Can someone give me an opinion on this? #2.

[APCLB]

Had to travel to ACT today.On the south side of Goulburn,just on the N.S.W. side of the N.S.W/ACT border I got done by a road side laser radar.
Now here is the grey part,i was boxed in by a ute behind me,some turkey in a Porche Cayane (?) directly beside me just pacing me not overtaking & a B double in front of me,we were actually catching up to the B dble tipper which was dropping heaps of rocks/blue metal & crap all over the road which was then hitting my bonnet,windscreen & roof!We all doing about 115km,snap decision I decided to boot it abit to get clear of
1)the turkey beside me.
2)the rocks & crap bouncing off windscreen,bonnet etc
3) to get clear of idiot behind me,beside me & the thoughtless corn hole in front of me.
Just as I booted it & started to over take the truck I saw the cop running for his car & knew I was done,it was no point in giving him a chase & letting him catch up to me so I cleared the truck then pulled over & waited for the bad news to arrive.
Told me all is being recorded in vid & audio etc can be used against me etc etc & then tells me I was recorded doing 151km passing the B dble truck,got your licence there son?
"Ffff rrrkk n whaaaa,151???"
Last glance as I was over taking was 140,but that is beside the point.
I didn't give him any attitude as I was caught outright,but I got out explained the situ regarding the rocks from the truck etc the turkey beside me,pleaded my defence if you will.
Said he can appreciate the moment but I was the one caught.Suggested I can appeal the fine & thanked me for taking it on the chin & for pulling over for him..........

What I was really p!ssed about is that I was honestly doing the speed limit all the way from Sydney up untill that point the radar got me!
I know I know I shouldn't have been speeding I only know this too well now,seeing as though over $500 is coming out of the SS up-grade slush fund!

I just need an honest opinion,should I plead my case in court & the fact the truck was spewing rocks etc all over the place & just tried to get out of a dangerous situ?
Or just take it "on the chin"? plus the 4 points,500 smackers & place in the experience file?
TIA.

[Elite SS]

Please read last "opinion thread"

Moderators..get ready...

[KeenGolfer]

Cop it on the chin, you were speeding, and a long way over. You won't have a chance in court, you could have always dropped back rather than speeding forwards.

[seldo]

Whilst I sympathise with you....just put it in the "unlucky" file...Sorry :)

[Glenn@Autowerks]

Cop it on the chin, you were speeding, and a long way over. You won't have a chance in court, you could have always dropped back rather than speeding forwards.

I tend to agree with Drew here, we all know what you are saying but when it goes before the court they will say the same thing, why didn't you just slow down....

I am sure we have all done the same thing as you did but unfortunately they pinged ya.

Good luck anyway

[Blown 454 AWD]

Yes, absolutely bad luck.

If you had a video of the truck dropping gravel, you wouldn't have a problem.

Unfortunately as you haven't, you have 2 shows.

It's bad enough however, could've been worse, could've been your licence. :spew:

[VooDoo]

Fight it in court, at worst it costs another $67 in court fee's but that copper is off the road for a day. At best, you put your case accross and could win.

[macca33]

Unless he is going to lie, there would be no real point in going to court. You would receive, at best, the minimum statutory penalty for the speed, which is what you have now. Was a licence suspension involved? If not, then there wouldn't be any reason at all to go to court and waste a day.

Yep, it's a shite of a thing, but it was also a fair cop, as you've already admitted.

Good luck with it.

Macca

[Glenn@Autowerks]

Fight it in court, at worst it costs another $67 in court fee's but that copper is off the road for a day. At best, you put your case accross and could win.

Read the RTA website in NSW
Listed below are the penalties if you are convicted by a court.


More than 30 km/h but not
more than 45 km/h


$2,200

[Peter B - CV8]

Fight it in court, at worst it costs another $67 in court fee's but that copper is off the road for a day. At best, you put your case accross and could win.
Bit of a shortsighted attitude.... -(no disrespect intended). What if "that copper" would have normally been first call to go to a life & death situation - maybe one involving your family ???
But in answer to the question ;
* You couldn't have been paying too much attention to get boxed in to start with (easily done when you are only cruising along).
* Maybe should have just eased up a bit & slotted in behind the Cayenne - or did you want to show him a clean pair of heels ??(151kph is getting up a bit).
Cop it on the chin & put it down to experience. Oh and I've probably done the same thing on many occassions & luckily haven't been pinged.

