Ls2 Harrop Blower

[APS Fston]

Well another week closer to the LS1 Nat's and what a busy week we have had.
We just finished tuning Darren’s LS2 Harrop blower package with an incredible 364RWKW this package is the best bang for your buck and heart pumping drivability we have ever dealt with.
I just got off the phone with Mario at Autotechniques to talk about two bar and when is it coming, he like me is just as confident to say that when it's available there will be more RWKW'S to come out of this packages.
So Darren I think you will need a clutch upgrade.

http://www.apsservicecentre.com.au/content/vzblown.JPG
http://www.apsservicecentre.com.au/content/ls2blown.JPG

That torque line looks like Ayres Rock and yes it is RW Torque.

Regards Mick

PS: I would like to thank Ken from Harrop and also Mario at Autotechniques for there support.

[Ghosn]

Nice work, we gonna see this beast at the nats?

[JRGRANGE]

If it sounds and drives :driving: anything like Franks VZ he'll be a happy man.
Hay have you got my in stock yet or are you going to fit Mick's 3.3 whipple at the same price (for free that is).:woohoo:
Don't worry I'm still rapped with my combo. Bring on the Nationals.:burnout: :beer: :burnout: :beer:

[SSZO6]

BRING ON NATS YOU BIATCHES.......:stick: :nos:

[R8888]

Oh So Nice....

Santa better put one of them under the tree for me...

oh, thats x 2 ok Santa.. I want one for my SS and my HSV ok...

Bring on the Nats... :burnout:

R8 :headbang:

[HSVJPL]

Great result APS,

I'm very interested to see the diffrences in RWKW and the chnage to the pwr/torque curves with a full 2 bar tune.

I have read differing opinions on the benefit over using the VZ MAF.

Good luck and keep us informed.

[ute400]

Well another week closer to the LS1 Nat's and what a busy week we have had.
We just finished tuning Darren’s LS2 Harrop blower package with an incredible 364RWKW this package is the best bang for your buck and heart pumping drivability we have ever dealt with.
I just got off the phone with Mario at Autotechniques to talk about two bar and when is it coming, he like me is just as confident to say that when it's available there will be more RWKW'S to come out of this packages.
So Darren I think you will need a clutch upgrade.

http://www.apsservicecentre.com.au/content/vzblown.JPG
http://www.apsservicecentre.com.au/content/ls2blown.JPG

That torque line looks like Ayres Rock and yes it is RW Torque.

Regards Mick

PS: I would like to thank Ken from Harrop and also Mario at Autotechniques for there support.


This car on chevs dyno day 3 weeks ago ran best power run of 322rwkw,whats the reason that it ran now 364rwkws with only a re-tune on a
diferente dyno?
A gain of 42rwkws just by re-tuning doesnt sound right especially when its not even tuned in 2 bar.

[APS Fston]

This car on chevs dyno day 3 weeks ago ran best power run of 322rwkw,whats the reason that it ran now 364rwkws with only a re-tune on a
diferente dyno?
A gain of 42rwkws just by re-tuning doesnt sound right especially when its not even tuned in 2 bar.
When it was at Chevs it still had higher numbers than Harrops ls2 GTO until Mario had a play with the tune, Darren like most cars on the day played the hand that they had.
In talking to the guys at Harrop Kens GTO ls2 was running a different pulley on his car even when it was at Chevs.
We fitted this pulley to Darren’s car along with an APS side air box and retuned it.
I didn't say this thread was a retune, this thread is about Harrops LS2 Blower package.

Mick

[ute400]

When it was at Chevs it still had higher numbers than Harrops ls2 GTO until Mario had a play with the tune, Darren like most cars on the day played the hand that they had.
In talking to the guys at Harrop Kens GTO ls2 was running a different pulley on his car even when it was at Chevs.
We fitted this pulley to Darren’s car along with an APS side air box and retuned it.
I didn't say this thread was a retune, this thread is about Harrops LS2 Blower package.

Mick

The smaller pulley must of been the 10 psi pulley,i know it must of made a diference together with the aps air box,but 42 rwkw is a big increase..What power did it have before you fitted the smaller pulley and air box ,and retuned it on your dyno?
What timing is it running, and what afr does it have.
The reason that im curiose is that i changed my pulley together with retune(2bar)and the increase in power was only 15rwkw,the reason for that the more boost you run,the more heat you generate=less power,thats why the increase in power is alwys minimal.
What type of cold air intake does it have?

[APS Fston]

This car is running 8-8.5 psi the fuel is fat so we could leave as much timing with no knock detection when running on the dyno or road.
This car made 331, 328, 331RWKW with 4.5-5 psi when we first fitted it.
Did you say you had 2bar for LS2?? And if so who has that available from?

