Supercharged HSV this year?....I say yes.

[sjhugh]

i would take a w427 any day over a gt335

I’d take 2 x GT335’s any day.
I won’t live long enough to make any worthwhile profit out of owning a W427.

Don't care what anyone says the Ford doesn't transmit its power to the ground in an effective manner ....

And neither can my VE’s straight from the dealer’s floor.
At times they’ve hopped so bad when launched hard you’d think the back end was going to break away. HSV and Commodores included.

.

[planetdavo]

I’d take 2 x GT335’s any day.
I won’t live long enough to make any worthwhile profit out of owning a W427.

ANYONE that thinks a car will appreciate in value over the medium term needs a different hobby.
But, W427 will always be a super rare piece of Australian history, something FPV can only dream about with their current range. People have a history of paying handsomely for a limited run model a step above the pleb models in this country...

[sjhugh]

My post was tongue in cheek but I do agree with your valuation of desirable older models, that’s why the GTHO is up the top of many peoples list.
Mine includes A9X, HQ 350 GTS Monaro and a couple of others. The W427 missed the cut.

.

[duke5700]

Not quite sure what your saying Davo?

Success is in the eye of the beholder. Business, is if it makes a profit or has enough flow on to increase lower spec sales. As for the buyer, well each to their own. It will want to knock the Ford around otherwise why bother.

If the Falcon had a body to match its driveline, Fords problems would be over.

W427 will see a limited market, it wasn't built for racing like the Walky or the VN Group A.

It would be a success whether "most" people agree or not. Camry is so popular around the world because it ticks most buyers boxes, but cars like W427, possible s/c HSV etc aren't about the mainstream 85th percentile buyer or the need to win popularity polls to be considered a success...

[bouka]

I don't know if they have too do it Bouka.. I mean they are killing FPV in the sales race. It will be a matter of will they deliver this for the fans??

I agree. Not this year and if it happens its going to want to be a cracker.

HSV have always outsold FPV Luke, and always will. It is more a matter of how they are going against their own sales targets.

Whether or not they consider FPV competitor (that whole issue is a joke), the market does and where HSV owners would laugh at the FPV V8 guys in the past and bully them at the lights etc, they now do anything to avoid eye contact.

They DO need to respond, regardless of whatever the second coming Brock may say (guess who). Spiritually more than any other reason.

And when they do, they will get my money again. I will buy the product that I consider the best. My money is being back in a HSV in 18 months. IF they do the right thing by me and the product!

[planetdavo]

Not quite sure what your saying Davo?

Success is in the eye of the beholder. Business, is if it makes a profit or has enough flow on to increase lower spec sales. As for the buyer, well each to their own. It will want to knock the Ford around otherwise why bother.

If the Falcon had a body to match its driveline, Fords problems would be over.

W427 will see a limited market, it wasn't built for racing like the Walky or the VN Group A.

The point you fail to understand is that, just like W427 was, any expensive factory s/charged HSV variant possibly release is a guaranteed success before it even comes out. And yes, it WAS a success, even if the gfc killed it off early, and the rather lofty beliefs that 427 might get made was never realised. Online naysayers (and Ford fanboyz) poo-poo'd W427 as being too expensive and nothing but a GTS with a different engine, yet it still achieved something regular models never can...exclusivity. People pay handsomely for exclusivity, and they will do the same for this one (if it's released). Comparisons with the "common" HSV or FPV models wont even come into it for the people that want one of these. Most wont even use half the performance potential, and have no interest in engaging in some d!ckbeating off the traffic lights with the poor people.

[bouka]

The point you fail to understand is that, just like W427 was, any expensive factory s/charged HSV variant possibly release is a guaranteed success before it even comes out. And yes, it WAS a success, even if the gfc killed it off early, and the rather lofty beliefs that 427 might get made was never realised. Online naysayers (and Ford fanboyz) poo-poo'd W427 as being too expensive and nothing but a GTS with a different engine, yet it still achieved something regular models never can...exclusivity. People pay handsomely for exclusivity, and they will do the same for this one (if it's released). Comparisons with the "common" HSV or FPV models wont even come into it for the people that want one of these. Most wont even use half the performance potential, and have no interest in engaging in some d!ckbeating off the traffic lights with the poor people.

W427 was a failure and nothing more than a GTS with an LS7 to the consumer. HSV got greedy. History will deal with it accordingly. Oh, and the SCGT is quicker. Does it matter? History will decide. And I am a big fan of the car, would have purchased one at 110k. Was heavily involved with the CSV LS7 that was on the front page of Wheels Mag and nothing but admiration for the motor and the lengths that HSV went to to make the car a reality.

I do admire you Dave but in at the moment you don't seem to get this market. This is evidenced by your continuous attacks and belittling of the type of buyer that spends their hard earnt on the products. As for Ford fanboys, I am one at the moment. These guys put it all on the line and delivered a genuine belter of a motor. It is nothing short of brilliant. The rest of the car, well, FPV are well aware of my thoughts on it.

Please don't spoil what is 80% tongue in cheek and 20% genuine information and 100% passionate banter by attacking the posters in this thread. You are far too knowledgable and intelligent for that.

