Advice... WH performance mods.

[Dillzio]

Hi all.

I've just bought a WH (VT) statesman gen III and i was wondering what sort of options there are for performance enhancing, and what the good mechanics around the northern suburbs of Adelaide are.

I've read a bit about MAF tunes and MAFless tunes, what is the difference?

It's already got an SS air intake in it. The extractors look a bit gay to me, does anyone know if the stock ones are any good?

I'm looking to spend maybe 1500 all up on exhaust, chip and maybe a cam.

Also, i'm getting rid of my 5L VQ statesman now, and i was wondering if it might have anything on it that would be worth keeping for the new car? It's got a low ratio (3.45:1) LSD diff center, an LPG system and a newly rebuilt 700r4 transmission that's in awsome condition.

Any advice appreciated.

cheers,

-D

[VNV8]

firstly you can find any info you need by searching, there are thousands of posts just like this. anyway in adelaide youve got www.ls1edit.com.au but not sure of any others sorry.

1) the MAFless tune deletes the air flow meter (the silver thing between the airbox and intake tube), which means the PCM runs in speed density mode the same as the VT-VY GTSs do, which come factory fitted without a MAF. basically it means more flow and more power, ive found it a hell of a lot smoother. the only minus is that it seems to hunt a little (doesnt settle on any RPM, wanders around a bit) at idle when very cold (first start-up in the morning for example). when going MAFless you need to replace the intake tube with a GTS or aftermarket item. hardly anyone still uses a MAF when getting a tune these days, although there are die-hards who swear by them, they are really just a hindrance.

2) SS inductions are a bit crap, unless its a growler (pod filter style). id sell it off and fit a K&N air charger, or an over-the-radiator intake (have a search-MAFless tune required for these), or a monaro intake (costs about $35 from holden) with a second hole cut into it. any of these will generally give you better power than your current CAI.

3) the stock extractors are fine for reasonable power outputs, but as youve said they look like shite. pick up a set of second hand HSV headers for a couple of hundred bucks, they look much better and give a slightly deeper note in my experience.

4) sorry but no way in hell. forget the cam (youre looking at $3500 plus unless youre doing all the labour yourself), you may get a cat-back exhaust system (redback twin 2.5inch) for around $500, but youll need around $1000 for a custom MAFless tune. maybe look into a mail order tune from oztrack, chipmaster or powertorque (all forum sponsors), theyre around the $400-500 mark but are a bit of a compromise as theyre basically an educated guess at what your car needs. then spend a couple of hundred on HSV headers and get the stock cat pipes opened to gain a bit more power. one more thing to consider is the intake manifold, on the VT/WH they are known as an LS1 manifold which was replaced with the LS6 manifold in the VX. the LS6 item flows alot better and is worth around 15-20hp at the flywheel apparently. pick one up second hand for around $200-300 and a couple of hundred for fitting (labour).

as for your VQ, sorry but none of the stuff will swap over, maybe the gearbox but thatd need a reworking to suit the LS1. youd be better off forgetting about it.

like i said have a search on the forums and give a couple of sponsors a call, theyll set you on your path.

[evlss1]

give Brad a call at Enhanced Automotive (in Salisbury) or send him a pm and he will answer all of your questions.

[lwbls1]

hi mate, how are you going with ideas for mods? I recently purchased a sato also, and have chosen to go the PCM route

[Dillzio]

G'day,

PCM is always a good choice, but you have to get rid of all your bottlenecks first, because otherwise you'll just have to get the PCM retuned after your next mod.

I'm a little short on $$$ at the moment, but when i have the spare money i want to go an OTRCAI and get it dyno tuned- i'm hoping for about 220rwkw. As luck would have it, mine already has a free flowing twin 2&1/4 system on it, and you don't need to upgrade to high flow cats unless you're chasing upwards of 250rwkw.

[markone2]

G'day,


I'm a little short on $$$ at the moment, but when i have the spare money i want to go an OTRCAI and get it dyno tuned- i'm hoping for about 220rwkw. As luck would have it, mine already has a free flowing twin 2&1/4 system on it, and you don't need to upgrade to high flow cats unless you're chasing upwards of 250rwkw.


:shock:..Whoa.......Free flowing 2&1/4" :errr:.....no need to upgrade cats :confused:..well possibly not given the current exhuast...

