VE Discussion / General Thread PART 3

[hatzi]

MOD EDIT: Thread continued from http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=58594&page=34





Enthusiast websites such as ls1.com.au published copious amounts of material about VE on their forums in the months prior to the public reveal.

Well at least the forum's getting some publicity and thats the main thing :cool:

[mutual_master]

Now that the VE Commodore is out, it seems every Aussie journo is having a big wank over the new car. I would love to get some unbiased news about the car for once...

found this the other day..

motorauthority.com/news/sedans/holden%e2%80%99s-all-new-ve-commodore

hopefully the US reviewers can give us a more rounded review:cool:

[Ls1CorpCruiser]

seen many VE's and WM's on the road the past week....

They all look awesome..

Favourites are Calias V in White and WM Caprice in white...

Never thought I'd say I liked a white car let alone an auto!!!:limpy:

[Ls1CorpCruiser]

BTW forgot to mention my neighbour the Holden Engineer is currently driving a WM Statesman with kickarse 19" HBD rims, will try to get a pic tonight when it arrives home.

:love:

[Danv8]

Now that the VE Commodore is out, it seems every Aussie journo is having a big wank over the new car. I would love to get some unbiased news about the car for once...

found this the other day..

motorauthority.com/news/sedans/holden%e2%80%99s-all-new-ve-commodore

hopefully the US reviewers can give us a more rounded review:cool:

I personally couldn't care less what the Journo's think as long as I like it and other Holden enthusiasts like it. Not some overpaid Journo. ;)
I haven't even bought any Wheels or Motor mags that has any info on the VE launch. :)

[jaykay]

BTW forgot to mention my neighbour the Holden Engineer is currently driving a WM Statesman with kickarse 19" HBD rims, will try to get a pic tonight when it arrives home.

:love:
Is he going to give you a drive ???

[XLR8 V8]

Thread split and reopened .... please continue...

[kermatt]

The blimp is up and flying

http://www.drive.com.au/Editorial/ArticleDetail.aspx?ArticleID=18964&vf=3

[Dr Smith]

The blimp is up and flying

http://www.drive.com.au/Editorial/ArticleDetail.aspx?ArticleID=18964&vf=3
I saw it this afternoon (2.15pm) heading towards Moorabbin Airport...actually crabbing in the crosswind.

[XLR8 V8]

The blimp is up and flying

http://www.drive.com.au/Editorial/ArticleDetail.aspx?ArticleID=18964&vf=3


See the frontpage of the forums for a pic of it with the screen activated

[Lad47]

Drive have all the reviews up
http://www.drive.com.au/Editorial/ArticleIndex.aspx?categoryID=55

Hi my first post by the way.

[Holden Man]

:bounce: :bounce:
Just saw 2 VE (Omegas 1 x white & 1 x brown) on the back of a truck heading along Ann Street in the Valley (Brisbane) I followed them for a little while and it looked as though they were headed to Armstrong's at the Gabba.
(could be wrong)

My first viewing, very nice. A lot more compact than I thought and not slab sided (like camry) as the pics make it look, it's actually curvy. Didn't look like the BF either.


OOOHHHH I'm excited . . . . . finally seen one :bounce:

[mac06]

It's good to hear that more and more people are SEEING and LIKING the VE. As always expected, the pictures don't do the VE justice. IMHO Holden are on a winner!!!!!!!!!:nos:

[boofhead]

The drive reviews so far look pretty positive - the SV6 seems to be rated as the least impressive of the model mix but the review for the Omega, SS and Calais are all good - the Calais-V is still the the pick of the models from my point of view

Also just received in the mail from Suttons Arncliffe (Sydney) about a VE Preview - no real dates or information but will register to see if it is any chop!

[Fnomna]

Lots of positives in the Drive reviews.

Not sure if mentioned already, but I also noted there is another webchat there tomorrow:

Join the live and exclusive online chat with Holden Executive Director of Engineering Tony Hyde.
Submit your questions here from 1pm 3/8/06.
Join the live chat here from 1:30-2:30 3/8/06.

[NRD80Y]

While Drive doesn't seem to think the SV6 is up to scatch, Carpoint love it.

"What did we do to deserve such an amazing choice at tarted-up Japanese runabout money?"
http://ninemsn.carpoint.com.au/car-review/1942397.aspx


Look slike Carpoint is slowly adding their reviews as they only have Omega and SV6 at the moment

[SCiFiRE]

Im normally very skeptical abou initial reviews like this. normally the excitment is too way up there for them to bag any car they WANT to drive much.

The drive articles dont bode well for the V6 really, apparently it cant keep up with the weight (even the 195)... thats pretty bad news considering the V6 is what most people will be lookin at with fuel prices

[spikeyboy22]

Holden has opened up all pages on the commodore website

[kayman]

http://www.holden.com.au/www-holden/jsp/campaigns/vecommodore/newcommodoreframe.jsp

i take it you dont mean that one?

[Speedy Gonzales]

I got to sit in one and have a look up close at several today, it looks ok, doesnt really get me all that enthusiastic besides it being a new car. I nearly mistook it for a Magna and walked right past it.

16" steelies fitted with 225/60R16 Bstone ER300s, asymmetric tyre with treadwear rating over 300. All I can say GM, about farkin time a 16" steel was fitted to such a car, should have been intro years ago.

Inside looked cheap, but will wait and see when I get to drive one to comment on what the journos have being wanking themselves over.

[Fnomna]

http://www.holden.com.au/www-holden/jsp/campaigns/vecommodore/newcommodoreframe.jsp

i take it you dont mean that one?
All unlocked for me. Try a refresh. It should have to load the Flash again.

[kayman]

ahh mine seems to be cached. thanks for that

[JEM]

I got to sit in one and have a look up close at several today, it looks ok, doesnt really get me all that enthusiastic besides it being a new car. I nearly mistook it for a Magna and walked right past it.

16" steelies fitted with 225/60R16 Bstone ER300s, asymmetric tyre with treadwear rating over 300. All I can say GM, about farkin time a 16" steel was fitted to such a car, should have been intro years ago.

Inside looked cheap, but will wait and see when I get to drive one to comment on what the journos have being wanking themselves over.

MMM, waiting for any "one eyed" or "biased" comments from other members. Somehow i don't think you will attract many.

you are correct in what you say, i found the same thing. The plastics do have quite a cheap look/feel about them, and the flares are wrong. Otherwise an acceptable conservative new car.

The drive.com.au drive impressions are laughable though. They will definitely have sore wrists tonight. It's amazing the media have totally accepted the reasons for VE being so much heavier, yet Ford weren't so lucky when they released their car with the same body advancements. Media just don't get it.

[kayman]

MMM, waiting for any "one eyed" or "biased" comments from other members. Somehow i don't think you will attract many.

you are correct in what you say, i found the same thing. The plastics do have quite a cheap look/feel about them, and the flares are wrong. Otherwise an acceptable conservative new car.

The drive.com.au drive impressions are laughable though. They will definitely have sore wrists tonight. It's amazing the media have totally accepted the reasons for VE being so much heavier, yet Ford weren't so lucky when they released their car with the same body advancements. Media just don't get it.

The media havnt really accepted the heavier weight. The fact may remain that the better car to drive is the holden even though Ford was the first out with some of this technology.

The only real way to find out it to drive one of each ourselves and compare the back to back.

[BlueVZSS]

MMM, waiting for any "one eyed" or "biased" comments from other members. Somehow i don't think you will attract many.

Not true...I don't think Speedy has had a positive comment yet about the VE either. He was obviously looking at an Omega that most members won't be purchasing anyway.

Whilst I accept that journos are prone to waxing lyrical about new cars, the reviews from those that have driven it speak highly of it in a uniform voice.

Holden have been rather devious in what they have had to say about the weight issue. The strategy seems to be to say nothing and hope nobody notices. So far, so good but it is an issue and will eventually get atttention along with no DOD.

[Fnomna]

So do all of the CD systems read MP3s from CD (not via the AUX input jack iPod setup thingy)? ie Omega too, or is it just the premium stacker systems?
The SS-V does because in one of the shots you can see the display says:
Folder 02 Track 13
The Datsuns
Sittin' Pretty

[EfiJy]

MMM, waiting for any "one eyed" or "biased" comments from other members. Somehow i don't think you will attract many.

you are correct in what you say, i found the same thing. The plastics do have quite a cheap look/feel about them, and the flares are wrong. Otherwise an acceptable conservative new car.

The drive.com.au drive impressions are laughable though. They will definitely have sore wrists tonight. It's amazing the media have totally accepted the reasons for VE being so much heavier, yet Ford weren't so lucky when they released their car with the same body advancements. Media just don't get it.
its a mute point aint it? from all reports the ve is quite economical. the only way to rate ve would be to test it against bf. no good knit picking about weight, shape of the handbrake, flares wahtever. there are many things i dont like about the ford design either.

the exciting part will be reading the back to back tests but based on the reviews so far ve is a generation in front as ba was over vy :deal:

[phantomsv8s]

how did you clear the cache, I am still seeing only the old selections on the VE mini site

PLEASE PLEASE HELP ME

[CharlieDontSurf]

so i wonder if HFV6 got sacked. Have not heard anything from him/her for ages. Wouldnt have been hard to find him as not too many holden employees driving senator 300's, unless he lied about his ride?? what do you know about this VE06??? Anyone else get their wings clipped??

Toecutters everywhere!!

[kayman]

umm to clear the cache (i use firefox) i went into the options in the tools menu and cleared the cache folder.

It should be in internet options if you are using internet explorer!

[Rick76]

Inside looked cheap, but will wait and see when I get to drive one to comment on what the journos have being wanking themselves over.

I havent seen the VE yet so cant comment.... but just to get an idea where you are coming from with the interior criticism, what is the VVT-I 1ZZFE???? A Corolla???

If so, crappy interiors obviously didnt put you off on your last purchase. My GF drives a current gen Corolla and the interior is poxy. Rock HARD tinny plastics everywhere (dash, door trims, console, etc), carpet pulling out from door sills, seats that are uncomfortable for anything over 30mins at a time, heaps of road noise, etc.

I currently drive a VZ Exec which is nothing special but base model vs base model the Corolla is absolute crap. Thats not even getting into the features (or lack of in Corolla) or driving experience. IMO the provious gen povo Commo is way ahead of the Rolla as a place to spend your time behind the wheel. I'm not sure what the other current gen Toyota interiors are like but if the VE is worse than a Corolla, Holden is in trouble and have gone backwards.

[BadMac]

umm to clear the cache (i use firefox) i went into the options in the tools menu and cleared the cache folder.

It should be in internet options if you are using internet explorer!

In IE, Tools, Internet Options, middle of window is "delete cookies", then to its right "delete files". Delete Files will clear you cache. Don't click delete cookies, unless you want to have to log into everything again (although it does clear your tracks).

And back on topic.

The reviews are exactly what you would expect and do show at least indicate that the commodore is a good car. The comparo tests will be much more interesting, not only with BF, as I think VE now competes with A6, 5 series, Merc, etc, in fact you may see the Ford V Holden comparos drop off as BF gets left behind. Wasn't one of the comments Ford, the perenial bridesmade. And these are the people who a few months back were raving about BF and lambasting VZ. Now BF is fish and chip wrapper (ie old news).

[VE06]

so i wonder if HFV6 got sacked. Have not heard anything from him/her for ages. Wouldnt have been hard to find him as not too many holden employees driving senator 300's, unless he lied about his ride?? what do you know about this VE06??? Anyone else get their wings clipped??

Toecutters everywhere!!

DRIVE: "One of the sacked workers came from the Elizabeth assembly plant in South Australia, the other from a regional sales office"


I think if you read HFV6's location, it says Melbourne. As for me, I've still got my employment.

[Fnomna]

how did you clear the cache, I am still seeing only the old selections on the VE mini site

PLEASE PLEASE HELP ME
Open the page, then Hold SHIFT and click on the Reload icon.

[CLUB_819]

isn't it 'ctrl F5' to refresh from the server.

Cheers
Scotty

[BadMac]

DRIVE: "One of the sacked workers came from the Elizabeth assembly plant in South Australia, the other from a regional sales office"


I think if you read HFV6's location, it says Melbourne. As for me, I've still got my employment.

If you go back and read HFV6's comments, he mostly just "confirmed" what others said. He did drop little hints and fed the marketing campaign. He also got a few things wrong, ie the dashes, he gave us the clues but indicated the dash we now know as omega was the top of range statesman. It was probably delibrate to throw us off after Wheels/Motor published the photos (it worked).

Therefore it is more likely HFV6 was acting in a semi offical capacity (he may be in Holden Marketing), monitoring the info and pictures in the forum, confirming what was already confirmed elsewhere, occasionally doing damage control and redirection, whilst also ensuring that interest remained high as we built up to release.

Hopefully he gets back from his sabitical and gives us the run down in his own words soon!

[phantomsv8s]

still no luck have tried all the above suggestions

[Fnomna]

still no luck have tried all the above suggestions
Yeah it may be CTRL + reload on Internet Explorer (I use FF)

(We are talking about the same page aren't we? http://www.holden.com.au/www-holden/jsp/campaigns/vecommodore/newcommodoreframe.jsp )


Refresh/reload
Browsers don't always refresh/reload when you tell them too. Depending on the browser options you have selected, they often just ask the Web server if the page has changed. (I can't tell you how to predict when.) If the server replies "No" the browser does not refresh/reload -- it reuses the page it previously stored in cache on your hard drive. The page in cache could be incomplete or corrupted though.

To force your browser to refresh/reload the page:

* Mozilla of Firefox: Hold down the "Shift" key and click the "reload" button, or hold down the "Shift" key and hit the "F5" key.
* Internet Explorer: Hold down the "Ctrl" key (it's one of the keys in line with the space bar) and click the "refresh" button, or hold down the "Ctrl" key and hit the "F5 key". This only works for version 4.x and above.

[CLUB_819]

still no luck have tried all the above suggestions

try deleting your cookie's,

For IE Tools > Internet Options > delete Cookies.

Hope it works

[monaroCountry1]

so i wonder if HFV6 got sacked. Have not heard anything from him/her for ages. Wouldnt have been hard to find him as not too many holden employees driving senator 300's, unless he lied about his ride?? what do you know about this VE06??? Anyone else get their wings clipped??

Yes hope those two got out of all that mess without a scratch. They've been very helpful and have provided better +ve publicity to Holden than Holden's (so far) pathetic PR machine.

[CLUB_819]

Whoops, sorry 'Bad Mac' didn't read 7 posts earlier your cookie delete explanation.

:stupid:

Scotty

[Ghosn]

Note: comments below are only reflective of exterior bodywork.

Im still TRYING to like the SS but can't seem to click with it. Some angles it looks OK, other angles I just wonder and think "could have done much better". Calais on the other hand I think they got pretty much spot on.. Lines are so much smoother and everything just blends into each other. The SS I find is too lego'y. It's like different people worked on different parts and just stuck them together.

Flared guards are good but when u struggle to incorporate the front bumper with them smoothly, you are left with an unattractive and unfinished front. Also, in some front on shots of the SS you will see a skinny car with big guards.. I see the Calais V as a more complete car, inside and out.

Im just praying HSV can get the bodykit right. Hoping for a more rounder and smoother front(and blends into the guards better). Something that will have more presence and aggression on the road and have much more WOW factor in it.

[myles]

Drive have all the reviews up
http://www.drive.com.au/Editorial/ArticleIndex.aspx?categoryID=55



Very positive reviews. Particularly for the Omega.

"But Omega's newfound class shines through before you even leave the car park. I'm convinced a longer drive will only cement my conviction that this is – by far – the best base-model sedan Australia has ever produced. "

http://www.drive.com.au/Editorial/ArticleDetail.aspx?ArticleID=18919&vf=3

[kermatt]

Courtesy of Carpoint:

http://www.carpoint.com.au/car-review/1941594.aspx


"Words - Joe Kenwright

Holden will offer HSV-branded dress-up kits for the new VE. Does this signal the Lion's icon brand is about to be dragged back to the pack?


Can you imagine a VW Polo with an Audi Sports Pack? Or a BMW with a Rolls Royce luxury pack? Perhaps a Fairmont Ghia with a Jaguar Sports Pack? Strange as it seems, Holden has announced it will offer the base VE Omega with HSV branded and developed option packs.

To be marketed under the Holden Special Vehicles Individual (HSVi) badge, base-model Omega buyers will be able to opt for the choice of three special equipment packages -- HSVi Sports Pack, HSVi Performance Pack or HSVi Business Pack.

When previously the entry price for Holden's premium HSV brand was at the top end of its own range, these new HSV packs will appear for a relatively low premium above the VE's entry figure.

The packs are simple and superficial in their scope. In other words, there is no trace of special vehicle engineering or exclusivity. The HSVi branding and concept has no relationship with the heritage of special vehicle engineering of complete vehicles in the original HSV context.

Those enthusiasts who suggested the HSV-rebadging of complete Astra VXR imports as the thin end of the wedge may have been proven correct.

Holden's justification is that the previous HBD (Holden by Design) branding was neither strong nor logical enough. Even though HBD was a TWR sister company to HSV, both Holden and HSV previously went to enormous lengths to keep them separate.

Now, the HSV name is being used in much the same way as NASCO, Holden's icon early Holden accessory line.

