VF Commodore revealed - Official details and pics- Part 2

[jc_sv8]

I'm sitting on a 10 year old SV8 VY that has been a spectacular vehicle.

I had a replacement gasket seal on the right side of the rear wing and within the three years a driver side B-pillar plastic cover where the top clip snapped.
These were the only warranty items that I had, and were only picked up by the final examination by the Holden dealership in North Ryde, which was good of them.

Other than that, a power steering unit, a rear set of rotors and a single set of tyres, it's been all good.

I get the car services at 10K and apart from wiper blades and headlights ( I run them 24x7 ) that's about it.
So as far as reliable, I'd put it up against any car on the planet. Worst case, I've got a low coolant coming up on the dash which is the result of a cracked overflow bottle that never seems to require refilling. It's being doing that for 6 months and the temp gauge never goes past 2/3. Yes I"ve checked and it doesn't ever completely empty so one day I'll fill it.

So here we are 10 years on and the VF looks like a decent trade, bring it on!

[Wonky]

I've had 5 Commodores in exactly 10 years this month. A VY SV8, 2 VZ SSs, SSV sedan and now the ute. I guess I mustn't be fussy because in total 160,000km the only problems I've had are a) badly hung driver's door on one of the VZs which required it to spend a few hours at a panel beaters under warranty and a broken clip on the driver's seat side plastic trim on both SSVs - very common till they produced an uprated part. Again, each under warranty but only a $70 or so part anyway and a few mins to fix. So (touch wood!!) apart from my own mods which began with catback only on the SV8, increasing with each vehicle till the ute which has an almost endless list, I've not spent a cent on my vehicles apart from normal wear and tear items and services (every 7,500 on VEs).

I stated I must not be fussy but as everyone who has been in my cars will tell you, they run perfectly with no odd noises or clunks. I cannot complain at the Commodore quality at all!!

[planetdavo]

I stated I must not be fussy but as everyone who has been in my cars will tell you, they run perfectly with no odd noises or clunks. I cannot complain at the Commodore quality at all!!

Obviously local cars must, by necessity, be developed on lower budgets than global vehicles. It's both a blessing and a curse, as on one side it means a car developed with usually excellent comfort and overall performance for our big country, whereas on the other hand, cost is often saved on some of the finer details, like trim finish.
If people are happy driving around in their imported cars that don't ride very well or are rather noisy on our crap roads, but have nice soft touch plastics- good on you, but if people are happy to sacrifice a bit of nicer trim finish or a slightly less resolution dash screen or whatever for a superbly comfortable cruiser that employees Australians in great numbers- even better.
Most Commodore buyers have excellent runs with their cars, and in most cases, issues are reasonably cheap to fix when compared to imported options. What's so sad these days is just how much "Aussie bashing" has become a sport for elitist bogans desperate to escape their common roots. Sorry to say peeps, but you are still the same person inside, no matter what you spend...

[powerd]

Sorry guys, buty if ypou think the difference between Commodores and the rest of the world is about a few soft touch plastics and noise reduction on coarse chip on coarse chip surfaces, then you have really missed the point. You may not notice them, but the differences are much deeper than that. I don't think Commodres are rubbish to dreive - far from it. But these days there are so many products that far outrip the Commodore in every other way than dynamics and noise on coarse chip surfaces, that you have to ask the question, why have Holden fallen so far behind in a number of ways. And if you thing a VE reppresents quality in new cars, wel, frankly , you need to get out more.

Maybe people are happy to settle for lower qualiity allround engineering and design, but I suggest the sales figures tell a different story.Its not about people being dumb or anything else, i9ts about people vauing wehat they think is important.

Sso if you are happy with the qualuty of your Commodore, that is great. But lots of customers know they can getelsewhere. Bury your head in the sand while Rome burns, to mix metaphors badluy.

[Plenty]

, but I suggest the sales figures tell a different story

What a narrow minded and naive comment, is there even a Euro car in the top ten of sales? Comparing the Commodore to other vehicles being sold in the country, for a near on 7 year old car in the VE it still is right at the top of the list every month.

The declining sales are more a sign of the choice people now have, where they used to by the Commodore ute they now buy a Hilux, BT50, Ranger and Isuzu etc etc.

The market is fragmented and this has had more influence on the sales, not the finer details of automotive manufacturing your suggesting.
By the way wet or dry i reckon the VE SS would absolutely pants your Skoda dynamically, in steering feel and feedback, damping and rebound and well everything short of ride comfort.

The fact that your car cannot compete dynamically with an SS, does that mean that the Skoda is not world class?

[jboy21]

You may not notice them, but the differences are much deeper than that.

Like what? Some examples please. I suppose they could put in another 12 airbags in lieu of actual engineered safety and save a few bucks...

BTW learn how to spell.

