Sydney P Plate Passenger Rule

[jas_the_ace]

WTF!!!!!!!!!!!

Read in the paper yesterday that there is a new rule going into effect from July.

All P-Platers from 11pm to 5:30am or something are only allowed 1 passenger in the car...

This is f***ing bull****.

Where can i find the idiot that proposed this crap, and beat the crap out of him. :errr:

[NickS]

Your reply has shown exactly why this sort of rule is necessary ... :rolleyes:

P platers are generally VERY average drivers, the problem is they all think they are exceptional drivers. I'll ask you again in 10 years if you think you know how to drive well and are capable of keeping a level head at the age of 17.

Hasn't school gone back yet ...

[jas_the_ace]

I'm a first year IT apprentice mate.

[VYBerlinaV8]

Not driving your mates around in the early hours is not going to kill you. Get over it. A bit of experience and maturity is a good thing.

Isn't a drivers license supposed to be a privilege rather than a right?

[MickNugent]

Yeah its a load of shit...

Dont worry though when everyone gos to the pub youll just have to ALL drive home. No designated driver for you blokes...

[T_Kiwi]

i reckon they should have the same rule as NZ. no driving between 10pm and 5am. the 1 passenger thing is a bit silly i think. most hooning is done after dark late at night so keep them off the roads. to all the P platers who do know wrong, dobb in the ones you see doing wrong.

[mido2k]

I'll admit some of the new rules they are proposing are good, others are a bit " how ya going"....

This whole no passengers after 11pm.......

You mean to say in years to come if my daughter goes out with her friends, and someone is the designated driver if they come home after 11pm there is the possibility she will get left behind or have to find an alternate method?

That's crap

[T_Kiwi]

I'll admit some of the new rules they are proposing are good, others are a bit " how ya going"....

This whole no passengers after 11pm.......

You mean to say in years to come if my daughter goes out with her friends, and someone is the designated driver if they come home after 11pm there is the possibility she will get left behind or have to find an alternate method?

That's crap


any descent mates would get your daughter home before 11pm mate, and if they didnt then they arent good mates, dont you agree?

[all4ford]

Yeah its a load of shit...

Dont worry though when everyone gos to the pub youll just have to ALL drive home. No designated driver for you blokes...

This is my biggest problem with this bull shit new law. How are people meant to get home from pubs and clubs late at night?

Every Friday and Saturday night, me and my friends take turns of being designated driver, so the others can drink, now we're left with what choices?

You cant expect everyone to fork out for a taxi, if you can even get one in most towns.

I'd like to see what all you blokes who been there and done that would say if your "privilege" was infringed upon.

[JNP304]

It will encourage more drink driving if anything. Instead of car pooling everyone will have to drive. And also instead of one or two cars cruising in a group it may be double or triple the number of "bad boy hoon p-platers" on the road at those hours because they will all get there cars out as I dont think many will want to stay home while only 2 mates go out on the town.
Not all P-Platers are dickheads, we were all there once. Live and let live. People who are caught doing burnouts ect should have the passenger restriction placed on them for wrong doing. Innocent until proven guilty for the rest of the p-plate motorists. If they play up then impose individual restrictions on them

[fyreblade2000]

WTF!!!!!!!!!!!

Read in the paper yesterday that there is a new rule going into effect from July.

All P-Platers from 11pm to 5:30am or something are only allowed 1 passenger in the car...

This is f***ing bull****.

Where can i find the idiot that proposed this crap, and beat the crap out of him. :errr:


Seriously your NOT gonna win ALOT of votes here if ANY!.....

...And after what I saw on Sunday (ala P-Plater in a buzzy 4 cyl Hatch which tried to over take me from thwe INSIDE lane with 4 meters to go infront of a stationary Truck!!!)

Your not getting mine!

Sure its harsh but hey The Law is the Law and if statisitcs say that P-Platers are a high risk then you can't argue with statisitcs.

No excuses about "how are we suppose to learn if there is so much restriction...."

There are plenty of Driver ED courses out there you can do. I had too to get both my L's and P for my motorcycle license...same thing should apply to getting your Drivers License aswell.

[chops]

The news report I heard mentioned FIRST YEAR P platers, which would mean for the vast majority it would be people under 18, and therefore drink driving wouldn't be an issue, as they can't legally drink anyway.

[mido2k]

any descent mates would get your daughter home before 11pm mate, and if they didnt then they arent good mates, dont you agree?

I think we will agree to disagree here..
If she is of legal driving age, and goes out, i want to know that she will be coming home with the same people i know and trust to take her out.
I dont want her to have to rely on the "unreliable" public transport system that we have here in sydney.

Again i will reiterate, let her go out with people i KNOW and TRUST and i would expect her to come home the same....

[VooDoo]

Its great news for P Platers. More of them might live to get thier opens now. If anything the rules are too light and licence to easy to get. Much more training is required

[brentonsav]

any descent mates would get your daughter home before 11pm mate, and if they didnt then they arent good mates, dont you agree?

or after 5.30?

it actually might work out quite good
go to pub at 10.30 and leave at 5.30.

;)

i agree with voodoo. training and driver education is the key.
its simply too easy to get a licence in aus. you should here what my norwegian mate has to do to get her licence, its insane.

[T_Kiwi]

I would just like to say that i am 33 and had my lisence since i was 15 in NZ. the no driving between 11pm and 5am has been in since before i got my license and it worked well. trust me, you are giving yourselves away by driving late at night, you will all stick out like dogs balls for cops, you will be doing there job for them and they will be reeling you in. the law is changing and it sux but it used to it. back in my day we all drank at friends houses and pulled up a bit of floor when we needed to sleep. the only time we went to town was for an occasion and we made provisions for it.

[fyreblade2000]

In addition to my response...

In my opion Driver Education (i.e Driver Courses) should definately be considered and a much much much much more Detailed Power restriction rule should apply for l's and P's...

I mean common a P-Plater can't drive those box little poxy copen Cars with 42kw because they are turboéd but a P-Plater can drive a Porche N/A car!!!???? Thats "BenZor"ed if you ask me!!! :weirdo:

[Mr Moosh]

All P-Platers from 11pm to 5:30am or something are only allowed 1 passenger in the car...


Thank god I dont live in Sydney... although I have had my licence for over a year. But its a SH@T idea! Like many others, the first thing I thought of was drink driving, and that will definately increase, and more people will die. There is more chance of crashing when under the influence of booze than when you have a few mates in the car... whats next? Banning stereos cos they are a distraction?

The solution is driving ed and more cops... not a half arsed solution. The target should be crap drivers, not P platers in general.

[MickNugent]

Well all i know is that when i was on my P's i didnt have any dramas despite driving a V8 the whole time. Also id say i was much better off driving round with me mates all night listening to some tunes instead of gettin pissed and punchin on at the pub..

Banning v8s/forced induction didnt work...
This wont work...

But when it doesnt will they admit they were wrong or just make an even stupider rule?

[VX225]

The news report I heard mentioned FIRST YEAR P platers, which would mean for the vast majority it would be people under 18, and therefore drink driving wouldn't be an issue, as they can't legally drink anyway.

Thats exactly what i was thinking. The rules apply to the first year, or red p's. Seeing as though you can get your red p's at age 17, i dont think the "not being able to go to the pub with my mates" argument will really stand up.

[T_Kiwi]

Im sick of seeing replies with the concerns of more drunk drivers out there when law changes, your just re-confirming that you are idiots, you disgust me with your pathetic arguments, grow up and think before you speak P Platers.....

[fyreblade2000]

Im sick of seeing replies with the concerns of more drunk drivers out there when law changes, your just re-confirming that you are idiots, you disgust me with your pathetic arguments, grow up and think before you speak P Platers.....

T,

They're just digging there own grave !:eek:

[jas_the_ace]

im putting forward my opinion. respect it or not. i dont give a shit.

This P plate rule is a crock of crap. For the minority of P platers like me that HAVE had experience (I've done courses such as the Warren Luff school) and know how to control and be normal in a car.

The minority shouldnt be subjected to this crap. There should be some system in which trained drivers like me are treated differently.

Privilege my ass.

My opinion once again.