Holden dubs the kits as "accessory packs". Walkinshaw Performance will also have a range of dress-up gear for the VE.

The HSVi Sports Pack features a body kit, spoiler and 19-inch alloys. The Performance Pack gets 20-inch alloys, colour-matched steering wheel and track stripes that resemble the rally panels on the original Monaros. The Business Pack gets 18-inch 'Challenge' alloy wheels, Bluetooth preparation and rear parking sensors.

Try to reconcile that lot with your limited edition $100K HSV GTO or Grange!

If there is one consolation, both Holden and HSV must be confident that the new HSV VE range will have the wings to lift it clear of Holden's new Super Cheap Auto approach to a special VE Commodore."

[Carby]

I got to sit in one and have a look up close at several today, it looks ok, doesnt really get me all that enthusiastic besides it being a new car. I nearly mistook it for a Magna and walked right past it.

16" steelies fitted with 225/60R16 Bstone ER300s, asymmetric tyre with treadwear rating over 300. All I can say GM, about farkin time a 16" steel was fitted to such a car, should have been intro years ago.

Inside looked cheap, but will wait and see when I get to drive one to comment on what the journos have being wanking themselves over.


I think you are selling short those Journo's. You have to remember they get to drive all new cars and that is the best way of drawing comparisons with vehicles in the same class.

They also get paid for what they do and quite frankly in most cases (there are a couple of losers who write for the Telegraph motoring section that I have NO respect for) I would value their opinion more than the average person who posts on these type of forums. These forums have there place as they are great in passing comment on ownership issues and real world situations, where they suffer is when it comes to comparisons - not many try all the vehicles available as would a motoring Journo!!:wave:

[Stevotski]

one thing that is dissapointing is the front pews in the SV6 look flat as, and seem to have lost passenger lumbar adjustment. They have lost the side bolsters of the VZ and VY equivalents.

I think they will lose sales to the SS at only $5k (man) or $6K (auto) more if equipment level differences like this are throughout the car

http://images.cainer.net//uploads/VE_SV6.jpg http://images.cainer.net//uploads/VZ_SV6.jpg


thanks cainer.net for image hosting

[Fnomna]

edit: sorry, replied before reading the HSV thread - delete

[hutchzvu8]

wonder how long it will take for the ve ute to come out

[shane W Z]

i believe the ute comes out next year wagon year after possibly

[kayman]

thats right, ute late 2007 wagon early 2008

[kayman]

Courtesy of Carpoint:

http://www.carpoint.com.au/car-review/1941594.aspx


"Words - Joe Kenwright

Holden will offer HSV-branded dress-up kits for the new VE. Does this signal the Lion's icon brand is about to be dragged back to the pack?


Can you imagine a VW Polo with an Audi Sports Pack? Or a BMW with a Rolls Royce luxury pack? Perhaps a Fairmont Ghia with a Jaguar Sports Pack? Strange as it seems, Holden has announced it will offer the base VE Omega with HSV branded and developed option packs.

To be marketed under the Holden Special Vehicles Individual (HSVi) badge, base-model Omega buyers will be able to opt for the choice of three special equipment packages -- HSVi Sports Pack, HSVi Performance Pack or HSVi Business Pack.

When previously the entry price for Holden's premium HSV brand was at the top end of its own range, these new HSV packs will appear for a relatively low premium above the VE's entry figure.

The packs are simple and superficial in their scope. In other words, there is no trace of special vehicle engineering or exclusivity. The HSVi branding and concept has no relationship with the heritage of special vehicle engineering of complete vehicles in the original HSV context.

Those enthusiasts who suggested the HSV-rebadging of complete Astra VXR imports as the thin end of the wedge may have been proven correct.

Holden's justification is that the previous HBD (Holden by Design) branding was neither strong nor logical enough. Even though HBD was a TWR sister company to HSV, both Holden and HSV previously went to enormous lengths to keep them separate.

Now, the HSV name is being used in much the same way as NASCO, Holden's icon early Holden accessory line.

Holden dubs the kits as "accessory packs". Walkinshaw Performance will also have a range of dress-up gear for the VE.

The HSVi Sports Pack features a body kit, spoiler and 19-inch alloys. The Performance Pack gets 20-inch alloys, colour-matched steering wheel and track stripes that resemble the rally panels on the original Monaros. The Business Pack gets 18-inch 'Challenge' alloy wheels, Bluetooth preparation and rear parking sensors.

Try to reconcile that lot with your limited edition $100K HSV GTO or Grange!

If there is one consolation, both Holden and HSV must be confident that the new HSV VE range will have the wings to lift it clear of Holden's new Super Cheap Auto approach to a special VE Commodore."


Thats FAR off the mark, what a crap article. BMW and its M sports options? and Mercedes with its AMG options? This is the exactly the same. I really dont see whats so bad about it because they will not look anything like the HSV product anyways.

[SSV8pilot]

Not sure if others are under the same misconception as I was until today.

Upsizing to the full size spare - gets you the full size tyre but a steel wheel not a matching alloy.

I may have just misunderstood - I thought you got the equivalent road wheel.

This means spare wheel road rotation aint really on.

[NODDY347]

Note: comments below are only reflective of exterior bodywork.

Im still TRYING to like the SS but can't seem to click with it. Some angles it looks OK, other angles I just wonder and think "could have done much better". Calais on the other hand I think they got pretty much spot on.. Lines are so much smoother and everything just blends into each other. The SS I find is too lego'y. It's like different people worked on different parts and just stuck them together.

Flared guards are good but when u struggle to incorporate the front bumper with them smoothly, you are left with an unattractive and unfinished front. Also, in some front on shots of the SS you will see a skinny car with big guards.. I see the Calais V as a more complete car, inside and out.

Im just praying HSV can get the bodykit right. Hoping for a more rounder and smoother front(and blends into the guards better). Something that will have more presence and aggression on the road and have much more WOW factor in it.

I tend to agree with most of your points and i too hope HSV make this car a little more cohesive, saying that it really is just the front bar/spoiler that doesn't gel. From some angles it looks like an aftermarket unit, other than that i think Holden have produced a very good car.

[PaulST]

one thing that is dissapointing is the front pews in the SV6 look flat as, and seem to have lost passenger lumbar adjustment. They have lost the side bolsters of the VZ and VY equivalents.

I think they will lose sales to the SS at only $5k (man) or $6K (auto) more if equipment level differences like this are throughout the car

http://images.cainer.net//uploads/VE_SV6.jpg http://images.cainer.net//uploads/VZ_SV6.jpg


thanks cainer.net for image hosting
Remember that most SV6s are purchased by fleets who won’t care about how close it is to the SS or how flat the seats are.

[barrycarr]

Not sure if others are under the same misconception as I was until today.

Upsizing to the full size spare - gets you the full size tyre but a steel wheel not a matching alloy.

I may have just misunderstood - I thought you got the equivalent road wheel.

This means spare wheel road rotation aint really on.

yes SSV8pilot i found this out when i ordered my SSV, initially i thought $250 was nothing to pay for upgrading the spare to a 19" rim and low profile tyre which i could use in rotation as i have done with my VX. on closer inspection my dealer then realised it was only a steel wheel and standard tyre so it was not worth the money. fingers crossed i dont get a flat 100km away from a tyre shop carrying rubber in 19's!!

[SCiFiRE]

well got my motor today. Most of the comments were good, but still a pretty neutral review

[Stevotski]

Remember that most SV6s are purchased by fleets who won’t care about how close it is to the SS or how flat the seats are.

I am a user-chooser fleet customer and it matters a lot to me :) NSW Govt policy now restricts all cars purchased through the state purchasing contract to 6 cyl - (except cops etc) so it is important to a lot of fleets

Thats why XR6T is so popular for 'user chooser' fleet cars in NSW

Fleets biggest concerns are residual values - and that is determined by how much the general public like the car - so they arent going to buy cars that have less appeal than their counterparts. Although in this case VE appeal >>>>>> the seat thing - but still

[VE06]

well got my motor today. Most of the comments were good, but still a pretty neutral review

can you elaborate on the "still a pretty neutral review" scifire?

[vyssbeast]

dont know if anyone would be interested but i recieved an email titled
"Here are 11 key things which you should know about VE Commodore and BF Falcon"
basically (ford comes out infront, but that was clearly the intention of this article)
first paragraph starts with
"The anticipated wait is over and the news is out - VE Commodore is here and frankly, we don't know what all the fuss is about. GM-Holden have gone to great lengths in their effort to catch up to the amazing BF Falcon, but take a closer look at the specifications and you will soon agree that there really is no comparison."

if anyone wants the whole thing ill post it up

cheers

[rs2000]

I am a user-chooser fleet customer and it matters a lot to me :) NSW Govt policy now restricts all cars purchased through the state purchasing contract to 6 cyl - (except cops etc) so it is important to a lot of fleets

Thats why XR6T is so popular for 'user chooser' fleet cars in NSW

Fleets biggest concerns are residual values - and that is determined by how much the general public like the car - so they arent going to buy cars that have less appeal than their counterparts. Although in this case VE appeal >>>>>> the seat thing - but still
i found this on another forum discussing fleet price :

The annual lease prices for the VE Commodore range were released today within our company...

I was expecting VE prices to be slightly higher than the Ford range, but have to admit that I am quietly surprised at how uncompetative the prices have turned out to be.

To give you a comparison:
Falcon XT to Commodore Omega - Omega is aprox. $4500 more expensive /year to lease.
Falcon XR6 to Commodore SV6 - SV6 is aprox. $3000 more expensive /year to lease.
Fairmont Ghia to Calais V - Calais is aprox. $4000 more expensive /year to lease.

It's clear to me that when we replace our business unit's existing pool vehicles, we'll be choosing Fords. It's a no-brainer given the price differences.

From a private perspective, for staff who will be choosing to salary sacrifice a vehicle; I'm struggling to understand how these prices put the Holden range even within the ballpark. I can foresee only die-hard Holden fans ordering from the Holden range. Why else would you fork out an extra $4500/annum just to have a Commodore?
It just doesn't make sense.

[SCiFiRE]

well, i wont go through the entire review. They like the seats in the SS, the 6sp auto is good but not as good as the fords, the throttle response is improved alot, the steering feel has improved alot, they dont like the red guages or handbrake lever or oil/voltage guages, .... They seem to be sticking to comments like "Shifts themselves are smooth enough", and seem to be trying to be not-overly positive but not negative.

but maybe its just me,

They do seem however very impressed with the times in the damp,
Auto: 0-100km/hr 5.69secs, 0-400m 13.9 @ 167.7km/hr
Manu: 0-100km/hr 5.35, 0-400m 13.63 @ 170.7km/hr

and this was in an SS-V, and if the SS is that little bit lighter, like the SV8 that came before it, we may get faster times from it too.

[Black_Utester]

i found this on another forum discussing fleet price :

The annual lease prices for the VE Commodore range were released today within our company...

I was expecting VE prices to be slightly higher than the Ford range, but have to admit that I am quietly surprised at how uncompetative the prices have turned out to be.

To give you a comparison:
Falcon XT to Commodore Omega - Omega is aprox. $4500 more expensive /year to lease.
Falcon XR6 to Commodore SV6 - SV6 is aprox. $3000 more expensive /year to lease.
Fairmont Ghia to Calais V - Calais is aprox. $4000 more expensive /year to lease.

It's clear to me that when we replace our business unit's existing pool vehicles, we'll be choosing Fords. It's a no-brainer given the price differences.

From a private perspective, for staff who will be choosing to salary sacrifice a vehicle; I'm struggling to understand how these prices put the Holden range even within the ballpark. I can foresee only die-hard Holden fans ordering from the Holden range. Why else would you fork out an extra $4500/annum just to have a Commodore?
It just doesn't make sense.

Ever thought for a moment why the Fords are cheaper now since the release of the VE? That is, if your comparison is relating to the VE.

Of the Fords would be cheaper as they are a older model compared to the VE.

[VE06]

dont know if anyone would be interested but i recieved an email titled
"Here are 11 key things which you should know about VE Commodore and BF Falcon"
basically (ford comes out infront, but that was clearly the intention of this article)
first paragraph starts with
"The anticipated wait is over and the news is out - VE Commodore is here and frankly, we don't know what all the fuss is about. GM-Holden have gone to great lengths in their effort to catch up to the amazing BF Falcon, but take a closer look at the specifications and you will soon agree that there really is no comparison."

if anyone wants the whole thing ill post it up

cheers

yeh post it for a laugh.

[Danv8]

yeh post it for a laugh.


Here ya go

The anticipated wait is over and the news is out - VE Commodore is here and frankly, we don't know what all the fuss is about. GM-Holden have gone to great lengths in their effort to catch up to the amazing BF Falcon, but take a closer look at the specifications and you will soon agree that there really is no comparison.

Here are 11 key things which you should know about VE Commodore and BF Falcon.

1. VE Commodore will not perform as well as the BF Falcon

· VE Commodore Omega -

Power = 180kW@6000rpm (ECE)

Torque = 330Nm@2600rpm (ECE) 1

· BF Falcon XT has greater power and torque –

Power = 190kW@5250rpm (DIN)

Torque = 383Nm@2500rpm (DIN)

· Furthermore, Falcon XT achieves 330Nm of torque at just 1500rpm, which ultimately means greater responsiveness and performance!

2. VE Commodore's Alloytec engine is not as technologically advanced as Falcon's Barra 190

The Alloytec V6 engine misses out on continuously variable camshaft timing for exhaust cams2
This is a feature unique to the High Output Alloytec engine but is found on all Barra 190 and 245 engines and well as the E-Gas engine.


3. VE Commodore does not offer 6-speed automatic transmission on any 6 cylinder models

German ZF 6-speed automatic transmission is available on XR6, XR6 Turbo and Fairmont Ghia
Falcon XR6 Turbo and XR8 Utes also feature this amazing optional transmission, something the GM-Holden VZ 'S', 'SS' or even HSV Utes can't match
6-speed automatic transmission results in a smoother drive and greater fuel economy.


4. VE Commodore is larger and heavier than its predecessor. Fuel consumption ranges from 10.9L/100km to 14.4L/100km

BF Falcon can achieve fuel consumption as low as 10.2L/100km on the Barra 190 engine with 6-speed automatic transmission.
Omega (4-speed automatic) = 10.9L XT (4-speed automatic) = 10.9L
SV6 (5-speed automatic) = 11.3L XR6 (6-speed automatic) = 10.2L
Calais V6 (5-speed automatic) = 11.3L Fairmont Ghia (6-speed automatic) = 10.2L
SS V8 (6-speed automatic) = 14.3L XR8 (6-speed automatic) = 13.7L


5. VE Commodore does not currently offer a dedicated LPG or dual fuel LPG option

The BF Falcon boasts an optional E-Gas engine, which has been specifically designed to run on LPG. The result is fuel savings of up to 43% when compared with petrol when travelling over the same distance5
GM-Holden do not offer LPG as an option on any of their VZ Ute models while the BF Falcon Ute range offers it as an option on XL, XLS, RTV and even XR6 Utes with no loss of load space!

6. Air conditioning is a $2,000 optional extra on the VE Commodore Omega

Air conditioning comes standard on the BF Falcon XT.

7. VE Commodore comes standard with a space saver spare wheel across the range

· A full size spare option is $100 on Omega and $250 on all other models

1 BF Falcon comes with a full size spare wheel standard across the range including wagon and Ute (excluding E-Gas).

8. VE Commodore's improved luggage capacity comes as a result of a space saver spare wheel. Even then, Falcon still has more luggage capacity

· BF Falcon has a luggage capacity of 504L with a full size spare wheel compared to VE Commodore at 496L7.

9. The cost of replacing original tyres has increased on VE Commodore

A set of four new tyres on the current Commodore Executive costs approximately $500 RRP. A set of four new tyres on the VE Commodore Omega costs $928 RRP (or $232 RRP each). This represents an 85% price increase
In comparison, a set of four replacement tyres on the BF Falcon XT, Futura or Fairmont costs just $569.52 RRP (or $142.38 RRP each)
VE Commodore SS-V 19" tyres RRP = 3,789 for a set of four (or $947.40 RRP each)
VE Commodore optional 20" tyres RRP = $4,316 for a set of four (or $1,079 RRP each)


10. VE Commodore's rear seating has a centre section fold-down only

· BF Falcon on the other hand offers a versatile 60/40 split fold-down rear seat back.

11. There is no VE wagon or Ute until late 2007

· The Falcon sedan, wagon and Ute range all feature the same front end sheet metal whereas GM-Holden's wagon and Ute models will remain in VZ guise for another 12 months

1 Furthermore, GM-Holden Ute no longer offers a Chassis Cab (i.e. One Tonner) while Falcon Ute offers a full range of XL, XLS and RTV Chassis Cabs

2 Wagon and Ute represent approximately 40% of total Commodore sales10.



References:

1 Holden Australia, "Holden VE Commodore: Fuel Economy Figures New", GM Media Online, (http://media.gm.com:8221/aus/holden/en/), July 24, 2006.

2 VE Commodore Specification Sheet, July 2006.

3 Holden Australia, "New Six-Speed Automatic Transmission for V8 Commodores", GM Media Online (http://media.gm.com:8221/aus/holden/en/), July 25, 2006.

