Supercharged HSV? - Part 3

A 12.6 is ok. Must admit that I was hoping for a little faster, say closer to a 12.2. Still, a 12s factory standard street car is nothing to be sniffed at - especially at this price point. Very impressed that it went around a race track quicker than the AMG though. Sort of the wrong way around! A muscle car is supposed to be quick in a straight line as the sine qua non! But then fall over a bit on the corners. No doubt the engineers could have concentrated more on getting a quick quarter time but perhaps this would have compromised track handling. The AMG is obviously at another level of engineering (as it should be) with much less fuel usage from its stout engine and a more resolved ride/handling balance.

Will be interesting to see the times when private guys get them out onto the race track. Tempted to have a go in mine at Willowbank but potentially not as quick as it is a manual.. Although from what some others have said it may actually be quicker with the ratios? The manual has a 3.7:1 differential as opposed to the auto's 3.23 (from memory, can anyone can check the .pdf sales brochure?).
I'm sure guys willing to tweak the GTS a bit will be posting sub 12s by next year without much effort.
One thing that Morley mentioned in his review was the bi-modal exhaust seemed to take a while to open even when on the sport setting. That sounds shite and would push me towards an aftermarket exhaust if mine does that.
Who wants a big delay for the sound when stomping on the pedal? He also didn't like the electric steering and found it a bit contrived. Agree with his comments about the interior - there is something just not right to my eyes every time I look at it. I think it is the mix of knobs and button and different finishes. I think the aircon vents should have been done in black and some of the buttons 'hidden' a bit better. But I am really knit-picking here, when I sat in an R8 at the dealership, the interior felt a lot more cohesive than it looks in pictures but it is not a patch on the AMG layout.

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Originally Posted by GTS LSA

The GTS to me is the winner regardless of .2 here or there on the basis of drive it out of a show room, & go so close to beating a car 3 times its price... what else can do that... and I don't want to mod it and possibly send it in the wrong direction based on what HSV have spent squillions getting so right

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Definitely, I've decided that if I want a fast car, I'll buy it fast.
Well ok, sometimes some simple mods are not so bad as Markone2 points out.

^^
Gear Ratios
6-speed manual / 6-speed automatic with Active Select
1 2.66 / 4.03 2 1.78 / 2.36 3 1.30 / 1.53 4 1.00 / 1.15 5 0.80 / 0.85 6 0.63 / 0.67 Final Drive 3.73 / 3.23

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Originally Posted by GTS LSA

^^
Gear Ratios
6-speed manual / 6-speed automatic with Active Select
1 2.66 / 4.03 2 1.78 / 2.36 3 1.30 / 1.53 4 1.00 / 1.15 5 0.80 / 0.85 6 0.63 / 0.67 Final Drive 3.73 / 3.23

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Working it out gearbox x diff, the auto has a shorter 1,2 and 3 and pretty much same same for 4th, maybe the auto will be quicker down the quarter mile? Are there different ratios available for the 9.75" diff apart from 3.73 and 3.23?

Cheers, Matthew

Was the car Wheels tested an auto or manual?

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Originally Posted by Vulture

Was the car Wheels tested an auto or manual?

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Auto. i'd be really interested if MOTOR tests a manual. I susect t will be quicker than wheels auto time

Yeah I wouldnt mind a comparison either, I thought I had read that auto but manually changing was the quickest, but that may have just been an opinion also

Just bought Wheels & read the GTS/E63 "comparison".
All I can say is "Wow", I thought the car would be well received, but that comparison shows it being "right up there" with the E63 for a little more than a third of the price. I think this article, & others, (there's another in the Sun today), will make even more people stand up & take notice of what this car is.....Phil Harding would have to be super happy.
John Bowe's comments were telling....He is nobody's idiot, and if he says something's good, then it is.
I did notice that the GTS was a manual, so another comparison with an auto?....well, what do you guys think?....would it be better, worse...or what? And another thing was that the standing quarter, 0-100 etc was done on damp surfaces, surely not the best launch for 430KW, so maybe those times for both cars could be improved upon.
Well done, HSV. Pickles.

Get Joe Public in them already !!!! :driving: :nos:

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Originally Posted by Pickles

I did notice that the GTS was a manual, so another comparison with an auto?....well, what do you guys think?....would it be better, worse...or what?

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If the Auto, in manual mode, changes gears when it's told to , then you have the best of both worlds.

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Originally Posted by jkgmh

Get Joe Public in them already !!!! :driving: :nos:

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YES... Send me mine early and I will tell all :driving:

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Originally Posted by Vulture

This is what puts it all into perspective for me:

I can have an E63 AMG S

OR

A GTS *and* a CLA45 AMG *and* still have enough change for an SSV Redline if I wanted one.

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Anyone buying an E63 AMG in Oz is getting sharfted, as they're only a 100-130k car in America/Europe.

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Originally Posted by XUV

Anyone buying an E63 AMG in Oz is getting sharfted, as they're only a 100-130k car in America/Europe.