[ute400]

This car is running 8-8.5 psi the fuel is fat so we could leave as much timing with no knock detection when running on the dyno or road.
This car made 331, 328, 331RWKW with 4.5-5 psi when we first fitted it.
Did you say you had 2bar for LS2?? And if so who has that available from?


I have 2bar for ls1,not ls2.
Harrop only has 2 pulleys for the blower,a stantard pulley 7 psi max ,and a smaller pulley wich reads 10 psi on my car.
How are the intake temps on road and dyno?
I spoke with Ken last week and his car isnt making that sought of power.
Maybe Darrens car is one of those freaks,just makes power.

[unittesting]

nice result

[APS Fston]

This blower is the same as a LS1 type and by my under standing and testing with the large pulley it only makes 4-4.5 psi on a LS2.
With the small pulley it makes 8-8.5psi with the results you can see on the dyno sheet.
Both Mario how tunes Ken's gto including Ken himself have said it should make every bit of 350-360rwkw and any one who was at Chevs dyno day herd Ken say that his cars was way down and has made 360 on other days.

[Delco]

We just finished tuning Darren’s LS2 Harrop blower package with an incredible 364RWKW this package is the best bang for your buck and heart pumping drivability we have ever dealt with.
I just got off the phone with Mario at Autotechniques to talk about two bar and when is it coming, he like me is just as confident to say that when it's available there will be more RWKW'S to come out of this packages.
.

2 bar tuning isnt about all about power Mick , its about control and safety throughout the whole operating range so the engine runs at its optimium rather than awesome at wot and doggy elsewhere as you would know.

I am looking forward to a few Positive displacment kits being fitted to LS2's , the Vortechs I have done so far have been nice but the low down of the PWR or Starr kits combined with the 6L will be nice packages to drive.

[APS Fston]

You hit the nail on the head, well done.
Any good tuner knows it needs to run at its optimum through all driving conditions and I haven’t said otherwise. When it's running at it's optimum that’s when you will have the best results and smiles on customers faces.
We are after 2 bar for the same reasons you will be, we have 2x 3.3ltr Whipple blowers coming from Peter Starrs Tuesday.

Cheers Mick

[Delco]

You hit the nail on the head, well done.
Any good tuner knows it needs to run at its optimum through all driving conditions and I haven’t said otherwise. When it's running at it's optimum that’s when you will have the best results and smiles on customers faces.
We are after 2 bar for the same reasons you will be, we have 2x 3.3ltr Whipple blowers coming from Peter Starrs Tuesday.

Cheers Mick

Ahh , but I am already 2 bar on the LS2 :dance: , it has taken a few sleepless weeks though to get it to work properly in the code but it has been worth it. I am sure HPT could rewrite the code to make it work for you , I looked at their software at a customers shop this week , it kept locking up on him when he tried to select any airflow pids and he was having a heap of USB issues , in the end he got me to tune it as he is still trying to come to grips with his software.

The 2 bar make a world of difference to the drivability

I have had a 3.3L on order from Pete for 6 months now , I better ring on Mon and see where mine is

[APS Fston]

Don't call him till Tuesday because it a public holiday here Monday but I may call you on Monday if you are willing to talk more about 2bar on LS2's.

Mick

[chev]

Goodaye Mick/Frank. How are you guys. Bloody fantastic result with the big fellas vehicle. Lets get together and run DD with MD and check results. Cheers Chev

[Scud]

Goodaye Mick/Frank. How are you guys. Bloody fantastic result with the big fellas vehicle. Lets get together and run DD with MD and check results. Cheers Chev

I think there lies the difference. In my experience Dynolog always producs lower readings to DynoDynamics and it always causes confusion.

Not saying there is anything wrong with this, it is just that the 2 dynos are quite different and therefore you can't really compare results between the 2 unless someone can come up with a formula to convert the readings to a common result. That would be an interesting test, to see if you can find the correlation between the dynos - ie MD + 12.5% = DD. If this could be done consistently, that would be a very interesting experiment.

[Ken]

I spoke with Ken last week and his car isnt making that sought of power.


On the day we went to Chev's (great fun day) I had put the standard air-box and standard cats-back exhaust on the night before ... resulting in the first (pathetic 314?) run. BIG mistake ... especially since I did not have time to re-calibrate. Luckily Mario came with VCM in hand, and all we did was pull some fuel out (not a re-tune) to produce ~328.
We have since re-calibrated (with the new dual 3" exhasut) and are back to ~340rwkw ... but now we now need to do valve springs.

