Around the workshop

[Animal]

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A few other things currently going on in the workshop

Our mate Choppo's white HSV ute is in. We are bolting in a stroker to compliment the twin turbo's he has already. This is going to be one very serious white blur when he departs from here in the next few days.


Nick the pom's twin turbo ute is also in getting a bigger cam and a kaaz

http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Animal/June%202007/Workshop/Twin%20Turbo%20cammed.jpg


And another VX will be added to the sleeper brigade :eyes:

Were fitting a 383 stroker

http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Animal/June%202007/VX%20Stroker/VX1.jpg

With a fancy manifold

http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Animal/June%202007/VX%20Stroker/VX3.jpg

And a tex clutch which has pretty much become a standard around here

http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Animal/June%202007/VX%20Stroker/VX4.jpg

Another CV8 has arrived today for a HH122 ( go the blown coupes ! :smilesandbanana: )

And there is another twin turbo setup also to be fitted to a clubby next week.

Where's my royal purple coffee :)


Ken

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Forgot to mention the white VZ that was on the rollers this morning.

We fitted a 383 stroker, a mid 230 cam, and it reeled off a very nice 420 horsepoewer at the treads.

The owner just came back from his 30 min test drive, biggest grin I have seen on a guys face for ages.

Another of the super sleepers is out there :eyes:

[chops]

Ken, do you find many people still doing the 383 these days?
I would have thought with the price and availability improving on the 6.0 alloy and iron blocks it would almost be redundant to build a stock block stroker.

Interested to hear your thoughts.

[Animal]

Ken, do you find many people still doing the 383 these days?
I would have thought with the price and availability improving on the 6.0 alloy and iron blocks it would almost be redundant to build a stock block stroker.

Interested to hear your thoughts.

Hi Chops,

We did 5 x 383 ls-1's in the last 2 weeks

My thoughts on a 6 litre .... a 6 litre will never have the torque of a 383 LS1

You can make a 383 in 2 ways -

big bore & small stroke = 383 ci - this will rev like a trooper

small bore & big stroke = 383 ci - this will make high horsepower

It is the stroke that makes the power, not the volume of the motor.

Some homework for you :)

Ford make a 427 - a 428 - and a 429 cubic inch motor ( one cubic inch difference ) Each are built for specific purposes and have totally a different output with regard to power. Why are the power outpots so different when the capacity is a bee's dik apart ?

Spelling mistakes in your reply will not be held against you :)

Ken

.

[Justice R8]

Thanks for that info. Big call saying my 412 doesnt rev. You might have to ask Sam what it really revs to if he pushes it.

Chops.
The 6ltr blocks you are refering to, I pressume you mean why would someone want a 383 when you can buy a 6ltr block a lot cheaper now and go to a 402 etc. The main reason is people look at it as still being more money that they dont need to spend for the 6ltr block. Most are looking for a bit more grunt down low and once they drive the 383 and a 402 they generally say the 383 will be plenty for what they need. Most of the 383's are being built as tough street cars being daily driven. Yes a few are chasing power but but more for dyno comps etc where torque is not the be all and end all just the HP number.

I still love the torque my 412 has over my 383 yet top end HP is not that far apart.

[Animal]

Thanks for that info. Big call saying my 412 doesnt rev. You might have to ask Sam what it really revs to if he pushes it.


I don't recall saying that :confused:

[NefariousLS1]

how much is the 383 kit fitted and finished?

[OUTAtheBloo]

Hi Chops,

We did 5 x 383 ls-1's in the last 2 weeks

My thoughts on a 6 litre .... a 6 litre will never have the torque of a 383 LS1

You can make a 383 in 2 ways -

big bore & small stroke = 383 ci - this will rev like a trooper

small bore & big stroke = 383 ci - this will make high horsepower

It is the stroke that makes the power, not the volume of the motor.