Cheers

[VooDoo]

Maybe when P platers can show some restraint, stay alive and stop killing themselves and others the rules might relax... then again, we are talking about P Platers....

jas, what makes you think your better than everyone else. Most P platers think they can drive really well and know it all. They still die. Your 17 and far from bulletproof, just arrogant and ill informed.

[Mr Moosh]

Im sick of seeing replies with the concerns of more drunk drivers out there when law changes, your just re-confirming that you are idiots, you disgust me with your pathetic arguments, grow up and think before you speak P Platers.....

Charming...

[jas_the_ace]

I'm not saying im Mark Skaife. But i do know a car's limits and i do know basic things such as not hanging the ass of a Commodore out on a corner.

Sure i'm not a gold licence holder, and i dont have as much as experience as you fellas. All i'm trying to say is that i've had training and i am more experienced than the typical P plater.

[Glenn@Autowerks]

Its just near my place where that red car driven by a P plater was ripped apart a few weeks ago and there were deaths involved. I pass by the heaps of flowers left there on the fence everyday.

It may just be me but there seems to be heaps more P platers on the road lately ? Every time a car flys past me it has P plate on it !!

Two of my kids are about to get their P's, I dont care how hard the laws get, tougher the better cause I wanna see my kids stay alive.

[MickNugent]

Im sick of seeing replies with the concerns of more drunk drivers out there when law changes, your just re-confirming that you are idiots, you disgust me with your pathetic arguments, grow up and think before you speak P Platers.....

Are you blind? There WILL be more P platers DUI with this brought in without doubt.

Prob more people walkin home in sydney gettin stabbed too, that'll be great...

[fyreblade2000]

im putting forward my opinion. respect it or not. i dont give a shit.

This P plate rule is a crock of crap. For the minority of P platers like me that HAVE had experience (I've done courses such as the Warren Luff school) and know how to control and be normal in a car.

The minority shouldnt be subjected to this crap. There should be some system in which trained drivers like me are treated differently.

Privilege my ass.

My opinion once again.

Cheers

Your opion is noted here...

I believe what everyone is trying to say\opinionate is that fact that you are a P-Plater and your License status is not gonna change (until the required time is expired) no matter what you say or do.

In other words (as harsh as it maybe) deal with it and learn from your experience.

All the best to ya.

Drive safe

[jerrel]

I encourage these rules. Its a great excuse to not buy a ute now... as i was planning on getting a ute to avoid taking more then 1 passenger from now on lol.
IMO less ppl in the car will mean less showing off to the driver, and therefore less destroyed powerpoles.
And as for "jas_the_ace", could ur civic even hold more then 1 passenger comfortably?

[jas_the_ace]

Your opion is noted here...

I believe what everyone is trying to say\opinionate is that fact that you are a P-Plater and your License status is not gonna change (until the required time is expired) no matter what you say or do.

In other words (as harsh as it maybe) deal with it and learn from your experience.

All the best to ya.

Drive safe

Thanks mate. :cool:

[T_Kiwi]

Are you blind? There WILL be more P platers DUI with this brought in without doubt.

Prob more people walkin home in sydney gettin stabbed too, that'll be great...

i cant answer to this comment seriously sorry. it just reinforces my previous quote.

[Mr Moosh]

Now all the young rebelious P platers will be catching taxis.... therefore more taxi drivers are gonna get attacked/stabbed/killed. See? The law is pointless.... :nyuk:

[jas_the_ace]

I encourage these rules. Its a great excuse to not buy a ute now... as i was planning on getting a ute to avoid taking more then 1 passenger from now on lol.
IMO less ppl in the car will mean less showing off to the driver, and therefore less destroyed powerpoles.
And as for "jas_the_ace", could ur civic even hold more then 1 passenger comfortably?

It can fit 3 chicks quite fine thanks mate. :fewl:

[bundyvx]

I'm all for these changes. The power to weight ratio for cars doesn't work because any late model family car or smaller still get to speed pretty quick, not like when i started driving 14 years ago. With the 1 passenger rule, it's got to be better than a bunch of drunks all reving each other up. I know its going to suck at first but when everyone gets use to it, then some road statisticts might be avoided.

[T_Kiwi]

Now all the young rebelious P platers will be catching taxis.... therefore more taxi drivers are gonna get attacked/stabbed/killed. See? The law is pointless.... :nyuk:


you make a good point there mate, i propose to put a curfew on anyone 19 (or whatever the age they are when on P's) and under to stay indoors so the country is a safer place, all those who agree say "I"

[Stevotski]

And as for "jas_the_ace", could ur civic even hold more then 1 passenger comfortably?


Not if VTEC kicks in YO! :stick:

seriously these new rules are a good idea. I know that it sucks if you do the right thing but there are too many cars full of dead kids around, killed at night with a p-plate driver.

I think the real problem with increasing deaths with P platers is that the typical P'plate car now is a hell of a lot more powerfull than it was 10 years ago. I had a VB with red 173 on my P's (then a $3k car) with a huge 80kw. Now what can you get for $3K or $4K - a 5.0L VN or VP or a VL turbo !!! (or an AU falcon for that matter)

[jas_the_ace]

Not if VTEC kicks in YO! :stick:

seriously these new rules are a good idea. I know that it sucks if you do the right thing but there are too many cars full of dead kids around, killed at night with a p-plate driver.

I think the real problem with increasing deaths with P platers is that the typical P'plate car now is a hell of a lot more powerfull than it was 10 years ago. I had a VB with red 173 on my P's (then a $3k car) with a huge 80kw. Now what can you get for $3K or $4K - a 5.0L VN or VP or a VL turbo !!!

True that. Even a typical mummy's car like a Magna or dare i say even camry are capable of bein flogged hard.

Lol @ VTEC comment haha

[MickNugent]

i cant answer to this comment seriously sorry. it just reinforces my previous quote.

Refer to your previous quote? Obviously your short some brain cells. How about grow up yourself.

I have a full Victorian licence and i ride a bike so its not going to affect me though it concerns me greatly because i know for sure that this is gonna hurt people i know and care about in ALOT of possible ways.

Im actually very suprised that it seems the majority of the forum is in support of this to be honest.

[notsostock]

:soap:
Probably preaching to the wrong choir here but its a free country right???

P-plate bashing needs to stop, all it is doing is making P-platers feel like they are being picked on, which they are, and maybe rightly so, however there is also a fair whack of people who are well and truely off their p-plates that need to get some of those viagra eyedrops and take a long hard look at themselves and their driving.

There is no boubt P-platers are dieing on the roads (i don't have numbers to state) but it would be interesting to see some stats as the media seem to paint a picture that it is ONLY P-plate drivers dieing.

I am a p-plater and to a certain extent think the rules are a good idea however maybe it should be applied to a wider array of drivers. Rather than ban V8's, turbo's and night driving enforce a power to weight ratio type of law(much more effective than saying a p-plater can't drive a turbocharged deisel landrover but can still get a hold of a 190KW 1700KG V6).

How about instead of simply sayin 'no' put drivers through some tests and compulsory driver training before they can drive cars with certain power to weight ratios. And dare i say it envolve not just the 18 to 25 age bracket but the 25 to old bastard age bracket as well.

Saying it is too easy to get a license these days is a bit hypocritcal as it is a hell of a lot harder to get a license now than it was 30 years ago(all be it still not hugely difficult).

This is a simlar issue to banning aggressive dogs, doesn't matter how many of the 'bad' breeds you ban the people who teach these dogs to be that way will just get the next most suitable breed. An out of control racing hundi will still do alot of damage at 10:30 AM

[T_Kiwi]

Refer to your previous quote? Obviously your short some brain cells. How about grow up yourself.

I have a full Victorian licence and i ride a bike so its not going to affect me though it concerns me greatly because i know for sure that this is gonna hurt people i know and care about in ALOT of possible ways.

Im actually very suprised that it seems the majority of the forum is in support of this to be honest.

you will get over it mate :)

[Ryzz]

Are you blind? There WILL be more P platers DUI with this brought in without doubt.

