ESP (ESC) - howsafeisyourcar ad

[Wonky]

Just saw a very interesting ad on tv. Assumed it was a Holden ad initially as the car in question was very obviously a VE Commodore and it was highlighting the benefits of ESP. At one point the big grille badge nearly filled the screen.

The ad demonstrated what could happen in the event of a driver having to swerve (in this case around a box which fell from the back of a truck). Without ESP (ESC - electronic stability control as they referred to it) the ad showed the car ending up about to crash sideways into a big bus with obvious disastrous consequences.

With ESP the car corrected the induced slide and continued on, safely being back on track by the time the bus passed.

At the end the ad said something along the lines of "Don't buy a car without ESC!". Very positive ad for Holden from howsafeisyourcar.com.au!

See http://www.howsafeisyourcar.com.au/electronic-stability-control.php for scenes from the ad.

[Mr Moosh]

At one point the big grille badge nearly filled the screen..

And like that wasn't intentional...

But Holden do deserve to get some recognition with in the public for offering standard ESP across the range, rather than opting for the more marketable inclusion of side airbags.

[KingClifton]

We discussed this one at length here (http://www.fordaustraliaforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=22878) at FordAustraliaForums.com...to save you navigating there, I've reproduced my comments below.


This has to be one of the best, if not the best, road safety advertising campaigns that Australia has seen.

Finally we have a Federal government taking road safety seriously - a start contrast to the revenue-oriented approach used by all State governments.

In SA we have seen ads which are an insult to our intelligence. The ad shows two EL-era Falcons in an emergency braking scenario. One hits a truck, one doesn't. The scenario is, of course, engineered to "prove" that 65km/h is much less safe than 60km/h. In other words, to prepare SA for the imminent introduction of zero-tolerance. The insulting part of the ad is that it makes no mention of the difference that ABS, EBD, brake assist, quality tyres, suspension, not to mention the car's overall engineeing, would make in that scenario. I bet that a BMW/Merc/Audi doing 80km/h would pull up in less distance than that EL Falcon. Likewise I bet that if the Falcon doing 60km/h was running on Nankang radials and the original 10yo suspension, it'd plow straight into the truck.

So hats off to the Feds for this great initiative.

[TigerMon]

Can't find any VE on the site though. It's all older commodores.

[hallyoz]

I think it's the TAC in Vic that is producung them. I sore another extrolling the virtues of curtain airbags. I also recall one about the NCAP crash rating.

[Wonky]

Can't find any VE on the site though. It's all older commodores.
The link I gave http://www.howsafeisyourcar.com.au/electronic-stability-control.php shows a couple of still scenes from the ad with the VE in it.

[Mr Moosh]

The link I gave http://www.howsafeisyourcar.com.au/electronic-stability-control.php shows a couple of still scenes from the ad with the VE in it.

...and you can press play and watch the ad with the VE Berlina showing off its niffty ESP/ESC. :deal:

[CV860L]

If that vehicle had been fitted with the 6.0L it could have corrected that slide and continued fishtailing down the road leaving some impressive black lines while also managing to miss the bus.
Mind you, if it had the 6.0L it would have overtaken that truck miles back.:yup:

[Wonky]

...and you can press play and watch the ad with the VE Berlina showing off its niffty ESP/ESC. :deal:
Coz I'd seen the ad already I didn't even notice that. Just saw the stills....... :doh:

[CalaisRider]

Wonky I am a great believer in the ESP but it has its limitations. I have often had the tail nicely hanging out in the wet even with ESP on - hence slides will ocur on the limit of traction. It is an aid only, JMHO

Additionally in track/khana events there are times when you are better off leaving it off; as the net effect of electronically trying to counteract your self induced oversteer sslide, is absolutely "massive understeer" as it tries to get things back in a straight line again for you.. It just tries to go straight ahead no matter how much lock you put into the steering.. Its a bit un-nerving the first time to say the least..

Just takes a bit of test and trial to get the best out of it IMHO..
.

[Mr Moosh]

Wonky I am a great believer in the ESP but it has its limitations. I have often had the tail nicely hanging out in the wet even with ESP on - hence slides will ocur on the limit of traction. It is an aid only, JMHO

Additionally in track/khana events there are times when you are better off leaving it off; as the net effect of electronically trying to counteract your self induced oversteer sslide, is absolutely "massive understeer" as it tries to get things back in a straight line again for you.. It just tries to go straight ahead no matter how much lock you put into the steering.. Its a bit un-nerving the first time to say the least..

Just takes a bit of test and trial to get the best out of it IMHO..
.

I agree to some extent. I know ive gotten myself into a situation and ive gone to correct the car, but the ESP has kicked in and pulled it back into line, but consequently ive also tried to correct it which has caused the car to over correct and makes the car jerk around like a fish out of the water.

However, with ESP on while driving on the dirt it works brilliantly. I shouldn't know that it works so well, but once again things happen, and ESP was given a chance to prove its self.

Cheers :driving:

[monaroCountry1]

Yes ESP is one of the best safety features.

I should know having crashed one of my cars into a gutter a couple of months back (single car accident). If I had ESP etc on I think I would have been able to pull up on time. Its well and good practicing controlled braking and handling when your expecting it, it a totally different thing when your not expecting the accident. Normally people will just stomp on the brakes and steer hard away from the oncoming object (which only makes it worse).