Some homework for you :)

Ford make a 427 - a 428 - and a 429 cubic inch motor ( one cubic inch difference ) Each are built for specific purposes and have totally a different output with regard to power. Why are the power outpots so different when the capacity is a bee's dik apart ?

Spelling mistakes in your reply will not be held against you :)

Ken

.


Thats really interesting info. Every other post i seem to read around here about strokers, everyone seems to say dont bother about a 383, go 402.

Can you explain how the stroke makes the power, not the volume of the motor ?

Dan

[Animal]

Thats really interesting info. Every other post i seem to read around here about strokers, everyone seems to say dont bother about a 383, go 402.

Can you explain how the stroke makes the power, not the volume of the motor ?

Dan

Every other post .... really ?

Perhaps you could link me to a few Dan, because I can't find any that say that.

Sam's clients all have the option to upgrade to a larger motor, most don't.

Considering the amount of strokers Sam builds, the majority are 383.

Think of the length of the stroke as leverage and you will beging to understand.

Ken

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how much is the 383 kit fitted and finished?

Would that be with the twin turbo kit supplied and fitted as well, or are you going to supply one for us to fit :)

[vyssbeast]

I think he was refering to the 383 alone, im also curious...

And i know it depends on the choice of parts, but a ballpark figure would be good.

cheers

[XCLUB]

how much is the 383 kit fitted and finished?

I would be pleasantly surprised if you got a straight forward answer to your question in a public forum like this.:hide:

[OUTAtheBloo]

[QUOTE=Animal;943455]Every other post .... really ?

Perhaps you could link me to a few Dan, because I can't find any that say that.

Sam's clients all have the option to upgrade to a larger motor, most don't.

Considering the amount of strokers Sam builds, the majority are 383.

Think of the length of the stroke as leverage and you will beging to understand.

Ken

.

http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=74018&highlight=Stroker
http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=70786&highlight=Stroker

Well theres atleast two threads. I've often asked peoples opinions too, and a number will say go for the 6l because its "only 1500" more. Whether these people I ask are keyboard warriors, or actually know what there talking about is another matter. It's good to see that there is a positive reason to go with a 383, gives me something else to think about while I continue to try and save for one day.

Dan
May I just clear up I wasnt having a go, just mearing asking :D

[seedyrom]

Dan, from my understanding stroke length should be decided by an engine builder with respect to what you want to achieve.

Exactly as Ken has said:

big bore & small stroke = 383 ci - this will rev like a trooper
small bore & big stroke = 383 ci - this will make high horsepower

From my University days in physics, a simplified view is to imagine 2 same capacity V8 engines, one going into a formula 1 car, one into a boat.

Obviously you would require totally different characteristics.
A boat has constant load, resistance and generally will require a lower rpm as it will be sustaining long periods of max throttle (i.e. you need it to be torquey like a mutha).
A formula 1 car is like a highly strung Chihuahua. Needs high revs, and needs to get there quickly. Constantly on and off the throttle, blipping the throttle at every moment you can through corners and chicanes.

Whilst they have the same capacity, the boat engine will have thin cylinders and a very long stroke, enabling fewer rpms, but pushing a high volume with each cycle, whereas a Forumla 1 engine will have a very large bore size and short cylinders, enabling a small stroke length. When doing 20,000rpms, you sure as heck want to preserve the amount of travel a piston has to do :)

These theories may be blown out of the water if RedVYSS comes on with his dealings with LSX based race boats.


And that's why engine builders are engine builders. They deal with matching up the right combination for the application.
Which I guess is why Sam is pumping out the 383's.
To match the customers goals.

[Animal]

I would be pleasantly surprised if you got a straight forward answer to your question in a public forum like this.:hide:

Actually, our prices have been public knowledge for a while and posted on this forum in January 2005.

http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=34605

http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=34607

Drive in drive out arounf the $13,000 mark if we use your block, around the $15,000 mark if we have to supply a block




Well theres atleast two threads. I've often asked peoples opinions too, and a number will say go for the 6l because its "only 1500" more. Whether these people I ask are keyboard warriors, or actually know what there talking about is another matter. It's good to see that there is a positive reason to go with a 383, gives me something else to think about while I continue to try and save for one day.