[planetdavo]

A new SV6 would be quicker than an XY GTHO these days bouka. Time doesn't stand still. W427 was the fastest "factory" car of it's era, and many were bought by speculators to store away. Says plenty that. Performance comparisons to later models means nothing. W427 will ALWAYS be way more desirable than any of the latest "mainstream" HSV's or FPV's, no matter how many kW's the brochure says it has. They will simply be replaced by the next new model.
I don't agree that I got it wrong bouka. I simply believe that people like yourself weren't the target market for W427, because you clearly have different priorities to the market that bought them. Hence, you don't agree with me. Plenty of cars are simply too expensive to justify on "rational" grounds like you try to. W427 is just one of them.
The rest is purely your opinion of me as a person. That's your issue.

[whitels1ss]

A new SV6 would be quicker than an XY GTHO these days bouka.

Sorry David, I don't think so.

[planetdavo]

Sorry David, I don't think so.

Are we talking reality for factory released models, or over 30 years of well developed rose coloured glasses...?
Do a lap or two of acceleration and braking between a stock GTHO and a stock SV6, and get back to me. You might be a little surprised what the passage of time does.
ALL the old muscle cars are slow compared to modern cars.

[whitels1ss]

Yeah okay David, around a track you might well be correct, but when I talk about quicker I mean straight line aceleration and
I reckon the GTHO would blow the ars3 off a SV6 on the drag strip.

[planetdavo]

Yeah okay David, around a track you might well be correct, but when I talk about quicker I mean straight line aceleration and
I reckon the GTHO would blow the ars3 off a SV6 on the drag strip.

With a mid to high 14 second 1/4 stock...
They would struggle against an SV6 (or an XR6) just about anywhere you'd care to name.
There are a LOT of rose coloured glasses about the GTHO, but cars like GTHO perfectly prove my point. They were something well above the pov models of the time, but they are worth big money now. Not because of their performance now, but because of what they were in their time. A piece of mobile automotive history. Time will judge W427 as it has the past muscle cars, but it's really the only likely super desirable future model since the VL/VN Group A's came out. If a supercharged and super pricey limited run HSV model comes out, it's likely to be the next one to join the queue.

[bouka]

A new SV6 would be quicker than an XY GTHO these days bouka. Time doesn't stand still. W427 was the fastest "factory" car of it's era, and many were bought by speculators to store away. Says plenty that. Performance comparisons to later models means nothing. W427 will ALWAYS be way more desirable than any of the latest "mainstream" HSV's or FPV's, no matter how many kW's the brochure says it has. They will simply be replaced by the next new model.
I don't agree that I got it wrong bouka. I simply believe that people like yourself weren't the target market for W427, because you clearly have different priorities to the market that bought them. Hence, you don't agree with me. Plenty of cars are simply too expensive to justify on "rational" grounds like you try to. W427 is just one of them.
The rest is purely your opinion of me as a person. That's your issue.

If you honestly believe that the W was an exclusive release for the collector then the delusion at Clayton was obviously more wide spread than many have thought. This is being strongly reflected in the current value of the W.

I don't have an opinion of you as a person, as we have never brocken bread. It was a polite way of saying that it would be appreciated by myself, and no doubt others, that you ( your Internet persona ) did not fill this thread with insults and attacks on the very same people that keep you in a job (same for many of us, they are called customers).

My apologies for taking this thread of topic.

[whitels1ss]

With a mid to high 14 second 1/4 stock...
They would struggle against an SV6 (or an XR6) just about anywhere you'd care to name.

The XY GTHO ran a 14.4 1/4 mile, an SV6 would not do that, niether would a NON TURBO XR6.

[Alex(AUS)]

HSV have always outsold FPV Luke, and always will. It is more a matter of how they are going against their own sales targets.

Whether or not they consider FPV competitor (that whole issue is a joke), the market does and where HSV owners would laugh at the FPV V8 guys in the past and bully them at the lights etc, they now do anything to avoid eye contact.

They DO need to respond, regardless of whatever the second coming Brock may say (guess who). Spiritually more than any other reason.

And when they do, they will get my money again. I will buy the product that I consider the best. My money is being back in a HSV in 18 months. IF they do the right thing by me and the product!

I can't agree with this entirely. Having visited drag strips more times than I would like to admit trying to get every last tenth out of ba-fg fords. I can openly admit that they are faster in stock form and more tunable with minimal mods. The zf is better. This is common with both the gt and also f6. However that is where the benefits end. The ve (particularly in e1 form) is much better in terms of ride, balance, grip, handling and sometimes most importantly vastly better in terms of quality. Not to mention the extent hsv has gone to add value and differentiate the car from Holden. Fpv is miles behind and I guess has no options with the volumes they sell/market they attract. Unfortunately for Fpv, it would be relatively easy for hsv to bridge the power/straight line gap but ford and Fpv would find it difficult to match the platform, quality, differentiation and value of the ve.

I agree with bouka .... They do need to respond. Plenty of experience and components they can simply copy from the ve based camaro zl1 ... If the Americans can do it for 53k, you are likely to see the equivalent for 106 ... Shame....

Alex