Prob more people walkin home in sydney gettin stabbed too, that'll be great...If thats the case then P Platers are just proving to be stupider. Instead of saying "Shit ok, its 1 year ONLY, ill just try and live with it" you decide that you'll just have to DUI Instead. That has to be the stupidest I have heard. If this is your attitude then march your ass down to the RTA and say "I'm to Arrogant & Stupid to have a provisional license!!!" :stupid:

[crtx]

About time! maybe a few lives can be saved from the taking out the "look at this bro" factor before they spin out.

[MickNugent]

If thats the case then P Platers are just proving to be stupider. Instead of saying "Shit ok, its 1 year ONLY, ill just try and live with it" you decide that you'll just have to DUI Instead. That has to be the stupidest I have heard. If this is your attitude then march your ass down to the RTA and say "I'm to Arrogant & Stupid to have a provisional license!!!" :stupid:

Back people into a corner and theyll do some crazy things, its the way of of life. Ofcourse though youve never made any mistakes have you?

Im all for better driver training and really severe punishment but when someone has actually ****ed up. I hate seeing people punished before theyve done anything.

Lets wait a year and see how it all goes, if it works ill buy you a beer...

[mark78]

I don't think the changes go far enough.

-Passenger restrictions should be in place for the whole 3 years of being on P's. The step from 17 to 18 doesn't automatically make one more mature, and one years driving experience is nothing really.

-Driver education would need to come from professionals, not parents who just teach their bad habits.

-I'd also like to see mandotory senior first aid courses brought in at schools to compliment a drivers license. You would need this cerificate, be it through school or otherwise, to obtain your license.

-4wd owners would need to get a special license, similar to that of a truck. Most of the incidents I have with people on the road are with these drivers who simply can't drive them properly.

-I would reduce full licence points to 6 in 3 years. I.e Get busted for speeding or the like, twice in this time and you take a holiday for 6 months.

-Free license renewal & rego discount for those who don't lose points in any given period. $500 per 3 points you lose when it comes time for renewal and higer rego.

There has to not only be punishment for those who do the wrong thing, but incentive for those who set a good example.

Targeting all drivers, and not just P-platers is the key I think. :1peek:

[Ryzz]

Back people into a corner and theyll do some crazy things, its the way of of life. Ofcourse though youve never made any mistakes have you?

Im all for better driver training and really severe punishment but when someone has actually ****ed up. I hate seeing people punished before theyve done anything.

Lets wait a year and see how it all goes, if it works ill buy you a beer...

Yes ive made mistakes, i make them everyday and I try and learn from them. I know I did some farking stupid things when I was on my P's, and most of the time it was when i was in the car with mates.

However if you think that being backed into a wall is an excuse to do something as stupid as DUI then as i said, just hand your license back in.

I agree this probably isnt the most elegant measure, and we all know that Mandatory driver education and training (Both in & out of the car) is the only real answer, but that is just to hard for the government to do, so they wont....anytime soon!!!!

[jas_the_ace]

Back people into a corner and theyll do some crazy things, its the way of of life. Ofcourse though youve never made any mistakes have you?

Im all for better driver training and really severe punishment but when someone has actually ****ed up. I hate seeing people punished before theyve done anything.

Lets wait a year and see how it all goes, if it works ill buy you a beer...

Make that 2 beers. Im all with you Mick.

[VX2VESS]

won't work well a said for those going out and sharing a ride. the driver will have to do more driving to shuttle everyone.

there are other ways i suppose, most clubs have a bus.

1 passenger, probably should be none under 25, if they do this thing at all, 1 can be just as bad influence as much as 2,3 or 4.

this is all just to stop them killing all their mates in the car.

Heard of some other rule coming up with no points at all for the first year on the licence.

[jas_the_ace]

Well probably the only upside is less fuel consumption... 2 people in car as opposed to 5.

[Mr Moosh]

I can say with full honesty that when I have people in my car, Im driving the safest I can. When I take my old mans new VE for a run down the back roads up where we live, I go by myself. I admit ive given it a fair run down this straight out in the middle of know where, but once again I was by myself, there was nothing but paddocks and no one around. So its unfair to say P platers show off with mates in their car... it's not always true.

[bundyvx]

I don't think the changes go far enough.

-Passenger restrictions should be in place for the whole 3 years of being on P's. The step from 17 to 18 doesn't automatically make one more mature, and one years driving experience is nothing really.

-Driver education would need to come from professionals, not parents who just teach their bad habits.

-I'd also like to see mandotory senior first aid courses brought in at schools to compliment a drivers license. You would need this cerificate, be it through school or otherwise, to obtain your license.

-4wd owners would need to get a special license, similar to that of a truck. Most of the incidents I have with people on the road are with these drivers who simply can't drive them properly.

-I would reduce full licence points to 6 in 3 years. I.e Get busted for speeding or the like, twice in this time and you take a holiday for 6 months.

-Free license renewal & rego discount for those who don't lose points in any given period. $500 per 3 points you lose when it comes time for renewal and higer rego.

There has to not only be punishment for those who do the wrong thing, but incentive for those who set a good example.

Targeting all drivers, and not just P-platers is the key I think. :1peek:

You should become a politician, you have some great ideas. Someone needs to fix our road system !

[Ryzz]

I don't think the changes go far enough.

-Passenger restrictions should be in place for the whole 3 years of being on P's. The step from 17 to 18 doesn't automatically make one more mature, and one years driving experience is nothing really.

-Driver education would need to come from professionals, not parents who just teach their bad habits.

-I'd also like to see mandotory senior first aid courses brought in at schools to compliment a drivers license. You would need this cerificate, be it through school or otherwise, to obtain your license.

-4wd owners would need to get a special license, similar to that of a truck. Most of the incidents I have with people on the road are with these drivers who simply can't drive them properly.

-I would reduce full licence points to 6 in 3 years. I.e Get busted for speeding or the like, twice in this time and you take a holiday for 6 months.

-Free license renewal & rego discount for those who don't lose points in any given period. $500 per 3 points you lose when it comes time for renewal and higer rego.

There has to not only be punishment for those who do the wrong thing, but incentive for those who set a good example.

Targeting all drivers, and not just P-platers is the key I think. :1peek:I agree with a lot of the points your making, however when things like 3km/h over the speed limit allow someone to be booked, i think $500 is way to expensive when it has nothing to do with driver/road safety, only $$$ in Revenue!

[womsv8]

Don't any drivers with red P's have any older friends with full licences that can be the designated driver? People are seeing these rules as a punishment, all you guys can sit back in a couple of years time when there will probobly will be even harsher rules and think that back then wasn't so bad.

[fyreblade2000]

Impose a "no-claim Bonus" scheme with vehicle rego something like a "no points lost" scheme,

Oh and it's the friggen Vehicle Tax thats the killer :flamin: :flamin: on NSW rego not the actual car registration fee!!!!!

[ti0350]

While i think the law is not a bad idea i dont think it actually goes far enough, I like the idea of it lasting the whole time somebody is on their P's.. I do a fair amount of kays a week and while you do see some red p drivers do stupid things, most of the p platers I see doing it are green p drivers and this new law wont effect them..
The whole licensing process is a joke my missus is from the states and she laughed when she saw how easy it was to get a license and how much training new drivers have here back there driving education starts when they are in high school long before they can get a license..

[JNP304]

Its very amusing to see the moral "high ground" taken by the people in theie 30`s and 40`s. Its like they are trying to justify there position on the forums by rubbishing all p-platers and there every comment. I guess they never did anything wrong and only drove there Suzuki MightyBoy to church on Sundays. :dancenana:

[jas_the_ace]

Its very amusing to see the moral "high ground" taken by the people in theie 30`s and 40`s. Its like they are trying to justify there position on the forums by rubbishing all p-platers and there every comment. I guess they never did anything wrong and only drove there Suzuki MightyBoy to church on Sundays. :dancenana:

100% agreeing right there. oath

[ssgirl2]

Change the laws relating to the age children can get their licenses to 18 and they can only drive unmodified 1.6l cars. Any "bling", they get "pinged". Zero points for the first year and when they get a fine, they must enroll in a Driver Training Course (pay for it themselves) and pass before getting their license back - Zero points for another full year from that point on!