Dan
May I just clear up I wasnt having a go, just mearing asking :D

You found a whole 2 :) .... and Big Shaun is the only one who actually purchased a kit, the rest are merely opinions. I expected as much.

Remember that when you go to a 6 litre engine, most of the time you have to obtain a new block. With a new block it is ILLEGAL to stamp your original engine number onto it. You have to go to the RTA and then the local cop shop for approval. Chances are a cop will defect you on the spot rather than offer the form to have the engine number swapped.

The reason most guys go for a 383 is that we use the original block and from the outside looking in, nothing much has changed.

It is pretty hard to quote an exact cost. Depends on what cam, injectors, fuel pump, cam springs, head work, exhaust, etc

You can ask all you want Dan, just make sure that your clear about what you want when you ask it.

Every time I reply to a question on a forum, as do most of the sponsors on her, I take a skeptical approach to protect both myself and Sam's.

Ken

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Thanks for that info. Big call saying my 412 doesnt rev. You might have to ask Sam what it really revs to if he pushes it.


Well I spoke with Sam,

And he says ha can make anything rev if he want it to :rofl:

Though your 412 is a little different to the average 412

[choppo]

.
Nick the pom's twin turbo ute is also in getting a bigger cam and a kaaz

http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Animal/June%202007/Workshop/Twin%20Turbo%20cammed.jpg



Update..... Nick actually got 425rwkw out of this baby after the cam! Well done! :smilesandbanana:

[KeenGolfer]

You found a whole 2 :) .... and Big Shaun is the only one who actually purchased a kit, the rest are merely opinions. I expected as much.

Not true. I've had a 383, 410 and 427 so I can speak from experience. A 383 is a waste of money IMO. There simply isn't enough difference from 6.0 to keep someone happy long term - they'll end up wanting more. The 410 would have eaten the 383 for breakfast - even though it had a much bigger cam the 410 had tons more torque, was more fun, heaps more power and better to drive. Every one I've spoken to that's had strokers agrees to go to the 400+ option, especially when it's so little extra cost.



Remember that when you go to a 6 litre engine, most of the time you have to obtain a new block. With a new block it is ILLEGAL to stamp your original engine number onto it. You have to go to the RTA and then the local cop shop for approval. Chances are a cop will defect you on the spot rather than offer the form to have the engine number swapped.


It varies state to state. In the ACT you only have to fill out a form, they don't inspect your car - just check the engine no stamped matches the one on the form. I've done this several times previously with no problem.

[vyssbeast]

P.S. Thanks for that informative post seedy! Never knew that! (too bad the thanks button is gone)

[Animal]

Not true. I've had a 383, 410 and 427 so I can speak from experience. A 383 is a waste of money IMO. There simply isn't enough difference from 6.0 to keep someone happy long term - they'll end up wanting more. The 410 would have eaten the 383 for breakfast - even though it had a much bigger cam the 410 had tons more torque, was more fun, heaps more power and better to drive. Every one I've spoken to that's had strokers agrees to go to the 400+ option, especially when it's so little extra cost..

Well Drew, thanks for your opinion. Not true is your opinion - just yours and we are glad it is an honest one.

You have had those motors for about a few months each. And from what I can recall, most of the parts were second hand. Your history with these motors is well documented on here and most of us have heard your complaints about each motor and why it didn't suit you.

What happened to the whipple you recently fitted to your wagon ?

The difference between what the 410 would have eaten and actually did ? guess we will never know.

And for every 'one' that you have spoken to, Sam has fitted more strokers to customers cars that you will ever begin to imagine. Not all are 383, just a high percentage. We are lucky to have a selection to chose from. Some people would like Mustangs instead of Corvettes, a house in Tamworth instead of the ACT, a 383 over a 410.