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Ha ha ha...Very true....ya can get a C63 for $80K in the U.S. Whatever Govt is in power here must have a big grin when anyone buys a "Luxury?" car.
Cheers, Pickles.

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Originally Posted by Brett240

Auto. i'd be really interested if MOTOR tests a manual. I susect t will be quicker than wheels auto time

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No, the Wheels test was the manual.

Cheers, Matthew

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Brett240

Auto. i'd be really interested if MOTOR tests a manual. I susect t will be quicker than wheels auto time

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In today's Carsguide in the Herald Sun's GTS vs E63 AMG comparison they say "We're assured the GTS auto is slightly quicker than the manual. We believe it, especially as the manual needs to grab second just before it passes the 100 mark."

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Originally Posted by GTS LSA

Yeah I wouldnt mind a comparison either, I thought I had read that auto but manually changing was the quickest, but that may have just been an opinion also

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I know people who should be pretty good at picking change points who've found their 400m times have improved by up to 0.3 just leaving the A6 in drive compared to manual shifting.

^ yeah I dont doubt it, if the auto is decent it should beat maual shifting I thought, though each car type is different I guess

As said earlier, we need some real world testing

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Originally Posted by Wonky

In today's Carsguide in the Herald Sun's GTS vs E63 AMG comparison they say "We're assured the GTS auto is slightly quicker than the manual. We believe it, especially as the manual needs to grab second just before it passes the 100 mark."

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Yep, sounds like the auto will be the numbers car (as expected).

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Originally Posted by Wonky

I know people who should be pretty good at picking change points who've found their 400m times have improved by up to 0.3 just leaving the A6 in drive compared to manual shifting.

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3 attempts at that little trick proved woesome in the big cammed VE Maloo….forget the 11.7 , shot it straight back into low 12’s with a 6mph loss each and every time.
Said Senator previously mentioned, admittedly only the one attempt , saw a 14.09 pass at 104mph…
................You simply cannot outshift the auto .be it 4A or 6A imho , Oddly enough the Senators fastest time came locked in Drive , with traction Control on.
.
Older forum members here will well recall *Chillys* shocking ¼ mile times until the truth came to light once his daugher drove down the 1/4 with the car locked in *3*…instant full second pickup ..Chilly finally being convinced that self shifting was not the way to travel .

After that nasty little habbit was established, we then saw the wee cam only VX knocking out high 11’s in full street trim ....whilst the good gentlemen in question was reading the Redbank times and supping on a cup of coffee in his left hand…there is a video of it here on the forum .

.


SV8 H/C 10.765

I hope the wheels story is indicative of the real GTS because if it is then we are going to be very happy. I think wait for a few cars to be tested before jumping on the sprint times. In any case the way wheels describes its twisty bits performance is what I am looking for.

The article suggests that launch control struggles with damp conditions and a totally manual approach was better. By the way 80 - 120 in 5.6 seconds in 5th is pretty fair with 2.8 seconds in 3rd. 0 - 60 in 2.5 seconds same as the AMG. From there the AMG has the edge. This is backed up by the Winton data with the GTS carrying higher corner speeds in 5 of 8 corners but the AMG has much higher straight speeds. Lap time to the GTS by 0.2 seconds in a 1:40.9. I have no feel for that number.

If memory serves, the FG GT-P and the old GTS did Winton in around 1:43.9X - 1:44.XX

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Originally Posted by markone2

Older forum members here will well recall *Chillys* shocking ¼ mile times until the truth came to light once his daugher drove down the 1/4 with the car locked in *3*…instant full second pickup ..Chilly finally being convinced that self shifting was not the way to travel .

After that nasty little habbit was established, we then saw the wee cam only VX knocking out high 11’s in full street trim ....whilst the good gentlemen in question was reading the Redbank times and supping on a cup of coffee in his left hand…there is a video of it here on the forum .

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:lol: .... that has to be one of the top 10 all-time classic LS1 forum posts for sure! Chilly was good value, no doubt about it.

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Originally Posted by Vulture

Yep, sounds like the auto will be the numbers car (as expected).

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I think, in a straight line, the auto may have the edge, but another member has quite correctly mentioned "the twisty bits", & in those situations, like John Bowe's Winton drive, I reckon the manual may have the edge.
Cheers, Pickles.

So much anticipation..so many scenarios...must be killing the GTS owners to be....

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Originally Posted by jkgmh

So much anticipation..so many scenarios...must be killing the GTS owners to be....

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What's killing me is when mine is due to arrive I won't be in the country. It will sit lonely somewhere waiting for me!

Finally got a chance to get down to the newsagent today to get the Wheels mag. Then had to sit through 4 hours of kids sport and parties/weekend stuff

Sitting here watching V8's, with a cold Corona, reading about the GTS.... Life is good

GTS well and truly did itself proud vs Germany's best... I am very impressed... Stiil like to see some dry weather running and some owners feedback, but regardless of that, I am 110% happy with my decision to buy one, the anticipation is killing me....waiting.....waiting......waiting

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Originally Posted by mjrandom

What's killing me is when mine is due to arrive I won't be in the country. It will sit lonely somewhere waiting for me!

