Holden to be built with fewer Australian components, so much for the 24,000 workers.

http://www.news.com.au/business/comp...-1226772530292

Quote:

---

THE cars Holden plans to build with more than $275 million in government assistance will be less Australian than a Toyota Camry, new documents reveal.The local content of the latest Holden Commodore has already dropped to 50 per cent, while less than one-third of the Cruze small car is made from Australian-sourced components, even though Holden has received $1.8 billion in government assistance in the past 12 years.


In comparison, the local content of the Toyota Camry and Ford Falcon sedans are 70 per cent, according to figures supplied by the makers.

---

If that their plan , to take our tax money and spend it over seas , then it should die .

toyota more 'australian'! crikey

agree XUV

More Joshua Dowling dribble................

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lmoengnr

More Joshua Dowling dribble................

---

obviously you have a low disregard for him, but, Who's joshua dowling??

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by XUV

obviously you have a low disregard for him, but, Who's joshua dowling??

---

\motoring writer and radio guest

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by XUV

obviously you have a low disregard for him, but, Who's joshua dowling??

---

A News Limited article author whose starting point on anything involving the Australian car industry is "doom, gloom, everyone's about to close" and writes accordingly. If the Holden cafeteria forgot to put its order through for cupcakes one afternoon, he'd write an article pointing to this as absolute proof that the factory is going to shut down as soon as the current supply of cupcakes runs out.

I don't recall all that many people complaining when Holden starting buying v8's from overseas....




If that their plan , to take our tax money and spend it over seas , then it should die .[/QUOTE]

Didn't the VE have barely more than 50% local content? Probably the last very high Australian content Holden would have been the VT series 1 5.0L 5 speed manual. Considering how high the AUD has been I hardly blame Holden for buying more parts overseas. Plus it becomes a vicious circle, as volumes drop for local parts makers, their unit price goes up and they become even more uncompetitive. With Ford going, even if Holden stays, there will be even less Australian componentry being used. A good guide for the future of our component industry is look at the Cruze. If the Malibu or Impala gets built here then it will be a glorified CKD car, so very little componentry will be Australian.

Cheers, Matthew

Maybe we should sell more brands here. That'll help the Australian car industry.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jac001

I don't recall all that many people complaining when Holden starting buying v8's from overseas....

---

Of course not...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by VYBerlinaV8

Of course not...

---

People have very short memories.....

When they announced the death of the Aussie V8 there was heaps of negativity. I remember when the LS1 SS was first released it got bagged for being doughy till it got up in the revs and sounded crap compared to the Aussie V8.

It wasn't until LS1EDIT came out that people started to accept it as better than the Aussie V8.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by C4B

People have very short memories.....

When they announced the death of the Aussie V8 there was heaps of negativity. I remember when the LS1 SS was first released it got bagged for being doughy till it got up in the revs and sounded crap compared to the Aussie V8..

---

Have to admit I was one such person. I was sad to see the Australian designed V8 go, especially after reading that in the early 90s Holden had developed prototype SOHC 3 valve heads for the 304 and it was making well north of 220kw in a rough state of tune. (compared with 165kw for the OHV 2 valve heads).

The other thing that always got me is why they never did a parts bin special, bolting the Group A twin throttle body onto a HRT blue printed 5.7L motor. The standard blueprinted 5.7 was around 230kw and the weak link seemed to be the bunch-of-bananas inlet manifold strangling the engine. Just imagine what the Group A manifold could have done for it.

You're dead right about the sound. Don't here to many "Holden" V8s on the road nowadays, but they do sound better.

Cheers, Matthew

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jac001

I don't recall all that many people complaining when Holden starting buying v8's from overseas....

---

but they were from GM , hHoldens parent, and it was happenning way back in the 60-70's and probably should have continued,
and wasn't there a story going around that we made the chev blocks here , sent them to there US , only to have them sold back to us.

If

I used to think they sounded better, but these days 5 litres just sound like boats or thong slappers. I thought all of the OHC experimental stuff had been canned quite a long time before the VT?

It was a wise move of GM to move the Holdens onto their global powertrain option in the V8, they should have done it with the VN IMO.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bozodos

I used to think they sounded better, but these days 5 litres just sound like boats or thong slappers. I thought all of the OHC experimental stuff had been canned quite a long time before the VT?

It was a wise move of GM to move the Holdens onto their global powertrain option in the V8, they should have done it with the VN IMO.

---

Yes, looking back it was good the VT2 went to the GM powertrain, better access to updates.