It varies state to state. In the ACT you only have to fill out a form, they don't inspect your car - just check the engine no stamped matches the one on the form. I've done this several times previously with no problem.

Since Sam is based in Sydney it makes sense that the local laws are quoted.

Maybey we should just move all the people in NSW that have had strokers fitted to the ACT to satisfy your statement. Fortunatley the chose to stay in NSW and keep there own blocks and engine numbers.

Choice is a wonderful thing Drew, it is just that some are better at it than others.

[KeenGolfer]

Animal, as a layperson who has experienced quite a few combos I can and do my best to help others with their choices. As anyone who knows or has dealt with me, I'm a pretty laid back guy and I don't speak shit. The 410 ran 119.9 mph in an M6 wagon weighing 1908 kg, full street trim, first time ever at the strip. For comparison (not to shit stir, but to compare) Darren's 383 (it was a 383 then Darren wasn't it?) ran a best mph of 114.2 that day. That shows there is a fair difference between a 383 and a 410 ci stroker power wise in that case. Depends what floats your boat - I just believe that most people with the power urge wouldn't be happy with a 383 in the long term. Just the same as people go the bolt on route, then put a cam in, then they decide to add heads. Don't fart around in the 1st instance, save some $$$ and go straight to 400+ cubes.

I've been making the right choices for a while now, that's why I go where I go now to get my work done. As Darren likes to say, if it's only your 1st root you think it's magic, but you need to compare a few to truly know the difference between them. If we all wanted the same thing we'd all have exactly the same combo and go to the same shop - thankfully that isn't the case.

p.s. Nothing has happened to the whipple...

[Justice R8]

Not true. I've had a 383, 410 and 427 so I can speak from experience. A 383 is a waste of money IMO. There simply isn't enough difference from 6.0 to keep someone happy long term - they'll end up wanting more. The 410 would have eaten the 383 for breakfast - even though it had a much bigger cam the 410 had tons more torque, was more fun, heaps more power and better to drive. Every one I've spoken to that's had strokers agrees to go to the 400+ option, especially when it's so little extra cost.

QUOTE]

Your 410 rattled its ass off due to clearence issues. Cant remember the 383, was that after the 410 needed a rebuild after a month? Your 427 was second hand from VXSS and you decided to pull out the 240+ cam and put in a smaller cam at 112+ which didnt allow you to get any timing into to it because it wasnt bleeding off any cylinder pressure like it was built to do with the 240+ cam and couldnt work out that the wrong cam choice was what was hurting the engine.

Now in saying that and if the big cube engines you had were the ducks guts why on earth would you buy a standard crate LS2 at 364 ci if all the big ones were better. You had all the big stroked forged internal big torque engines yet whack a whipple on a standard crate LS2 engine. I actually remember you saying that after you got your LS2 with a GTS it felt nearly as good as your 427. Must have been one seriously farked up cam you had put in that 427 because when VXSS had it the engine ran a 10sec pass full weight in his auto vxss

Actions speak louder than words and I really cant work out some of the actions you have taken. Its a bit like being on a merry go round. You keep coming back to the same point. I hate to think of the money you have pissed away to end up with a LS2, 17ci bigger than the car came out with standard +a GTS cam. Maybe you just have too much money to throw around or have listened to the wrong info.

There are engines for different applications thats why I have 346, 383 and 412. I was just stirring Ken on my 412 not reving comment.

Ken
What is the story with the whipple. Is it not still on Drews car. I know it was too powerful when he first got it. Has it now been removed due to too much power?

So Drew, from your experience it would be actually quite hard for anyone to understand how you could comment on what is true or not especially when you think your LS2 with GTS cam is nearly as good as your 427. From your actions we should all go back to crate LS2's. See my point. everybody is different. If you start with a 6 ltr block you can go to 412. If you start with a 346 you can go to 392. As you said with your 410, its all about the money.