[lowriding]

Read the RTA website in NSW
Listed below are the penalties if you are convicted by a court.


More than 30 km/h but not
more than 45 km/h


$2,200

$2200 :shock: :shock: Thats ridiculous really. mate i do feel for you , that is a bum situation at best and i know i have been in that as well. Cant stand people in right hand lane doing speed limit :flamin: leaving you with no "out".,in all reality it was his actions which forced your hand ,and will now cost you 2 and half grand by the looks. Sure the courts and do-gooders on this forum and elsewhere will say you could have just slowed down , but i can sympathise with your story in anycase.
Bad luck but i think your done .Try a traffic solicitor who may help .
edit - it's actually "only" $575 infringement if you pay and not take to court -best option imo

[VooDoo]

QLD must be different then. The fine is the same as whats on the ticket. All you pay is court costs if still found guilty. ive gone to court 3 times and won twice. The court up here cannot change the point nor the fine.

Peter_B: If the copper needs to goto court then the have a replacement for his shift anyway. Ive had some pretty silly tickets and if they want to waste my time, ill make sure they can justify their actions. Dont get me wrong, i have a lot of respect for the police and the job they do but just because they have a badge, doesnt mean they are always right. They interprete the law one one, the courts often have a slightly different view. I dont condone speeding on the streets at all, thats what the drags are for but the law and fines need to be justifiable and fair.

While i dont know the exact situation in this case, you could easily argue you were avoiding an accident due to the rocks. You can request a copy of the video which may also show the details of the truck, the rocks and other things that may work in your favour.

[LS297]

contest it, if you know you were doing les than he has booked you for then fight it. I have and have won..

[Elite SS]

My front spoiler and bonnet are also full of chips (painted twice already)
and it also ticks me off too, but I don't overtake at 150 kl/h thats one hell of a pick up from 100 kl/h..in future just be more cautous...
At that speed it will be very hard for a judge to see you side of the story..

Good luck with it if you intend on taking it to court.:teach:

[HRT 8]

QLD must be different then. The fine is the same as whats on the ticket. All you pay is court costs if still found guilty. ive gone to court 3 times and won twice. The court up here cannot change the point nor the fine.
In Vic the fine printed on the Infringement notice is the bare minumum. It can and often does go up from there.



While i dont know the exact situation in this case, you could easily argue you were avoiding an accident due to the rocks. You can request a copy of the video which may also show the details of the truck, the rocks and other things that may work in your favour.
In my opinion, and it is just that, trying to argue your point of exceeding the speed limit by 50% just to avoid stones is suicidal.
I've spent a lot of time in court and cannot see any magistrate condoning that, when a simple reset of the cruise to a lower speed or even a call to the police to report the truck dropping debris would have been far more prudent.

Id take it on the chin and move on.

[Pickles]

You've got nothing to lose by going to court. You have a genuine case, although it's not an excuse, under the law, for speeding. But, i'd definitely go to court & tell what happened. The cop will have to go to defend it as well. I'd probably seek a bit of legal advice before I went, but probably wouldn't take a solicitor to the court because of the cost.
Anyway, you were in a genuine situation, just go to court & tell it how it is,--if you've got a good driving record, & the magistrate is only half way reasonable, you may get a reduction in the penalties.
Cheers, Pickles.

[Elite SS]

You've got nothing to lose by going to court. You have a genuine case, although it's not an excuse, under the law, for speeding. But, i'd definitely go to court & tell what happened. The cop will have to go to defend it as well. I'd probably seek a bit of legal advice before I went, but probably wouldn't take a solicitor to the court because of the cost.
Anyway, you were in a genuine situation, just go to court & tell it how it is,--if you've got a good driving record, & the magistrate is only half way reasonable, you may get a reduction in the penalties.
Cheers, Pickles.