4 Holden Australia, "All-New Holden Commodore Unveiled to the World", GM Media Online (http://media.gm.com:8221/aus/holden/en/), July 15, 2006.

5 Calculated using ADR 81/01 fuel consumption figures of 15.9L/100km (E-Gas) and 10.9L/100km (petrol) and average Sydney and Melbourne capital city fuel costs of LPG (49.91c) and unleaded petrol (129.68c), April 1 to April 30, 2006. Source: Informed Sources Pty Ltd. The actual fuel consumption you achieve will depend, however, on many factors including your driving habits, the prevailing conditions and your vehicle's equipment, condition and use. Figures based on sedan vehicle.

6 Holden Australia, "Holden Releases Pricing For 2006 Commodore, WM Statesman and Caprice", GM Media Online (http://media.gm.com:8221/aus/holden/en/), July 18, 2006.

7 McDonald, N, "Freeze Frame", GoAuto E-News, No. 345, July 19, 2006.

8 Dowling, J & Hudson, J, "VE News: Commodore's $3,500 tyre change", the Sydney Morning Herald, July 21, 2006.

9 Martin, T, "Billion Dollar Car", GoAuto E-News, No. 345, July 19, 2006.

10 VFACTS, June 2006.

[VLturbo3.0]

Not sure if others are under the same misconception as I was until today.

Upsizing to the full size spare - gets you the full size tyre but a steel wheel not a matching alloy.

I may have just misunderstood - I thought you got the equivalent road wheel.

This means spare wheel road rotation aint really on.

On the Holden website when you "build" an SSV, one of the options is "Full size spare alloy wheel & tyre, $250...

[csv rulz]

what a lot of s**t, until they are compared back to back than you cant determine anything. Look at ls2 old technology compared to fords V8 but fords V8 sucks compared to ls2.

Looking at those peformance figures i think ford have just been blown ot of the water. There unreal considering the extra weight the car has. i would not be suprised if HSV have consistant 0-100 in the high 4 seconds.

Not one Ford or FPV can match those times laid down by SSV

[Controltech]

I have ordered an SSV and was told there is no fleet discounts available on the VE apart from the Omega. This apparently is to try and improve the resale value of the VE in the future.

[csv rulz]

I have ordered an SSV and was told there is no fleet discounts available on the VE apart from the Omega. This apparently is to try and improve the resale value of the VE in the future.

I thought in series 2 of this thread it was proven that fleet discounts were available on an all permenant models just not on temporary models. (eg: lumina, equipe)

[jaykay]

I have ordered an SSV and was told there is no fleet discounts available on the VE apart from the Omega. This apparently is to try and improve the resale value of the VE in the future.
Fleet discounts do apply, just check with your dealer as to how much you can get.....

[Merlin]

Not one Ford or FPV can match those times laid down by SSV

Typhoons run high 12's at the strip don't they?

[csv rulz]

Typhoons run high 12's at the strip don't they?

As far as i new which is only what iv read in mags is the typhoon is no quicker than GT in the quarter.

[jaykay]

As far as i new which is only what iv read in mags is the typhoon is no quicker than GT in the quarter.
Read this post about the F6 Typhoon's 1/4 mile times..

http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showpost.php?p=675785&postcount=20

[SSV8pilot]

On the Holden website when you "build" an SSV, one of the options is "Full size spare alloy wheel & tyre, $250...


Good pick up - brocheur just states full size spare.

Someones gonna get the botty kicked methinks

[lowriding]

[SIZE="2"]Here ya go

The anticipated wait is over and the news is out - VE Commodore is here and frankly, we don't know what all the fuss is about. GM-Holden have gone to great lengths in their effort to catch up to the amazing BF Falcon, but take a closer look at the specifications and you will soon agree that there really is no comparison.

Here are 11 key things which you should know about VE Commodore and BF Falcon.

1. VE Commodore will not perform as well as the BF Falcon

· VE Commodore Omega -

Power = 180kW@6000rpm (ECE)

Torque = 330Nm@2600rpm (ECE) 1

· BF Falcon XT has greater power and torque –

Power = 190kW@5250rpm (DIN)

Torque = 383Nm@2500rpm (DIN)

· Furthermore, Falcon XT achieves 330Nm of torque at just 1500rpm, which ultimately means greater responsiveness and performance!

2. VE Commodore's Alloytec engine is not as technologically advanced as Falcon's Barra 190

The Alloytec V6 engine misses out on continuously variable camshaft timing for exhaust cams2
This is a feature unique to the High Output Alloytec engine but is found on all Barra 190 and 245 engines and well as the E-Gas engine.


3. VE Commodore does not offer 6-speed automatic transmission on any 6 cylinder models

German ZF 6-speed automatic transmission is available on XR6, XR6 Turbo and Fairmont Ghia
Falcon XR6 Turbo and XR8 Utes also feature this amazing optional transmission, something the GM-Holden VZ 'S', 'SS' or even HSV Utes can't match
6-speed automatic transmission results in a smoother drive and greater fuel economy.


4. VE Commodore is larger and heavier than its predecessor. Fuel consumption ranges from 10.9L/100km to 14.4L/100km

BF Falcon can achieve fuel consumption as low as 10.2L/100km on the Barra 190 engine with 6-speed automatic transmission.
Omega (4-speed automatic) = 10.9L XT (4-speed automatic) = 10.9L
SV6 (5-speed automatic) = 11.3L XR6 (6-speed automatic) = 10.2L
Calais V6 (5-speed automatic) = 11.3L Fairmont Ghia (6-speed automatic) = 10.2L
SS V8 (6-speed automatic) = 14.3L XR8 (6-speed automatic) = 13.7L


5. VE Commodore does not currently offer a dedicated LPG or dual fuel LPG option

The BF Falcon boasts an optional E-Gas engine, which has been specifically designed to run on LPG. The result is fuel savings of up to 43% when compared with petrol when travelling over the same distance5
GM-Holden do not offer LPG as an option on any of their VZ Ute models while the BF Falcon Ute range offers it as an option on XL, XLS, RTV and even XR6 Utes with no loss of load space!

6. Air conditioning is a $2,000 optional extra on the VE Commodore Omega

Air conditioning comes standard on the BF Falcon XT.

7. VE Commodore comes standard with a space saver spare wheel across the range

· A full size spare option is $100 on Omega and $250 on all other models

1 BF Falcon comes with a full size spare wheel standard across the range including wagon and Ute (excluding E-Gas).

8. VE Commodore's improved luggage capacity comes as a result of a space saver spare wheel. Even then, Falcon still has more luggage capacity

· BF Falcon has a luggage capacity of 504L with a full size spare wheel compared to VE Commodore at 496L7.

9. The cost of replacing original tyres has increased on VE Commodore

A set of four new tyres on the current Commodore Executive costs approximately $500 RRP. A set of four new tyres on the VE Commodore Omega costs $928 RRP (or $232 RRP each). This represents an 85% price increase
In comparison, a set of four replacement tyres on the BF Falcon XT, Futura or Fairmont costs just $569.52 RRP (or $142.38 RRP each)
VE Commodore SS-V 19" tyres RRP = 3,789 for a set of four (or $947.40 RRP each)
VE Commodore optional 20" tyres RRP = $4,316 for a set of four (or $1,079 RRP each)


10. VE Commodore's rear seating has a centre section fold-down only

· BF Falcon on the other hand offers a versatile 60/40 split fold-down rear seat back.

11. There is no VE wagon or Ute until late 2007

· The Falcon sedan, wagon and Ute range all feature the same front end sheet metal whereas GM-Holden's wagon and Ute models will remain in VZ guise for another 12 months

1 Furthermore, GM-Holden Ute no longer offers a Chassis Cab (i.e. One Tonner) while Falcon Ute offers a full range of XL, XLS and RTV Chassis Cabs

2 Wagon and Ute represent approximately 40% of total Commodore sales10.



References:

1 Holden Australia, "Holden VE Commodore: Fuel Economy Figures New", GM Media Online, (http://media.gm.com:8221/aus/holden/en/), July 24, 2006.

2 VE Commodore Specification Sheet, July 2006.

3 Holden Australia, "New Six-Speed Automatic Transmission for V8 Commodores", GM Media Online (http://media.gm.com:8221/aus/holden/en/), July 25, 2006.

4 Holden Australia, "All-New Holden Commodore Unveiled to the World", GM Media Online (http://media.gm.com:8221/aus/holden/en/), July 15, 2006.

5 Calculated using ADR 81/01 fuel consumption figures of 15.9L/100km (E-Gas) and 10.9L/100km (petrol) and average Sydney and Melbourne capital city fuel costs of LPG (49.91c) and unleaded petrol (129.68c), April 1 to April 30, 2006. Source: Informed Sources Pty Ltd. The actual fuel consumption you achieve will depend, however, on many factors including your driving habits, the prevailing conditions and your vehicle's equipment, condition and use. Figures based on sedan vehicle.

6 Holden Australia, "Holden Releases Pricing For 2006 Commodore, WM Statesman and Caprice", GM Media Online (http://media.gm.com:8221/aus/holden/en/), July 18, 2006.

7 McDonald, N, "Freeze Frame", GoAuto E-News, No. 345, July 19, 2006.

8 Dowling, J & Hudson, J, "VE News: Commodore's $3,500 tyre change", the Sydney Morning Herald, July 21, 2006.

9 Martin, T, "Billion Dollar Car", GoAuto E-News, No. 345, July 19, 2006.

10 VFACTS, June 2006.

sad thing is this email originated from Ford Australia (PR/marketing ??) , i'm led to beleive . Obviously Ford would be shitting themselves at this point from a sales point of view, but still if true how very sad to resort to that .:teach:

[VE06]

Typhoons run high 12's at the strip don't they?

Doubt that. Purely for straight line pace, its slower than the LS2 first of all (VZ HSV's are consistently quicker then their ford counterparts in this respect), but for it to get even a 12.9, the Typhoon would have to be pulling, say, 4.8-5.0 secs for the 0-100kmh - it hasnt gone near that from what ive seen.

[VE06]

sad thing is this email originated from Ford Australia (PR/marketing ??) , i'm led to believe. Obviously Ford would be shitting themselves at this point from a sales point of view, but still if true how very sad to resort to that .:teach:

Ford SPAM what else :limpy: They're getting kinda desparate methinks

[Vulture]

Mmm, spot the mistake on this page from the Holden website.

http://static.flickr.com/72/205574887_6c1e7cbf74_o.jpg

[VE06]

Mmm, spot the mistake on this page from the Holden website.

http://static.flickr.com/72/205574887_6c1e7cbf74_o.jpg

lol V8 4-speed auto. Back to the dark ages.

[Ghia351]

yes SSV8pilot i found this out when i ordered my SSV, initially i thought $250 was nothing to pay for upgrading the spare to a 19" rim and low profile tyre which i could use in rotation as i have done with my VX. on closer inspection my dealer then realised it was only a steel wheel and standard tyre so it was not worth the money. fingers crossed i dont get a flat 100km away from a tyre shop carrying rubber in 19's!!
As a matter of interest can you get a steel rim in 19"?

[Ghosn]

Ford SPAM what else :limpy: They're getting kinda desparate methinks

I bet at the end of the email it says "Forward this to 10 or more of your friends and we will give you a free car".

[Mightyrollaman]

Does anyone know details of the launch shindigs being held at dealerships?

The public launch is the 14th, so I'm assuming there might be VIP evenings on Sunday the 13th.

Does anyone know if this is the case? If this has been mentioned before, please laugh at me, but also let me know.

[Venom XR]

Had a read of the Drive reviews. It appears the Falcon still have the power train advantage with respect to the 6-cyl engine + 6-speed auto combination, but Holden has done a good job in other areas on the Omega/Berlina making the cars fairly line ball depending on your tastes. However, the SS V came up trumps, pretty much 'owning' the XR8. Interesting reads.

This was posted in FF already, some of you might have read it. It's an interesting reflection on what one company boss says, and what a new boss needs to depend - bit like Crennan taking a swipe at FPV for doing a turbo 6, only to release a hot hatch...



(smh.com.au, 10/12/2003 by Toby Hagon)

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2002...9379788523.html

just a snip:

Holden boss wants Ford's gas guzzler outlawed
By Toby Hagon
December 10 2002

"Holden took a swipe at arch-rival Ford yesterday as it called for the Federal Government to force the development of more environmentally friendly cars.

The nation's biggest car maker said that any increase in fuel consumption - such as the minor one recently initiated by Ford with its heavily revised Falcon - was "inexcusable".

Speaking yesterday at a lunch to outline the company's busiest year of new product releases in its 54-year history, Holden's chairman and managing director, Peter Hanenberger, said the increasing demands of export markets should encourage Australian car manufacturers to improve efficiency.

"One thing that has concerned me about the fuel economy debate in this country has been the line that 'It's only a few extra dollars a week'," said Mr Hanenberger. "We are talking about a finite resource and deteriorating fuel economy performance is inexcusable.

"It becomes harder to protect Australia's environmental quality if some car makers take a 'few extra dollars a week' approach.

Holden has set its own internal goals for 2010 ahead of an imminent government move to impose strict economy guidelines, similar to those enforced upon United States car makers in the form of the CAFE (Corporate Average Fuel Economy) regulations.

"The industry has proposed to the Federal Government that a national fuel consumption average of 6.8 litres per 100 kilometres could be achieved by 2010 if the right environment is in place," Mr Hanenberger said.

However, critics believe that Holden is clutching on to one of a handful of advantages its latest Commodore has over the vastly improved Ford Falcon. The BA Falcon has been widely praised as having made a huge leap forward to the point where it is now the benchmark in the fiercely-contested large car class.

But Holden still holds on to a fuel economy advantage at a time when the new Falcon uses more fuel than its predecessor due to a significantly heavier body. Ford's general manager of communications, Louise Teesdale, said the added weight in the Falcon was unfortunate, but necessary.

"We would have preferred not to inherit a small disadvantage in fuel economy, but that was partially a pay-off for the expensive additional safety equipment that was incorporated into this car," Ms Teesdale said.

other stuff about the design centre...


Don't believe Tom Gorman will call to have the VE outlawed, but perhaps the new Mitsu boss might have a go. :)

[AusCalais]

Ford SPAM what else :limpy: They're getting kinda desparate methinks

It's a bit like Custer's last stand....and guess who's Custer.

Obviously the wheels are falling off at Ford ....but I expect Ford spam puts a smile on their worker's faces as management try to shore up sagging morale....there will be little else for quite a while.

[Speedy Gonzales]

I havent seen the VE yet so cant comment.... but just to get an idea where you are coming from with the interior criticism, what is the VVT-I 1ZZFE???? A Corolla???



I have a car to suit any occasion, the car you mention was not purchased based on style, or with intention to run low 1/4 times or break track records with blistering lateral speed and grip, but it does get the job done when it comes to gridlock, running costs, parking and reliability.

Toyo quality and efficiency shits all over what GM has to offer, though GM does have the size, power and style advantage.

So what was your point? Youre comparing a 19K cheapo runabout to a $35K car thats supposed to be a E Class, 5 Series and A6 level of standard, whats the punchline?

[jaykay]

Does anyone know details of the launch shindigs being held at dealerships?

The public launch is the 14th, so I'm assuming there might be VIP evenings on Sunday the 13th.

Does anyone know if this is the case? If this has been mentioned before, please laugh at me, but also let me know.
My invite to the dealer launch of the VE to client's is on Wednesday 16th of August....

[jaykay]

Check out the V8 Supercar drivers putting SSV through it's paces and telling us what they think. The V8 definitely has a nice note inside the cab now ...

Click on -

http://www.holden.com.au/www-holden/jsp/campaigns/vecommodore/newcommodoreframe.jsp

Then -

Skip Intro

Go to Driving Passion

Click on Watch the Supercar Drivers video...awesome footage.... :nos:

[VZSS250]

The V8 Supercar drivers video is the biggest load of crap ever..."like a race car on the road"? What are they going on about....!!!!

Peter Brock gives the game away when he notes "a touch of understeer" coming into the corner. The only honest comment.

[HSVMAN]

yes SSV8pilot i found this out when i ordered my SSV, initially i thought $250 was nothing to pay for upgrading the spare to a 19" rim and low profile tyre which i could use in rotation as i have done with my VX. on closer inspection my dealer then realised it was only a steel wheel and standard tyre so it was not worth the money. fingers crossed i dont get a flat 100km away from a tyre shop carrying rubber in 19's!!

What you need to remember is if you have high performance directional tyres on your car, there is no need for a full size spare. In fact its a complete waste of time as you cannot have a directional tyre on the spare to match. Otherwise you could only use it on one side :doh:
The idea of the space saver or steel spare is to only get you to where you can repair your flat and refit the correct wheel as quickly as possible. Sure it doesnt look right, but if it did people wouldnt hurry to change it and risk driving with an unmatched full sized wheel :eek:
That is why you should never see a high performance car with full size matching spare :)

[SV805]

What you need to remember is if you have high performance directional tyres on your car, there is no need for a full size spare. In fact its a complete waste of time as you cannot have a directional tyre on the spare to match. Otherwise you could only use it on one side :doh:
The idea of the space saver or steel spare is to only get you to where you can repair your flat and refit the correct wheel as quickly as possible. Sure it doesnt look right, but if it did people wouldnt hurry to change it and risk driving with an unmatched full sized wheel :eek:
That is why you should never see a high performance car with full size matching spare :)

Completely agree with HSVMAN. Alot is being made of this full sized spare issue. What is the drama, 90% of people would not have had to use their spare for years and if they had it would have been straight to the tyre fitter for repair.....Yes a few people will want the full sized spare hence you have an option....If you want one you can have one otherwise you don't.....No problem.....Also agree with the directional tyre issue....If you go to a full size spare it would need to suit any tyre.....REally how many people here have actual in the last 12 mths had to use their spare and couldn't have it repaired with in the day ?????