BTW I think Ken is only quoting Sam as I often do, so if you think you have the knowledge to debate Sam it bring it on. I think Sam has built more strokers than you have had cars, bikes and matchbox cars combined.

Have a crack at answering the Kens 427 428 and 429 motor question?

So in summary we should all get LS2's and put a GTS cam in them. I thought we were all playing nicely but I guess we need to get back to the good old days.

And just for the record Criso's 383 ran 10.2 at 133mph (refering to your above post) His 440ci ran 10.01 at 135. His 383 cost fark all his 440 cost him a bomb

[QUOTE=drewbytes;943888]

I've been making the right choices for a while now, that's why I go where I go now to get my work done. As Darren likes to say, if it's only your 1st root you think it's magic, but you need to compare a few to truly know the difference between them. If we all wanted the same thing we'd all have exactly the same combo and go to the same shop - thankfully that isn't the case.

p.s. Nothing has happened to the whipple...

But if you keep rooting duds you will end up thinking thats the best a root can be:). Good to see the whipple is still on and going strong. The main thing is you are happy.

[Animal]

LSSS Winner

Engine Size: 383
Induction : N/A
60' : 1.6544
ET: 11.4798
MPH : 120.1

Best MPH : 123.83

Post #7 taken from here ... http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=73784

This is an example. I don't know the weight of the car, though the MPH is very close to yours. A lot also has to do with the driver, the set up of the car, quality of tyres, pressure of tyres, fuel used, 60" times and how they are feeling on the day. I think it fair for Darren to comment on his run though.

As you would know, torque is about driveability, about coming out of a corner easily, about cruising up hills without changing back gears. You really have to experience it. The difficult part is that the person must experience it, you can not pass that on to someone verbally. Much like watching 2 top fueller's run a pair of 4.6's.

As I have never met you in person I am unable to comments on you as a layperson. Your beleifs are your beleifs, not everone elses. You can't expect people to beleive it just because you do.

I belevie what Sam has to say rather then what you do. He has been doing this for over 20 years and honestly does not have to prove himself everytime someone has a beleif in something different.

If people want an opinion about a stroker, they need to pick up a phone and ring him. As the person who actually builds them for a living, do you not think is wise to ask them questions ? And remember that they also need to keep within a budget that neither you or I will ever know about.

[Justice R8]

I think it fair for Darren to comment on his run though.



It doesnt do Drews argument anygood to analyse my day then. I usually do the drag days in prep for a dutton rally which is what I did that particualer day. So lets look at it, I had semi comps, hard suspension for the circuit which is what I run for a rally. Gee I wonder why it didnt lay a time down. Drews car was running I think his choice of tyre then was sumitomo which the Melb boys were using whilst chasing the street tyre class records and standard ss suspension which we all know will run deep into the 11's quite well and even 10's. Getting the tyres to bite is the key to both ET and MPH. There is no use me practicing with fe2 or standard shocks and springs if that not what I run in a rally. Another great example is my wifes old blown coupe made 675rwhp yet ran a 12.6 @ 112 smoking the tyres across the line at heathcote and I mean smoking not just spinning. The tyres need to be driving the car for the whole 1/4 mile to get a time and MPH.

Now drew. If you want to compare track results I am happy to sit and list those to blow your argument apart.

[Animal]

Good to see the whipple is still on and going strong. The main thing is you are happy.

Ok ... I'm confused

Is this it or not ? ... http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=74675

Thanks for revvin me up ya bugger :)


Update..... Nick actually got 425rwkw out of this baby after the cam! Well done! :smilesandbanana:

Thanks for the update Steve, did Nick manage a smile when he picked it up.

Can't wait to see yours on the dyno mate

[choppo]

did Nick manage a smile when he picked it up
.....a smile, thats anunderstatement! He was telling me the story of the drive home...... accidently getting sideways in 4th gear on the way home :errr::errr:he needs a new set of undies!! Ha ha!!

