to the max power at 5600rpm... thats what you want. That is ALOT better than what you are saying in dropping the revs down to the torque curve since torque doesnt matter as much in the quarter mile. Why do you think people change gears as fast as possible? to keep the revs up meaning more power on tap. Tell me any V8 supercar driver that will drop to the torque curve when accelerating down a straight, none. Torque is used for corners and taking off, not for the quarter mile.
And yes i kno that its the gearing that makes the boss lose alot of rpm, thats not good since it doesnt utilise the boss engine output.
seems like a storms brewing in here lol :flame:

[ratter]

interesting, ok, the LS1 reaches max power at 5600rpm. yet it has a cutout at 6500rpm (as shown in wheels mag). the advantage of this is that when a driver revs past its max power, when changing gears, it'l drop back down closer to the max power at 5600rpm... thats what you want. That is ALOT better than what you are saying in dropping the revs down to the torque curve since torque doesnt matter as much in the quarter mile. Why do you think people change gears as fast as possible? to keep the revs up meaning more power on tap. Tell me any V8 supercar driver that will drop to the torque curve when accelerating down a straight, none. Torque is used for corners and taking off, not for the quarter mile.
And yes i kno that its the gearing that makes the boss lose alot of rpm, thats not good since it doesnt utilise the boss engine output.
seems like a storms brewing in here lol :flame:

:doh:
I think you need to do some more reading and understand a few more facts.
:weirdo:








So anyone seen any XR6 Turbos lately?

[VX8255]

Factory cutout is 6200rpm on most models.

[McobraR]

:doh:
I think you need to do some more reading and understand a few more facts.
:weirdo:








So anyone seen any XR6 Turbos lately?

CAN SOMEONE PLEASE BACK ME UP? WHO HERE KEEPS THEIR ENGINE ON THE PEAK OF THE TORQUE CURVE RATHER THAN PEAK POWER WHEN RUNNING DOWN THE QUARTER? seriously dude, u sound like a 15 year old, cus thats what i use to think when i was that age. its common sense to keep the engine running high when running the quarter LOL :lol:

[alexcs]

CAN SOMEONE PLEASE BACK ME UP? WHO HERE KEEPS THEIR ENGINE ON THE PEAK OF THE TORQUE CURVE RATHER THAN PEAK POWER WHEN RUNNING DOWN THE QUARTER? seriously dude, u sound like a 15 year old, cus thats what i use to think when i was that age. its common sense to keep the engine running high when running the quarter LOL :lol:

and you sound like a 20 year old :) way to keep the kids down maaan.

[McobraR]

and you sound like a 20 year old :) way to keep the kids down maaan.

Yeh but common, you gotta tell em straight, what if the guys older than me, that would be more frustrating, anyways im off :clown:

[ratter]

Factory cutout is 6200rpm on most models.


Thanks for that, it's close to what I thought.

:)

[vysandman]

I'm a Holden man through and through but yesterday I saw a bloke driving an F6 Typhoon (brand new BF with trade plates) in that lime green colour (TOXIC) and that has to be the hottest Australian musclecar on the roads at present, It stood out like black balls on a white dog. I also saw a VZ clubby LS2 in Impulse Blue (nice colour) and I hate to admit it but it doesn't hold a candle to the F6 for sporty looks. It's a pity the BF FPV cars aren't fitted with LS2's. If you look at HSV's site and you see "the latest strand in their DNA" is the Vauxhall VXR and then look at some of the photos on the FPV site, you've got to question whether HSV might be losing it a bit ! I remember when John Crennan had a shot at FPV for building the F6, saying that they were deviating from their cars heritage and customer base and here they are still trying to flog 4 cylinder cars to us. What's going on down there.

[vysandman]

Don't u hate that. It never ends, just be happy with what u own, be it ford or holden. If it does the job u require, that's all that matters. Not my car penis does this better than ur car penis. So long as both camps are building decent performance cars, we all win.

I agree, I admire both makes when they bring out good models and at the moment the FPV range looks the goods.

[Aus8]

Crennan has always been like that. Bags out Ford in his press release looking like a total unprofessional scared fool. Never hear the same from Ford. All they do is get their heads down and produce a Damn good car and never rubbish the opposition.

Saw a yellow BF XR6T with the optional Black 19's today (Like CSV_LS1's car from this forum). It was tinted and dumped! I also would have to say it looks better than any current HSV. My opinion of course but there was a time where I would have never considered or dreamt of a performance Falcon, that time has gone.

Cheers

Aus8

[Falcon Freak]

This video is appropriate for this thread (http://media.putfile.com/fordlo)

FF

[Redline]

Saw a yellow BF XR6T with the optional Black 19's today (Like CSV_LS1's car from this forum). It was tinted and dumped! I also would have to say it looks better than any current HSV. My opinion of course but there was a time where I would have never considered or dreamt of a performance Falcon, that time has gone.

Cheers

Aus8That would have been a BF F6 Typhoon then.....not a XR6T :D

[vecommo]

This video is appropriate for this thread (http://media.putfile.com/fordlo)

FF

Yeah man fooly sick mate :lol:

[vysandman]

I received an email from FPV (as many others would have) letting everyone know they have taken out Australian Performance car of the year. It was interesting to note which is also stated on their site that sales for Jan/Feb 2006 are up 44% on this period 2005. Not a bad increase and I'm sure HSV wouldn't dismiss FPV as a non-contender as they did in the early days.

[Aus8]

I received an email from FPV (as many others would have) letting everyone know they have taken out Australian Performance car of the year. It was interesting to note which is also stated on their site that sales for Jan/Feb 2006 are up 44% on this period 2005. Not a bad increase and I'm sure HSV wouldn't dismiss FPV as a non-contender as they did in the early days.

I remember when arrogant Crennan coming out saying there is no market for 6cylinders. Egg on the face me thinks.

Aus8

[vysandman]

I remember when arrogant Crennan coming out saying there is no market for 6cylinders. Egg on the face me thinks.

Aus8

He sure has said some dumb things in tha past which he would regret. I'm thinking more along the lines of an omlette on his face. He thought FPV were all mixed up in the head because he said "they didn't know what market they wanted to be in". I think it's called the performance car market. Stupid fools at FPV couldn't read the market right. People don't want 6 cylinder turbos, they want re-badged 4 cylinder front wheel drive turbos and V8's that run old series donks that can't be registered (Clubsport R) and lots of limited editions with no extra performance. I would love to know the comparison in sales HSV vs FPV 2 years ago, last year and current.