[vessloveit]

Sorry guys, buty if ypou think the difference between Commodores and the rest of the world is about a few soft touch plastics and noise reduction on coarse chip on coarse chip surfaces, then you have really missed the point. You may not notice them, but the differences are much deeper than that. I don't think Commodres are rubbish to dreive - far from it. But these days there are so many products that far outrip the Commodore in every other way than dynamics and noise on coarse chip surfaces, that you have to ask the question, why have Holden fallen so far behind in a number of ways. And if you thing a VE reppresents quality in new cars, wel, frankly , you need to get out more.

Maybe people are happy to settle for lower qualiity allround engineering and design, but I suggest the sales figures tell a different story.Its not about people being dumb or anything else, i9ts about people vauing wehat they think is important.

Sso if you are happy with the qualuty of your Commodore, that is great. But lots of customers know they can getelsewhere. Bury your head in the sand while Rome burns, to mix metaphors badluy.

Seriously I can not comprehend this post????????????????

[C4B]

Seriously I can not comprehend this post????????????????

If you drive a lot of other new cars on offer it's very simple to understand.

[planetdavo]

If you drive a lot of other new cars on offer it's very simple to understand.

Really?
Depends what you actually WANT in a new car.
Drive most DSG equipped cars in city conditions and they are sh!t. Technology is "good" my @rse.
Drive many imported cars on crap Australian roads and they aren't comfortable long distance cruisers. Drive most imported cars on coarse chip Australian roads and they are poorly insulated, noise transmitting annoyances.
How many imports have sh!t radio reception just out of town? Apologies to the Apple generation, but most people still actually listen to the in-car radio.
Send most imported cars into a workshop for repairs and see how quickly your wallet empties compared to local cars.
Compare the real world fuel economy of much larger Aussie made cars to the much smaller, less comfortable imported cars, and convince me it's actually huge (particularly the newer generation of supposedly more efficient small capacity turbo'd petrol ones). Diesels? Pffft, for all the extra initial outlay, how many people ever recoup their costs, not to mention the constant laggy takeoff's and need to do DPF burnoff driving cycles in city driven cars for many owners. Diesel economy in traffic isn't that much better than petrol cars.
So yes, if you compare them by the brochure or a showroom sit, it is very simple to understand why Australian cars are often "inferior" to imports...

[planetdavo]

Sorry guys, buty if ypou think the difference between Commodores and the rest of the world is about a few soft touch plastics and noise reduction on coarse chip on coarse chip surfaces, then you have really missed the point. You may not notice them, but the differences are much deeper than that. I don't think Commodres are rubbish to dreive - far from it. But these days there are so many products that far outrip the Commodore in every other way than dynamics and noise on coarse chip surfaces, that you have to ask the question, why have Holden fallen so far behind in a number of ways. And if you thing a VE reppresents quality in new cars, wel, frankly , you need to get out more.

Maybe people are happy to settle for lower qualiity allround engineering and design, but I suggest the sales figures tell a different story.Its not about people being dumb or anything else, i9ts about people vauing wehat they think is important.

Sso if you are happy with the qualuty of your Commodore, that is great. But lots of customers know they can getelsewhere. Bury your head in the sand while Rome burns, to mix metaphors badluy.

Dude, you need to re-think what the hell you've written.
Besides the muddle of spelling errors, you have so many faults in your claims.
You claim "Maybe people are happy to settle for lower qualiity allround engineering and design". The engineering and design of VE is WORLD CLASS. It's been exported to many parts of the world, and VF will continue that. The GFC prematurely killed off most exports, NOT the engineering and design of the car.
So you claim that VE lacking engineering effort, yet defend noisy imports on our common course chip roads as having "superior" engineering? As you serious?!!! Why do they have so much trouble "engineering" superior noise reduction into their cars?
Again with engineering. I'll use VAG Group as an example (VW, Audi, Skoda, Seat). Why does that group suffer from so many DSG issues? So many engine failures and oil burning issues? So many expensive diesel injector failures? So many air conditioning failures? Most seem to happen just outside warranty...
Do I need to go on?
SO, I get back to my earlier point.
Having said just above why Commodore is still on the pace in many ways, and imports also aren't perfect, tell me WHY imports are so superior?
I mean, Holden introduced tighter body shut lines than nearly every import 7 years ago, and are STILL tighter than most of them. Tight shut lines needs strong design and manufacturing capabilities to come out in the final product, as most manufacturers wont go this tight as any variances are more easily noticeable.
If it's NOT down to saving a few dollars on trim finish, or the resolution of the in-dash screen, or what's included in the standard cost of the car, or whatever, then what is it?
Is Holden not using modern GM drivelines? Seems they are. Direct injection V6's, current spec V8's, 6 speed auto's, diffs from the highly respected ZF. Same with the steering rack.
Is it because they hadn't put radar adaptive cruise in their 40K large car? Most expected stuff appears to be in the upper luxury cars- with a small number of exceptions. Look at what you get for your 50 something K though in such a large and comfortable car that's surprisingly light on fuel for something so big.
Do they "need" a turbo 4 cyl so favoured by European manufacturers? Go have a look at Falcon sales with such an engine.
Still looking for ingrained engineering "problems", besides obviously plastic looking trim and lower resolution iQ screens.
The large car used to be the default choice for many buyers, private and fleet. Private buyers brought up on a diet of family Holden's and Ford's, combined with Aussie pride, bought them in huge numbers. Fleets ususally dictated these cars as the main options.
Now, we have around 60 DIFFERENT BRANDS competing for just ONE million sales. Most Aussies don't give a toss about Aussie Made anymore- someone elses problem. Large cars aren't "cool" anymore. SUV's are "cool". Small cars have perceived much lower running costs (reality often isn't close to the perceived savings). Crew cab tradie utes have exploded into the "family car" domain, even though most are still pretty rough around the edges.
I'm sure I could come up with more.