No offence mate..but a genuine excuse..I realy don't think that any Magistrate will swollow that one...
There are many options that could of been taken nearly all mentioned right here by many who have been in a similar situation...
I have friends that are in the Police force and I also have a friend that is a Public Defendant..some of the stories that I have heard with a lot more reasonable excuses than this one have been laughed at, at court.
I don't agree with most offences and the amount of the fines, but they are the rules and if we get caught we get caught, this fortunately was not a life threatening situation, so very little chance of having the fine squashed....

[VSSII]

Ah.. NO you don't have a "genuine case". You may have what you believe to be a valid reason for doing a tonne and a half but the basic proofs of the offence are that you exceeded the speed limit, driving a vehicle, on a road and your speed was measured by an approved device. These are really simple proofs. People often have the offence proven but the weak as water magistrate may reduce the fine or similar. But they can't take the points away. And then people on forums such as this tell everyone they won without going into the important details (not to mention enormous legal fees as well). I guess some may regard this as a win.
Do yourself a favour and go speak to the chamber magistrate at your local Court they will give you informed advice on whether to lose a days pay over something that can't be avoided.

I hate getting booked just as much as the next person but I think the pain goes away quicker if you man up and cop it on the chin instead of spending more $$ fighting a losing battle.

[ACT_Cross8]

Mate, you had 2 choices (right peddle or middle peddle) and you took your chances. Cop it sweet, we can do without shit like this clogging up the legal system.

[Y2kGoofball]

yeah I tend to agree :stick:

Although we can understand what your saying because Im sure alot of us would do the same thing if in the same situation, they'll wheel out the records, plus the video ... and audio from the HWP car and officer, and in court their looking at facts to back up both sides claims thus one of the reason why HWP cars have video front and rear. Now theres the facts for the HWP and the reason for pinging you, but wheres your facts for doing the speed?

Although you'll be saying "the truck was dumping shite and see there i am on that audio tape explaining it to the cop" on the other side of the fence their going to see the radar record, the tape of you waiting for him to arrive, and at some stage during your conversation if you've said "I realise" or "I know I was" or something like that then your gone because youve admitted you were in the wrong.

And I suppose at the end of it all their really going to more then likely rule against you, and why wouldnt they, you were speeding and theres multiple proofs, and make suggestions - perhaps you shouldve noted the trucks number plate and reported it to 000 as you drove along, obviously if there was a HWP car parked up the road they couldve nabbed him, perhaps you shoulda backed off to a safe distance. Initial speed of 115 Kph, thats not the speed limit to begin with! It goes on and on.

I mean its up to you but personally I think cop it on the chin and be thankful youve still got your licence at the end of it, its a lesson Im sure youve learnt and to all of us to watch your speed as you overtake because no matter what the car in front / behind / beside is doing its always you whose targeted!

[LSavvy]

Your lucky it wasn't 155km/h otherwise i think instant suspension for 45km/h over limit. Pay the fine you were way over the 110km/h for a overtake, had the same prob with an overtake on a single lane with driver infront 10km/h below limit, found out i could not exceed speed limit to overtake, yeah stupid i know, but they have to draw the line somewhere.

[Nemisis]

Being a police officer and subsequently spending significant amounts of time at court, I can tell you now that you didnt act as a "Reasonable and Prudent" person would have. This has already been demonstrated by previous posts. There is no way you can prove that the instrument was wrong (I'm assuming it was the Lidar not the Silver Eagle). So what is your defence going to be? Bearing in mind that for traffic offences there is a strict liability. So it not a responsibility of police to prove you meant to speed (Mens Rea) just that you were speeding (Actus Reas).

If you know your in the wrong just cop it sweet (No pun intended). If not fight it and be prepared for a bigger penalty, a disqualification (Not a suspension) and a big invoice from a legal firm. And by the way, if a cop is at court another is rostered/given overtime to take his/her place. Your tax dollar at work.

Good Luck with whatever you decide to do.

Regards
Karl

[APCLB]

Thanks gents,I really do appreciate all the informative & understanding replies.I wasn't sure about asking this forum in the first place but I'm glad I did now.
I have tried to get in contact with the officer involved regarding the truck/rocks,just to see if he did get any of that on vid or his rego?And if he did what then?Still doesn't make it ok for me to tear off like a d/h.
I'm guessing it might all hinge on the officers at the road side to back up my statement about the rocks,dont think that'll ever happen.
This one goes to the "you d/h file" & cop it sweet.