[Maccas]

just read in cars guide from the herald sun that the ss and ss-v can do 0-100km/h in 5.4secs, thats quicker than any fpv v8 and the typhoon in only 0.1 of a sec quicker, now to see the hsv line up mmmmmmmmmmm:drool:

cheers maccas

[SSV8pilot]

Completely agree with HSVMAN. Alot is being made of this full sized spare issue. What is the drama,

Don't want to over cook this one and agree much has been said.

Part of the attraction of upgrading to a full size alloy for $250 - was quite simply - in 25000Klms time when all four shoes need replacing - that's a fair bit cheaper at least by buying one at that price than buying a genuine Bridgestone replacement tyre at approx $700- $900 per wheel (guesstimated).

And yes I know - you don't have to go Bridgestones again.

[HSVMAN]

Don't want to over cook this one and agree much has been said.

Part of the attraction of upgrading to a full size alloy for $250 - was quite simply - in 25000Klms time when all four shoes need replacing - that's a fair bit cheaper at least by buying one at that price than buying a genuine Bridgestone replacement tyre at approx $700- $900 per wheel (guesstimated).

And yes I know - you don't have to go Bridgestones again.

But the spare cannot be directional. Therefore the full size spare option on cars with performance/directional tyres is ONLY for looks - nothing else. You should not use a directional tyre as a spare full stop, period, end of story, thanks :)

[Controltech]

All VYSS Series 1 had a full size (alloy) wheel and directional tyre as spare.

[rs2000]

Don't want to over cook this one and agree much has been said.

Part of the attraction of upgrading to a full size alloy for $250 - was quite simply - in 25000Klms time when all four shoes need replacing - that's a fair bit cheaper at least by buying one at that price than buying a genuine Bridgestone replacement tyre at approx $700- $900 per wheel (guesstimated).

And yes I know - you don't have to go Bridgestones again.
your not getting an equivalent alloy for $250 your getting a steel wheel only.

[Dacious]

Are you sure? When you build/price a car the option listed is 'full size spare alloy wheel and tyre'. Same for all cars with alloy wheels - Berlina/Calais/SS

[rs2000]

Are you sure? When you build/price a car the option listed is 'full size spare alloy wheel and tyre'. Same for all cars with alloy wheels - Berlina/Calais/SS
someone else mentioned it in another ve related thread.

[VE06]

I bet at the end of the email it says "Forward this to 10 or more of your friends and we will give you a free car".

:P hehe, yeh true

[Ryzz]

Continued from Here (http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=58405)

[Holden Man]

{Originally - DeeJay
Im sorry if this has been cover before couldnt be bothered reading all 500 posts,

But the new Holden looks like a Ford .!!!!!

Ref to photo of SS bottom of page 25 in the car guide of Fridays Herald Sun ( VIC ) 04/08/06, if that doesnt resemble a Ford ill jam my Rod into my turbos.

Sorry Holdsen nice looking car but just not different enough billion Dollars to flare the guards and add Audi A6 tail lights you must be Joking.


So where can i find a discounted new VZ SS me thinks they might be in demand.
__________________
Danny}


Don't read too much from the pictures as I thought the same before seeing one (2 actually) in the flesh. Nothing like a Falcon and in my opinion makes the Ford look dated / bland. I think Ford may be in trouble as they have 2 more years of this shape. New Commodore, New 380, New Camry & Aurion....Old Ford.

The tail lights look nothing like the A6. Trust me you will like it, it's curvy, sharp and has real presence.

[pixelengine]

Have you seen a VE on the road? I'd be reserving judgement before I make the Ford comparison (which has been done to absolute death already).

Make no mistake, when you see a VE on the road, there will be no doubting that it's a Commodore you're looking at.

It's also amazing how you'll start to look at the VZ and anything earlier as looking terribly out-of-date.


{Originally - DeeJay
Im sorry if this has been cover before couldnt be bothered reading all 500 posts,

But the new Holden looks like a Ford .!!!!!

Ref to photo of SS bottom of page 25 in the car guide of Fridays Herald Sun ( VIC ) 04/08/06, if that doesnt resemble a Ford ill jam my Rod into my turbos.

Sorry Holdsen nice looking car but just not different enough billion Dollars to flare the guards and add Audi A6 tail lights you must be Joking.


So where can i find a discounted new VZ SS me thinks they might be in demand.
__________________
Danny}


Don't read too much from the pictures as I thought the same before seeing one (2 actually) in the flesh. Nothing like a Falcon and in my opinion makes the Ford look dated / bland. I think Ford may be in trouble as they have 2 more years of this shape. New Commodore, New 380, New Camry & Aurion....Old Ford.

The tail lights look nothing like the A6. Trust me you will like it, it's curvy, sharp and has real presence.

[Stevotski]

Have you seen a VE on the road? I'd be reserving judgement before I make the Ford comparison (which has been done to absolute death already).

Make no mistake, when you see a VE on the road, there will be no doubting that it's a Commodore you're looking at.


its just the same as when VN's and EA's came out - heaps of poeple were saying that they looked the same and you could probably buy a VN windscreen and fit it to an EA etc

[VX2VESS]

It's also amazing how you'll start to look at the VZ and anything earlier as looking terribly out-of-date.

dunno bout that VX is still the better looking up to VZ. more so the VX HSV R8

New one VE looks good still need to see one in the flesh....

[Wezza]

I saw a black VE SS-V today at Gerald Salven Holden in Canberra. All i can say is WOW!! The photos definitely do NOT do the car justice. Awesome looking car. You would have to be blind freddy to think it was a Falcon seeing it in the flesh. I love it!! Only problem is, NOW I WANT ONE!!! lol :lol:

[Carby]

[QUOTE=Speedy Gonzales]IToyo quality and efficiency shits all over what GM has to offer, though GM does have the size, power and style advantage.


I think you are having yourself on a bit there - just ask all those involved in the world wide recall of Prado's and RAV 4's.

I think a the recent article in Choice magazine sums up Toyota puchasers, when they compared owners of Camrys, Falcons and Commodores. The Falcon and Commodore owners looked at competitors cars before purchase, 3 of the 4 Toyota drivers just blindly bought the Camry!! SHEEP is a word that comes to mind.

And the Current Corolla is rubbish compared the the Mazda 3, Astra and Focus - not to mention the Golf but hey it is the top seller - those dealers must be giving big discounts.........

[jaykay]

I saw a black VE SS-V today at Gerald Salven Holden in Canberra. All i can say is WOW!! The photos definitely do NOT do the car justice. Awesome looking car. You would have to be blind freddy to think it was a Falcon seeing it in the flesh. I love it!! Only problem is, NOW I WANT ONE!!! lol :lol:
Don't blame you seeing your current ride...

Did you get any pics ?????

[Wezza]

Haha. :) My GTS was slightly quicker than the Camry. But oh well. :lol: No i didn't get pics, it drove in the yard and into a garage where all the salesmen were drooling over it. I might head back over there tomorrow to see if i can get some pics. Only problem is, i'm in Canberra & i don't have the transfer cable for my camera with me. I'll see if i can get the pics anyway.

[Wezza]

Yeah don't worry about Speedy Gonzales, he's just a troll. Sorry Speedy, but it's true.

Anyways, i saw my first VE today, a black SS-V. :drool: AWESOME

[Carby]

Here ya go

The anticipated wait is over and the news is out - VE Commodore is here and frankly, we don't know what all the fuss is about. GM-Holden have gone to great lengths in their effort to catch up to the amazing BF Falcon, but take a closer look at the specifications and you will soon agree that there really is no comparison.

Here are 11 key things which you should know about VE Commodore and BF Falcon.

1. VE Commodore will not perform as well as the BF Falcon

· VE Commodore Omega -

Power = 180kW@6000rpm (ECE)

Torque = 330Nm@2600rpm (ECE) 1

· BF Falcon XT has greater power and torque –

Power = 190kW@5250rpm (DIN)

Torque = 383Nm@2500rpm (DIN)

· Furthermore, Falcon XT achieves 330Nm of torque at just 1500rpm, which ultimately means greater responsiveness and performance!

2. VE Commodore's Alloytec engine is not as technologically advanced as Falcon's Barra 190

The Alloytec V6 engine misses out on continuously variable camshaft timing for exhaust cams2
This is a feature unique to the High Output Alloytec engine but is found on all Barra 190 and 245 engines and well as the E-Gas engine.



What a laugh - the Barra has a cast iron block (heavier), has a 10% greater capacity than the Holden and in normally aspirated form , is 5 KW shy of the all Alloy Holden V6 - and this clown reckons it is more technically advanced ??:werd:

[Dee Jay]

Im sorry guys but from the pics i have seen not pushing my buttons.

I will wait to see it in the flesh, and pass judgement then.


As for making it a better drive , well the Magna was always pumped up by the press as being a great drive, still it looked as boring as bat sh1t and sold as quick.
It may well drive like a BMW but if it doesnt grab you in the looks department then it wont grab you at all.

[lowriding]

I think a the recent article in Choice magazine sums up Toyota puchasers, when they compared owners of Camrys, Falcons and Commodores. The Falcon and Commodore owners looked at competitors cars before purchase, 3 of the 4 Toyota drivers just blindly bought the Camry!! SHEEP is a word that comes to mind.

And the Current Corolla is rubbish compared the the Mazda 3, Astra and Focus - not to mention the Golf but hey it is the top seller - those dealers must be giving big discounts.........

:bravo: Finally some one gets it ! I have been saying Toyota are overrated and bought by sheep for years . IMO Toyota marketing is right up there with real estate spruikers

[FunkyPig]

So what, sounds like Barra is more techonologically advanced, who cares? power, efficiency, and driveability are what counts, and Holden wins that from what I hear.

Also looking at the versions Alfa and Saab has, seems theres many future upgrades Holden could give us for the Alloytec.

But I would be worried what Ford has up its sleave for the future, the BF is a good car, but basically 4 years old. So Holden can be comfy for a year of so, but don't be complacent! Orion is coming and will be worth Holden worrying about now.

[Wezza]

^^
You don't have to buy one..... If you don't like it, thats ok. But we don't have to hear about you not being keen on it in every post.

[FunkyPig]

Check out this ad for the Aurion http://video.vividas.com/media/4393_hothouse/web/
Hilarious!!!

[Vulture]

Check out this ad for the Aurion http://video.vividas.com/media/4393_hothouse/web/
Hilarious!!!

Inspired by F1! :lmao:

[payaya]

the Ve should be better than BF its meant to be and will. How much better? I believe not much. The BF has set the standard for the best car in australia and logically the VE cannot be much better if it is then it should by placed in 5 series territory. For the price which it sells for its not possible.

You can design a good car, but to be as good as a BMW it requires not only development dollars but also dollars spent on the cars.

BF is a good car, the VE would be too. How big the gap is? Who knows.

From the review today in the Herald sun the 3.6L does seem to be a bit of a flop! Everyone thought new chassis and development would help the engine feel better but it didnt. New six speed is good when not compred, but ford has the ZF and everyone knows its the best in the business.

[payaya]

just read in cars guide from the herald sun that the ss and ss-v can do 0-100km/h in 5.4secs, thats quicker than any fpv v8 and the typhoon in only 0.1 of a sec quicker, now to see the hsv line up mmmmmmmmmmm:drool:

cheers maccas

quoted times mean nothing.

The XR5 and turbo astra have quarter mile times in the low 13.

[Vulture]

quoted times mean nothing.

The XR5 and turbo astra have quarter mile times in the low 13.

Not sure where those figures are from:

Wheels XR5 turbo 0-400m 15.4s

[kayman]

Not sure where those figures are from:

Wheels XR5 turbo 0-400m 15.4s

low 13s were a mistake from MOTOR mag.

[vxtreem]

Saw my first Stato today. It was another Victorian Plated UAM ###, in gun metal grey.
Boy does this thing have road presence. It looks big but a smoother style in the roof line than previous statos. It sits very very high in the guards tho, drop the front 2inches and the rear at least 1.5 and it would look awsome.

[sully]

Hey i don't know if this has been posted, it's off the drive site. its a video of the VE doing engine testing at mt hotham, but the engine doesn't seem to sound like the other holden engines and it has a bonnet scoop (which could just be camo, but yeah) http://www.drive.com.au/Editorial/ArticleDetail.aspx?articleID=18661 anyone know what sought of engine? the sound i'm reffering to is in the last couple of runs they make, almost sounds deiselish?

[VE06]

quoted times mean nothing.

The XR5 and turbo astra have quarter mile times in the low 13.

if only. theyre no qucker than low 15's

[V8BRUTE]

Why do people automatically assume the ZF auto is automatically (sorry for the pun) better than the GM 6 speeder, if I had a choice I would go the GM box any day of the week, like all GM boxes to date once the US aftermarket industry gets behind making upgrade kits you will be able to build them very strong for a reasonable price, don't like your chances buying ZF parts cheap :confused:

I am really surprised at all the talk about Toyotas in this thread, I will give Toyota something in that they are good at marketing and advertising but come on, they will never be a true equal to Holden or Ford in this country with FWD ever, I am sure that F1 inspired front spoiler will eliminate all understeer and give it perfectly weighted sterring :rolleyes:

[HSE2]

Why do people automatically assume the ZF auto is automatically (sorry for the pun) better than the GM 6 speeder, if I had a choice I would go the GM box any day of the week, like all GM boxes to date once the US aftermarket industry gets behind making upgrade kits you will be able to build them very strong for a reasonable price, don't like your chances buying ZF parts cheap :confused:






Not sure that has happened and it depends on what "better" means.

I have had ZF transmissions in my cars since 87. They are bloody good but they would want to be when they are considered to be one of the best in the field.

I can’t say I have read much about the GM box other then a short write up by the drive crew which seemed to suggest the ZF to be ahead of the GM offering. I read it as offering more features (fuzzy logic) and not necessarily a functionality concern. When they start talking about shift quality and response then its time to ask questions and those reports will only come about with the real appraisals not the toy soldiers. There have been occasions when ZF and GM boxes have been offered in the same European products. ZF for the petrol and GM for the diesel model. Back to back testing usually went the way of the ZF but not by much.

And besides it’s highly unlikely the difference to be significant enough for a Holden buyer to over look the rest of the package. GM makes good boxes. What might be interesting is if Ford starts offering the ZF 6 speed in XTs against the 4 speed in the VE. That might be significant enough to sway buyers but I cant see it making a difference 6 speed car v six speed car.

[Dacious]

ZF trans is not available on 6 cyl. XT or Futura unless you get the 5.4 V8 according to Ford website. The bit about the 'comparison' between XT and VE Omega is not really valid, either. Omega comes standard with stability (not avail. on XT/Futura) optional side airbags (optional Futura, not avail XT), and optional curtain airbags which (even if I think they're window dressing) can't be optioned in an XT or Futura. Plus the safety pack comes with side/curtain/active head restraints (not any any Falcon).

Omega is a closer competitor for Fairmont, which in the fleet pricing I've seen is much closer. Everyone whinges about Holden resale - well, now they're doing something about it. Are they right? They gave up the taxi market with no problems. Will giving up the bottom feeder fleet market hurt them? Who knows. I guess we'll find out in a year if Holden does a '380'. Maybe this might be the saving of 380?

[payaya]

Why do people automatically assume the ZF auto is automatically (sorry for the pun) better than the GM 6 speeder, if I had a choice I would go the GM box any day of the week, like all GM boxes to date once the US aftermarket industry gets behind making upgrade kits you will be able to build them very strong for a reasonable price, don't like your chances buying ZF parts cheap :confused:

I am really surprised at all the talk about Toyotas in this thread, I will give Toyota something in that they are good at marketing and advertising but come on, they will never be a true equal to Holden or Ford in this country with FWD ever, I am sure that F1 inspired front spoiler will eliminate all understeer and give it perfectly weighted sterring :rolleyes:

why assume?? every car reviewed with the ZF six speed has always come up on top! In the Herald Sun is states that the six speed is smooth but is not as good as the ZF box.

I remember reading that the ZF would be offered in the premium VE vehicles. That explains it all.

[payaya]

Why do people automatically assume the ZF auto is automatically (sorry for the pun) better than the GM 6 speeder, if I had a choice I would go the GM box any day of the week, like all GM boxes to date once the US aftermarket industry gets behind making upgrade kits you will be able to build them very strong for a reasonable price, don't like your chances buying ZF parts cheap :confused:

I am really surprised at all the talk about Toyotas in this thread, I will give Toyota something in that they are good at marketing and advertising but come on, they will never be a true equal to Holden or Ford in this country with FWD ever, I am sure that F1 inspired front spoiler will eliminate all understeer and give it perfectly weighted sterring :rolleyes:

yeah why would you put toyota in this thread??? They are making a profit and also have enough money to buy GM outright.

