Holden/Car Advice drive day

[mjrandom]

The sedan looks ok but the wagon is ungainly. In my view anyway.

My real concern is the sell off, so these have a 3 year life cycle as Holdens and then what happens?

[Ausmartin1]

The sedan looks ok but the wagon is ungainly. In my view anyway.

My real concern is the sell off, so these have a 3 year life cycle as Holdens and then what happens?

Your screwed - basically.
1) Large depreciation loss
2) Parts under warranty will take a long time to source and then later will not exist.

Smart move would be to buy something else unless you have money and time to burn in the not too distant future.
This is not a time to be loyal to Holden, the shackles are off so go compare other options and pretend Wheels magazine as being paid under the table on this one.

[Goggles]

I think the ZB Commodore looks ok inside and out (all bodystyles).

However, its existence makes me sad.

Why? Not because it has the name and doesn't have RWD, V8, manual transmission.

Because it shows what the Zeta based Commodores could have been if GM and Holden had the same amount of money for development etc and the same potential sales numbers worldwide to amortise the development costs.

Imagine a VF with the VXR seats which have a heating/cooling/massaging function and side bolster adjustments as well as the infotainment connectivity options. Of course, there are all the other tech features the VXR has that the VF never did, but were available in the lifetime of the VF.

I also find it disingenuous that comparisons repeatedly say that the ZB is a better handler than the VF. It had better be, given the chassis tech is at least 10 years newer, if not more.

[Smitty]

............

I also find it disingenuous that comparisons repeatedly say that the ZB is a better handler than the VF. It had better be, given the chassis tech is at least 10 years newer, if not more.

having driven several ZBs, it is not a better handler imo (well not in the 'burbs or on the freeways where I have driven it)
it is different... more understeer but power on mid corner straightens it
but not too much with the right foot, otherwise the dreaded torque steer takes over.

it also reacts different to bumps, tar strips, potholes... less tyre noise over these but more 'thump' noise

and thinking about it.... .. ZB should have been brought in to COMPLEMENT VF
(and replace that gawd awful Malibu, piece of pox that was!)

then Holden might have had a decent passenger car range (which it ain't got)
....new Astra, ZB and VF

[SASLS1]

I also find it disingenuous that comparisons repeatedly say that the ZB is a better handler than the VF. It had better be, given the chassis tech is at least 10 years newer, if not more.

All the motoring comparisons, articles, mags, etc... are all just "Subjective Opinion" nothing more... doesn't make it Fact.... there always biased one way or the other...

Drive the car for "Yourself", and make your "Own Decision" if you like the way it drives & handles...



The new Insigniadoor does 100% nothing for me, I have Zero Care Factor for it... IMO...

[CLUBRED]

Sigh, to think what the VJ could have been. I hope Holden get to release any design sketches / renders they may have had for it.

[CLUBRED]

Took the base LT for a run on the weekend. In my opinion that matters to no one, Holden are in trouble.

[csv rulz]

As much as im not really afn of zb styling, as a V8 supercar they look quite good

[Smitty]

the ZB fleet/retail launch was yesterday ....
so after a briefing at Holden HQ in Salmon st, off we went with over 3 hours out on the road
all models to test drive spread over 28 vehicles

[whitels1ss]

the ZB fleet/retail launch was yesterday ....
so after a briefing at Holden HQ in Salmon st, off we went with over 3 hours out on the road
all models to test drive spread over 28 vehicles

So what were your impressions of the car Smitty?

[Smitty]

So what were your impressions of the car Smitty?

it is NOT a Commodore (not as we know it)
and
yes I actually like to drive it

Not A commodore.. in that it reacts and drives different to ANY VF... Calais SS or HSV you have driven.
This is noticeable as soon as you start to drive it. Great steering but it handles differently
to VF, reacts differently, turns in differently, brake reaction is different.

I have driven the original Opel Insignia in Germany back in mid 2016 and Holden have done a great job
of fixing its faults (the Opel really is not a nice car compared to VF). It is nice to drive in all the versions
I tried 'cept one (see below)

if you are in the market for a Mazda6 (it is better than that, and better value for$) or a Camry (which is cheaper btw) or Optima
ZB is just better (handling, features, grunt).. certainly the wagon version I would buy for the missus in place of a SUV
the sedan (aka liftback) obviously the same but its styling means it looks like white goods on wheels
(as do the Mazda and CAmry and Kia)

it is in a tuff market but out of the others ( I have not driven the new 2018 Camry yet only the 2017.. 2018 is next week) it is superior.
Old time Commodore it is not.. a midsize new imported vehicle with a nice range of doodads features and easy to drive it is.