Don't agree that the VN should have gone to US V8s. Back in 1980s Chev V8s were underpowered heaps of sh!t. The Corvette L98 produced around 180Kw from a 5.7L V8. Holden were getting 165kw from a 5.0L. Even when the Chev 5.7L LT1 came out in 1994 it was only good for 224Kw and 460Nm, we had the 215Kw and 475Nm 5.7L Holden V8. It was only really with the LS1 that GM's US engines got significantly better than the Holden V8.

Cheers, Matthew

I still think the best V8 rumble was a Valiant Hemi an ex cop car which went real well, family friend had it and that was music to the years much like the 3 barrel Chargers.
Wonder what their power figures were as they looked a way better setup in the 70's to the opposition.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jag530G

Didn't the VE have barely more than 50% local content? Probably the last very high Australian content Holden would have been the VT series 1 5.0L 5 speed manual. Considering how high the AUD has been I hardly blame Holden for buying more parts overseas. Plus it becomes a vicious circle, as volumes drop for local parts makers, their unit price goes up and they become even more uncompetitive. With Ford going, even if Holden stays, there will be even less Australian componentry being used. A good guide for the future of our component industry is look at the Cruze. If the Malibu or Impala gets built here then it will be a glorified CKD car, so very little componentry will be Australian.

Cheers, Matthew

---

yes.. that is all pretty correct
and its simply based on economics and who can supply what.

Ignoring the dribble from Dowling for the moment, The figures (productivity Commission data)
shows that Holden spend around $16000 in parts/components from local suppliers on an EVOKE sedan.

That figure of course ignores the local labour force used to make the car ..plus of course all the factory suppliers like
the power company, the water board, the pallet suppliers etc who are local.

the actual $ paid to people/companies/suppliers make up much more than 50% of the total cost of making the car.

which by the way is not bad, given the $2000+ auto trans is not available locally nor are the tyres and interestingly
neither is the auto glass . Local glass maker VIRIDIAN (aka Pilkingtons) refused to bid for the VE business so Holden
were forced to go overseas for the glass (the glass is now made by St Gobain).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Smitty

yes.. that is all pretty correct
and its simply based on economics and who can supply what.

Ignoring the dribble from Dowling for the moment, The figures (productivity Commission data)
shows that Holden spend around $16000 in parts/components from local suppliers on an EVOKE sedan.

That figure of course ignores the local labour force used to make the car ..plus of course all the factory suppliers like
the power company, the water board, the pallet suppliers etc who are local.

the actual $ paid to people/companies/suppliers make up much more than 50% of the total cost of making the car.

which by the way is not bad, given the $2000+ auto trans is not available locally nor are the tyres and interestingly
neither is the auto glass . Local glass maker VIRIDIAN (aka Pilkingtons) refused to bid for the VE business so Holden
were forced to go overseas for the glass (the glass is now made by St Gobain).

---

That's way more then we're lead to believe , so the question is why don't Holden use this to defend themselves .

Maybe they want out or maybe more so, GM wants out , maybe Tata could buy Holden, I'd support that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Smitty

Local glass maker VIRIDIAN (aka Pilkingtons) refused to bid for the VE business so Holden
were forced to go overseas for the glass (the glass is now made by St Gobain).

---

Interesting. Anyone know the back story to this?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by VYBerlinaV8

Interesting. Anyone know the back story to this?

---

I don't know the exact details, but coming second hand from someone who used to work at pilkingtons it was because Holden wanted them to spend $Xmill upgrading their processes for better quality glass and they refused, wanting Holden to pay for the upgrades. So Holden went to India (I think), as the glass supplier there was already providing the quality they wanted. Again, this is second hand info recalled from a conversation a good 5 years ago or more... so don't take it as gospel.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by C4B

People have very short memories.....

When they announced the death of the Aussie V8 there was heaps of negativity. I remember when the LS1 SS was first released it got bagged for being doughy till it got up in the revs and sounded crap compared to the Aussie V8.

It wasn't until LS1EDIT came out that people started to accept it as better than the Aussie V8.

---

There's negativity attached to most changes in life.
Whilst the naysayers made plenty of noise (something most people are used to hearing in life and don't take much notice of), sales figures told the story about which engine was more popular with the punters. Once LS1 came out, V8 sales had a big surge. HSV performance for Holden money.

Well we now have an FTA with Sth Korea, so Craptivas for everyone ......... :(

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SCiFiRE

I don't know the exact details, but coming second hand from someone who used to work at pilkingtons it was because Holden wanted them to spend $Xmill upgrading their processes for better quality glass and they refused, wanting Holden to pay for the upgrades. So Holden went to India (I think), as the glass supplier there was already providing the quality they wanted. Again, this is second hand info recalled from a conversation a good 5 years ago or more... so don't take it as gospel.

---

I recall Holden was demanding new investment to meet a higher specification and Pilkington did not see the numbers in financially.