You cant bag Toyota for their cars. If GM had the choice of making their cars more like toyota and have their profits as high they would jump on it. Why would they change a formula which is working?? Understeer or not they are lucky compared to Ford or GM.

True equal??? Yeah thats true they sell more vehicles so i guess they arent an equal! Business is business, and Toyota are good at it!

[monaroCountry1]

yeah why would you put toyota in this thread??? They are making a profit and also have enough money to buy GM outright.

True equal??? Yeah that’s true they sell more vehicles so i guess they aren’t an equal! Business is business, and Toyota are good at it!

GM actually sold more cars than Toyota. So far this year GM sold 4.6 million cars beating Toyota by 240,000 (Toyota with 4.36 million units).

GM seems to be turning its operations around with new engines, gearboxes and a whole lot of new cars debuting within several months. The zeta platform in the VE will underpin GM's revival into the large RWD sedan markets. Things are looking better and better for GM whilst Toyota have had its fair share of recalls and scandals. GM as well as Ford has a nice position (at the top) on the renuable fuel issue. GM is the biggest and best manufacturer of E85 cars. I'll Take Toyota till 2008 to even come out with a mass produced E85 car.

The main problem for GM has always been their overgenerous pension and health benefits. They are also moving forwards in this area (faster than expected too).

[payaya]

GM actually sold more cars than Toyota. So far this year GM sold 4.6 million cars beating Toyota by 240,000 (Toyota with 4.36 million units).

GM seems to be turning its operations around with new engines, gearboxes and a whole lot of new cars debuting within several months. The zeta platform in the VE will underpin GM's revival into the large RWD sedan markets. Things are looking better and better for GM whilst Toyota have had its fair share of recalls and scandals. GM as well as Ford has a nice position (at the top) on the renuable fuel issue. GM is the biggest and best manufacturer of E85 cars. I'll Take Toyota till 2008 to even come out with a mass produced E85 car.

The main problem for GM has always been their overgenerous pension and health benefits. They are also moving forwards in this area (faster than expected too).

But it all comes down to whos making money. In a business sense it does not look good for GM and Ford.


I think the E85 would be the last thing in GM and Ford's mind at the moment. If the ZETA platform was almost scrapped then obviously there are massive problems GM face at the moment.

[payaya]

Here ya go

The anticipated wait is over and the news is out - VE Commodore is here and frankly, we don't know what all the fuss is about. GM-Holden have gone to great lengths in their effort to catch up to the amazing BF Falcon, but take a closer look at the specifications and you will soon agree that there really is no comparison.

Here are 11 key things which you should know about VE Commodore and BF Falcon.

1. VE Commodore will not perform as well as the BF Falcon

· VE Commodore Omega -

Power = 180kW@6000rpm (ECE)

Torque = 330Nm@2600rpm (ECE) 1

· BF Falcon XT has greater power and torque –

Power = 190kW@5250rpm (DIN)

Torque = 383Nm@2500rpm (DIN)

· Furthermore, Falcon XT achieves 330Nm of torque at just 1500rpm, which ultimately means greater responsiveness and performance!

2. VE Commodore's Alloytec engine is not as technologically advanced as Falcon's Barra 190

The Alloytec V6 engine misses out on continuously variable camshaft timing for exhaust cams2
This is a feature unique to the High Output Alloytec engine but is found on all Barra 190 and 245 engines and well as the E-Gas engine.



What a laugh - the Barra has a cast iron block (heavier), has a 10% greater capacity than the Holden and in normally aspirated form , is 5 KW shy of the all Alloy Holden V6 - and this clown reckons it is more technically advanced ??:werd:

What a laugh - the Barra has a cast iron block (heavier), has a 10% greater capacity than the Holden and in normally aspirated form , is 5 KW shy of the all Alloy Holden V6 - and this clown reckons it is more technically advanced ??:werd:

Your a clown for thinking that! In comparisons the I6 has always been hailed as the better engine. If you truely believe the Ford motor is crap because with all the technology put into it it only puts out another 5kw then thats obviously a sign of someone who does not know much about engines.

A lot of technology is put into an engine to make it smoother and produce more power at lower revs. There are so many factors which influence the characteristics of an engine its not funny!

I have a car thats 2.0L and produces 147KW and revs to 8500RPM. So does that make the alloytech a dud??? No it does not. Certain engines are made the way they are to suit certain cars. Each engine is good in their own way.

So if you truely believe in comparisons put into consideration the torque figure, earlier in the rev range and thats your extra technology.

[Speedy Gonzales]

I think you are having yourself on a bit there - just ask all those involved in the world wide recall of Prado's and RAV 4's.

And the Current Corolla is rubbish compared the the Mazda 3, Astra and Focus - not to mention the Golf but hey it is the top seller - those dealers must be giving big discounts.........

Can you tell me which company is currently in debt up to its eyeballs?

And which company is the number one car manufacturer worldwide and in the black? Do you get to being number 1 by being in the business of building shit cars?

And from a country no bigger than Qld?

The Corolla nameplate speaks for itself, here and worldwide. But this isnt a thread about Corollas or Toyota for that matter.

I can post what I think of your GTO, but Ive got little to nothing positive to say :) Isnt it funny how some of you blokes cant behave the same? :slap:

GM does have an advantage over Toyota atm, the Q is, whether they will use it.

Wezza - You have nothing to contribute, have you ever posted anything helpful to members in the tech section or how to help members benefit from making their LSx experience more beneficial? Like a VE, a big fat farkin NO on that front, so whos the troll?

Hey Mods, how am I doing at defending? Can I get an honourary mention? :lmao:

I think some of you fellas are blinded by the badge of a lion, you should work in the trade and sit in other marques and see things hands on, maybe thats why my opinion is not as biased, since Im lucky to get the opportunity to drive all matter of cars, and from knowing a big network of dealer and service outlet people you get to see and hear everything right in front of you.

The Mods are letting this slide so I am willing to do the same.

[XLR8 V8]

Official CalaisV Accessories Pic (See other threads for Calais-V and Omega accessories)
Preview:
http://www.excelerate.com.au/downloads/XLR8V8/SSV_Acc_Sml.jpg

Full Size Version: http://www.excelerate.com.au/downloads/XLR8V8/VE_SSV_Acccessories_Lrg.jpg

[XLR8 V8]

Official CalaisV Accessories Pic (See other threads for SS-V and Calais-V accessories)
Preview:
http://www.excelerate.com.au/downloads/XLR8V8/Omega_Acc_Sml.jpg

Full Size Version: http://www.excelerate.com.au/downloads/XLR8V8/VE_Omega_Acccessories_Lrg.jpg

[Wezza]

Can you tell me which company is currently in debt up to its eyeballs?

And which company is the number one car manufacturer worldwide and in the black? Do you get to being number 1 by being in the business of building shit cars?

And from a country no bigger than Qld?

The Corolla nameplate speaks for itself, here and worldwide. But this isnt a thread about Corollas or Toyota for that matter.

I can post what I think of your GTO, but Ive got little to nothing positive to say :) Isnt it funny how some of you blokes cant behave the same? :slap:

GM does have an advantage over Toyota atm, the Q is, whether they will use it.

Wezza - You have nothing to contribute, have you ever posted anything helpful to members in the tech section or how to help members benefit from making their LSx experience more beneficial? Like a VE, a big fat farkin NO on that front, so whos the troll?

Hey Mods, how am I doing at defending? Can I get an honourary mention? :lmao:

I think some of you fellas are blinded by the badge of a lion, you should work in the trade and sit in other marques and see things hands on, maybe thats why my opinion is not as biased, since Im lucky to get the opportunity to drive all matter of cars, and from knowing a big network of dealer and service outlet people you get to see and hear everything right in front of you.

The Mods are letting this slide so I am willing to do the same.
Excuse me, but have you ever got anything useful to post on here?? All you do is say how much you don't like the VE. How useful can that be??:weirdo: I'm not looking to get into an argument with you but i just had to get that off my chest. Now carry on.......Lol

[HSE2]

ZF trans is not available on 6 cyl. XT or Futura unless you get the 5.4 V8 according to Ford website.

You didn't read the post correctly. I said "IF" Ford and they are rumour to be considering it, offer the ZF on the XT “THEN” the difference might be significant enough to hurt the VE offerings but even then as I said, the buyer is over looking a significant portion of the rest of the VE package.

[KeenGolfer]

Got some pics of a black SS-V at a dealer, going to upload them now :) Thanks to Wezza for pointing it out.

[Dee Jay]

^^
You don't have to buy one..... If you don't like it, thats ok. But we don't have to hear about you not being keen on it in every post.
That is true when i see one in the flesh and it gets me going then ill have one in the driveway.:idea:

So i supose that i could say that we dont have to listen to you drooling about how GREAT it is then in every post:weirdo:

Its a forum, a place for everyones opinion not just the ones that are positive or that suit you.

[NRD80Y]

So do the stripes continue onto the boot or spoiler? How far along the boot do they go?

[Ghia351]

ZF trans is not available on 6 cyl. XT or Futura unless you get the 5.4 V8 according to Ford website. The bit about the 'comparison' between XT and VE Omega is not really valid, either. Omega comes standard with stability (not avail. on XT/Futura) optional side airbags (optional Futura, not avail XT), and optional curtain airbags which (even if I think they're window dressing) can't be optioned in an XT or Futura. Plus the safety pack comes with side/curtain/active head restraints (not any any Falcon).

Omega is a closer competitor for Fairmont, which in the fleet pricing I've seen is much closer. Everyone whinges about Holden resale - well, now they're doing something about it. Are they right? They gave up the taxi market with no problems. Will giving up the bottom feeder fleet market hurt them? Who knows. I guess we'll find out in a year if Holden does a '380'. Maybe this might be the saving of 380?
Maybe a government fleet buyer with OH&S commitments will consider an Omega with the all the safety features however a non-government fleet buyer won't give it a look unless forced to. To give an example, a great deal of fleet XR6 buyers choose the premium ICC as it lifts the interior to a Fairmont look and bypass the ZF A6 because in a short turnover time the money on the ICC can be better justified in aiding residuals (and it's initally a cheaper option) it's very visually obvious giving the interior a big lift while the A6 needs a longer term ownership to win back the fuel savings.

[vt350phantom]

Official CalaisV Accessories Pic (See other threads for Calais-V and Omega accessories)
Preview:
http://www.excelerate.com.au/downloads/XLR8V8/SSV_Acc_Sml.jpg

Full Size Version: http://www.excelerate.com.au/downloads/XLR8V8/VE_SSV_Acccessories_Lrg.jpg

Looks tuff! Me likes

[HSE2]

The bit about the 'comparison' between XT and VE Omega is not really valid, either. Omega comes standard with stability (not avail. on XT/Futura) optional side airbags (optional Futura, not avail XT), and optional curtain airbags which (even if I think they're window dressing) can't be optioned in an XT or Futura. Plus the safety pack comes with side/curtain/active head restraints (not any any Falcon).



So are you trying to suggest any review of the Omega will have no reference to the XT? They are valid other wise the Omega would have the vastly better interior and wouldn't have the 4 speed auto with no sports shift.

It’s not unusual for a brand new car to have a packaging advantage. That's good luck to the manufacturer in question, but there won’t be a dealer anywhere trying to pass the Omega off as a Fairmont competitor not with the short cuts taken on the Omega interior. That’s not derogatory that’s stating the obvious due to the omegas status in life. Price structure dictates the competition not features. If someone is offering features not available for the same money then they have a significant advantage in the market place and that is what Omega represents as it stands today. At months end the situation although in Holden’s favour won't (most likely) be as significant. James Stanford yesterday wrote that he felt the XT had the better interior ambience or words to the affect when talking about comparison with the Omega. I guess Holden forgot to mention comparison validity at the press release to the media.

Ford look set to react almost immediately to these packaging issues. The stability control and the side airbags are certainly features that can be addressed. There appears to be tremendous temptation at offering the ZF in the XT to embarrass Holden for using the 4 speeder. The calibration is already done in XR6 guise as it shares the same engine as the XT. The question is volume and cost. Personally it would be a very bold move and I reckon highly unlikely, but Ford have said they will be bringing fuel economy saving to the market in BF2. Industry speculation has offering the ZF box across the range as the easiest out for Ford given the stated BF was already the mechanical upgrade. It’s hard to see another engine upgrade or weight reduction being in the pipeline.

[KeenGolfer]

Sorry about the image quality on some, sun was in a really bad spot and car is in a locked section of the yard, so couldn't get too close.

http://www.gimmecarparts.com.au/images/ssv/vess-v-1.jpg
http://www.gimmecarparts.com.au/images/ssv/vess-v-2.jpg
http://www.gimmecarparts.com.au/images/ssv/vess-v-3.jpg
http://www.gimmecarparts.com.au/images/ssv/vess-v-4.jpg
http://www.gimmecarparts.com.au/images/ssv/vess-v-5.jpg
http://www.gimmecarparts.com.au/images/ssv/vess-v-7.jpg
http://www.gimmecarparts.com.au/images/ssv/vess-v-8.jpg
http://www.gimmecarparts.com.au/images/ssv/vess-v-9.jpg
http://www.gimmecarparts.com.au/images/ssv/vess-v-10.jpg
http://www.gimmecarparts.com.au/images/ssv/vess-v-11.jpg
http://www.gimmecarparts.com.au/images/ssv/vess-v-12.jpg
http://www.gimmecarparts.com.au/images/ssv/vess-v-12.jpg

http://www.gimmecarparts.com.au/images/ssv/vess-v-6.jpg

[Danv8]

That is true when i see one in the flesh and it gets me going then ill have one in the driveway.:idea:

So i supose that i could say that we dont have to listen to you drooling about how GREAT it is then in every post:weirdo:

Its a forum, a place for everyones opinion not just the ones that are positive or that suit you.


That is true but there was more than enough negativity about the car before it was released.

I tell you what I usually tell people drive it for yourself before writing it off.

[Danv8]

Can you tell me which company is currently in debt up to its eyeballs?

And which company is the number one car manufacturer worldwide and in the black? Do you get to being number 1 by being in the business of building shit cars?

And from a country no bigger than Qld?

The Corolla nameplate speaks for itself, here and worldwide. But this isnt a thread about Corollas or Toyota for that matter.

I can post what I think of your GTO, but Ive got little to nothing positive to say :) Isnt it funny how some of you blokes cant behave the same? :slap:

GM does have an advantage over Toyota atm, the Q is, whether they will use it.

Wezza - You have nothing to contribute, have you ever posted anything helpful to members in the tech section or how to help members benefit from making their LSx experience more beneficial? Like a VE, a big fat farkin NO on that front, so whos the troll?

Hey Mods, how am I doing at defending? Can I get an honourary mention? :lmao:

I think some of you fellas are blinded by the badge of a lion, you should work in the trade and sit in other marques and see things hands on, maybe thats why my opinion is not as biased, since Im lucky to get the opportunity to drive all matter of cars, and from knowing a big network of dealer and service outlet people you get to see and hear everything right in front of you.

The Mods are letting this slide so I am willing to do the same.

Shit sorry we actually like the car we should worship ford then.
:p

[lowriding]

thanks for posting those drew ! geez it's looks very tidy in real world shots .The proportions are right on . Black looks awesome too,though black on black is too much for me and i'm not doing the red dash .Not much option there .Hello Holden what about black over a black dash and camel / tan leather seats /doortrim combo :deal:
very 3 series here

http://www.gimmecarparts.com.au/images/ssv/vess-v-2.jpg

[HSE2]

Official CalaisV Accessories Pic (See other threads for SS-V and Calais-V accessories)
Preview:
http://www.excelerate.com.au/downloads/XLR8V8/Omega_Acc_Sml.jpg

Full Size Version: http://www.excelerate.com.au/downloads/XLR8V8/VE_Omega_Acccessories_Lrg.jpg

They are nice rims. I assume they are the 20s?

[CraigH]

I saw that black SSV at Gerald Slaven during the week as well as a base model. The panel fit and general look was impressive, however the SSV sits way too high with large gaps above the wheels.

I would have hoped for a bit more radical change in shape but I imagine slow and steady does not loose your fan base.

I was impressed but not blown away and will reserve final judgement till I see one on the road and can see what it looks like in motion.

So no urge to change cars on first inspection.

[Dee Jay]

That is true but there was more than enough negativity about the car before it was released.

I tell you what I usually tell people drive it for yourself before writing it off.
As i said in my last 2 posts when i see it in the flesh and drive it i will make a more informed judgement.

But all the majority of buyers have seen are pics and they are not that flattering, especialy when you think that Holden would have taken hundreds of professional pics and picked the best of the lot for release.

Ill ask you a question, why do you think there was a lot of negativity before its release?? do you think people were just being negitive for negatives sake ?? or was it based on what they saw which was Holdens professional pics in the press releases??

[Speedy Gonzales]

That is true but there was more than enough negativity about the car before it was released.

I tell you what I usually tell people drive it for yourself before writing it off.

DanV8 - I think you are forgetting there are a lot of members who happen to still own GM cars, are very happy with them and have very accomplished results, aftermarket wise, at the track, daily driving etc

There is no doubt the VE will drive nice. The Q is, feasability in more ways than one.