Calais version is a nice quiet comfy way to get around the 'burbs. Goes OK, even the 2 litre turbo version with auto (only trans available)
spins the front wheels in the dry in first Cheap too for a Calais

As a vehicle for our reps at work?... yes I does the job fine
'cept for one MAJOR problem, well two really Holden has a BIG issue here!
All models get space saver spare (NO option for a full size spare or goo/pump either)
so not happy about our country reps having just a space saver
BUT THE REAL ISSUE IS...
no room to put a full size wheel/tyre with the puncture. YES I am serious!
Holden sales guys were stunned when I asked this... ummm ummm we don't know
(but I have been promised an answer, can't wait!)

final comment... the VXR ? nup no stay away.
I drove an opel insignia in Germany as mentioned. TERRIBLE! I was given an updated one late last year here as a loan car, this sold by
Holden as the Insignia VXR supposedly updated by holden in relation to steering suspension etc. Naaaah still terrible!
This one? .. rorty engine noise, shocking seats, only ok brakes (despite being brembos) nice transmission (major issue with old model)
but $60k PLUS on roads? Nup Nyet! Maybe $50 large plus on roads might gather some interest. The Stinger kicks the VXR arse

[csv rulz]

it is NOT a Commodore (not as we know it)
and
yes I actually like to drive it

Not A commodore.. in that it reacts and drives different to ANY VF... Calais SS or HSV you have driven.
This is noticeable as soon as you start to drive it. Great steering but it handles differently
to VF, reacts differently, turns in differently, brake reaction is different.

I have driven the original Opel Insignia in Germany back in mid 2016 and Holden have done a great job
of fixing its faults (the Opel really is not a nice car compared to VF). It is nice to drive in all the versions
I tried 'cept one (see below)

if you are in the market for a Mazda6 (it is better than that, and better value for$) or a Camry (which is cheaper btw) or Optima
ZB is just better (handling, features, grunt).. certainly the wagon version I would buy for the missus in place of a SUV
the sedan (aka liftback) obviously the same but its styling means it looks like white goods on wheels
(as do the Mazda and CAmry and Kia)

it is in a tuff market but out of the others ( I have not driven the new 2018 Camry yet only the 2017.. 2018 is next week) it is superior.
Old time Commodore it is not.. a midsize new imported vehicle with a nice range of doodads features and easy to drive it is.

Calais version is a nice quiet comfy way to get around the 'burbs. Goes OK, even the 2 litre turbo version with auto (only trans available)
spins the front wheels in the dry in first Cheap too for a Calais

As a vehicle for our reps at work?... yes I does the job fine
'cept for one MAJOR problem, well two really Holden has a BIG issue here!
All models get space saver spare (NO option for a full size spare or goo/pump either)
so not happy about our country reps having just a space saver
BUT THE REAL ISSUE IS...
no room to put a full size wheel/tyre with the puncture. YES I am serious!
Holden sales guys were stunned when I asked this... ummm ummm we don't know
(but I have been promised an answer, can't wait!)

final comment... the VXR ? nup no stay away.
I drove an opel insignia in Germany as mentioned. TERRIBLE! I was given an updated one late last year here as a loan car, this sold by
Holden as the Insignia VXR supposedly updated by holden in relation to steering suspension etc. Naaaah still terrible!
This one? .. rorty engine noise, shocking seats, only ok brakes (despite being brembos) nice transmission (major issue with old model)
but $60k PLUS on roads? Nup Nyet! Maybe $50 large plus on roads might gather some interest. The Stinger kicks the VXR arse

Agree with most of those comments. The 2.0T is a great thing for a base car, the steering is a bit on the light side for my liking and yes VXR seems overpriced given the performance available. I did however love the VXR seats and was impressed with how hard the VXR could instantly be pushed due to the awd grip. Being able to alter the width of the seat bolsters meant it was extremely easy to find a comfortable setting.

I also beleive they shouldnt have named it a commodore, however we have to remember VE/VF was the only aussie built commodore, all previous models had some influence from opel (some more than others) and holden have already succeeded in that this is probably the most talked about new commodore in a long time.
Regardless if its positive or negative people are talking about it.

[Smitty]

Agree with most of those comments. The 2.0T is a great thing for a base car, the steering is a bit on the light side for my liking and yes VXR seems overpriced given the performance available. I did however love the VXR seats and was impressed with how hard the VXR could instantly be pushed due to the awd grip. Being able to alter the width of the seat bolsters meant it was extremely easy to find a comfortable setting.

yes agree ..... the VXR seat bolsters are adjustable but the seat itself is like sitting on a hard park bench
unbelievably rock hard and boneshaking, just uncomprising, no cushioning at all ... totally unsuitable for a road car imo
(and I say that as someone who regularly parks his rear in a FIA Sparco race seat in the race car)

the seats we have in our VF SS SSV or HSV are so vastly superior ... as is the normal ZB seats

[csv rulz]

yes agree ..... the VXR seat bolsters are adjustable but the seat itself is like sitting on a hard park bench
unbelievably rock hard and boneshaking, just uncomprising, no cushioning at all ... totally unsuitable for a road car imo
(and I say that as someone who regularly parks his rear in a FIA Sparco race set in my VK race car)

the seats we have in our VF SS SSV or HSV are just vastly superior ...

Fair call. I was only in them for a few minutes at a time and it was for hard driving so i didnt notice how firm they were.
I was in a Calais V Tourer for a lot longer and found the front seats in that very comfortable

[CLUBRED]

I wonder how many passengers will pull the park brake thinking they're operating the windows.