[Plenty]

Really?
Depends what you actually WANT in a new car.
Drive most DSG equipped cars in city conditions and they are sh!t. Technology is "good" my @rse.
Drive many imported cars on crap Australian roads and they aren't comfortable long distance cruisers. Drive most imported cars on coarse chip Australian roads and they are poorly insulated, noise transmitting annoyances.
How many imports have sh!t radio reception just out of town? Apologies to the Apple generation, but most people still actually listen to the in-car radio.
Send most imported cars into a workshop for repairs and see how quickly your wallet empties compared to local cars.
Compare the real world fuel economy of much larger Aussie made cars to the much smaller, less comfortable imported cars, and convince me it's actually huge (particularly the newer generation of supposedly more efficient small capacity turbo'd petrol ones). Diesels? Pffft, for all the extra initial outlay, how many people ever recoup their costs, not to mention the constant laggy takeoff's and need to do DPF burnoff driving cycles in city driven cars for many owners. Diesel economy in traffic isn't that much better than petrol cars.
So yes, if you compare them by the brochure or a showroom sit, it is very simple to understand why Australian cars are often "inferior" to imports...

I reckon I have to actually agree with you for once Davo.

[planetdavo]

I reckon I have to actually agree with you for once Davo.

I reckon you've actually agreed with me once before Plenty, so we're on a bit of a roll now...

[kevin101]

Really?
Depends what you actually WANT in a new car.
Drive most DSG equipped cars in city conditions and they are sh!t. Technology is "good" my @rse.
Drive many imported cars on crap Australian roads and they aren't comfortable long distance cruisers. Drive most imported cars on coarse chip Australian roads and they are poorly insulated, noise transmitting annoyances.
How many imports have sh!t radio reception just out of town? Apologies to the Apple generation, but most people still actually listen to the in-car radio.
Send most imported cars into a workshop for repairs and see how quickly your wallet empties compared to local cars.
Compare the real world fuel economy of much larger Aussie made cars to the much smaller, less comfortable imported cars, and convince me it's actually huge (particularly the newer generation of supposedly more efficient small capacity turbo'd petrol ones). Diesels? Pffft, for all the extra initial outlay, how many people ever recoup their costs, not to mention the constant laggy takeoff's and need to do DPF burnoff driving cycles in city driven cars for many owners. Diesel economy in traffic isn't that much better than petrol cars.
So yes, if you compare them by the brochure or a showroom sit, it is very simple to understand why Australian cars are often "inferior" to imports...

+1

Comparing different cars can't simply be done by saying this one has this and that one doesn't etc etc.

[CLUBRED]

Got to agree with PD also, have been through a similar exercise helping a family member buy a new car and i have to say I'm far from impressed with the current crop of the popular sellers. Eventually she settled on an import (because it was cuter, waste of my time) but even the sales guy scoffed when she said she'd keep it for 8-10 years. I drove the demo and hated it, and drove the actual delivered car a few times now and still hate it - yet everyones buying them, and I really don't know why. And if there's no 15 year old commodores left to buy, what are all the kiwi's moving here going to drive.

[csv rulz]

Got to agree with PD also, have been through a similar exercise helping a family member buy a new car and i have to say I'm far from impressed with the current crop of the popular sellers. Eventually she settled on an import (because it was cuter, waste of my time) but even the sales guy scoffed when she said she'd keep it for 8-10 years. I drove the demo and hated it, and drove the actual delivered car a few times now and still hate it - yet everyones buying them, and I really don't know why. And if there's no 15 year old commodores left to buy, what are all the kiwi's moving here going to drive.

Out of interest what did she buy