Proof is in the pudding as they say, GMH have 94,642 units in one year to beat or 259 cars a day, thats 7 days a week, 24 hrs a day to prove whether the car will be marketable.

Lets see if that can be accomplished? Fleets will get the ho hum models, lease and private the higher spec, but will the VE get the above number from private and lease that it did in the past?

I dont believe so but it could happen. I think you will find that we can agree to disagree like many others here, and theres no need to get knickers in a twist :lol: :wave:

[korrupt]

They are nice rims. I assume they are the 20s?
I think those ones are 18 or 19.

[HSE2]

I think those ones are 18 or 19.

Ah ok thanks. I am having trouble with the Holden website- can you tell me where to find a picture of the optional 20s please?

[Ghosn]

I tell you what I usually tell people drive it for yourself before writing it off.

Driving it aint gonna make it look any prettier.

[jaykay]

thanks for posting those drew ! geez it's looks very tidy in real world shots .The proportions are right on . Black looks awesome too,though black on black is too much for me and i'm not doing the red dash .Not much option there .Hello Holden what about black over a black dash and camel / tan leather seats /doortrim combo :deal:
very 3 series here

http://www.gimmecarparts.com.au/images/ssv/vess-v-2.jpg
One could fit some big wheels under those guards !!! :teach:

Me wonders how long until the aftermarket rim manufacturers develop 21 and 22" rims for this car.....:idea: otherwise they do need lowering...

[jaykay]

Ah ok thanks. I am having trouble with the Holden website- can you tell me where to find a picture of the optional 20s please?
http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showpost.php?p=692628&postcount=11

[jaykay]

They are nice rims. I assume they are the 20s?
They are the "19" x 8" 5 port alloy wheels"....

[HSE2]

http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showpost.php?p=692628&postcount=11

Thankyou. They are very nice too
I assume the stripes go down the boot as well?

[jaykay]

Thankyou. They are very nice too
I assume the stripes go down the boot as well?
Not sure, haven't seen a pic of the boot. Will be seeing some on Monday so hopefully they have one with stripes on and I can let you know, or even takes pics .....:headbang: :stick:

[Dee Jay]

I know that im asking for trouble for asking this:kapow: :slap: :box: :nutkick: but can someone please use photo shop on the new VE and take off the flared guards and replace the Holden badge with a Ford one.

Or if that seems to hard what about adding flared guards to the Ford XR6 and adding a Holden badge.

[Ghosn]

I know that im asking for trouble for asking this:kapow: :slap: :box: :nutkick: but can someone please use photo shop on the new VE and take off the flared guards and replace the Holden badge with a Ford one.

Or if that seems to hard what about adding flared guards to the Ford XR6 and adding a Holden badge.

I found a website for you DJ :stick:

http://www.opsm.com.au/

And that includes anyone else that thinks it looks like a Falcon or Magna or both :)

[AndrewW]

Official CalaisV Accessories Pic (See other threads for SS-V and Calais-V accessories)
Preview:
http://www.excelerate.com.au/downloads/XLR8V8/Omega_Acc_Sml.jpg

Full Size Version: http://www.excelerate.com.au/downloads/XLR8V8/VE_Omega_Acccessories_Lrg.jpg

that is sex on wheels.

I wonder how the stripes are added, are they a decal or are they painted on ?

purely from wear and tear point of view ...

Andrew.

[Rick76]

So what was your point? Youre comparing a 19K cheapo runabout to a $35K car thats supposed to be a E Class, 5 Series and A6 level of standard, whats the punchline?

The point of my post was wanting you to elaborate on your comments re. the cheap interior - was it the look, function, feel, fit, etc? Its easy to something is crap, but why was it? I'm not saying you are wrong just that most of the feedback from those who have seen it so far say its quite good, and IMO most of the pics look ok (apart from Berlina woodgrain).

I wasn't bagging your choice of a Corolla (I recommended my GF buy hers for the same reasons you mentioned). I only bought it up as my major criticism of that car is the interior and as I mentioned, If the VE interior is worse than that, it must be bad. I think its fair to compare the interiors of sub-$50K base model cars of the same basic purpose (ie. cheap passenger cars with a lot of fleet, lease, company & hire cars sales).

I dont remember reading anything about anyone from Holden saying the VE was superior to the Euros, just they were used in benchmarking and they were happy with what they ended up with. They said the same thing about the VT... and probably the VL.... and HZ.... and 48/215.

[jaykay]

White VE SS pics courtesy of SJMHSV.....

http://images.cainer.net//uploads/Picture 005.jpg

http://images.cainer.net//uploads/Picture 001.jpg

http://images.cainer.net//uploads/Picture 002.jpg

http://images.cainer.net//uploads/Picture 004.jpg

http://images.cainer.net//uploads/Picture 006.jpg

Check out the handbrake lever in the interior pic....

Also a good comparison of VZ next to VE....

[Carby650]

I know that im asking for trouble for asking this:kapow: :slap: :box: :nutkick: but can someone please use photo shop on the new VE and take off the flared guards and replace the Holden badge with a Ford one.

Or if that seems to hard what about adding flared guards to the Ford XR6 and adding a Holden badge.

Hay Dee Jay I saw some pics done on one of the threads about 2 weeks ago where they showed a front and rear profile side by side of the VE , Falcon and 380. When you put them up against each other they look nothing alike. Tried finding the thread but come up with nothing. Might be worth while having a search for it.
cheers
Carby650

[Wonky]

I saw that black SSV at Gerald Slaven during the week as well as a base model. The panel fit and general look was impressive, however the SSV sits way too high with large gaps above the wheels.
I think it tells a story that in all the pics in brochures etc the SSV looks like it has been lowered slightly. I went to the preview in Melbourne on July 16 and the one thing that spoiled all the cars is that they sat waaaaay too high. The pics in brochures and still shots on tv have been doctored........ :(

[Wonky]

I dont remember reading anything about anyone from Holden saying the VE was superior to the Euros, just they were used in benchmarking and they were happy with what they ended up with. They said the same thing about the VT... and probably the VL.... and HZ.... and 48/215.
Yeah, just the motoring press wankers....... I remember reading a review on the VB Commodore just after it was released and some wanker compared it to a Rolls Royce for quietness and smoothness.......... :weirdo:

[HRT 8]

Had the chance to get up close and personal with a Black SSV this morning.
How farking fat are they from the front.
Took a good look over and found what I reckon is the only carry over part. The plastic clips holding the sound dedener under the bonnet.

This particular car was fitted with a sunroof so I decided to get in and make myself comfortalel. Got the seat in the furthermost down position (im 6'9" so I need room) and climber in over what seems like a much wider sill panel. I sit in the seat and!!!!!!!
Bugger me. My head hit the roof. Due to the sunroof, there is less headroom (1.5" Id guess).
So for you big blokes over about 6'7",your gonna be in trouble if you want the wind in your hair, and sun on your mellon on nice days. DONT order a sunroof.

Steering wheel has a really nice feel to it also. Be a nice retro fit to pre VE if it can be done.

My thoughts.
Fat from any angle in the frontal direction. And, a resounding, I LIKE! :love:

[VX SS]

I pick mine up on the 15th August Black on Black 20 inch rims lowered

[CLUB_819]

Yeah they do sit to high but the pics that look lowered did they have the 20's on them.

And that comparison that 'Carby 650' was talking about was in the 'official lead up to the VE' thread (which seems to have disappeared), and from seeing those pix they look nothing alike, unless said person has been sqwinting vigerously looking at something else before hand. :stick:

Cheers
Scotty

[Fnomna]

Hay Dee Jay I saw some pics done on one of the threads about 2 weeks ago where they showed a front and rear profile side by side of the VE , Falcon and 380. When you put them up against each other they look nothing alike. Tried finding the thread but come up with nothing. Might be worth while having a search for it.
cheers
Carby650
http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?p=681675#post681675
http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?p=681686#post681686

[HRT 8]

I pick mine up on the 15th August Black on Black 20 inch rims lowered
Sounds right Garry. I was told today that they are not allowed to register any before August 14.

[payaya]

Can you tell me which company is currently in debt up to its eyeballs?

And which company is the number one car manufacturer worldwide and in the black? Do you get to being number 1 by being in the business of building shit cars?

And from a country no bigger than Qld?

The Corolla nameplate speaks for itself, here and worldwide. But this isnt a thread about Corollas or Toyota for that matter.

I can post what I think of your GTO, but Ive got little to nothing positive to say :) Isnt it funny how some of you blokes cant behave the same? :slap:

GM does have an advantage over Toyota atm, the Q is, whether they will use it.

Wezza - You have nothing to contribute, have you ever posted anything helpful to members in the tech section or how to help members benefit from making their LSx experience more beneficial? Like a VE, a big fat farkin NO on that front, so whos the troll?

Hey Mods, how am I doing at defending? Can I get an honourary mention? :lmao:

I think some of you fellas are blinded by the badge of a lion, you should work in the trade and sit in other marques and see things hands on, maybe thats why my opinion is not as biased, since Im lucky to get the opportunity to drive all matter of cars, and from knowing a big network of dealer and service outlet people you get to see and hear everything right in front of you.

The Mods are letting this slide so I am willing to do the same.

But in a lot of instances number 1 does not mean your invincible. Eg RMG biggest mercantile agnet in Australia went bankrupt no long ago.

Which country is the size of QLD? Japan or USA?

[VX SS]

Grant thats right dealers cant register before that date something about Holden wont realease the vin numbers to the revelant authorities till that date

[VE06]

Yeah, just the motoring press wankers....... I remember reading a review on the VB Commodore just after it was released and some wanker compared it to a Rolls Royce for quietness and smoothness.......... :weirdo:

it probably was back then :hide: :p Must have been a really bad rolls royce heh.

[payaya]

To sum things up the VE will:
Be better than BF

Wont be as good as Euros. With massive development budgets, more mechanical in the build process and the use of better and more expensive materials, I doubt our cars would ever be as good as the Euros. Also we have the USA influencing how we build the car and what we can work with! Everyone knows the USA dont know how to build cars.

Toyota make white goods and put wheels on them. Why tell them to make them otherwise they are making the money.

GM wont close down as it will have too much of an impact on life in USA. It will be rescued by goverment.

Our market is so small it doesnt matter to the rest of the world anyway!

[BlownVR]

I pick mine up on the 15th August Black on Black 20 inch rims lowered
Are there lower springs available already?
Nice ride BTW :)

[HRT 8]

Are there lower springs available already?
Nice ride BTW :)
Yep you bet.

[Ghosn]

Are there lower springs available already?
Nice ride BTW :)

I was wondering about that. Im not technically minded so is someone able to shed some insight into lowering one of these. What I want to know is if I change the suspension to have the car lowered, will I lose all the advantages it has already against previous models?

Best way I can explain this is lets say a stock VE SS out handles/rides better than a stock VZ SS by 30%, will lowered variants of each car still have the same gap or will changing suspension on the VE just bring it back to VZ levels?

Reason I ask is Im not sure in regards to lowering the VE, would it involve changing important components which already work in sync with the rest of the suspension and removing them takes away the advantage?

I hope that makes sense, if not Ill try and clarify a bit more.

[EfiJy]

forget ford. holden aimed higher and targeted 5 series. it will be interesting to see if ve is a true bmw rival. im willing to bet its far better value even if it comes up just short of the mark.

[Speedy Gonzales]

Rick76 - I dont recall ever saying the VE was crap, you are putting words into my mouth, when I sat in it, it just didnt look, feel or function using your words up to scratch to other cars I have driven, difficult to put into words a feeling. It felt cheap. If the Commodore has plans to go global, it has to compete against cars that are of much better standard for the same pricing.

The info display and dials, is Audi ish yet still not quite there, doesnt look as legible with the green lighting and the pixel resolution, door trims, seats, centre console doesnt give that intuitive feel like a cockpit setup where the driver feels like a pilot and everything designed with the driver as primary focus.

In previous models, driver focus was a main concern, being more of a drivers car.

Even the look and functionality of the steering wheel, the bottom section should be one spoke instead of 2 separate spokes imo making it look more integrated and driver applicable.

Just made me feel uncomfortable because it didnt meet what I was expecting.

Maybe I am expecting too much given the amount of money invested, also given what Ive driven, they did a great job with a shoestring budget on the previous platform, now with the financial backing, it seems like the alterations are small. VS-VT the car was just unbelievable, such a massive difference, VZ-VE, the step isnt as great as I was expecting.

No doubts as to whether its a well contructed car or whether it drives nice, whether it meets expectations, thats the Q that only people who are shopping for one can answer. Youll excuse me if I seem indifferent to peoples reactions regarding certain cars as I get to see cars all day every day so its all ho hum the hype. Unless its an LS7.

The Calais V is the level of standard I expect the whole range to start at, but thats the top of the tree so how do you make that standard across the base model?

Ghosn pointed out in the other thread exactly what most ppl are thinking, the interior and exterior of the Calais is spot on, integrated, classy and ergonomic, except for a few things, the steering wheel, the amount of buttons in the centre console and no manual trans option. GMH FFS bring back a manual for the Calais, some people actually enjoy driving their car!!!!

The SS looks like a ricers wet dream with tacked on flared front and rear spoilers, pox wheels and silly striped stickers for the exterior ( might as well get the Blitz, Mugen, Apexi and Trust stickers with neons to match and the ricer drift wings ), the interior is pox with the dash, color coding, and the electronic centre binnacle.

I even asked someone who has zero interest in cars and they said the VE looked like a Falcon, so that confirms the divisiveness on styling. To me it looks like they have tried to take on too many different cues from other cars ie Astra, Falcon, Magna and Camry than say stuff it, this is how it will look and people will know its a Commodore.

Payaya - What are you, 24 and you dont know how big countries are? :lol: Did you finish high school or learn geography? Your an adult bloke, you should know where it is.

RMG mercatile? You are talking about Toyota Corporation, they have as much chance of going bankrupt as Sony Corp, Nippon Denso, Sumitomo Industries or Mitsubishi Corp, very bloody unlikely. You are talking about a country which was reduced to rubble at the end of WW2 with nuclear fallout and devastation which has turned itself into one of the most powerful nations on the globe.

Can you imagine if they decided to build RWD front engined family cars with performance variants, GM and Ford would be in deep crap, they cant compete without Gov handouts, from this aspect, they are lucky Toyota havent bothered to try.

[V8BRUTE]

why assume?? every car reviewed with the ZF six speed has always come up on top! In the Herald Sun is states that the six speed is smooth but is not as good as the ZF box.

I remember reading that the ZF would be offered in the premium VE vehicles. That explains it all.
I am sure the ZF box is good but you are taking the opinion of journalists who have had the best part of an hour or so driving the VE to cast a judgement, we need to wait till the cars are tested head to head or you have sampled the car for yourself :)

I used to work at Mercedes Benz in a past life and I can tell you first hand ZF parts are worth more than gold and I will stick to GM boxes for this very reason alone, I would be very surprised if Holden used a ZF box when the parent company is the biggest manufacturer or transmissions in the world ;)

[jaykay]

I pick mine up on the 15th August Black on Black 20 inch rims lowered
Did you get the stripe option on yours ? Not sure if they are a sticker or painted.

I'm trying to stay away from black after all the negative comments from previous black car owners and detailers, but they do look hot. Look forward to seeing your pics when you get it... They may just sway me back in black .....

I'm seeing an Impulse Blue SSV on Monday.

[payaya]

Rick76 - Payaya - What are you, 24 and you dont know how big countries are? :lol: Did you finish high school or learn geography? Your an adult bloke, you should know where it is.

RMG mercatile? You are talking about Toyota Corporation, they have as much chance of going bankrupt as Sony Corp, Nippon Denso, Sumitomo Industries or Mitsubishi Corp, very bloody unlikely. You are talking about a country which was reduced to rubble at the end of WW2 with nuclear fallout and devastation which has turned itself into one of the most powerful nations on the globe.

Can you imagine if they decided to build RWD front engined family cars with performance variants, GM and Ford would be in deep crap, they cant compete without Gov handouts, from this aspect, they are lucky Toyota havent bothered to try.

I did not know which contry he was referring to. I thought he was comparing the size of the USA to QLD. I know how big the countries are.

[VX SS]

Did you get the stripe option on yours ? Not sure if they are a sticker or painted.

I'm trying to stay away from black after all the negative comments from previous black car owners and detailers, but they do look hot. Look forward to seeing your pics when you get it... They may just sway me back in black .....

I'm seeing an Impulse Blue SSV on Monday.

Stripes only come in black apparently so no good on a black car

Besides I wasnt fussed to have them anyway

[jaykay]

Stripes only come in black apparently so no good on a black car

Besides I wasnt fussed to have them anyway
You can get black or silver stripe options only. Good luck, look forward to seeing it...

John

[Ls1CorpCruiser]

hope this works...
here are the pics of the WM my neighbour is driving at the moment...

looks sweeeeeet.........:love: :love: :love:

http://www.e-wire.net.au/~eb_recci/r/P1010069.JPG

http://www.e-wire.net.au/~eb_recci/r/P1010072.JPG

http://www.e-wire.net.au/~eb_recci/r/P1010073.JPG

http://www.e-wire.net.au/~eb_recci/r/P1010074.JPG

thanks to Ross for the assistance with hosting too...