I'm now questioning the very idea of spending money on performance up-grades on the car at all!What to do,what to do......thanks again folks.

*edit* Yes Karl it was a lidar that got me,I was only trying to plead the reason for speeding up,obviously the wrong decision, I've learnt from this,if only it wasn't for the (tail-gating) ute behind me.......ah,hind sight is a wonderful thing.

[brettarmst]

Pay the tick it takes to long to argue your point, still get the ticket and have to pay a court fee.

Saying all that I did get off a speeding ticket after a car and bike panic braked in front of me after seeing a speed van. Only reason I got off was becuase the speeding photo clearly showed the guy in the right hand lane with smoke from his wheels and his car at 30 degrees to the lane at almost the speed limit and the motor bike in front of me clearly stopping. The judge agreed I was better off speeding and missing both of them then killing a motorbike rider who coluld stop a lot quicker then a car. The ticket was for 128 kms in a 100 zone.

[mad.ed]

Had to travel to ACT today.On the south side of Goulburn,just on the N.S.W. side of the N.S.W/ACT border I got done by a road side laser radar.
Now here is the grey part,i was boxed in by a ute behind me,some turkey in a Porche Cayane (?) directly beside me just pacing me not overtaking & a B double in front of me,we were actually catching up to the B dble tipper which was dropping heaps of rocks/blue metal & crap all over the road which was then hitting my bonnet,windscreen & roof!We all doing about 115km,snap decision I decided to boot it abit to get clear of
1)the turkey beside me.
2)the rocks & crap bouncing off windscreen,bonnet etc
3) to get clear of idiot behind me,beside me & the thoughtless corn hole in front of me.
Just as I booted it & started to over take the truck I saw the cop running for his car & knew I was done,it was no point in giving him a chase & letting him catch up to me so I cleared the truck then pulled over & waited for the bad news to arrive.
Told me all is being recorded in vid & audio etc can be used against me etc etc & then tells me I was recorded doing 151km passing the B dble truck,got your licence there son?
"Ffff rrrkk n whaaaa,151???"
Last glance as I was over taking was 140,but that is beside the point.
I didn't give him any attitude as I was caught outright,but I got out explained the situ regarding the rocks from the truck etc the turkey beside me,pleaded my defence if you will.
Said he can appreciate the moment but I was the one caught.Suggested I can appeal the fine & thanked me for taking it on the chin & for pulling over for him..........

What I was really p!ssed about is that I was honestly doing the speed limit all the way from Sydney up untill that point the radar got me!
I know I know I shouldn't have been speeding I only know this too well now,seeing as though over $500 is coming out of the SS up-grade slush fund!

I just need an honest opinion,should I plead my case in court & the fact the truck was spewing rocks etc all over the place & just tried to get out of a dangerous situ?
Or just take it "on the chin"? plus the 4 points,500 smackers & place in the experience file?
TIA. yeah , ya gotta love it .

[cwhast]

Isn't there a speedo inaccuracy buffer in NSW? IIRC its 10% so you could get away doing 135kph

[lx406]

Doing that speed qualifies for the car being impounded in Vic after July 1. Count yourself lucky you didn't cop anything more than a piece of paper.

[Blown 454 AWD]

Your lucky it wasn't 155km/h otherwise i think instant suspension for 45km/h over limit. Pay the fine you were way over the 110km/h for a overtake, had the same prob with an overtake on a single lane with driver infront 10km/h below limit, found out i could not exceed speed limit to overtake, yeah stupid i know, but they have to draw the line somewhere.


NSW is now bye bye licence @ 30 klm over, no ifs or buts.

[Elite SS]

G'day "APCLB"

Glad to hear youv"e got common sense on the subject..we've all been throught it one way or the other...
Here's a bit of help if your stuck with finances,paying off such a large fine,
Find out what excatley the full fine is and go to your local court house and plead financial destitute and you should be able to pay the fine off in instalments possibly up to 12 months...depending on your financial situation..
see how you go it wont cost you anything to ask.

[APCLB]

NSW is now bye bye licence @ 30 klm over, no ifs or buts.