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Not an issue, I’ll happily volunteer to pick it up for you, and given it’s a brand new model ..I’ll even waiver my usual fee for supplying a best of 3 base line runs at Willowbank ,



.
;)

Funny I have been inundated with offers to "keep it clean for you while you are away". A mate of mine was going to get me some money back offering drives in the country! Thanks for the offer though I think it can sit in Melbourne or the dealership.

Given that the wheels car was a silver manual I guess it is a production car and not a mule and it seems that the performance is fairly similar to the first two cars. I was expecting Camaro like figures, looks like that wont happen. Doesn't detract from the car that I have ordered or make me second guess the decision. Just wondering why the lower than expected numbers????

[QUOTE=mjrandom;2090901]Funny I have been inundated with offers to "keep it clean for you while you are away". A mate of mine was going to get me some money back offering drives in the country! Thanks for the offer though I think it can sit in Melbourne or the dealership.

QUOTE]

I can tell with a little Authority , ( I was watching ) last week at Willowbank a NEW Stock looking + Stock sounding NEW Comaro smashed the traps in the 11”s…….Tuned by whom ??????...
Does anyone here Know ?

.
Ps Brisbane or Melbourne ?....only reason I offerred

the YANKS always have big er ##:lmao:

I think it will come up to Brisbane and sit in the dealership. They would probably like that as long as they respect my property. Otherwise I it can stay down at HSV until I am ready for delivery up here. Will find out some more over the next week or two. In any case Simon will be hitting the streets a week or two before me.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mjrandom

Just wondering why the lower than expected numbers????

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The test's were conducted in the wet and with a manual.

I just got back from the US last week. TV add puts the c63 coupe at 62k. We truly get screwed with these on-Australian cars!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pickles

Ha ha ha...Very true....ya can get a C63 for $80K in the U.S. Whatever Govt is in power here must have a big grin when anyone buys a "Luxury?" car.
Cheers, Pickles.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pickles

I think, in a straight line, the auto may have the edge, but another member has quite correctly mentioned "the twisty bits", & in those situations, like John Bowe's Winton drive, I reckon the manual may have the edge.
Cheers, Pickles.

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The fact that it is quicker around the track is a massive compliment to what HSV have done. Not many people bag the AMG so I would have thought it was a great result if it got within 1 sec of AMG, but to beat it is fantastic for the dollars.

I would suspect that the Great gearbox and extra gear in AMG would account for most of the 0 - 100 time difference. Against the 6 Speed Manual

Looking at all these threads and links have we seen a Dry Run in an Auto against anything else on same day. ?

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Originally Posted by vyssbeast

I just got back from the US last week. TV add puts the c63 coupe at 62k. We truly get screwed with these on-Australian cars!

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100% Correct . in fact they are cheaper to buy in NZ..........When I sold the C63 here on the forum for $110K...same car ( NOT JAP IMPORT ) could be purchased for 80K in NZ , Thats when our Aus $ was worth 30% over the NZ dollar..........:shock:

.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SV805

Looking at all these threads and links have we seen a Dry Run in an Auto against anything else on same day. ?

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If I can put my mits on one you will have your answer, complete with
1/ Temperature
2/Humidity
3/Barometric Pressure

All up front from 3 passes...ie what the car can do under a given Atmospherics’ ie.. its true potential
Exactly as it left the factory .

Now for the the clincher .....another
3 runs *Tuned* to show its full potential
My reckoning 1/2 second minimum .

.

I'm happy to have a go with the manual at Willowbank. I am pretty handy with a shaft in my hand after all.

I wonder if anyone will enter the GTS in Oz GT Racing, would be nice to see it up against the imports.

A little bird has told me that as well as the recently read Wheels E63/GTS comparison, there will shortly be another such article where the GTS is run with.....guess what.....what else but a BMW M5! The same little bird also tells me that once again, the GTS is looking good.
Cheers, Pickles.

Well I managed to hack into a North Korean spy satellite and found these pics. Zoomed in on the open bonnet to confirm the VIN and yes it exists and it is on the floor ready for HSV magic to be done. Not sure when the work will start buy hopefully in the next week or so.

http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/i...pse5568222.jpg

http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/i...ps27abc669.jpg

And 100% LSA goodness

http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/i...ps89c891c1.jpg

As I understand the build process:


Strip / prepare
Exhaust, airbox, coolers
Electrical (tail lamps, EDI, Gauges, MRC module)
Rear suspension
Front Suspension
Rear body
Front body
Side skirts
Brakes/Wheels/Alignment
Badging/programming
Final inspection
Data Dots

Depending on any supply issues I expect to be driving the beastie around the time I get back from my business trip. Will make all the pineapples in Japan worthwhile.