Cheers

Rob

[Jimmy2010]

thats hot :drool:

[BadMac]

Can you imagine if they decided to build RWD front engined family cars with performance variants, GM and Ford would be in deep crap, they cant compete without Gov handouts, from this aspect, they are lucky Toyota havent bothered to try.

They have been for many years and GM/Ford aren't in the crap(yet). See if you can figure it out.

[HSE2]

that is the nicest of the VE models for my money. Very nice

[Ausmartin1]

Looks great,

Balance weights must on the inside.
What are tyre experts thoughts on sucessfully blalancing a wheel using only the inside - is it done sucessfully ?
I thought you need to balance inner outer for true perfection ?

[EfiJy]

Can you imagine if they decided to build RWD front engined family cars with performance variants, GM and Ford would be in deep crap, they cant compete without Gov handouts, from this aspect, they are lucky Toyota havent bothered to try.



mate thats an ignorant statement. if you are prepared to type a letter of substance then at least look at your facts in more detail. you say gm and ford will be in the crap if toyota waves its magic wand? well imagine how strong gm and ford would be if they were allowed to close factories in line with market demand in the us. look at how the japanese govt artificially keeps the yen low to keep jap exports competitive. look at how toyota have been ignoring recalls to the tune of millions of cars. look at how little tax toyota australia pay because of understated profits (speculation i know). you make it sound like toyota can do no wrong. if you dont like the ve or gm cars thats fine, you have an opinon like everybody else but dont ram it down the noses of those who questioned your reasoning. we know you dont like ve and in the last post you were far more constructive than your other posts. ffs give ve a chance by driving one before you cast aspersions on what could be the best ever locally made vehicle.

yibba yibba yandare :wave:

[payaya]

Toyota do have a performance car in the pipeline and by the sounds of it its going to be 350kw+. Its going to be a competitor to the GTR so its also going to be expensive. I believe $100000.00+ is possible.

[Guzzles]

jeez, I was so excited by the exhaust note watching those videos, until I noticed that the SS-V only had a single (large) pipe on each side ... something tells me that the cars in that video do not have the standard exhaust system, and that the cars they sell will be just as boring and quiet as previous models

But hopefully I'm wrong, because they sound awesome on the videos.

Andrew.

THE EXHAUST SOUND IN THE VIDEO WITH THE SUPERCAR DRIVERS IS THE REAL SOUND!:woohoo:

The red car with the two single outlets going through the corner in a SV6. It also makes a V6 sound.

The SS V A6 the supercar drivers were driving is Impulse blue coloured.

I can tell you because i have the small videos off the Media CD, Ryzz uploaded. The Holden clip uses these small clips.
They left out the Impulse SS V going sideways through the same bend , though.

all supercar driver videos here:click (http://www.excelerate.com.au/downloads/ls1/ve/03%20Multimedia/1.%20VE%20Car%20Showcase/03.%20V8%20Supercars%20Drive%20Day%20Mpegs/)
I captured a few screenshots of the cars in the vids

This is the SS V they drive in the vid, obviously quad exhausts
note the number plate: SSV-06
http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Guzzles/ssv1.jpg

This is the red car, SV6 with SV6 badging and dual exhausts
note the plate: SV-602
http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Guzzles/sv61-1.jpg

[jaykay]

[QUOTE=Ls1CorpCruiser]hope this works...
here are the pics of the WM my neighbour is driving at the moment...

looks sweeeeeet.........:love: :love: :love:


If that is what the Holden version is, Can't imagine how good the Grange will be ???? :cool:

[BadMac]

Heres some pics from the drive day (02/08). Just random from the GM Media website.

http://images.cainer.net//uploads/14537-385 small.jpg

http://images.cainer.net//uploads/drive day 0208 small.jpg

http://images.cainer.net//uploads/drive day 0208 testing gear small.jpg

http://images.cainer.net//uploads/drive day 0208 calais small.jpg

http://images.cainer.net//uploads/14537-302 small.jpg

http://images.cainer.net//uploads/14537-089 small.jpg

[Lofty]

Does anyone have a pdf brochure on the SSV?

[jaykay]

Does anyone have a pdf brochure on the SSV?
Try this Lofty...

http://www.excelerate.com.au/downloads/XLR8V8/CommodoreBrochure.pdf

John

[jaykay]

Any more of the SSV ???? :teach:

[Speedy Gonzales]

mate thats an ignorant statement. if you are prepared to type a letter of substance then at least look at your facts in more detail. you say gm and ford will be in the crap if toyota waves its magic wand? well imagine how strong gm and ford would be if they were allowed to close factories in line with market demand in the us. look at how the japanese govt artificially keeps the yen low to keep jap exports competitive. look at how toyota have been ignoring recalls to the tune of millions of cars. look at how little tax toyota australia pay because of understated profits (speculation i know). you make it sound like toyota can do no wrong. if you dont like the ve or gm cars thats fine, you have an opinon like everybody else but dont ram it down the noses of those who questioned your reasoning. we know you dont like ve and in the last post you were far more constructive than your other posts. ffs give ve a chance by driving one before you cast aspersions on what could be the best ever locally made vehicle.



How can I explain it to someone who gives the impression they are not willing to debate reasonably? Do I even bother?

Did you read my post? Youre not a closet ricer are you? And people wonder why the forum members give attitude? Can you see why? Im not going to explain it again just because you dont understand. Relax, and take it with a grain of salt, I dont have bias to any manufacturer, unlike YOURSELF, I just like driving a nice car, simple as that. Nice is a perception to everyone which is different.

And you make it sound like GM can do no wrong, Im sure if you google GM and car issues, you will find a mega list, same for any other manufacturer. And GM do make nice cars, Im sure if you look around there is proof.

Where have I rammed it down your throat? Where have I said I hate GM cars? Rick76 has asked politely what I found crap, and I have outlined the things that fall short, who knows what impresses who, who cares? Its just my view. You dont have to like it.

Never underestimate the determination of the Japanese people was the gist of my reference to how they conduct business and how they have become a global force to be reckoned with. Poor corporate behaviour happens with many corporations, corporations are in it to make profits. Bottom line.

My posts are indifferent, if someone asks me my take on it, Ill lay it out no holds barred, its my contribution, see the 2 words under my user name, then look at the words under your user name, says alot about yourself. What is your occupation may I ask? Yobbo? That speaks volumes :lol:

You dont seem like a person who is educated, rational or polite, when it comes to reasonable debate, and Im not going to bother trying to explain to people of your ilk, all they do is mouth off, got nothing better to do than to insult or goad members (who have accomplished goals or reasonable opinions) due to small person syndrome. Fark politeness in your case, wheres my desert eagle :kill:

[jaykay]

How can I explain it to someone who gives the impression they are not willing to debate reasonably? Do I even bother?

Did you read my post? Youre not a closet ricer are you? And people wonder why the forum members give attitude? Can you see why? Im not going to explain it again just because you dont understand. Relax, and take it with a grain of salt, I dont have bias to any manufacturer, unlike YOURSELF, I just like driving a nice car, simple as that. Nice is a perception to everyone which is different.

And you make it sound like GM can do no wrong, Im sure if you google GM and car issues, you will find a mega list, same for any other manufacturer. And GM do make nice cars, Im sure if you look around there is proof.

Where have I rammed it down your throat? Where have I said I hate GM cars? Rick76 has asked politely what I found crap, and I have outlined the things that fall short, who knows what impresses who, who cares? Its just my view. You dont have to like it.

Never underestimate the determination of the Japanese people was the gist of my reference to how they conduct business and how they have become a global force to be reckoned with. Poor corporate behaviour happens with many corporations, corporations are in it to make profits. Bottom line.

My posts are indifferent, if someone asks me my take on it, Ill lay it out no holds barred, its my contribution, see the 2 words under my user name, then look at the words under your user name, says alot about yourself. What is your occupation may I ask? Yobbo? That speaks volumes :lol:

You dont seem like a person who is educated, rational or polite, when it comes to reasonable debate, and Im not going to bother trying to explain to people of your ilk, all they do is mouth off, got nothing better to do than to insult or goad members (who have accomplished goals or reasonable opinions) due to small person syndrome. Fark politeness in your case, wheres my desert eagle :kill:
On that note.....

More VE pics please.... :wave:

[Guzzles]

Any more of the SSV ???? :teach:
a few more(not all ssv)
http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Guzzles/VE/14537-056%20(Large).jpg
http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Guzzles/VE/14537-167%20(Large).jpg
http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Guzzles/VE/14537-281%20(Large).jpg
http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Guzzles/VE/14537-298%20(Large).jpg
http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Guzzles/VE/14537-045%20(Large).jpg
http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Guzzles/VE/14537-320%20(Large).jpg

[AndrewW]

THE EXHAUST SOUND IN THE VIDEO WITH THE SUPERCAR DRIVERS IS THE REAL SOUND!:woohoo:


awesome news, sorry for the mistake.

I'll still wait until I hear one in the flesh before I believe that they sound that good from the factory, been taken in by marketing spin too many times in the past ;)

Andrew.

[monaroCountry1]

Look I dont want to bag the Falcon in any way or form. It is a great car.

However the previous generation commodore was a far bigger seller than the AU-BA. What makes you think a better version of the Commodore cant win against an aging BA (when even the previous commo can)?

Face it the Falcon is an old hat. Good luck to them.

[payaya]

it all comes down to loyalty! There are way more Holden Supporters out there.

Holden have done a good Job dragging out the shelf life of their V series commodores. The BF is the better car no one can deny it, but thats life isnt it!

I've driven many V series commodores and seriously it really shows its a dated platform! Dont even get me started on that 4 speed!

[vt350phantom]

I'll have my old VT over any ford. Still havent made up my mind about VE, but then again havent driven one, so my opinion is reserved for the time being

[payaya]

thats your opinion and I respect that.

[Lofty]

Thanks John.

Im glad that i didnt end up with a VZ clubby after all.

[lowriding]

it all comes down to loyalty! There are way more Holden Supporters out there.

rubbish !:teach:


Holden have done a good Job dragging out the shelf life of their V series commodores. The BF is the better car no one can deny it, but thats life isnt it!

Believe me if the AU wasn't a complete flop Ford would be still dragging the AU series 8 today ,and probably still with a live rear axle .They tried it on and the sales reflected their half arsed approach. Yep the BF is generally better than the VY/VZ ,but not by a margin as it should be considering the money Ford has used developing the AU (unbeleivably over $1 billion there) and further premature investment required by the unsuccessful sales of AU to morph into BA (another $500 million). And after all the $$ spent on this cycle,Ford still need to address ongoing quality and reliabilty issues.Not good when put into perspective.


a few more(not all ssv)
Those VE pictures look great - i didnt notice that SS and SS-v had different tailights .Must of missed that. Look better in SS actually !

[F6Mauz]

Took a good look over and found what I reckon is the only carry over part. The plastic clips holding the sound dedener under the bonnet.



From what i've read the indicator stalks are carryover also.

[BadMac]

From what i've read the indicator stalks are carryover also.

I don't have a VZ so can't tell. Heres a picture. If it is carryover, it looks good, way better than my VX one!

http://images.cainer.net//uploads/172_L_m.jpg

[Carby]

Your a clown for thinking that! In comparisons the I6 has always been hailed as the better engine. If you truely believe the Ford motor is crap because with all the technology put into it it only puts out another 5kw then thats obviously a sign of someone who does not know much about engines.

A lot of technology is put into an engine to make it smoother and produce more power at lower revs. There are so many factors which influence the characteristics of an engine its not funny!

I have a car thats 2.0L and produces 147KW and revs to 8500RPM. So does that make the alloytech a dud??? No it does not. Certain engines are made the way they are to suit certain cars. Each engine is good in their own way.

So if you truely believe in comparisons put into consideration the torque figure, earlier in the rev range and thats your extra technology.


You missed the point completely - suffice ro say, the Holden gets the job done using a smaller motor.

[F6 Hoon]

The VE is a nice looking car. I'll be keen to test drive one when the opportunity arrises. I doubt the BF is better than the VE; Holden have done their homework and released a great car from all accounts.

Lucky for me by the time I consider upgrading my BF F6 auto Ford will have released the new Falcon in '08, giving me a good choice between either manufacturer.

[SCiFiRE]

yeah its carryover.

i still prefer steering wheel controls, like on my TS astra. but whatever, no biggie.

looks to me like the manual gearknob is carryover too. The mirrors are definatly NOT, even though alot of people thought they were with the spy photos

[SJM HSV]

Hi Guys First Post. Found This In Our Local Holden Dealer Yesterday (already Sold). Hope This Works

CLICK ON PHOTO'S TO ENLARGE




http://f10.putfile.com/thumb/8/21622332570.jpg (http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=main/8/21622332570.jpg&s=f10)http://f10.putfile.com/thumb/8/21622341170.jpg (http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=main/8/21622341170.jpg&s=f10)http://f10.putfile.com/thumb/8/21622350561.jpg (http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=main/8/21622350561.jpg&s=f10)http://f10.putfile.com/thumb/8/21622361697.jpg (http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=main/8/21622361697.jpg&s=f10)http://f10.putfile.com/thumb/8/21622370546.jpg (http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=main/8/21622370546.jpg&s=f10)http://f10.putfile.com/thumb/8/21622380145.jpg (http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=main/8/21622380145.jpg&s=f10)

[Goggles]

already posted in one of the VE sticky threads (VE SSV Part 3), however makes a good comparison with the VZ next to it.

[mad.ed]

What an UGLY MOTHER F**CKER , Holden astra that has taken too many steroids.

[Cainer]

cant wait to see one of these in the flesh

[vecommo]

Believe me if the AU wasn't a complete flop Ford would be still dragging the AU series 8 today ,and probably still with a live rear axle .They tried it on and the sales reflected their half arsed approach. Yep the BF is generally better than the VY/VZ ,but not by a margin as it should be considering the money Ford has used developing the AU (unbeleivably over $1 billion there) and further premature investment required by the unsuccessful sales of AU to morph into BA (another $500 million). And after all the $$ spent on this cycle,Ford still need to address ongoing quality and reliabilty issues.Not good when put into perspective.

Very well said. This is something people often overlooked when comparing BA/BF to VY/VZ. When Holden released the VY, they were going along with their usual model cycle and released a minor update, while Ford very prematurely brought out an almost all new car. How is that a fair comparison?
What I would like to know is how Ford are managing to pay back these investments...$1 billion for AU, $500 million for the BA, $500 million for the Territory, yet all have had either mediocre or less than projected sales.
I think Ford will be on the back foot for a long time now. Face it, I don't care what people say but I think the VE makes the BF look like the VT made the EL. You would have to be either a penny pincher or a blind one eyed Ford supporter to buy a BF over a VE.
The new 08 Falcon will be essentially a modified BF with a new body, which means that in 08 it will still be based on what is essentially a 1998 platform which itself dates back to the 60's and 70's. In contrast, Holden has a fresh clean sheet platform with far more potential and versatility.

[vt350phantom]

What an UGLY MOTHER F**CKER , Holden astra that has taken too many steroids.

I don't really want to admit it but I think I agree

[SS_Fury]

very good comparison to the vz next to it...i like em, makes the vz look dated

[VE06]

Very well said. This is something people often overlooked when comparing BA/BF to VY/VZ. When Holden released the VY, they were going along with their usual model cycle and released a minor update, while Ford very prematurely brought out an almost all new car. How is that a fair comparison?
What I would like to know is how Ford are managing to pay back these investments...$1 billion for AU, $500 million for the BA, $500 million for the Territory, yet all have had either mediocre or less than projected sales.
I think Ford will be on the back foot for a long time now. Face it, I don't care what people say but I think the VE makes the BF look like the VT made the EL. You would have to be either a penny pincher or a blind one eyed Ford supporter to buy a BF over a VE.
The new 08 Falcon will be essentially a modified BF with a new body, which means that in 08 it will still be based on what is essentially a 1998 platform which itself dates back to the 60's and 70's. In contrast, Holden has a fresh clean sheet platform with far more potential and versatility.

mate thats spot on, unlike some elitist BS that has been posted recently in here.

[shockwavexr6na]

Very well said. This is something people often overlooked when comparing BA/BF to VY/VZ. When Holden released the VY, they were going along with their usual model cycle and released a minor update, while Ford very prematurely brought out an almost all new car. How is that a fair comparison?
What I would like to know is how Ford are managing to pay back these investments...$1 billion for AU, $500 million for the BA, $500 million for the Territory, yet all have had either mediocre or less than projected sales.
I think Ford will be on the back foot for a long time now. Face it, I don't care what people say but I think the VE makes the BF look like the VT made the EL. You would have to be either a penny pincher or a blind one eyed Ford supporter to buy a BF over a VE.
The new 08 Falcon will be essentially a modified BF with a new body, which means that in 08 it will still be based on what is essentially a 1998 platform which itself dates back to the 60's and 70's. In contrast, Holden has a fresh clean sheet platform with far more potential and versatility.

Bullshit... Based on Australian built sales Ford is outdoing holden by roughly 1500 cars a month. As for anyone buying a BF over the VE you'll be suprised at how poorly the VE does do in the current market, BF still gets great reviews in all the magazines and news papers. Some journos are even saying it still better then VE. I know a few Holden guys that have just rushed out and bought VZs as they think the new car is less then exciting, that just shows how poorly Holden have done.