I'm probably not going to bother doing the springs as we will be inserting the 402 with the TSK140 in the next few weeks (waiting on pistons) ...

Then the serious fun will begin ...
:woohoo:

[awddynotodd]

I think there lies the difference. In my experience Dynolog always producs lower readings to DynoDynamics and it always causes confusion.

Not saying there is anything wrong with this, it is just that the 2 dynos are quite different and therefore you can't really compare results between the 2 unless someone can come up with a formula to convert the readings to a common result. That would be an interesting test, to see if you can find the correlation between the dynos - ie MD + 12.5% = DD. If this could be done consistently, that would be a very interesting experiment.

There are 3 common reasons why a DD is normally higher than a Mainline Dynolog:

1. Intake Air Temperature correction is used on top of Ambient Air Temp for Atmospheric Correction on a DD, this would enable the user to gain extra KW's if they were dishonest. On a Mainline Dynolog the Intake Air Temperature is merely just an Input for the operator to monitor, and most guys don't even use it.

2. Atmospheric Correction on a DD is manually entered from readings from a $150 weather station, once again if the operator chooses to cheat, he can.
Total Atmos Correction on a DD does not seem to capped, as correction figures above 10% can be calculated, on a Mainline Dynolog the Correction is capped at 10%, and the dyno wil not save an data if this limit is reached, and the highest Atmos Correction I have ever seen was 9.2% in a concrete dyno room in Bangkok, and this was using the SAE J607 formula which is 4% higher than SAE J1349.
On a Mainline Dynolog the Atmospheric Correction is an Automatic function from a hard wired Weather Station that costs the users over $2K, the user has no control over Atmospheric Correction.

3. DD apply an "assumed" vehicle inertia figure and add this to the reading in Shootout mode, Mainline Dynolog do not apply any Vehicle Inertia.

The combination of the above 3 factors generally account for the higher readings on a DD. In most cases, if a car has been dyno'd on a DD, it wil be lower on a Mainline Dynolog, how much lower there is no direct correlation.
Sometimes it's a couple of RWKW, in other cases it's a lot more.

[ute400]

On the day we went to Chev's (great fun day) I had put the standard air-box and standard cats-back exhaust on the night before ... resulting in the first (pathetic 314?) run. BIG mistake ... especially since I did not have time to re-calibrate. Luckily Mario came with VCM in hand, and all we did was pull some fuel out (not a re-tune) to produce ~328.
We have since re-calibrated (with the new dual 3" exhasut) and are back to ~340rwkw ... but now we now need to do valve springs.

I'm probably not going to bother doing the springs as we will be inserting the 402 with the TSK140 in the next few weeks (waiting on pistons) ...

Then the serious fun will begin ...
:woohoo:
No wonder it lost power!!!
The 3"exhaust works well with this setup,compared to standard.
Im running vx cats on mine,would it be worth while getting diferente ones,what do you recommend?

340rwkw is more like it.
The 402 will be interesting to see the increase,SERIOUS POWER!!!!!!

[Blown VZ Clubby]

This car on chevs dyno day 3 weeks ago ran best power run of 322rwkw,whats the reason that it ran now 364rwkws with only a re-tune on a
diferente dyno?
A gain of 42rwkws just by re-tuning doesnt sound right especially when its not even tuned in 2 bar.


Thats correct but sense then i have fitted 3" Di Filippo cats back with hi flow cats, small harrop pulley and an APS air box and they had to re-tune it because of those mods, its an awesome package to drive it will frighten the shite out of you, it pushes you well back into your seat if you can get traction :stick:

Like to say a BIG Thank you to Mick/Frank and all the boys and girls at APS this is an awesome package

P.S Will need a twin plate clutch before the LS1 Nats

Cheers Darren

[VILLAIN]

I must appoligise to Mick and the guys at APS, after a chat with Mick i realised i read his thread incorrectly so my comment was inappropriate and appoligise for any angst this may have caused.

Regards Chris

[jsttry]

I must appoligise to Mick and the guys at APS, after a chat with Mick i realised i read his thread incorrectly so my comment was inappropriate and appoligise for any angst this may have caused.

Regards Chris
I must be going blind, I can't see any previous comments

[Holdn Tease]

Wow, this is exciting stuff guys. I'm glad i logged on to check out whats going on. Cant wait to get back to Australia to catch up with whats happening!! I fly back Wednesday, but will definately be in before Monday.