Thanks Steve.Got my 3 month holiday paper work in the mail yesterday (bye bye licence).
Thanks for the tip Elite,the fine was not a prob thats paid for,just need a good solicitor now,need to keep a day licence.Do the courts frown on this thesedays?Could I appeal for a work hour only licence?:confused:
Whats my chances?Not disputing the offence,just appealing for a "work hour only" licence.

[Vulture]

Another safe driver loses his licence - absolutely crazy times we live in folks.

[Devil CV8]

Thanks Steve.Got my 3 month holiday paper work in the mail yesterday (bye bye licence).
Thanks for the tip Elite,the fine was not a prob thats paid for,just need a good solicitor now,need to keep a day licence.Do the courts frown on this thesedays?Could I appeal for a work hour only licence?:confused:
Whats my chances?Not disputing the offence,just appealing for a "work hour only" licence.

There is no longer a "day or work only license". The time to dispute the offence was prior to paying the fine. You paid the fine which means you pleaded guilty and the penalty includes the loss of license. Hate to say it, but looks like you walk for 3 months. Hope you don't need to drive for work, or at least have an understanding boss (or 3 months leave)

[Holdendriver]

Another safe driver loses his licence - absolutely crazy times we live in folks.

AND was guilty until he could prove himself innocent, which as we have found out in this thread is nigh-on impossible.

For those of you in NSW don't forget that 130KPH anywhere (even on a 110K freeway) will give you a 3 month walk now... that's 20k over folks...

Cheers,

[Vulture]

AND was guilty until he could prove himself innocent, which as we have found out in this thread is nigh-on impossible.

For those of you in NSW don't forget that 130KPH anywhere (even on a 110K freeway) will give you a 3 month walk now... that's 20k over folks...

Cheers,

This is just unbelievable, I still can't read that without incredulity even after all this time. We have completely lost the plot with regard to road safety in this country. The emphasis on speeding is quite simply preposterous. I would go so far as to say it is wilfully negligent to focus on speeding to this extent.

The original poster in this thread may have had a chance. Remember the motorcyclist who accelerated away from a possible crash? He won his case. I would have focused on the fact that *LARGE* rocks were falling from the truck ahead and that I feared for my safety. Might have worked.

[Devil CV8]

AND was guilty until he could prove himself innocent, which as we have found out in this thread is nigh-on impossible. Once you pay the fine on the T.I.N or have the magistrate bang his gavill as he says guilty the penalties apply, that includes fine, points and any suspension. he would've had a better chance of keeping his license by electing the court option. (and by better I mean better than 0% which is what he has now)


For those of you in NSW don't forget that 130KPH anywhere (even on a 110K freeway) will give you a 3 month walk now... that's 20k over folks...

Cheers, Please don't give out factually incorrect information. There was a period of time where you were correct, that is no longer the case..
Rather than argue back and forth, go and check out the RTA website
http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/rulesregulations/penalties/speeding.html?rrlid=11

[Devil CV8]

The original poster in this thread may have had a chance. Remember the motorcyclist who accelerated away from a possible crash? He won his case. I would have focused on the fact that *LARGE* rocks were falling from the truck ahead and that I feared for my safety. Might have worked.

Exactly, that the OP chose to pay his fine and now has to deal with the consequences of that action should act as a warning to others.

[Holdendriver]

Please don't give out factually incorrect information. There was a period of time where you were correct, that is no longer the case..
Rather than argue back and forth, go and check out the RTA website
http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/rulesregulations/penalties/speeding.html?rrlid=11

Apologies to all, I was unaware they had changed this, although I wouldn't be game enough to test it, if someone has been pulled for 135 or so in a 110 recently please let us know here!

It is very rare that the RTA reduces a non-monetary penalty for speeding and unlikely to be permanent anyhow, like when small amounts over went back to one point, didn't last real long.

Cheers,

[Devil CV8]

Apologies to all, I was unaware they had changed this, although I wouldn't be game enough to test it, if someone has been pulled for 135 or so in a 110 recently please let us know here!

It is very rare that the RTA reduces a non-monetary penalty for speeding and unlikely to be permanent anyhow, like when small amounts over went back to one point, didn't last real long.

Cheers,
It was part of the group of changes that lowered the $$ fine for under 15 over while lifting the point penalty.