SS :)

[jas_the_ace]

Change the laws relating to the age children can get their licenses to 18 and they can only drive unmodified 1.6l cars. Any "bling", they get "pinged". Zero points for the first year and when they get a fine, they must enroll in a Driver Training Course (pay for it themselves) and pass before getting their license back - Zero points for another full year from that point on!

SS :)

I like that idea... but a 1.6L can still get sideways lol

[EddieVE06]

I agree with tougher laws on new drivers, I was on my P's many years ago and the way I drive now and the awareness is so different to back then. My only issue with this new law is that lets say there was a car load with 4 passangers and they are all P platers, now that becomes 4 cars on the road rather than 1 car and would it be fair to assume that if 4 friends all on p plates are driving around together that there isn't going to be some fun had also along the way....

[JNP304]

exactly the point I made earlier EddieVE06. A group of mates is not going to let only two go out and the rest stay home watching Harry Potter. Effectively there will be more P-Plate vehicle on the road in groups. Thats when the trouble usually begins. Dont get me wrong when a clown drops a burnout or clowns around near houses and kids ect im as pi$$ed off as the next person. Driver training is the answer and making people more accountable. I think the passenger law will NOT resolve any underlying issues. How does it make the person a better driver?

[VYBerlinaV8]

100% agreeing right there. oath

Did the older guys (like myself) here do dumb things on their P's? Of course we did. Did we break the law and have some close calls and accidents? Yes we did. Does that mean we should sit idle while (many or most of) the current crop of p-platers continues to act like dickheads and kill themselves and their mates? No.

This is not about being fair. It is not about your rights. It is about your responsibilities. P-platers get involved in more accidents than other demographic groups, and they die more, especially at night and with their mates in the car. This is an attempt to stop this from happening so often. Will it work? Who knows. But there's nothing wrong with trying a solution, then tweaking the solution if it doesn't work.

As for the DUI comments, that's got to be just about the silliest thing I have ever heard. What did people do when they didn't have cars or licenses? They still managed to socialise and get on the turps. The more p-platers whinge and moan, and complain how its "bull$hit", and generally carry on the more these rules will be applied to make up for the obvious lack of maturity.

To re-iterate: the older guys aren't saying they are or were perfect angels, but they have learnt a thing or 2. Think about it.

[ssgirl2]

I like that idea... but a 1.6L can still get sideways lol

Yeah I know, but it's alot easier handling a little Toyota/Holden (whatever) than the bigger more powerful (and touchy) ones that can get out of control without much effort at all.

I have been thinking about this issue for quite some time (have two young boys of my own) and the ex has kindly de-registered/uninsured his 1994 1.6l Toyota for my boys to learn to drive in. It's easy to drive and on hot days the AC kills any power left in it :lmao:.

SS :)

[jas_the_ace]

Thats so true.

10 mates. 2 passengers a car. that makes 5 cars in a line. All with P Plates. Picture them lining up at the lights people.

The government has no idea whats going to happen.

[VZSS250]

I welcome the change and hope its applied in Victoria as well. Having a P-plater carrying a full car load, in a V8 on a saturday night is a leathal combination.

There wont be more cars on the road because p-platers will just ask their older friends to drive.

[ssgirl2]

...and if those cars are (unmodified) tiny older model 1.6l's - they won't want any more than one person in their car's anyway :lmao:

SS :)

[jas_the_ace]

i can see it on the news...

5 cars in a line doing dori dori drift on the M5.

lollll

[Ryzz]

Thats so true.

10 mates. 2 passengers a car. that makes 5 cars in a line. All with P Plates. Picture them lining up at the lights people.

The government has no idea whats going to happen.

You really need to pull your head out of your ass mate. Every comment someone makes, you have to find something wrong with it, or why it wont work, or why its Bull$shit, or not fair, etc.

Maybe you need to respect the laws for what they are trying to do, and start spending some time thinking about how you can make your lifestyle fit in with the relevant laws.

[jas_the_ace]

no mate.

i agree with some of the comments actually and im actually having a laugh with them.

everyones got an opinion anyway. and i respect that

[hsvcsv]

You really need to pull your head out of your ass mate. Every comment someone makes, you have to find something wrong with it, or why it wont work, or why its Bull$shit, or not fair, etc.

Maybe you need to respect the laws for what they are trying to do, and start spending some time thinking about how you can make your lifestyle fit in with the relevant laws.

Couldn't have said it better myself...

[DaveHAT]

Its very amusing to see the moral "high ground" taken by the people in theie 30`s and 40`s. Its like they are trying to justify there position on the forums by rubbishing all p-platers and there every comment. I guess they never did anything wrong and only drove there Suzuki MightyBoy to church on Sundays. :dancenana:

This comment shows an unbridled level of ignorance. What you claim to be moral "High Ground" by "those in the 30's and 40's" is actually said people trying to enlighten so called younger people based on "THEIR EXPERIENCES WHEN THEY WERE YOUNGER ! The only reason it's any different now to what it was then is that the internet is around now and people can publically say what everyone has been saying for ages. As someone in this "30-40's category" I wish I and my friends had listened to people in their 30-40's when I was 18-24-ish and maybe a lot of my mates would still be alive now. :vpo:

As a person who has had to see 1st hand, the catastrophic consequences of driver stupidity/irresponsibilty (Both P-Plater and otherwise) I think any legislation that helps to reduce the P-Plate driver deaths is a good thing and I don't care what anyone says. See one needless death and you've seen too many I'm afraid.

Whilst I submit that it is easy to generalise in regards to P-Plater issues, "P-Plater bashing" as everyone loves to call it will continue as long as P-Platers continue to put themselves in the spot light for all the wrong reasons. These so called "picked on P-Platers" need to wake up to themselves and stop feeling like the persecuted masses. The comments in the thread and this legislation in general is some form of attempt to try and save the lives of a group of people who seem very adept at killing themselves.

What's that I hear you say .... "pfft won't happen to me" ... yep heard that before too.

I note comments such as "Oh well you've never done anything wrong have you" .... well of course we bloody have, but the sort of vehicles that are readily available to people today (i.e. Jap go fast imports and so forth) just weren't around when we were younger. Readily available finance, large amounts of easily accessible quick cars and the inherent teenage belief that "I am 10ft tall and bullet proof" can be and is a recipe for disaster.

I don't give a stuff about all this bleeding heart bullshit that "this legislation is bullshit and unfair" and so on, IT'S THE LAW so deal with it. Having a licence to drive a car is NOT a right ... it is a privilege granted to an individual and people need to wake up to this fact. LAW implies "this is how it is" and does NOT imply "this is a suggestion and we hope you like it". Once a license is acquired IMHO it is the holders responsibility to use it RESPONSIBLY. If people need to have that explained to them then they probably shouldn't have a license in the 1st place. Making people accountable for their actions and driver training should also added to the arsenal of actions to reduce road deaths.

Sorry for the rant ... :flamin:

[hsvcsv]

This comment shows an unbridled level of ignorance. What you claim to be moral "High Ground" by "those in the 30's and 40's" is actually said people trying to enlighten so called younger people based on "THEIR EXPERIENCES WHEN THEY WERE YOUNGER ! The only reason it's any different now to what it was then is that the internet is around now and people can publically say what everyone has been saying for ages. As someone in this "30-40's category" I wish I and my friends had listened to people in their 30-40's when I was 18-24-ish and maybe a lot of my mates would still be alive now. :vpo:

As a person who has had to see 1st hand, the catastrophic consequences of driver stupidity/irresponsibilty (Both P-Plater and otherwise) I think any legislation that helps to reduce the P-Plate driver deaths is a good thing and I don't care what anyone says. See one needless death and you've seen too many I'm afraid.

Whilst I submit that it is easy to generalise in regards to P-Plater issues, "P-Plater bashing" as everyone loves to call it will continue as long as P-Platers continue to put themselves in the spot light for all the wrong reasons. These so called "picked on P-Platers" need to wake up to themselves and stop feeling like the persecuted masses. The comments in the thread and this legislation in general is some form of attempt to try and save the lives of a group of people who seem very adept at killing themselves.

What's that I hear you say .... "pfft won't happen to me" ... yep heard that before too.

