Supercharged HSV? - Part 3

[Pickles]

http://www.goauto.com.au/mellor/mell...257A920018D550
So, whtat d'ya think?
Cheers, Pickles.

This is a continuation thread, the old thread is Here by Pickles Titled Supercharged HSV?

This is a continuation thread, the old thread is Here by Pickles Titled Supercharged HSV? - Part 2

[Moderators]

This is a continuation thread, the old thread is Here

[Carby]

Rubbish. Both are performance oriented, large 4 door cars with a similar price tag, performance and options. Some us can't stretch to the decent euros new, but still want massive go in a GT type package. The M5 fits the bill perfectly (until you start examining the cost of a transmission or gearbox replacement and the alarming frequency with which both are required on later models), as does the GTS, the ford GT and a few others. I know I was certainly comparing the 2 now that it's time to think about upgrading, and dare I say it, the ford is in the mix as well. If you're after a large performance 4 door in that price range, those 3 (plus the merc, but I think it's ugly) are probably the main contenders. It just becomes a case of if the badge matter and if you can trade some refinement for a newer car and warranty.

Exactly right. For about 100 k you will get a 2007 2008 M5, or if it doesn't have to be a 4 door how about a C6 Corvette, 2006 model v8 AM Vantage ( surprisingly quick around the Nurburgring) or a nice 2012 model Camaro. Some of these cars have very low Ks as well so for that amount of coin it opens up a very large range of vehicles, that have a real presence and credibility.

[Plenty]

E63 is actually both powerful and fast and obviously way out of the GTS’s league.

Obviously! One is $100,000 the other is $250,000. Honestly who the hell buys a $250,000 E63 AMG and gives a hoot how quick or not Gen F HSV GTS is? Who in their right mind test drives a HSV GTS then goes you know what, i'm gonna go try an E63 now.

[mattnsw]

Plenty
The R8 SV managed a 4.9sec sprint how is that any slower than the F6? It's pretty common knowledge that the Ford/FPV power figure is highly under-rated.

Maybe common knowledge to you and some other car enthusiasts but not to the general public.

It would be more common knowledge if the reviewers start mentioning the understated power output of the Ford whenever they compare it to the HSV.

Otherwise the average joe will have trouble understanding how a 335kw powered car can keep with a 430kw most powerful Australian car ever.

[Plenty]

Maybe common knowledge to you and some other car enthusiasts but not to the general public.

It would be more common knowledge if the reviewers start mentioning the understated power output of the Ford whenever they compare it to the HSV.

Otherwise the average joe will have trouble understanding how a 335kw powered car can keep with a 430kw most powerful Australian car ever.

Yep good point, often wondered why it's not mentioned more often.

[NickS]

The majority of HSV owners are only interested in the "package" ... I've owned 8 and can honestly say I've only ever taken one from zero - 100 km/h, it was far from stock and on a drag strip. The rest have been driven around Sydney or given a bit of a go on the open road ... I couldn't give a shit what they do zero - 100 in.

I own an AMG too, haven't taken that from zero - 100 either.

These times give the mags something to crap on about but if you're looking to spend $100K on a car you don't choose on standing acceleration times. If you have $100K to spend on a car you're generally smarter than that. As others have said, 4 second bracket is plenty quick and more than competitive (hell ... 5 / 6 second bracket is fast enough for a daily driver) beyond that I'm only interested in the whole package.

[mattnsw]

Obviously! One is $100,000 the other is $250,000. Honestly who the hell buys a $250,000 E63 AMG and gives a hoot how quick or not Gen F HSV GTS is? Who in their right mind test drives a HSV GTS then goes you know what, i'm gonna go try an E63 now.

No doubt there is a big price difference but that doesn’t seem to matter these days when comparisons are done. Many mismatched cars are being compared on forums and in reviews.

For weeks while it was speculated the GTS may be almost as fast as the E63 there were a lot of people comparing them.

As I pointed out, the comparison is now over.
Germany – 1 HSV – 0

Bugger the E63, give me a C63 any day. It’s definitely worth the extra for the overall package.

Or if the overall package is not as important, a GT for its cost effective power output would be a lot of fun.

[IJ.]

The majority of HSV owners are only interested in the "package" ... I've owned 8 and can honestly say I've only ever taken one from zero - 100 km/h, it was far from stock and on a drag strip. The rest have been driven around Sydney or given a bit of a go on the open road ... I couldn't give a shit what they do zero - 100 in.

I own an AMG too, haven't taken that from zero - 100 either.

These times give the mags something to crap on about but if you're looking to spend $100K on a car you don't choose on standing acceleration times. If you have $100K to spend on a car you're generally smarter than that. As others have said, 4 second bracket is plenty quick and more than competitive (hell ... 5 / 6 second bracket is fast enough for a daily driver) beyond that I'm only interested in the whole package.

This/end thread

[Pickles]

No doubt there is a big price difference but that doesn’t seem to matter these days when comparisons are done. Many mismatched cars are being compared on forums and in reviews.

For weeks while it was speculated the GTS may be almost as fast as the E63 there were a lot of people comparing them.

As I pointed out, the comparison is now over.
Germany – 1 HSV – 0

Bugger the E63, give me a C63 any day. It’s definitely worth the extra for the overall package.