[jescam]

Thanks Steve.Got my 3 month holiday paper work in the mail yesterday (bye bye licence).
Thanks for the tip Elite,the fine was not a prob thats paid for,just need a good solicitor now,need to keep a day licence.Do the courts frown on this thesedays?Could I appeal for a work hour only licence?:confused:
Whats my chances?Not disputing the offence,just appealing for a "work hour only" licence.

Forget that...........

I was done years ago, and tried to have the time period reduced or a 'work only' license granted!

I went to court and waited my turn to plead my case!

The guy before me was losing his license from an accumulation of points.

He had paperwork from his employer stating he would lose his job without his license.

He showed documentation of his mortgage and said he would lose his house without his job.

He explained he was the sole income earner in his family due to his wife just giving birth to a baby.

He was dressed neatly and was well spoken.

The judge just said..........you should've thought about all that before you did it! You've lost your license!

I thought well if he didnt get off i'm stuffed!

In short i wasted a day in court and had to serve the 3 months disqualification!

The only thing i thought that was very stupid, was the fact that if i was such a danger to the public, why was i allowed to continue driving up until the court date, which from memory was months!!???

Friggin ridiculous if you ask me!

One last word of warning!

If you do in fact lose your license for any time period, dont be tempted and drive!

A friend did this, and had only 1 week to go and got caught!

He got a huge fine and lost it for another 6 months!

Good luck anyway.

[APCLB]

Forget that...........

I was done years ago, and tried to have the time period reduced or a 'work only' license granted!

I went to court and waited my turn to plead my case!

The guy before me was losing his license from an accumulation of points.

He had paperwork from his employer stating he would lose his job without his license.

He showed documentation of his mortgage and said he would lose his house without his job.

He explained he was the sole income earner in his family due to his wife just giving birth to a baby.

He was dressed neatly and was well spoken.

The judge just said..........you should've thought about all that before you did it! You've lost your license!

I thought well if he didnt get off i'm stuffed!

In short i wasted a day in court and had to serve the 3 months disqualification!

The only thing i thought that was very stupid, was the fact that if i was such a danger to the public, why was i allowed to continue driving up until the court date, which from memory was months!!???

Friggin ridiculous if you ask me!

One last word of warning!

If you do in fact lose your license for any time period, dont be tempted and drive!

A friend did this, and had only 1 week to go and got caught!

He got a huge fine and lost it for another 6 months!

Good luck anyway.


Same situ here Jescam,loss of licence wont be till mid Sept to mid Dec & rego is due in Nov lol.When I was orginally pulled over I was thankful I had someone with me to drive the car as I thought they'd disqal me there & then....
Monies not a prob for 3 months off i.e: car repayments bills etc etc,but I just had 7 months off from a work related accident,dont want to sit around again........plus the job could be filled whilst I'm gone,thats my main worry.
And I must admit I was tempted to not say anything to work about this,but that lasted 2 seconds,just not worth the risk especially when driving company cars & equipment.

DevilCV8,I paid the fine at the time because I just accepted my fate & wanted to be done with it,I also didnt know I was going to lose my brief for 3 months at the time.Either way I'm fronting the courts tomorrow to chat with court clerk & see what my (slim) options are regarding a reduced suspension
plus the RTA.

Big thanks to Nemisis & everyone else for all the good & bad comments,appreciate them all.
Hope this topic serves some good & has given some ppl out there a second thought when speeding,its just not worth it really.Even though the situ I was caught in could have been alot worse,I chose the wrong way to handle it & paying for it now.
I'm seriously looking into track days at Eastern Crk,Oran Pk etc from now on,do my speeding there! Whens the next street meet at WSID? :)

[Devil CV8]

DevilCV8,I paid the fine at the time because I just accepted my fate & wanted to be done with it,I also didnt know I was going to lose my brief for 3 months at the time.Either way I'm fronting the courts tomorrow to chat with court clerk & see what my (slim) options are regarding a reduced suspension
plus the RTA.


It pays to always know what the penalties that you are agreeing to prior to paying the fine, and for you it is a harsh lesson. Let this also be a warning to others.
As for work, talk to your boss, you never know, maybe they can accomodate you. Without knowing what your job is, maybe they can put a trainee with you as a driver.

good luck .