The 08 Falcon is a new car from the ground up, essentially all Commodores / Falcons are based on earlier platforms in some form or another as there is some form of carry over. My BA XR6 (which i no longer have) was a better looking car then the VE SV6 and was just well equiped.

As for Holden, I hope they have some room for discounting come Nov / Dec this year, the BF Series II which will see some great changes to combat the VE will shock a few, its more then just a minor face lift. The BF makes the VE look 4 years too late! Then you have the issue of the utes, no upgrade till late next year, wheres that going to leave Holdens ute sales? Id prefer to go and buy a current model falcon ute with a 6 speed auto then a dated VZ ute.

What about fleet pricing to, ive heard of ORIX and others canceling forward VE Orders based on fleet pricing released, putting most of the VE line $4000 more expensive then the comparable BF models.

[EfiJy]

Bullshit... Some journos are even saying it still better then VE.

i think you aptly described your post. :weirdo:

[SICK SS]

Bullshit... Based on Australian built sales Ford is outdoing holden by roughly 1500 cars a month. As for anyone buying a BF over the VE you'll be suprised at how poorly the VE does do in the current market, BF still gets great reviews in all the magazines and news papers. Some journos are even saying it still better then VE. I know a few Holden guys that have just rushed out and bought VZs as they think the new car is less then exciting, that just shows how poorly Holden have done.

The 08 Falcon is a new car from the ground up, essentially all Commodores / Falcons are based on earlier platforms in some form or another as there is some form of carry over. My BA XR6 (which i no longer have) was a better looking car then the VE SV6 and was just well equiped.

As for Holden, I hope they have some room for discounting come Nov / Dec this year, the BF Series II which will see some great changes to combat the VE will shock a few, its more then just a minor face lift. The BF makes the VE look 4 years too late! Then you have the issue of the utes, no upgrade till late next year, wheres that going to leave Holdens ute sales? Id prefer to go and buy a current model falcon ute with a 6 speed auto then a dated VZ ute.

What about fleet pricing to, ive heard of ORIX and others canceling forward VE Orders based on fleet pricing released, putting most of the VE line $4000 more expensive then the comparable BF models.


you poor poor ford man:weirdo:

[Dacious]

Mr Shockwave, try the following straight from the SMH:

Sales of new cars dip 1.4% in July - 3rd Aug 2006 (http://www.smh.com.au/news/Business/Sales-of-new-cars-dip-14-in-July/2006/08/03/1154198249380.html)


With Holden running out its current model Commodore in preparation for first sales of the new model in August, the Toyota Corolla took over the mantle of Australia's top selling model in July.

Toyota sold 4,711 Corollas last month compared to 4,022 for the Commodore and 3,951 for the Ford Falcon.

Note Holden haven't built VZ sedans for, oh, nearly two months? Even in runout, with low dealer stocks, even though it's such a dreadful dated, crap, horrible car, even though fleets haven't been able to order them it still outsells Falcons. If there was a time when Ford should be making hay while the sun shines, it's now. Seems the market is waiting to see which it likes.

The 6-speed auto BF Ute - yes terribly advanced with it's horse-and buggy rearend.

[VE06]

complete, utter Ford fanboi rubbish (shockwave)

[Dacious]

What an UGLY MOTHER F**CKER , Holden astra that has taken too many steroids.

Obviously another thought-free zone. :clown:

[EfiJy]

shockwave must be the ford person who sent all those spam emails to every tom dick and harry. :limpy:

[Sting]

Just changing the subject a little, I have read somewhere that the 5L40 5-Speed Auto will be replaced by the 6L50 6-Speed Auto for V6 models in mid
'07.
If true, we may be able to buy 6-Speed Auto V6's (at least on premium models). Also, it may improve performance and economy and be able to stick it up to the BF 6-speed auto I6 Falcons.

[Ghia351]

What I would like to know is how Ford are managing to pay back these investments...$1 billion for AU, $500 million for the BA, $500 million for the Territory, yet all have had either mediocre or less than projected sales.

by using their low interest rate credit card......this thread is heading down the drain faster then a "polywaffle" in a whirlpool.

[vecommo]

Bullshit... Based on Australian built sales Ford is outdoing holden by roughly 1500 cars a month.

Only including the Territory. Commodore still outsells Falcon plain and simple. If you added exports then Ford wouldn't come near selling as many Australian built cars as Holden.
I'm sure Holden would be in a far better financial position than Ford. Holden had many years of profits with VT-VZ, while Ford had nothing but loss after loss after loss, followed by heavy investments in products which only increased sales fractionally. It doesn't take an accountant to work that one out.


As for anyone buying a BF over the VE you'll be suprised at how poorly the VE does do in the current market
So you can sit here and tell me how the VE is going to sell? Do you have a crystal ball or something?

BF still gets great reviews in all the magazines and news papers. Some journos are even saying it still better then VE.
AHH HA HA, what a crock of s**t!! Show me one article where that was stated.

I know a few Holden guys that have just rushed out and bought VZs as they think the new car is less then exciting, that just shows how poorly Holden have done.
Oh well, it's their loss. As the VE isn't even in showrooms yet, it can be assumed that they haven't even seen a VE in the flesh yet let alone driven one. They will be kicking themselves soon, you'll see,


The 08 Falcon is a new car from the ground up, essentially all Commodores / Falcons are based on earlier platforms in some form or another as there is some form of carry over.
Get your facts straight before posting. It is common knowledge that the 08 Falcon will be using a slightly modified carryover of the BA/BF platform. The VE platform is a clean sheet design - nothing is carried over from previous Commodores.


My BA XR6 (which i no longer have) was a better looking car then the VE SV6 and was just well equiped..
That is a matter of opinion. I'm sure not many people out there would agree.



The BF makes the VE look 4 years too late!.. :limpy: One can only laugh.:lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: The VE makes the BF look 1990's.




Then you have the issue of the utes, no upgrade till late next year, wheres that going to leave Holdens ute sales? Id prefer to go and buy a current model falcon ute with a 6 speed auto then a dated VZ ute.
VZ ute dated? That's a bit rich considering the BF ute has basically the same underpinnings as an XD!


What about fleet pricing to, ive heard of ORIX and others canceling forward VE Orders based on fleet pricing released, putting most of the VE line $4000 more expensive then the comparable BF models.
All hearsay, no real facts.

[AusCalais]

shockwave must be the ford person who sent all those spam emails to every tom dick and harry. :limpy:

I don't think so... the spam was reasonably well crafted (if not a little misleading) and certainly smelt of a Marketing Dept's rear-guard action...the shockwave post was just a little head-in-the-sand rubbish....he knows Ford will be caned for the next 14-18 mths until the next real update comes out and they can also whip the Australian motoring journalists into a frenzy.

[VE06]

by using their low interest rate credit card......this thread is heading down the drain faster then a "polywaffle" in a whirlpool.

only because some clown was bored and decided to start posting myths about something which he knows nothing about.

But back on topic...

[Ghia351]

only because some clown was bored and decided to start posting myths about something which he knows nothing about.

But back on topic...
So you work for Ford or Holden?

[VE06]

So you work for Ford or Holden?

You wouldn't need to work for holden or ford to know that what shockwave posted smacked of desparation. Look at vecommo's reply. Exposes it for what it is.

[V8BRUTE]

I love these Holden versus Ford battles, its great that we have two manufacturers in this country with such loyal supporters on both sides, I for one am a Holden guy but can appreciate the Falcon being a damn good car and hope it does continue to sell well along side the VE range, we need both of these companies to survive and keep making us cars that drive well and are more than whitegoods on wheels, also to keep the Aussies employed building them :yup:

I couldn't care less for Toyota as they will survive regardless, they could build a giant turd with wheels and people will still buy them but they will never be as good a drive or evoke as much emotion as a Holden or Ford product in this country, thats the way it has been for 40-50 years and will continue on for may years :clown:

[shockwavexr6na]

Only including the Territory. Commodore still outsells Falcon plain and simple. If you added exports then Ford wouldn't come near selling as many Australian built cars as Holden.
I'm sure Holden would be in a far better financial position than Ford. Holden had many years of profits with VT-VZ, while Ford had nothing but loss after loss after loss, followed by heavy investments in products which only increased sales fractionally. It doesn't take an accountant to work that one out.


So you can sit here and tell me how the VE is going to sell? Do you have a crystal ball or something?

AHH HA HA, what a crock of s**t!! Show me one article where that was stated.

Oh well, it's their loss. As the VE isn't even in showrooms yet, it can be assumed that they haven't even seen a VE in the flesh yet let alone driven one. They will be kicking themselves soon, you'll see,


Get your facts straight before posting. It is common knowledge that the 08 Falcon will be using a slightly modified carryover of the BA/BF platform. The VE platform is a clean sheet design - nothing is carried over from previous Commodores.


That is a matter of opinion. I'm sure not many people out there would agree.


:limpy: One can only laugh.:lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: The VE makes the BF look 1990's.




VZ ute dated? That's a bit rich considering the BF ute has basically the same underpinnings as an XD!


All hearsay, no real facts.

Pfft

You think you know it all dont you.

The 08 Falcon will be a full revamp as per the VE was, there will be no sheet metal carry over from the AU/BA/BF, its an all new car.

If any of you were actually in the industry and read any of the GO auto / Drive discussions on the new Car an the comparisons between it and the current BF you would obviously know where I was coming from. Dislikes of the VE.

Massive A-pillars obscure vision through corners.
Four-speed auto is still not up to 2006 standards.
You have to pay extra (albeit not much) for a full-size spare tyre. As someone pointed out, “that’s un-Australian”.
Curtain airbags are still optional on base vehicles.
Air-conditioning still listed as an option on base cars.
Not enough mechanical differentiation between Calais/Calais V and SV6/SS/SS V.
SV6 doesn’t drive as good as it looks.
Heavier bodies take their toll on V6 performance.
Lighter steering not for everyone.
Carryover indicator stalks are an unwanted reminder of VZ.
Shiny plastics looks cheap in places, particularly on the SV6.
Plastic fit on early production cars could be improved, especially the plastic strips on the inside of the windscreen.
The obscure name game that’s seen things like Berlina replace Acclaim, SS replace SV8 and Calais replace Berlina.
Split-fold rear seat is not available.
Rear wing on sports models hinders rear vision.

The only reason Holden still outsells Commodore Vs Falcon is because of their fleet pricing structure. If you actually looked at the private registered cars verse each other you would soon see that Fords sales are predominately Private buyers why Holdens are poverty pack Fleet buyers.

I had planned to buy a VE V8 of some discription but I wont be now, the interior is my biggest gripe.

[shockwavexr6na]

only because some clown was bored and decided to start posting myths about something which he knows nothing about.

But back on topic...

You call it a myth?

Grow up and have a look around.

Yep i know nothing!

:limpy:

[XLR8 V8]

You have differing opinions .... get over it and move on.

[Dacious]

I just got back from the shops in Nepean Highway Cheltenham. Parked outside Bicycle Superstore was UAM454 - the light blue Calais V. V6 by the single outlets each side. Still had the black-painted mule alloys wheels, chrome strip down the side. Had a trailer hitch and towball.

I got to walk all around it. Even though I know it's larger than the old car, looking up the road to my Monaro, the VE looks physically smaller. More like a Vectra-size car. Hides size very well.

It doesn't look like a Falcon. It doesn't look like an Astra or Vectra. It doesn't look like an Audi or 380 or Mazda. I am not ready to swap the Monaro for one, but I might for the two-door when it comes out.

Soundwise it was muted, slight v-throb when he drove off.

[Fnomna]

If any of you were actually in the industry and read any of the GO auto / Drive discussions on the new Car an the comparisons between it and the current BF you would obviously know where I was coming from. Dislikes of the VE.
...
Of course you didn't post a list of 'likes' to present a balanced view, did you?
I'm waiting for MOTOR/Wheels opinions. I think they carry more cred anyway.

[VE06]

You call it a myth?

Grow up and have a look around.

Yep i know nothing!

:limpy:

thats laughable, but coming from a ford fanboi id expect it. Yep you know nothing and you just proved it. You go around every website cutting and pasting what theyve said and then think you're an expert, bravo well done. Nice to know you read the net.

[Dilan]

thats laughable, but coming from a ford fanboi id expect it. Yep you know nothing and you just proved it. You go around every website cutting and pasting what theyve said and then think you're an expert, bravo well done. Nice to know you read the net.
I hope you know that you are comming across as a fanboy as well and this is the first time I have read one of your posts. I am sure that all the members would agree that you as well as Shockwave have shown how stupid you are! Even I know that the 08 falcon will be a new platform, are you 13 or something?

[Marco]

How good does that black one look? I didn't think black would suit the new shape but I thought wrong.

Right, put black back on the list of colours I'll consider :)

[FunkyPig]

I have read articles where the Ford boss himself says in a round about way the current Falcon platform will carry over, perhaps altered significantly, but what's clear, is the the Orion is not on a new platform.

[HSE2]

I don’t think there are too many people in a position to be talking about the 08 Falcon. Don’t get too sucked in with this claim about all new design. Chassis development for our cars are evolutions. Unless you want to get under the bloody things and start measuring to the mm it’s a point less argument.

To say one platform dates back to the 60s is like ignoring the heritage of the wheel, completely pointless. While I haven't looked under a VE I suspect its like everything that has come before it. Two rails from which sub frames are attached. Stretching it and reposition is a clean sheet design? The last time I saw a clean sheet design applied it involved extruded aluminium bonding and rivets to replace spot welds. As far as I know VE hasn't gone down that path.


And it doesn't need to. Just as the BA represented an increase in stiffness over AU so to have the VE over the VZ. That’s it. To say one is better then another on age is childish. Nearly all things automotive have origins that trace back many a year.

[VE06]

I hope you know that you are comming across as a fanboy as well and this is the first time I have read one of your posts. I am sure that all the members would agree that you as well as Shockwave have shown how stupid you are! Even I know that the 08 falcon will be a new platform, are you 13 or something?

lol omg. :weirdo: Havent you got your toys to play with little fella?


.......the Ford boss himself says in a round about way the current Falcon platform will carry over, perhaps altered significantly, but what's clear, is the the Orion is not on a new platform.

nah its not, its an all-new platform. Just as dilan said :limpy:

[vecommo]

I hope you know that you are comming across as a fanboy as well and this is the first time I have read one of your posts. I am sure that all the members would agree that you as well as Shockwave have shown how stupid you are! Even I know that the 08 falcon will be a new platform, are you 13 or something?
Umm, I think you'd have some egg on your face after posting this ^^.:doh:

I have read articles where the Ford boss himself says in a round about way the current Falcon platform will carry over, perhaps altered significantly, but what's clear, is the the Orion is not on a new platform.

[Wezza]

My BA XR6 (which i no longer have) was a better looking car then the VE SV6
According to whom?? It's all a matter of opinion.

[paulvdb]

Pfft
The 08 Falcon will be a full revamp as per the VE was, there will be no sheet metal carry over from the AU/BA/BF, its an all new car.

There's more to a car than sheet metal. VS to VT was new sheet metal but not a new platform. VE is a new platform. I'm not that sure that Orion will be anything more than a new body over the existing platform. Realistically though, this is pretty unimportant.

Re your other points (and yes I've driven Falcons, and own a Territory), you could easily say about the Falcons...
Massive A-pillars obscure vision through corners.
Four-speed auto is still not up to 2006 standards.
Curtain airbags are still optional on base vehicles.
Not enough mechanical differentiation between Fairmont and XT/XR6NA.
XR6 doesn’t drive as good as it looks.
Heavier bodies take their toll on I6 performance.
Old-fashioned steering system not for everyone (excluding the Terri)
Shiny plastics looks cheap in places, particularly on any model.
Plastic fit on all production cars could be improved, especially the plastic strips on the door handles.
The obscure name game that’s seen things like Futura.
Rear wing on sports models hinders rear vision.

Essentially none of these cars sell in BMW/Merc quantities so we shouldn't expect that they will be perfect for under $40k - that's simply not realistic.

[vecommo]

Curtain airbags are still optional on base vehicles.
Curtain airbags are not available on the Falcon full stop.

[VE06]

There's more to a car than sheet metal. VS to VT was new sheet metal on a revised existing platform. VE is a totally new platform. I'm not that sure that Orion will be anything more than a new body over the existing platform. Realistically though, this is pretty unimportant.

Re your other points (and yes I've driven Falcons, and own a Territory), you could easily say about the Falcons...
Massive A-pillars obscure vision through corners.
Four-speed auto is still not up to 2006 standards.
Curtain airbags are not available on any model (excluding Terri)
Not enough mechanical differentiation between Fairmont and XT/XR6NA.
XR6 doesn’t drive as good as it looks.
Heavier bodies take their toll on I6 performance.
Old-fashioned steering system not for everyone (excluding the Terri)
Shiny plastics looks cheap in places, particularly on any model.
Plastic fit on all production cars could be improved, especially the plastic strips on the door handles.
The obscure name game that’s seen things like Futura.
Rear wing on sports models hinders rear vision.

Essentially none of these cars sell in BMW/Merc quantities so we shouldn't expect that they will be perfect for under $40k - that's simply not realistic.

just a couple of adjustments, i hope you dont mind :)