Mod list for 12.5 second WH Series 1 Statesman
LS6 Manifold......
25% UD
2nd hand Tri-y's
2.5 cat back / 2nd hand hi flow cats
3.9's
High Stall
OTRCAI
PT Mafless tune 221rwkw.....12.554 @ 107.53mph

$1500 budget
1/ Maffless Mail order aprox $400 on advertised specials
2/ 2nd hand 3.46 diff gears...practicly give these away aprox $200
3/ Catback 2.5 system / opened cats...2nd hand $400 which should include fitting..shop around
4/ 25% UD $300..fit yourself
5/ Ebay OTRCAI & Filter $200..............Expect 13.3/13.4 quarter mile performance...which is pretty damn quick for a full weight barge imho

Add-ons ...LS6 Manifold ..drop 2/10ths off above times..$200.00
2nd hand TC.......straight into high 12's..from $300.00

[Dillzio]

hey mate,

I can see you've done more homework than i have...
what are tri Ys? are they a type of extractor?
what is the 25%UD?

Are you going to change the diff ratio yourself? There's a lot of work involved in changing all the seals and everything isn't there?

I like where you're headed with your mods, but remember that the cruisy statto suspension isn't made for breaking 14 seconds down the quater, remember to upgrade!

I personally want to keep some of the cruisy, cumfortable element to my car. What you're doing sounds awsome for the strip, but maybe not so good for everyday driving. I would be reluctant to get a 3.9 ratio diff and a high stall converter because i'd be worried about it making the ride too jerky, but i've never been in one (an LS1 anyway) either so i can't speak from experience, and i have heard that with the right chip mods you can get the torque converter to behave quite smoothly and lock up quite quickly at low throttle.

Also, I LOVE the fact that the LS1 has so much torque down low, i love being able to cruise at 1700rpm at 100km/h using 9L/100Ks. If you get the low ratio diff you can kiss goodbye the low rpm cruises down the freeway :-( Also, you'll increase your fuel costs owing to the higher rpm the car will be doing all the time and the increased drag of the diff spining almost 4 times per rotation instead of just over 3- which will also cost you a little bit of power at the wheels.

As far as i'm concearned, powerful torquy motors LOVE to be under load, if i had something with shit loads of power i'd want a higher ratio diff before i went a lower ratio, imagine what it will do to your quater mile time if you can get 90km'h out of first! But still, if you don't have shit loads of power, and you want to increase your quater mile time, a low ratio diff is one way to do it.

But as i said, that's just my opinion and if you want a drag car then i think that with those mods your car's gonna be a beauty!

Cheers,


-D

[iamhappy46]

Lower ratio diffs do not necessailry increase fuel consumption, there is more torque multipication and therefore less throttle is required to mantain the same speed even though the engine is spinning around 15~30% more rpm.

Keeping a 'barge' moving with more rpm from a lower diff ratio can still give good fuel economy(much better than you expect!).

Also, a mafless tune can unleash the low rpm torque further and improve your fuel economy much more anyway.

My best is 5.7L/100kms on the highway and around 6.5L/100km is my average on long trips(which involves a bit of full throttle every now and then)

[thnk_again]

in my stato i have done a lill bit of work buy far the best thing is the diff gears, i think you should be getting diff gears then a tune and you will be happy

[Dillzio]

my economy must be screwed!

on the open road at 120 i average 11.5 km/h with no full throttle overtaking. I wonder if my car could have a dodgey PCM tune?

[markone2]

hey mate,



I like where you're headed with your mods, but remember that the cruisy statto suspension isn't made for breaking 14 seconds down the quarter, remember to upgrade!

Cheers,


-D

Whooooooooo....Who told you that nonsense :shock:..........Stock Factory Statesman Caprice * cruisy * rear Suspension in full working order........please observe........

http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/markone2/Caprice%20launch%201.jpg

Just how fast is that launch on said stock rear factory suspension ....????

1.55 back to back

http://www.haroc.1337thing.com/ls1/markone2/Caprice%201.555.jpg

All on 3.9 diff gears....and the clincher ..same car worked a full working week as company limo.........moonlighting at Willowbank on the weekend and Wednesday nights...that should put paid to any 90kph out of 1st gear nonsense :)

pm me for details if you like......you really have the totally wrong end of the stick atm so too speak...I'll send you on the path way to enlightenment if you wish

Unbeknown to many, the stock rear Barge suspension is one of the most Drag friendly factory setups out there imho

[Vulture]

I can see you've done more homework than i have...
what are tri Ys? are they a type of extractor?
what is the 25%UD?

Markone2 is only a beginner in the LS1 scene but he is on the right track :rofl:...