[CarlFST60L]

I found it quite fun to play with at wakefeild (beside loosing 2 seconds a lap). I recall turn one being made uneasy at 170km/h when ESC stopped the usual slight 4 wheel drift (the braking area is a slight right hand turn for those unfamiliar) under heavy brakes and turned it into a strange underteer with the feeling of the car gaining a mind of its own and not listening to my instructions (ESP will now ALWAYS remain off for any spirited driving)... I hear that the porche's new one actually makes up a second or two a lap? Darren?

[jerrel]

i stupidly swearved around a car (which was doing a right hand turn into a side street) and almost lost it into the opposite lane of oncoming traffic...to this day i still dont no how i caught it in time. if i was more patient this wouldnt have happened, but forgetting that, if i had esc it may not have been as scary...


p.s. is it esp or esc??

[Shmacky]

Different car companies call it different things - they however both the same thing really.

Shmacky

[BigFella]

in our euros, legend, and CRV's its called VSA (Vechicle Stability Assist)
Its been on some of the hondas standard since late 2002 in some of the luxury models. It good to see Holden putting it in the bread and butter models too!

We now have it standard on all the new CRV's and its the only SUV in the maket now with min 4 airbags and VSA standard throughout thw whole range!

We tested the VSA out at calder oneday driving the euro and then at sandown driving the legend, i can tell u it makes a massive difference!

i just wish i could demonstrate how good it is in a test drive lol:thumbsup:

-jimmy

[PaulST]

And like that wasn't intentional...

But Holden do deserve to get some recognition with in the public for offering standard ESP across the range, rather than opting for the more marketable inclusion of side airbags.
I agree with you there. Holden's move to make ESP standard across the range didn't appear to be planned so no doubt Holden isn't making as much money as they'd have liked to. But it's a brilliant safety feature and Holden deserve to be praised for what they've done.

[moose]

ESP is similar to ABS in that a professional driver will be able to outdrive it in a non-ABS or ESP model, but the ABS/ESP will always be there in an emergency, where professional driving skills may not.

Interesting that they've had it on selected astra and vectra models for several years, but it hasn't been a "marketed" feature.

[CalaisOwner]

[QUOTE=moose;840965]ESP is similar to ABS in that a professional driver will be able to outdrive it in a non-ABS or ESP model, but the ABS/ESP will always be there in an emergency, where professional driving skills may not.QUOTE]

But not when you have ESP that is SWITCHABLE because it defeats the purpose of having ESP in the first place.

[moose]

That's beside the point. You can also pull the fuse on the ABS and disable that. You can do a lot of things to make a car less safe than it needs to be.

Point is the ESP will be there to react when the skills may not be. Not everyone has the skills to cope in all conditions they may get in.:driving:

[CalaisOwner]

That's beside the point. You can also pull the fuse on the ABS and disable that. You can do a lot of things to make a car less safe than it needs to be.

Point is the ESP will be there to react when the skills may not be. Not everyone has the skills to cope in all conditions they may get in.:driving:

That is why ESP should never be switchable. You never know when you will need it. I suppose we are not too far off from seeing manufacturers putting a warning label to ESP switchable vehicles such as: "Switching off ESP in this vehicle will reduce your chance of controlling your vehicle in a hazardous situation". It is also about time auto magazines stop giving readers the impression that vehicles with switchable ESP are more attractive than the ones with permanent ESP for the sake of a "sporty ride".

[CarlFST60L]

ESP is so bad its not funny, no more trips to the drags, no circuit racing and no more skid pan's (unless you happy to be owned by ricers)... Try doing this with ESP on :rofl:

http://www.oz8.org/gallery/albums/Carl/EseriesR8_Dec_2006.wmv

i wouldnt by a R8/GTS/SS/SSV (but maybe a calais)... Sure, its great in the wet, pulling the boat at at sandy ramps, driving with family, daily use, dirt roads etc but actually using the car for sports purposes or 'going fast', you MUST have it off...

I do believe the carrera's gain a second a lap with ESP on though, i think its because it will turn the car in better due to braking on the inside wheel early, the R8 certainly dosnt, it almost stops you and turns the car :limpy:

[moose]

That is why ESP should never be switchable. You never know when you will need it. I suppose we are not too far off from seeing manufacturers putting a warning label to ESP switchable vehicles such as: "Switching off ESP in this vehicle will reduce your chance of controlling your vehicle in a hazardous situation". It is also about time auto magazines stop giving readers the impression that vehicles with switchable ESP are more attractive than the ones with permanent ESP for the sake of a "sporty ride".
I'm fairly sure there's a warning like that in the owner's manual! I think the fact the ESP has to be switched off each time is fair warning though.


ESP is so bad its not funny, no more trips to the drags, no circuit racing and no more skid pan's
Methinks you are missing the point of ESP if you see it solely as the fun police. But, as calaisowner stated it can be switched off to do those things.

[CarlFST60L]

Methinks you are missing the point of ESP if you see it solely as the fun police. But, as calaisowner stated it can be switched off to do those things.

Maybe i have, but this quote 'That is why ESP should never be switchable' makes me think he is saying it should never be turned off...

If my kids had the car it would be covered so it couldnt be turned off, its a great saftey feature!

[moose]

Maybe i have, but this quote 'That is why ESP should never be switchable' makes me think he is saying it should never be turned off...


Yeah, umm, can't say I agree with that particular comment either;)

[Marco]

To be honest when I get my VE I doubt that I'll ever switch the ESP off - I can't think of a reason why I'd want to and part of the reason I was so keen to get a car with ESP is so that I would worry less about my wife driving a powerful car...