[Justice R8]

Thanks for that info. Big call saying my 412 doesnt rev. You might have to ask Sam what it really revs to if he pushes it.

Chops.
The 6ltr blocks you are refering to, I pressume you mean why would someone want a 383 when you can buy a 6ltr block a lot cheaper now and go to a 402 etc. The main reason is people look at it as still being more money that they dont need to spend for the 6ltr block. Most are looking for a bit more grunt down low and once they drive the 383 and a 402 they generally say the 383 will be plenty for what they need. Most of the 383's are being built as tough street cars being daily driven. Yes a few are chasing power but but more for dyno comps etc where torque is not the be all and end all just the HP number.

I still love the torque my 412 has over my 383 yet top end HP is not that far apart.

Just thought I would add a bit more to this as well. The difference between going to a 400+ ci over a 383 is the $1500 for the block. Right in theory, wrong in practice. Someone that is going to a 410 is chasing more torque and a little more power. If you use all your old bits and add a 6ltr block, crank rods and pistons you will pick up torque but will lose up top over the 383. Why? The heads just wont flow enough to make the power. To explain it in laymans terms its a bit like trying to exit at the footy after a game. As everyone rushes for the gate, it becomes a bottle neck slowing it all down. The same will happen in the inlet port. The air can actually stall in the port and not be able to flow the air that the engine requires. So the 1500 become an extra couple of grand for better heads, then you need to increase the inlet in the manifold as it cant get enough air through it. That is why I went to the 8tb. On a blown app you can force it it in as seen on my wifes old GTO 675 rwhp through a standard manifold, in n/a you dont have the luxury of a big pump pushing it in. So suddenly the cost starts to skyrocket. That is why more and more people are sticking with a 383 over a 402, 410 412 etc. They can do the basics for around the 12 k mark then if they want to go bigger in the cam or heads etc they have the option, but when they drive out the door they have a shit load more torque than they started with. As long as your combination is right and your pockets are deep enough you can make power out of any capacity. Nascar is a great example. One year they were making lets say 700hp (to use a figure). To slow them and make it more competitive, Nascar officials made them run a restrictor plate in the intake which did slow them down for one season. Next season the cars went faster still using the restrictor plate. This shows that no matter what, a guy that knows what he is doing will always find ways to make more power.


Drewbytes
Not true. I've had a 383, 410 and 427 so I can speak from experience. A 383 is a waste of money IMO. There simply isn't enough difference from 6.0 to keep someone happy long term - they'll end up wanting more. The 410 would have eaten the 383 for breakfast - even though it had a much bigger cam the 410 had tons more torque, was more fun, heaps more power and better to drive. Every one I've spoken to that's had strokers agrees to go to the 400+ option, especially when it's so little extra cost.


The highlighted section shows your lack of experience and limited knowledge that can go a long way towards confusing and misleading people when it is portrayed as hard facts. I am often accused of jumping into your threads troublemaking when all I am generally trying to do is actually sort the fact from the fiction so people are not mislead. You have proven that you dont know what you want as you keep changing your mind, even to the point of buying a turbo kit and selling it before it was fitted. Just because you have a had a 383 or a 410 doesnt mean you know what you are talking about. Same goes for me. If you werent happy with all the combos how can you say you have had the best advice. Do you suggest that everyone follows your mod path. At least you have had some warm fuzzies on the way. See I can shit stir as good as most, the difference is I generally have facts from experts to back up my big mouth. This is not a shot at you, once again it is fact. Its your money therefore your choice but the main thing is you are happy.