I note comments such as "Oh well you've never done anything wrong have you" .... well of course we bloody have, but the sort of vehicles that are readily available to people today (i.e. Jap go fast imports and so forth) just weren't around when we were younger. Readily available finance, large amounts of easily accessible quick cars and the inherent teenage belief that "I am 10ft tall and bullet proof" can be and is a recipe for disaster.

I don't give a stuff about all this bleeding heart bullshit that "this legislation is bullshit and unfair" and so on, IT'S THE LAW so deal with it. Having a licence to drive a car is NOT a right ... it is a privilege granted to an individual and people need to wake up to this fact. LAW implies "this is how it is" and does NOT imply "this is a suggestion and we hope you like it". Once a license is acquired IMHO it is the holders responsibility to use it RESPONSIBLY. If people need to have that explained to them then they probably shouldn't have a license in the 1st place. Making people accountable for their actions and driver training should also added to the arsenal of actions to reduce road deaths.

Sorry for the rant ... :flamin:

:bow: :bow: :bow:

[ssgirl2]

This comment shows an unbridled level of ignorance. What you claim to be moral "High Ground" by "those in the 30's and 40's" is actually said people trying to enlighten so called younger people based on "THEIR EXPERIENCES WHEN THEY WERE YOUNGER ! The only reason it's any different now to what it was then is that the internet is around now and people can publically say what everyone has been saying for ages. As someone in this "30-40's category" I wish I and my friends had listened to people in their 30-40's when I was 18-24-ish and maybe a lot of my mates would still be alive now. :vpo:

As a person who has had to see 1st hand, the catastrophic consequences of driver stupidity/irresponsibilty (Both P-Plater and otherwise) I think any legislation that helps to reduce the P-Plate driver deaths is a good thing and I don't care what anyone says. See one needless death and you've seen too many I'm afraid.

Whilst I submit that it is easy to generalise in regards to P-Plater issues, "P-Plater bashing" as everyone loves to call it will continue as long as P-Platers continue to put themselves in the spot light for all the wrong reasons. These so called "picked on P-Platers" need to wake up to themselves and stop feeling like the persecuted masses. The comments in the thread and this legislation in general is some form of attempt to try and save the lives of a group of people who seem very adept at killing themselves.

What's that I hear you say .... "pfft won't happen to me" ... yep heard that before too.

I note comments such as "Oh well you've never done anything wrong have you" .... well of course we bloody have, but the sort of vehicles that are readily available to people today (i.e. Jap go fast imports and so forth) just weren't around when we were younger. Readily available finance, large amounts of easily accessible quick cars and the inherent teenage belief that "I am 10ft tall and bullet proof" can be and is a recipe for disaster.

I don't give a stuff about all this bleeding heart bullshit that "this legislation is bullshit and unfair" and so on, IT'S THE LAW so deal with it. Having a licence to drive a car is NOT a right ... it is a privilege granted to an individual and people need to wake up to this fact. LAW implies "this is how it is" and does NOT imply "this is a suggestion and we hope you like it". Once a license is acquired IMHO it is the holders responsibility to use it RESPONSIBLY. If people need to have that explained to them then they probably shouldn't have a license in the 1st place. Making people accountable for their actions and driver training should also added to the arsenal of actions to reduce road deaths.

Sorry for the rant ... :flamin:

Don't apologise...that was fantastic! :yup:

When us "oldies" get on here and rant, we're just trying to open the eyes of you "younguns"...this is partly because we've been there and done that or because we are now parents ourselves (and once you become a parent you realise just how damn stupid/irresponsible and selfish you were as a kid). So if there's anything we can do to change the thinking of young drivers, don't flame us or say "it's not fair" - WE'RE TRYING TO SAVE YOUR LIVES (and ours).

SS :)

[jas_the_ace]

ok... the Gold license holders have had their say. Valid argument i respect it.

Any youngies like me wanna say anything?

[OLS108]

whats the Difference between being 17 and being 20 ?
having your opens and a little more experience..

just for Clarification here, Do people think P platers are more likely to Kill themselves or others because they are Young and Stupid or Just under equipped and under educated in driving ?
PS i drove my car around on my P's all without any Drama at all.
Did i Race my car ? yes
have i "hooned" a little Drift or mountain Run with mates ? Yes
all about controlled driving i guess, while i enjoy a Quick Squirt from the Lights I wouldnt think about trying to Wind it off the Clock on the highway.
My opinion is Driver Training is Key, if you can reverse park and Hill start you can Drive a car ??? please.

[Ryzz]

whats the Difference between being 17 and being 20 ?
having your opens and a little more experience..

just for Clarification here, Do people think P platers are more likely to Kill themselves or others because they are Young and Stupid or Just under equipped and under educated in driving ?
PS i drove my car around on my P's all without any Drama at all.
Did i Race my car ? yes
have i "hooned" a little Drift or mountain Run with mates ? Yes
all about controlled driving i guess, while i enjoy a Quick Squirt from the Lights I wouldnt think about trying to Wind it off the Clock on the highway.
My opinion is Driver Training is Key, if you can reverse park and Hill start you can Drive a car ??? please.
Both, and often one as a result of the other mate.

[ssgirl2]

ok... the Gold license holders have had their say. Valid argument i respect it.

Any youngies like me wanna say anything?


young-uns, sonny boy, young-uns

SS :)

[jas_the_ace]

young-uns, sonny boy, young-uns

SS :)

:) sorrrrry haha

[OLS108]

Both, and often one as a result of the other mate.

agreed.
so what do we really need then ???
a second Driving test going from P's to opens ???
too many Drivers on our Roads ( at least up here ) are undereducated with how to Control a Vehicle in the event of Losing Traction around a corner, aquaplaning etc.. young people are Not shown how to control a vehicle apart from keeping it within the lines and parking...
IMO driver Training is the First issue that should be addressed.
Dave

[Ryzz]

agreed.
so what do we really need then ???
a second Driving test going from P's to opens ???
too many Drivers on our Roads ( at least up here ) are undereducated with how to Control a Vehicle in the event of Losing Traction around a corner, aquaplaning etc.. young people are Not shown how to control a vehicle apart from keeping it within the lines and parking...
IMO driver Training is the First issue that should be addressed.
Dave

Mate I agree with you 150% on the driver training issue. I've actually been looking into a possible business venture with this in mind.

[jas_the_ace]

There's an open market for that. Advertised and marketed well theres alot of money to be made. The government would help out too.

[Ryzz]

There's an open market for that. Advertised and marketed well theres alot of money to be made. The government would help out too.

You would think so, but it doesnt appear so atm.

[DaveHAT]

just for Clarification here, Do people think P platers are more likely to Kill themselves or others because they are Young and Stupid or Just under equipped and under educated in driving ?

Chicken and the egg Dave. I tend to agree with Ryzz (can't believe I said that out loud :nyuk: ) that one is often the direct result of the other.

I also have the opinion that driver attitude amongst todays driver is in general (Yes not just P-Platers for those poor persecuted people) piss poor. Lethal mix.

You are 100% right though, driver training is the key to so much of this problem but as we all know THAT COSTS MONEY which we all also know the government won't spend. Trying to convince drivers to spend the money themselves won't work either IMHO ... as you said "I can hill start and reverse park ---> I can drive a car" .... PLEASE ! Maybe you can drive a car BUT can you CONTROL a car in a "shit where did everything go wrong type of situation"? ----> NUP. Sadly ... until this very thing happens to someone they generally won't ever see the value in REAL and advanced driver training.

Good example of the simple things you can pick up from driver training is fact that most don't realise that in 1 second, at 60km/h your car travels 17-20mtrs. It also takes approx 1.5-2 seconds to stop a car from 60km/h in ideal conditions ... hmm this now equates to 40 metres to stop a car at 60km/h, How many times do you see cars with a 40mtr-ish gap between them? Bugger all I wager. How many "Learner driving schools teach stuff like this I wonder?

I think what is needed is a log book which contains a set criteria of compentencies that they must reach some of which entails attending driver training courses ... the benefit of which could be reductions in insurance premiums as a reward. This makes them accountable for their own learning and hopefully with benefit others when they pass. Dunno, but it sounds like a start.