Well done guys, Lauren

[EnhancedCalais]

ute 400,
I hear on the grapevine that you would understand the differences from dyno to dyno, and tuner to tuner :)

[ute400]

ute 400,
I hear on the grapevine that you would understand the differences from dyno to dyno, and tuner to tuner :)


Thats right if every body did there job well the first time, no one would have to go from dyno to dyno and tuner to tuner.

[Smikvyss]

Thats right if every body did there job well the first time, no one would have to go from dyno to dyno and tuner to tuner.

Who has tuned your car

[ute400]

Who has tuned your car


Its a confidential matter,sorry.

[Berniebgf]

I cant offer any smarts about tuning and performance and so on....I just like driving them...

All I can say is.... Ferrari or Lambo? not a problem...

Fantastic work, just think!!! maybe in one or two years we will see a Supercharged LS2 off the Holden production line?? I'm sure they are watching your great work.

Best regards

Bernie.

(P.S. anything I say can not be taken as fact)

[APS Fston]

There is no doubt the Harrop Supercharger kits are hard to beat.

I have heard that HSV are going to have an aftermarket performance range of products that may include the Harrop products. Can anyone shed light on this?

[Ken]

There is no doubt the Harrop Supercharger kits are hard to beat.

I have heard that HSV are going to have an aftermarket performance range of products that may include the Harrop products. Can anyone shed light on this?

The program you refer to is probably the Walkinshaw Performance Products concept which is being considered. It is true that we have been asked to quote on the supply of some products to WPP ... but it would be irresponsible of me to comment further than that.
:stick:

[Pickles]

There is no doubt the Harrop Supercharger kits are hard to beat.

I have heard that HSV are going to have an aftermarket performance range of products that may include the Harrop products. Can anyone shed light on this?
Walkinshaw Performance Products is a definite goer. In fact, in some respects, it is already operating, but not in so far as the aspect you are interested in, as yet. It is headed up by Chris Payne, who was John Crennan's right hand man at HSV. I'm not sure of ALL that this group will do, but road car modifications will form a part of it.The word is that this group will be able to do all manner of modifications- blowers, brakes, suspension etc etc. I reckon you'll hear a public announcement within the next 2 months.
Cheers, Pickles.

[keen]

On the day we went to Chev's (great fun day) I had put the standard air-box and standard cats-back exhaust on the night before ... resulting in the first (pathetic 314?) run. BIG mistake ... especially since I did not have time to re-calibrate. Luckily Mario came with VCM in hand, and all we did was pull some fuel out (not a re-tune) to produce ~328.
We have since re-calibrated (with the new dual 3" exhasut) and are back to ~340rwkw ... but now we now need to do valve springs.

I'm probably not going to bother doing the springs as we will be inserting the 402 with the TSK140 in the next few weeks (waiting on pistons) ...

Then the serious fun will begin ...
:woohoo:
Hi Ken
what is TSK 140?
I really like your kits and have been seriously considering getting one.But I really want a fair bit more then the present kit produces.Is this TSK what im looking for? Any ballpark on $$$.
Thanks Josh



(sorry to hijack thread.)

[APS Fston]

Hi Ken
what is TSK 140?
I really like your kits and have been seriously considering getting one.But I really want a fair bit more then the present kit produces.Is this TSK what im looking for? Any ballpark on $$$.
Thanks Josh



(sorry to hijack thread.)

No dramas at all. Feel free to discuss Harrop in this thread, as we are quite happy to promote all Harrop products

[RED R8]

This Maloo on saturday made a very Healthy 455rwhp LS2 with harrop and the sound was awsome.

http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h49/Dazvyss/dynoDay163.jpg

I have the video of it as well I will post up this week if anyone is keen.

[Ken]

Hi Ken
what is TSK 140?
I really like your kits and have been seriously considering getting one.But I really want a fair bit more then the present kit produces.Is this TSK what im looking for? Any ballpark on $$$.
Thanks Josh
(sorry to hijack thread.)

The TSK140 is a 140ci twin-screw supercharger (2300cc). It is something we have developed using the Lysholm rotors (Whipple bought their superchargers from Lysholm until recently).
It is a couple of steps up from the LS112, and is best suited for "big" engines.

I have one on my stock LS2 at present for testing, and will soon transfer it to the 402ci to complete durability testing before release to the public.
:dance: :shock:
Please do not ask for performance numbers yet ... we will not answer until testing is complete.:(

Talk with the APS guys re pricing ...

[Smikvyss]

This Maloo on saturday made a very Healthy 455rwhp LS2 with harrop and the sound was awsome.

http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h49/Dazvyss/dynoDay163.jpg

I have the video of it as well I will post up this week if anyone is keen.

What sort of zorst system is this ute running and are they 20" rims i like