Try-Ys are an extractor design that basically goes from the 4 exhaust ports on each bank to two pipes, then to one. Therefore a Y shape before merging to the X pipe then splitting again into two separate pipes to the rear muffler. They are better for torque in low to mid rpm and probably a touch better for fuel economy as well. The other main design for our LS1s is a 4 into 1 design on each bank ie. 4 separate pipes to one pipe which then continues on each side to the X or merge pipe etc. Generally better for high rpm power.

25% UD is 25% underdrive pully or underdrive balancer. Basically turns the serpentine belt 25% less speed to reduce losses turning the power steering pump, aircon, alternator etc.


I would be reluctant to get a 3.9 ratio diff and a high stall converter because i'd be worried about it making the ride too jerky, but i've never been in one (an LS1 anyway) either so i can't speak from experience

You need to experience a high-stalled, 3.9 diffed car before you make these proclaimations :teach:



Also, I LOVE the fact that the LS1 has so much torque down low

You're shitting me? The LS1 has stuff-all torque down low standard. That has been one of its major problems. It is a short-stroke design compared with old-school V8s.



My best is 5.7L/100kms on the highway and around 6.5L/100km is my average on long trips(which involves a bit of full throttle every now and then)

That's got to be one of the most ridiculous economy claims from a GenIII I have so far heard. Maybe down hill, trailing throttle after a reset of the trip computer but not for an average over a hundred Km or so. Sorry but no way.

[iamhappy46]

http://img2.putfile.com/thumb/8/22219495854.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=6277039)
6.5L per 100km's and I use my ute mainly for work with the Tomtom getting the distance and confirming it is same as odometer for the log book. Usually get around 800km's between fuel fill ups with highway use. The above pic was after 3/4 of a tank of highway driving :)

For example: Coffs Harbour to Newcastle, drove around newcastle for a while and then on to Epping in Sydney on a single tank of fuel. Stock tank, no surge tank. Also done the Coffs to Goldcoast trip and BACK on a single tank of fuel.

[STATIE]

$1500 budget
1/ Maffless Mail order aprox $400 on advertised specials
2/ 2nd hand 3.46 diff gears...practicly give these away aprox $200
3/ Catback 2.5 system / opened cats...2nd hand $400 which should include fitting..shop around
4/ 25% UD $300..fit yourself
5/ Ebay OTRCAI & Filter $200..............Expect 13.3/13.4 quarter mile performance...which is pretty damn quick for a full weight barge imho

Add-ons ...LS6 Manifold ..drop 2/10ths off above times..$200.00
2nd hand TC.......straight into high 12's..from $300.00

Do this ^^^^ exactly and you'll be on a winner.:teach:
Dunno about some of those prices but if you have contacts & shop around you should be OK.
Personally go for at least 3.7's & preferably 3.9's in the gears if you can.

Stato's are no different to any other LSX car - Tune - Pipes - OTR - Gears & in the case of an auto a Stallie and away you go.

12.5 sec Stato
http://www.oz8.org/gallery/albums/statie/IMG_3302.sized.jpg

12.3 sec Stato
http://www.gmmotorsport.com/gm_customers/mrsls1/burnout.jpg

[thnk_again]

markone2
that launch is awesome what tyres did you have on the back?

[Dillzio]

Quote:
Also, I LOVE the fact that the LS1 has so much torque down low

You're shitting me? The LS1 has stuff-all torque down low standard. That has been one of its major problems. It is a short-stroke design compared with old-school V8s.


Well, i don't think mine is standard as it has tonnes or torque down low, i can climb hills in overdrive and the fuel economy sits on about 18L/100Ks. That's a lot better than my last 5.0 EFI V8 which could barely make it up the same hills without dropping into drive.

[Brumby]

If your in to stripping the vq. Take the lsd centre while you can it will fit the vt diff. Go th the wreckers and get a diff from a r31 skyline or pinatra for 3.9 gears. They do fit the early vt diffs they changed in the vx to rubber coupling which use differnt gears. Fuel econermy is normal for a stocker i have heard some whoppers in regards to fuel economy. i could get 5lt per/100 if i coasted along the hiway and reset the odo whilst crusing but only would do it for 1km or so. When you get a tune they should upgrade the os to a vx-vy which gives better tuneability by ditching the dual ve tables and enabling lean cruise etc. Apart from that Markone2 seems to have his package sorted to acheive good times(a driver who can race helps) just scan and learn from the forums but dont take everything as gossipal there are some ludicrious claimsand some claims that have been proven and can back it up

[markone2]

markone2
that launch is awesome what tyres did you have on the back?

Trusty and well proven MT drag radails ...235x60xR15 ( 3752R )