I wish something like that had been in place when I first got my license. I believe many people who plain faced state " I have been driving for 20 years or whatever with no problems" are stating more about how lucky they are than how good their driving skills are.

Sadly though and this will always be a hurdle I fear, is trying to convince people of the benefits of driver training. Most people drive because it is a means to an end ... ie transport and thus never think beyond that. Otherwise known as a BUGGERSHIT ! :nyuk:

[nudenut]

whats the Difference between being 17 and being 20 ?
having your opens and a little more experience..

just for Clarification here, Do people think P platers are more likely to Kill themselves or others because they are Young and Stupid or Just under equipped and under educated in driving ?
Bit of both for me. Technically, I'm probably no better a driver now than I was at 17, but having seen a lot more driving situations and conditions I'm definitely a better real world driver, relying less on outside factors going well to remain safe.

When I was on my P's, occasionally I was what would today be labelled a hoon. But, I never came that close to killing myself when i was driving because (a) I'd done some advanced driving/skidpan training and knew how to react in an emergency situation, and (b) I was lucky. I was "young and stupid" at times, and probably would have been a statistic if I hadn't had that training, or if other factors (which I'm much more likely to allow for now) had gone against me.

I was also a passenger in two P-plater accidents, and they both happened when mates of mine who were "model" drivers were behind the wheel - didn't speed, usually very careful etc - but they'd only taken the lessons necessary to get their licenses. One lost control in the wet around a corner (low speed but there have been people killed at low speed), one was in the country and tried to take a bend too fast and lost it (and I think back on as "shit I was lucky to survive"). Neither were being "hoons", neither were being egged on by the others in the car, just didn't know how to respond in an emergency.

So, I reckon that the only real solution is better driver training. All the bandaid measures in the world can't replace that, and I think that the danger in having harsher P-plate laws is that they'll just keep getting more draconian when they don't work, while masking a lack of attention to the real issue which is that most drivers (not just P-platers) aren't trained well enough.

Having said that, given that none of the pollies have the balls to mandate expensive and hence unpopular training, it might be worth a try. And some of the reactions to the law have been ridiculous. FFS, it's only a year, and a year when 90% of P-platers are not meant to be at the pub anyway. It's not saying P-platers can't go out in groups, just that if you want to take a car and come home after 11pm, make you have a designated driver who's had their license for more than a year. And only those P-platers who are likely to become statistics regardless would use it as an excuse to DUI, and that's called natural selection. I'd just hope they don't take anyone else out.

(By the way, I'm now 34.)

My 2c ...

[T_Kiwi]

how about this, drive sensabley and you live. Thats a pretty good scheme if ya ask me

[OLS108]

Mate I agree with you 150% on the driver training issue. I've actually been looking into a possible business venture with this in mind.

If i were Back at 17 and getting my license I would be spending as much time as possible getting better Driver Training, Ive had a Few moments on the roads Both wet and Dry where i have overestimated my Driving Skill and underestimated Both the power of my car and the Conditions of the roads.
thankfully was able to Pull the car back without any damage to anyone or anything, But i wish i didn't have to learn that way :errr:

[T_Kiwi]

If i were Back at 17 and getting my license I would be spending as much time as possible getting better Driver Training, Ive had a Few moments on the roads Both wet and Dry where i have overestimated my Driving Skill and underestimated Both the power of my car and the Conditions of the roads.
thankfully was able to Pull the car back without any damage to anyone or anything, But i wish i didn't have to learn that way :errr:

lets face it, you would spend too much time thinking about what you had learnt and before you know it you would have crashed, you either have it or you dont and obviously you are one of the lucky ones who are naturally tallented. please think before you reply

[CLUB_819]

If i were Back at 17 and getting my license I would be spending as much time as possible getting better Driver Training, Ive had a Few moments on the roads Both wet and Dry where i have overestimated my Driving Skill and underestimated Both the power of my car and the Conditions of the roads.
thankfully was able to Pull the car back without any damage to anyone or anything, But i wish i didn't have to learn that way :errr:

The issue also is that it's ok to say that but alot of people getting there liciences etc.. with reg, insurance can't afford driver training so it becomes secondary to the value of fuel, stereo, going out, tyres, maintainance.

I here people saying there will be more DUI's happening etc.. etc.. have we lost all self control where you can't say I'm driving I'll have a coke instead. If people are dumb enough to drink and drive and get caught then tough. How can you blame the law when you know if you have that beer you can be done.

Cheers
Scotty

Not actually directing this at you OLS 108 just generally.

[Mr Moosh]

If i were Back at 17 and getting my license I would be spending as much time as possible getting better Driver Training, Ive had a Few moments on the roads Both wet and Dry where i have overestimated my Driving Skill and underestimated Both the power of my car and the Conditions of the roads.
thankfully was able to Pull the car back without any damage to anyone or anything, But i wish i didn't have to learn that way :errr:

Thats it. Unfotunately sometimes you have to have a close call to actually realise that your not invincible and your not driving a supercar. I remember just after I had my licence I didnt leave enough room between me and the car in front, and wasnt watching ahead, and traffic pulled suddenly to a hault, and I had to swerve on to another lane to avoid running up this guys arse. Luckily there wasn't a car sitting right next to me... But nonetheless a lesson well learnt. If these things can be taught in driver training, then it should be implemented NOW. You need to experience it rather than just have it quoted to you by your parents, or read it in a book.

And I think complusary driver training is an answer, and would be a good attempt by the government to lower the road toll, rather than introducing a ridiculous rule that makes them look like they are doing something when they arn't tackling the problem with full force.

EDIT: If people cant affor driver training, the government should make it a free service... woops what am I thinking? That would actual cost money and require planning... better just introduce some more pointless rules to keep the parents and voters happy.

[Boom]

I was young and stupid too.
I had a bit of an off not long after getting mw P plates.
End result, 2 buckled rims and a bent diff housing, and a slightly damaged bit of kerb.
Step 1 repair car. 1 week
Step 2 attend driver training course. 1 day
Step 3 practice what I had learnt. Ongoing
Doing the course will not automatically make you a better driver. It took months and months of practice on the road to be confident to use my new skills appropriately.
Things have changed in the near 30 years since then.
Back then if you had a little off chances were that you wouldnt hit anyone else. These days the chances are very real of hitting someone.
These new laws may seem unfair to the average P plater, but it is something that the powers that be CAN do. It CAN be implemented and it CAN be enforced. Some of the other ideas, although potentially better solutions, at this stage would be difficult or near impossible to do. An idea similar was floated some years ago but died a quiet death because it would cost underpriveleged people too much to get their licence. Votes for politicians may have been another issue.
If these new laws save just 1 life then they are worth it.
I dont know how many of you have ever dragged broken and maimed people or bodies out of cars, or picked body parts up off the roadway, but it is not something that is pretty.
Anything that can save a life is worthy of doing. Some we must do for ourselves.

[Paxton]

I can understand your frustration.

It's a silly rule which will prove ineffective. Just more regulation... boo hiss.

[all4ford]

NRMA rejects the new laws
http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=95066

[jerrel]

It can fit 3 chicks quite fine thanks mate. :fewl:

the key word there was comfortably......:lmao:

[michaels1v8]

NRMA rejects the new laws
http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=95066

link didnt work for me...

[Mr Moosh]

the key word there was comfortably......:lmao:

Lol

And he was probably including the boot

[michaels1v8]

I don't think the changes go far enough.

-Passenger restrictions should be in place for the whole 3 years of being on P's. The step from 17 to 18 doesn't automatically make one more mature, and one years driving experience is nothing really.

-Driver education would need to come from professionals, not parents who just teach their bad habits.

-I'd also like to see mandotory senior first aid courses brought in at schools to compliment a drivers license. You would need this cerificate, be it through school or otherwise, to obtain your license.

-4wd owners would need to get a special license, similar to that of a truck. Most of the incidents I have with people on the road are with these drivers who simply can't drive them properly.

-I would reduce full licence points to 6 in 3 years. I.e Get busted for speeding or the like, twice in this time and you take a holiday for 6 months.

-Free license renewal & rego discount for those who don't lose points in any given period. $500 per 3 points you lose when it comes time for renewal and higer rego.