Or if the overall package is not as important, a GT for its cost effective power output would be a lot of fun.

Depends what you want....we own a C63....and whilst it is a weapon, it has its drawbacks.
It is small, very restricted room in the rear, it has a harsh ride, & getting in & out, whilst not difficult, takes a bit of care if ya don't wanna risk damaging seat bolsters.
None of this particularly bothers us....but it will certainly bother some, who need a bigger, more practical car, and also something that is around half the price....if ya get a C63 with a bit of the stuff that's on the GTS, it's not hard to get close to $200K.....if ya don't believe me, check out the price of the new C63507, then add on LSD, & several of the electronic gizmos that the GTS already has, & ya'll see what I mean.
Cheers, Pickles.

[bouka]

The majority of HSV owners are only interested in the "package" ... I've owned 8 and can honestly say I've only ever taken one from zero - 100 km/h, it was far from stock and on a drag strip. The rest have been driven around Sydney or given a bit of a go on the open road ... I couldn't give a shit what they do zero - 100 in.

I own an AMG too, haven't taken that from zero - 100 either.

These times give the mags something to crap on about but if you're looking to spend $100K on a car you don't choose on standing acceleration times. If you have $100K to spend on a car you're generally smarter than that. As others have said, 4 second bracket is plenty quick and more than competitive (hell ... 5 / 6 second bracket is fast enough for a daily driver) beyond that I'm only interested in the whole package.

That's fair enough nick, it's your criteria and your money and no one else can make that decision for you (stating the obvious, I know).

BUT, the performance figures are what drive extensive r&d with ALL manufacturers who design and build performance oriented cars. Amg v m division, Ferrari v Lamborghini, mustang v corvette etc etc. all throughout history there have been great rivalries amongst performance car manufacturers who have each strived to make their cars faster and quicker than the opposition (and their own previous models).

It is what they use to attract the consumer.

Whilst I see your point, all of your purchases have been performance oriented (using you as an example as you have a long history of buying performance cars), and the competition amongst the brands has lead to better (and faster) cars. Whilst you may not have taken advantage of the full capabilities of the cars, knowing their potential would surely have been part of the buying criteria?

Either way, what a great debate to be having. Sub 5's to 100 and mid, low 12 second cars made locally. I would have been laughed out of town if I said this would be the case 10 years ago.

[brasher]

The majority of HSV owners are only interested in the "package" ... I've owned 8 and can honestly say I've only ever taken one from zero - 100 km/h, it was far from stock and on a drag strip. The rest have been driven around Sydney or given a bit of a go on the open road ... I couldn't give a shit what they do zero - 100 in.

I own an AMG too, haven't taken that from zero - 100 either.

These times give the mags something to crap on about but if you're looking to spend $100K on a car you don't choose on standing acceleration times. If you have $100K to spend on a car you're generally smarter than that. As others have said, 4 second bracket is plenty quick and more than competitive (hell ... 5 / 6 second bracket is fast enough for a daily driver) beyond that I'm only interested in the whole package.

This.

Cars are about emotions, no use jumping in technological rocketship if it doesn't tug at the heartstrings, make you smile when you take it out on the weekend or do the second look when you park it up for the night. For some that might be an Evo that does 0-100 in 2.5sec's or a 1969 Camaro with 400+ cubes of the generals finest. I remember when I worked for Motor magazine a few years back and was umming and arring between an SSV ute and a XR6T 50th Anniv ute and I couldn't decide, the editor at the time said "which one brings the biggest grin to your face when you jump in for the first time" and the deciscion was simple, might not be the fastest in a straight line or do the Nurburgring in 7 minutes flat but it was the car that made me grin like a 6 year old whenever I took it for a wrap.

/cool story hansel

[Deco28]

One test it ran 4.7s...

Wait for more to come out, this car has better suspension, tyres and a more powerful engine then the W427, it will run faster.

[GTS LSA]

This.

Cars are about emotions, no use jumping in technological rocketship if it doesn't tug at the heartstrings, make you smile when you take it out on the weekend or do the second look when you park it up for the night. For some that might be an Evo that does 0-100 in 2.5sec's or a 1969 Camaro with 400+ cubes of the generals finest. I remember when I worked for Motor magazine a few years back and was umming and arring between an SSV ute and a XR6T 50th Anniv ute and I couldn't decide, the editor at the time said "which one brings the biggest grin to your face when you jump in for the first time" and the deciscion was simple, might not be the fastest in a straight line or do the Nurburgring in 7 minutes flat but it was the car that made me grin like a 6 year old whenever I took it for a wrap.

/cool story hansel

Nicely said, I went from a 350 rwkw GTO to a 240 awkw EVO that could 0 to 100 in sub 4 and do wakefield in. 1.042 ( which is not a bad number for that power for those that havent been there) they both had me grinning like a 13 year who has just discovered girls..... Completely different both with positives and negatives... Each to their own whatever floats your boat

[jc_sv8]

Even though the simplest measurement is 0-100 it is not the be all and end all.
Important? Merrrr, may be.
Qtr mile times, probably more relevant as it shows more of the ability to get the power down.

To settle all arguments of whether it's a performance car or not get it to the ring.....