Now for some more facts. You are quoting there is not much difference between a 6ltr 364ci and a 383ci. I would go as far as to say there is far more difference between a 364 6ltr and a 383ci than there is between a 346ci and a 364. Not just because the difference is 3ci bigger between the 383 and the 364. You need to understand how the engine works. The difference between a 346 and a 364 is purely the bore size. The stroke is exactly the same. Therefore you are getting a little more capacity from the increased bore size 16ci. The difference between a 383 (Stroker not allbore) and a 346 is as follows. The bores remain the same between the 346 and the 383. The capacity increases 37 CI but its not all about the capacity increase. Why? The stroke/throw of the crank are more important in the equation which goes back to Kens point on the 427,428,429. The stroke/ crank throw is where the extra capacity is gained and the shitloads more torque over the 364 , The stroke/throw is what gives you the torque. Yes theortically speaking as you go longer in the rod you should not be reving it as hard due to the increased piston speed in the bore. Ie 5000rpm on a 346 and 5000rpm on a 383 has the crank doing exactly the same revs but the piston in the 383 is travelling further down the bore during the same 360 degree rotation of the crank therefore has to move at a far greater speed. In saying that I rev my 412 as hard as I ever reved my 383 or my 346.

Now if we look at a 2 383 engines.
engine 1 is a 383 using a bigger bore and standard crank and rods
engine 2 is using standard bore but stroker crank and rods

If both engines are exactly the same except for the stroke which engine will produce more torque, especially down low? Yes engine 2. It is like using a 5 inch screwdriver to lever a 10kg weight. If you change to a 6 inch screwdiver to lever it, it is a whole lot easier. Same applies to stroke

Comparing your 383 or 410 to any of my engines is amusing. I am still running the same 412 I have been racing for 2 or maybe even 3 years, so I guess that means either my advice was better than yours or you have a lot more money than I have to waste on being a guinea pig or trying to work out what you really want.

To use another one of my great sayings
If you go to a Hooker and you pull out a 3 inch hard penis and ask her what she thinks of it. If the Hooker tells you it is the biggest she has ever seen, one of the following is happening

1. She is just trying to make you feel better knowing you have no idea
2. She knows if she tells you your dick is tiny you wont spend your money with her
3. She doesnt know any better
4. She knows if she can convince you it is a monster you will keep coming back as she makes you feel good about yourself.

Same applies when you are talking to a workshop.:)

Think before you try and throw a hand grenade. Once you pull the pin and its in the air there is no going back.

Bootm line is (another fact). More people are doing 383's at the moment as they feel thay are getting a better bang for buck. Not everyone wants to go to the strip or run a dyno comp. Looking for a nice street car. Thats what I thought you have been looking for and still obviously still havent found.

[choppo]

1. She is just trying to make you feel better knowing you have no idea
2. She knows if she tells you your dick is tiny you wont spend your money with her
3. She doesnt know any better
4. She knows if she can convince you it is a monster you will keep coming back as she makes you feel good about yourself.

Damn.... i thought she loved me.......:doh:

[Animal]

Damn.... i thought she loved me.......:doh:

I though she loved me too mate ..... thats why we have nice cars :)

[keen]

Great post Darren.Certainly cleared up some things I didnt understand.Good to see from time to time there still some good info on the forum.

[chops]

Thanks for the responses guys. An eye opener for me.
I'm almost sorry I asked the question, as I surely wasn't attempting to rubbish anyones choices.

Always love the updates from the Sam's Performance stable.

[Animal]

** Workshop Update **

Last week there were blowers everywhere.

This week we are back to throttlebodies - 8 at a time

On the dyno are a set

http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Animal/June%202007/June%20Update/Dyno%20Noel.jpg

On the engine dyno is another set

http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Animal/June%202007/June%20Update/Engine%20dyno%201.jpg

Even a set on the floor :)

Sam has spent a considerable amount of time helping to develop these

http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Animal/June%202007/June%20Update/Sam's%208tb1.jpg

.

http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Animal/June%202007/June%20Update/Sam's%208tb2.jpg

.

http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/Animal/June%202007/June%20Update/Sam's%208tb3.jpg

If you are considering a set of 8 throttlebodies for you pride and joy,
give Sam a call at the workshop.

Ken


.

[SLE355]

How did they go on the dyno?