There has to not only be punishment for those who do the wrong thing, but incentive for those who set a good example.

Targeting all drivers, and not just P-platers is the key I think. :1peek:


Mark, I am a P plater and I agree with all of these ideas completely!

Except I feel that the offences issued should be either from officers or very extreme cases from set cameras.

EG: 3km over the limit should not result in a loss of points (not sure if it does as I have never been fined for speeding) but 11 or more km's over should. 3kms over the limit I can see as a genuine mistake. 10kms could be plausible as a mistake but anything larger than that should result in a loss of points.

If your going to act like a tool you deserve what is thrown at you...

All of your other ideas IMHO are fantastic and would make our roads alot safer for everyone


My 2 cents worth anyway

[Waabs]

I support this new rule. To me it seems that some people on this thread think that the people supporting it are saying that this will solve the problem of P platers or young people dying on the roads. It clearly can't solve the problem because it's a complex problem that really can never be 100% solved.

Sure the rules might be inconvenient at times for some but if they save even one life what value can you place on that life? If it were the choice of inconvenience for me vs the life of a loved one I know which I would choose.

[SSBarney]

Sure the rules might be inconvenient at times for some but if they save even one life what value can you place on that life? If it were the choice of inconvenience for me vs the life of a loved one I know which I would choose.

The drink drive rules can be bloody convenient, but as society has come to accept,... to break them not only puts ur lisence at risk, but endagers the general public and urself.

[Elite SS]

Only 2 kids in each car, thats not Fair..I won't have a large group of kids to pick on when I cruise through Maccas ....it's just not right...:vpo:


Mark, I am a P plater and I agree with all of these ideas completely!

Except I feel that the offences issued should be either from officers or very extreme cases from set cameras.

EG: 3km over the limit should not result in a loss of points (not sure if it does as I have never been fined for speeding) but 11 or more km's over should. 3kms over the limit I can see as a genuine mistake. 10kms could be plausible as a mistake but anything larger than that should result in a loss of points.

If your going to act like a tool you deserve what is thrown at you...

All of your other ideas IMHO are fantastic and would make our roads alot safer for everyone


My 2 cents worth anyway

I agree...the goverment has gone a little overboard with the new "P" plate rule's...first they get a kid doing 200 kl/h BUT he can still drive a car in another state...how stupid...Now they want to remove their licence/ permit for something as little as 5 kl ( Under 15) over the speed limit.
Any body can go over the spped limit just by driving with the flow of traffic.
they should be harsher with big offenders and known offenders not every "P" plater.
they should of left it with 2/3 demerit points, and a automatic loss of licence for over 15 kl/h.
My 2 c worth anyway.

[ti0350]

Thats so true.

10 mates. 2 passengers a car. that makes 5 cars in a line. All with P Plates. Picture them lining up at the lights people.

The government has no idea whats going to happen.

See this is the reason the government is making stricter laws because they know whats going to happen, even by this comment alone you suggest that you guys cant go out in a group on the road without doing something stupid..

I am the first to admit that I did stupid things when I was younger and was luvky enough to live through it, I dont want to see anybody else have to go through the same thing..
Also I work in an Emergency Department so I unfortunately I get to see the results of what happens when things go wrong on the roads..
What some of you young guys need to do is think for a minute before the next time to get on the road, that is think about what the direct result of you doing something stupid would be.. Think about how your family or somebodys elses would feel if they got the knock on the door by the boys in blue at 2am.. People need to be less selfish on the roads and think about the other road users as well, if more people did this then I recon there would be less trouble..
Sorry for the rant but working where I work I deal people from all cross the community from cops, ambo, Dr's, nurses and patients familys so I've seen how some tragic events effect people and believe me it effects everybody in some way shape or form..

[VX2VESS]

This comment shows an unbridled level of ignorance. What you claim to be moral "High Ground" by "those in the 30's and 40's" is actually said people trying to enlighten so called younger people based on "THEIR EXPERIENCES WHEN THEY WERE YOUNGER ! The only reason it's any different now to what it was then is that the internet is around now and people can publically say what everyone has been saying for ages. As someone in this "30-40's category" I wish I and my friends had listened to people in their 30-40's when I was 18-24-ish and maybe a lot of my mates would still be alive now. :vpo:

As a person who has had to see 1st hand, the catastrophic consequences of driver stupidity/irresponsibilty (Both P-Plater and otherwise) I think any legislation that helps to reduce the P-Plate driver deaths is a good thing and I don't care what anyone says. See one needless death and you've seen too many I'm afraid.

Whilst I submit that it is easy to generalise in regards to P-Plater issues, "P-Plater bashing" as everyone loves to call it will continue as long as P-Platers continue to put themselves in the spot light for all the wrong reasons. These so called "picked on P-Platers" need to wake up to themselves and stop feeling like the persecuted masses. The comments in the thread and this legislation in general is some form of attempt to try and save the lives of a group of people who seem very adept at killing themselves.

What's that I hear you say .... "pfft won't happen to me" ... yep heard that before too.

I note comments such as "Oh well you've never done anything wrong have you" .... well of course we bloody have, but the sort of vehicles that are readily available to people today (i.e. Jap go fast imports and so forth) just weren't around when we were younger. Readily available finance, large amounts of easily accessible quick cars and the inherent teenage belief that "I am 10ft tall and bullet proof" can be and is a recipe for disaster.

I don't give a stuff about all this bleeding heart bullshit that "this legislation is bullshit and unfair" and so on, IT'S THE LAW so deal with it. Having a licence to drive a car is NOT a right ... it is a privilege granted to an individual and people need to wake up to this fact. LAW implies "this is how it is" and does NOT imply "this is a suggestion and we hope you like it". Once a license is acquired IMHO it is the holders responsibility to use it RESPONSIBLY. If people need to have that explained to them then they probably shouldn't have a license in the 1st place. Making people accountable for their actions and driver training should also added to the arsenal of actions to reduce road deaths.

Sorry for the rant ... :flamin:


hey just read this one gone no further yet, but very well said! now you should have scrubie's job, he make no sence.

Cars seem to be some extension of ones ego. you havn't made it in life unless you proove it with you car. All the extra media, internet, tv, magazines only seem to push this. All pre driving kids think about is when they get a car how they are going to do great burnouts and great drifting to proove themselves to their mates. mines faster, beat me around this surburban street.

yes we did stupid things too and learnt from them, if you made it that far. but also were a lot less cars on the road and the cars were not cheap to make fast as production cars are now.

but 90% of young guys will never listen to advise, they know better because they have all that experience right. when your older you think i wish i listened to that advise, they were right.

drags and ractracks are the place to proove things.

[Redhot_57]

im putting forward my opinion. respect it or not. i dont give a shit.

This P plate rule is a crock of crap. For the minority of P platers like me that HAVE had experience (I've done courses such as the Warren Luff school) and know how to control and be normal in a car.

The minority shouldnt be subjected to this crap. There should be some system in which trained drivers like me are treated differently.

Privilege my ass.

My opinion once again.

Cheers

Interesting comments, ace. Take another look at your post, youve just unknowingly supported the new laws. Performance driving courses are one thing, but perhaps you would like to elaborate further on exactly how much real world driving experience you have?? 6 months?? Maybe less.

While I agree with the benefits of performance driving courses in general, the flipside is that they often give younger and perhaps less experienced drivers more confidence than they are entitled to, on the road. See, while you may have slid your Civic around a racetrack without incident, dont think for one second that this translates to your ability on the road.

I reckon driver attitude and maturity is just as important as ability or skill, and your comments would suggest your attitude could do with some work.

Speaking of priviledge, yesterday I had the priviledge of being cut off by a selfish, arrogant P plater while driving along Pennant Hills rd. After sitting less than a ft behind the guy in front for a while, this boofhead then squeezed past me and raced up the road. I can only assume his house was on fire or something, the way he was driving.

One off incident?? Most P platers dont drive like that?? I disagree.
A buddy of mine is in the highway patrol and always has stories to tell. Like the P plate driver he stopped a few weeks back doing 125 in a 60 zone, on bald tyres. The P plate driver doing 140 on the F3 in the wet with 3 passengers. He reckons over half his speed tickets these days are for P platers. These imbeciles are just fatals waiting to happen.

I did some silly things when I was younger too, but out in the sticks with no-one around, not in residential streets. I reckon most of us would say the same thing if we were honest too.

So, if new P plate laws will make me and my family safer on the roads, then yeah, I support them 100%.

[Boom]

Are we going back to the rules from when I had Ps?
Speed. Walk
Not display Ps. Walk
Actually anything at all apart from not display 1 P. Walk.
I managed to get through.
Rules is rules.

[michaels1v8]

Are we going back to the rules from when I had Ps?
Speed. Walk
Not display Ps. Walk
Actually anything at all apart from not display 1 P. Walk.
I managed to get through.
Rules is rules.

I hope so and this is how it should be too. I think it would get rid of a lot of non sense that occurs on the streets.

[Penko]

This has got to be the 100th thread witch turns into a p-plate, non p-plate war, its getting a bit old in my opinion

finally how many people can honestly say they did not do a burnout or sped while on there p-plates

cheers

[vyssls1]

im sure every single member on here has travelled faster than the limit, and at least driven without due care before........ive done it before. was it cool, no cause i had to go to court, and yes it cost me shitloads..... do i still enjoy it yes...:hide: But there is a time and place for it.

ok, i think that the rules do require changing, maybe all licence holders should get a motorbike licence, or at least do the training, it opened my eyes.

But im sure many would have to agree with this, control the cars like motorbike restrictions have been for years.

But the biggest problem is the government should shouldnt let these kids get bored, put up another social activity (eg timezone or the movies) basically more complexes so the kids dont get bored.

When i was a kid, at the age of 16, i couldnt legally drink in the pub, sowhat did we do, we used to go drag racing, doing burnouts, etc....cause we were bored....

Thats my 2 cents worth, and im sure many will agree.

[Micks]

I don't necessarily agree with all the Gov proposing here.
But one thing I do know is we have a great increase in population in our suburbs over the past 20-30 years & unfortuneately our roads are not up to scratch & can't cater for this volume. This is where the problem lies. Its also very apparent that younger drivers do not have the experience to deal with that. More chance now of a serious crash or fatality. This was not the case when I had my P's 25 yrs ago, sure I done some silly things, but lucky for me & other users no one got hurt.
Cheer up Guys not on the P's that long it will go in no time.

Cheers
VYT

& Bloodywell Slow down.

[Boom]

This has got to be the 100th thread witch turns into a p-plate, non p-plate war, its getting a bit old in my opinion

finally how many people can honestly say they did not do a burnout or sped while on there p-plates

cheers

Cant say it and will never say it. But given that my mates and I seemed to instinctively know the right place/right time thing. There were alot less cops around then and a lot less people to annoy but we still had our fun in places where we would not draw so much attention to ourselves. Could be positive peer pressure or perhaps more likely showing respect for others who would not agree with what we were doing. This may be somewhat close to the core of the current problem, A lot of these young uns (no not all of them, the "bad" minority) just dont care where they carry on, and may be influenced by negative peer pressure. And a lack of respect for those around them.

[vyssbeast]

Thats a good point ...

Theres hoons that do burnouts in the middle of major intersections (which i just cant comprehend) like noble macas crew ....

And there are the guys that wanna have some fun so take it to an empty industrial area late at night where there is massive empty space and no one to bother ...

But its all taken the same way ... and still, they provide nothing in terms of a safe place for these people to let it all out ...

A burnout pad can be paid for with all the $$$ they rack up fining people for hooning ... do something positive with it

[angelo.vs]

This has got to be the 100th thread witch turns into a p-plate, non p-plate war, its getting a bit old in my opinion

finally how many people can honestly say they did not do a burnout or sped while on there p-plates

cheers

I never did a burnout on my Ps. I was too scared my $1000 VK 6 cyl might break/blow up and I did not want to spend money to fix/replace it. Might have done the odd 'turning right/left wheelspin' though. Didnt really have enough power to do anything.

[Chappy]

WTF!!!!!!!!!!!

Read in the paper yesterday that there is a new rule going into effect from July.

All P-Platers from 11pm to 5:30am or something are only allowed 1 passenger in the car...

This is f***ing bull****.

Where can i find the idiot that proposed this crap, and beat the crap out of him. :errr:


---------------------------
Well after reading this long thread I have come to the conclusion that this new law will upset P plates but its there for a reason not just trying to make life hard for P plate drivers.

At 17 the first year for a P plate you shouldn’t be drinking so there goes that argument out the window.

This argument goes back and forth for ever but the FACT remains it’s the law live with it or lose your P plates for breaking the law.

And for those hero’s who decided to rebel and break the law go for it kids when you lose your licence that one less dick head we need to contend with driving on the roads.

Prime example on what I am talking about:-

Last Friday night about 10:30pm I am driving my car (VY SS) home from a friends place and when I stop at a stop sign a car (looked like a WRX) pulls up along side with what would have to have been at lest 5 young teens inside I would say 17 to 18.

Anyway they are leaning out the window yelling “come on pops want to have ago lets see what that commodore crap can do” the driver is revving up his motor and carrying on like a idiot.

So I let them go roar off in the distance and at the same time take their number plate then I rang my mate who I was visiting who just happened to be a cop in my town, gave him the info and rego number.

My mate rang me the next day about 2:00pm and said hay by the way we got those kids in the WRX, the drive went DUI and we got the rest on possession of drugs charge.

Just an example of how mature and smart some and I mean some not all of the young teens driver are and you say why bring these crazy laws.

I think the got it right changing the laws just got the times wrong it should have been between the hours of 6:00pm till 6:00am.

Cheers
_____________________-

[all4ford]

Apologies if this has already been posted.

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,21058266-1702,00.html

NSW oppositions proposal, whether its bull as the labour government suggests is a different story.

[michaels1v8]

Apologies if this has already been posted.

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,21058266-1702,00.html

NSW oppositions proposal, whether its bull as the labour government suggests is a different story.

Sounds like a good idea to me...

I would like to see them run a trial for a period of 2 years and see just how effective it would be...

[Micks]

Could you believe anything that man says? Heees Craaaazy.

Cheers
VYT

[vyssls1]

it wont be long before they bring that rule here in sa by the looks. and the australia wide...

A p-plater was booked and licence suspended for doing 145+km in a 90 zone.

and some fully licence drivers were booked at more than 100km over the speed limit. all in a 90 zone...

So yes i can see its not always the p-platers, but at that speed, if a blow out were to occur, no matter what age group i doubt they hold it on the road.......and no doubt a innocent family would be involved.

So is the government really doing the job correctly, or should everyone be required to go through a driving coarse.

[BOBGEN111]

10 years ago, i would not have supported these rules as i would have called it P Plate bashing but now, I fully support it. These are way too many idiots out there on there P's in fairly powerful cars doing stupid stuff.

I was not innocent when I was younger, in fact, I used to do some very stupid and dangerous stuff all with mates in cars. I have learnt what I did was dam right stupid.

I hope they bring out something like this in SA. I am sick of taking the family out to dinner and other stuff and being hassled for a drag race by young idiots.

[motorin on]

my daughter is sitting at the table asking me about this subject.Her P plate friend just drove her home and made the other 2 kids hide in the back seat coz he only allowed 1 passenger,that's why I searched for a thread to see if he knew what he was talking about
My kid pretty level headed and reckons the guy is a good driver-very sensible but I agree with the law after some of the stuff I see kids doing with a car full of friend's.Some of the older Arab boys just as bad and should know better
I got my licence(1967) in my old mans HD Holden and the 1st thing I did when I got my licence and drove it alone was put it in the creek out in the bush-hit the gravel and ran off the road from going 2 fast.Got my FJ not long after
I have a weakness for driving fast when alone and going interstate,especially out west at night,but have never drag raced,had a few prangs from being stupid or unlucky.Now if I know my kid will be in the car I refuse to drink before I drive,occassionally get noisy in 2nd just to make some noise,but normally I am pretty well behaved.I have told her I want her to have a 2 door car to try and stop her having more than 1passenger but now I won't need to worry about it as I know she will follow the law while she on her "P's"